SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Sybo, I don't know for sure if the house will lose money but its very possible. I just see what goes for what around the area and I would be happy with close to even. Only thing maybe in my favor is I did some work in there that could make it attractive. I gutted out couple rooms and upgraded them with look and space on what it was. Maybe that will help.

But to get going on that she was going to really dig in for the house. I really couldn't make her leave her name was on it too. I don't want to keep going back and forth about it or leave it to a judge. I already got the lawyers to draft this agreement and sign off. She has to be out by tomorrow. To ensure the house is in fine condition and she didn't wreck it the check doesn't get sent to her till the 14th of June. So for 15k I get her to officially relinquish all rights to the house and get out of there.

It helps me get going on getting this house sold and one less thing I have hanging on between her and I.

I wanted to also ask should I not be posing here anymore? I am not really someone that just found out my wife cheated and my marriage is in trouble. I am on the road to divorce. I don't want to take away from people that are in need like I was from the posters here. I don't want to not talk to people here at the same time as I have gotten a lot of help and its somewhere I can talk about this hell I am in. Just want to make sure I am following the right guidelines here.

I think it's easier to keep things in as few threads as possible. It's also easier for people who need advice or guidance as they can follow someone's situation in it's entirety instead of having to bounce around to multiple threads. But it's up to you and at the end of the day I guess the moderators??

If this thread gets to 50 pages though (the max) I'd make a new one in the Divorce section.

Do not bite on this alimony extortion PLEASE

Cheese and crackers, dude

I know that you are trying to do what is right.

I know that you are trying to do whatever you can to remain a part of that little boy's life. BUT BUT BUT you canNOT do one damn thing to guarantee that will happen. The money and the boy are two completely separate issues. If you agree to pay this extra money to her, it is going to be extremely difficult to stop paying her even if she is not allowing you to see the kid.

Some states do allow for 3rd parties to have court-enforced visitation rights but it doesn't sound as if where you are follows that since your L has told you that you are SOL regarding the kid -- and I suspect that any type of agreement that links money w/ seeing the kid is probably not going to be enforceable. If you can't get a bona fide visitation order for the kid in your circumstance, you sure as heck aren't going to be able to "barter" for him.

Have you confirmed with the insurance company that you'll be able to continue the child's health coverage after the divorce?

How will the "responsible party" for payment of medical fees be handled -- if he goes to the doctor (or heaven forbid, is hospitalized) will you be 'on the hook' for those fees?

It is so unfortunate that the boy has that woman as his mother. She is absolutely horrid.

I don't think you should pay her any more than you absolutely have to. You will never be able to enforce seeing your step-son, even with it on paper. She will have excuse after excuse and you'll have no recourse because you are not any type of relative. You'll be rewarding her with extra money for nothing. She'll be using him to punish you whenever she feels like it and, in the long run, that will punish him. Really, it might be better for him to have it over and done and not have the confusion of having you come in and out of his life on her whims. But that's up to you. I know it's painful because when my son and his long term ex broke up, I lost two kids I considered my grandchildren. But I can't have a relationship with them if she'd even let me because the ex would use it as a window into my son's life and create drama for he and his wife. (No, he didn't cheat. The ex cheated on him and he met his wife after it was over).

Gary, one day you may meet a woman who is perfect for you. You'll want to give her everything. Except that bitch you were married to will be taking more than she's entitled to and possibly using her son as a pawn. That money you're willing to throw at her might just be money you could use for a fabulous future with someone you really love and who loves you and treats you the way you deserve. Any extra you give to the ex is money you could be using on your future. You might actually be able to take vacations with a woman you love or save for something special with someone who actually deserves your efforts.

And you could always start a savings account with the intention of giving it to the boy for college if she does let you see him (or if he looks you up if she doesn't). She doesn't have to know a thing about that. But, if you give her extra, do you really think your step-son will benefit in the long run? Because the only benefit he could possibly get is spending time with you and I guarantee it will not take her long to put a stop to that. The minute she finds some new guy willing to fund her lazy ass and cart her son around, whatever you've agreed to will be disregarded in much the same way her vows were. Think about the bite in the ass that money is going to be in the future because it will be.

Please just let your lawyer handle this because your emotions are clouding your vision in a way that is going to impact your future detrimentally.

That 15k should be a HUGE negotiation in settling future marital matters.

Gary, I know that you want to be FAIR. You have always taken this stance, and you need to stand by that viewpoint. But your WW is NOT being FAIR. She is avoiding marital debt...like Sybo has be stating.

You also want to keep your stepson on your insurance plan, which is costing money. THAT ALONE should be more than enough of a financial bargaining chip to have visitation. But as stated by everyone here, she is NOT being FAIR.

All I am asking is that you be FAIR to yourself. Do not give more than is legally necessary. Put any additional costs(insurance, additional alimony, etc.) into a separate account for your stepson. Nobody else has to know. That is FAIR. That is beyond FAIR.

You are in a legally weak situation with a morally weak parent figure when it comes to your stepson's well-being. Don't feed the beast...it will not work to you or your stepson's benefit. Please.

It's pretty apparent that she married you for financial support. You're trying to be fair in an unfair relationship. Good luck with that. She's using her kid to gain advantage. You really need to wake up here. Once she gets what she can from you there will ne no relationship with her son.

Her and her family were just using you. You never mattered.

Use your head. Walk away. Your heart is betraying you here.

Read "No More Mr Nice guy" free download.

Get on with your life.

Gary - you are getting very consistent advice. Do not do anything more than the absolute minimum that the law requires you to do. The reality is that it was a short marriage and even in NJ that means a very short support obligation. At the end of the day the child is not your child. As others are saying she will NEVER allow you to have a real relationship with him. As hard as it is for you you need to make a clean break.

You will meet someone worthy of you in the future. Do not chain yourself to a disfunctional situation and limit your future happiness.

Please... Listen to the advice you are getting here and listen to your lawyer.

I just wanted to say to all that posted here you were all right on your points. I was being thick headed and trying to do something that everyone would say would not work. Well I learned that this weekend. I wish I just took what others here told me and moved on.

I had a pretty bad weekend. I see now that my relationship with my step son is pretty much over unless something changes at some point. I am beyond crushed over this. I am saddened that my wife is being this way and thru this all has such little regard for me.

She had to move out this weekend per out agreement. The house is fine outside it being messy, shocking I know from her but no real damage. She left me a note in the bedroom for me to read. To sum it up and make it brief, it stated that since I wont talk to her this is her only way for her to get thru to me. That I abandoned her for a mistake. That both are lives will be ruined now.

But the worst part is when she told me that since I want to play hardball with alimony (probably from our last counter which was lower than before) she said I can kiss seeing her son goodbye. That I was hurtful to fight her on money to see him. Cause she can ruin me in court. That she has evidence I should not see him. She brings up an incident from 2 years ago at a friends party. My step son was hitting this girl with a toy hard making her cry. I grabbed him off and yelled at him. Telling him this was wrong. I admit I did grab him hard but I didn't want him to keep hitting this girl. He cried and such. When we got home I talked to him. It was fine. But she says she will have the parents confirm that I was forceful.

On top of that she says she will show I cant be fit to have him on my own as I allowed drugs in the house. Ugh seriously there was 2 times I had college friends stay for a visit and late at night on the porch we had some pot. My wife was there and didn't care. She doesn't smoke but I guess to her drinking 2 bottles of wine is better. But in black and white terms I did this.

I don't even want to get into this now. Dragging other people in and such. My lawyer told me that this was her point all along that I don't have the legal ground. So I am taking the extra alimony off. I am not going to fight this to see him cause if she is this vengeful now who knows down the road. I will keep money aside for him for later if I do have a relationship with him again I have it. Plus he deserves it.

I cant believe she went this low. I hate that it seems I wont have him in my life. I am crushed. I was feeling good with things but now I am pretty low with it all. I just want it over but after that is all signed I am just a guy with a failed marriage with no kids of my own.

Anyway thanks to all that told me this from the jump. I went against it and got burned. Sorry to have wasted the advice.

Don't be too hard on yourself.

Sometimes all of us have to touch the hot stove, no matter what our parents said, just to see how hot it is.

This is no different.

But now that you "know", don't find a way for denial to allow you to "un-know", and proceed accordingly.

I think you are doing an excellent job of trying to do what you feel is right.

Sorry that it's not working out as you hoped, but that's her choice.

Your plan moving forward seems solid.

Keep your chin up, Gary!

farsidejunky, thanks good tip. I wont undo what I learned here trust me. I know thru these posts from me my wife seems horrible but she wasn't before. Or at least what I remember but I am questioning that now too.

When I called and told my sister this she just told me I am now seeing her true colors. That she says when she or others brought up things about her I always had a reason or something that excused it. I guess I didn't realize I did this.

I just don't want to believe that this whole person that I loved is this bad the whole time.

But the worst part is when she told me that since I want to play hardball with alimony (probably from our last counter which was lower than before) she said I can kiss seeing her son goodbye. That I was hurtful to fight her on money to see him.

like I said...extortion. Eff her. She doesn't care if this hurts her son too.

Cause she can ruin me in court.

No she can't. I repeat...no she can't. The courts deal w/ vindictive & dishonest fairy tales every single day and the judge will see right through her.

That she has evidence I should not see him. She brings up an incident from 2 years ago at a friends party. My step son was hitting this girl with a toy hard making her cry. I grabbed him off and yelled at him. Telling him this was wrong. I admit I did grab him hard but I didn't want him to keep hitting this girl. He cried and such. When we got home I talked to him. It was fine. But she says she will have the parents confirm that I was forceful.

Even if this was YOUR child...this "incident" would be inconsequential. But there is no custody issue on the table here so this silly story won't even be heard in a court. And in the absence of custody and/or MAJOR assets there won't be any witnesses called in. That would be absurd.

On top of that she says she will show I cant be fit to have him on my own as I allowed drugs in the house. Ugh seriously there was 2 times I had college friends stay for a visit and late at night on the porch we had some pot.

Same as above....doesn't matter...nor would it if custody was in play.

This is just desperate scare tactic/guilt trip nonsense.....don't let it bother you. This is family court not criminal court and they don't care about nor have time for this silly bullshit. The court wants you to SETTLE and get the hell out of their system as quickly as possible.

I am just a guy with a failed marriage with no kids of my own

Cmon brother...don't let this beat you down. She failed...not you. And this boy (I promise) may very well be a part of you life at some point down the road....give it some time. You don't see it right now but there are much much better days ahead. Soon you will be feasting on Filet Mignon instead of shit sandwich

[This message edited by Sybo at 12:11 PM, May 31st (Tuesday)]

Sybo, thanks and my lawyer basically said the same. I just told her that I am done trying to make it work. Just do what you can and use whatever you have to. I wont go against anything like I was doing about my step son. So I am totally out of it now 100% and leaving it to my lawyer. Probably what I should have done from the start like others here told me to.

Legally she is his guardian, and she has the power to keep you out of his life.

Morally she is too selfish and vindictive to let her son maintain a relationship with the only real father he has known.

It sucks and I feel for you on this. But you are doing the right thing here. Don't let her attemps of manipulation let you lose sight of that. You haven't abandoned anyone.

The forceful parenting you describe is simply parenting. It happens in my house every other day. She's blowing smoke once again to manipulate you. Make sure your lawyer gets the note and keeps a copy.

You can find creative ways to be involved in your stepson's life. It won't be what you want, but you can do it. Trust fund in his name only, going to his ball games (maybe after all this settles), sending him notes & gifts. She will try to block it but eventually he will be old enough to contact you on his own. One day it will be better man.

You put that letter away for later. I'm not sure you will want to show him when he's a grown man, but you might.

Make a video to the boy too, and keep that. It will show him that at this point in time, all you wanted was to be part of his life. When he comes to you in the future, show him the video so he knows.

Even if you had paid to see him, there would always be more, more, more. Now you know, SHE IS YOUR ENEMY.

Listen to your lawyer, and fight like this is some stranger trying to take your life away... because it is.

ChangeMaker had the same thought that I had about the video. I was thinking of even taking it a step further like a video diary of everything you would want to say to him at various points. Maybe someday he will see them, maybe he won't, but always take the high road in the videos. He will see that and appreciate that someday.

But man is your stbx very shortsighted when it comes to him. She misses the bigger picture but that's not surprising seeing how she's all about herself. But where she really falls short is her son's emotional well being. When I was a kid I caught my mother in her A and repeatedly exposed. I didn't understand everything that was going on. Eventually after 6 years of repeated false R my parent's got D and my father left for his own AP. Now as an adult I can see through adult eyes what was going on. I don't want anything to do with my mother these days and have been NC for 2 years now. Sad, but I could no longer tolerate my mother's selfishness in my life. Someday your son, yes your son as he is on many levels, may wake up like I did and see everything for what it truly was. That's where your stbx misses the bigger picture entirely.

yop

Hi, Gary.

I'd first like to copy a part of my post from around a month ago:

Now, if you're in a country/state where you can't get a legal right to visitation, please ask your GOOD lawyer to be creative about what you can legally do if her son wants to remain in contact with you. For example, if her son wants to remain in contact with you despite his mom's opposition, are you legally allowed to communicate with him through e-mails if he continues to email you from school/library/...? What can the mom do to stop that? In what way can you set up a trust fund for the son (for example for college) to ensure she doesn't get any of the money, and in what money can you inform the son about this? When can a child/teenager legally decide whom he wishes to talk to over emails, skype, visit,...? 14, 15, 12, 17? Can you set up a trust fund to cover his therapy sessions if he'll choose to go to therapy once he'll be old enough to be able to legally decide for his own medical decisions?

Can she legally prevent you from being part of the church/church activities she and her son go to, or her son goes (maybe sports activities organised by the church)?

Basically, if you want to remain in her son's life, there's a gazillion ways I can think of that might work IF her son will want to communuicate with you, either now or when he'll be older and will be able to understand what happened etc. You don't have to give up on having a relationship with him.

You too can get creative - you can tell him that you will write letters for him, make videos with advice for him etc.,..., that will be kept by your lawyer etc., and that he can get them when he'll be old enough to be legallly able to decide. Tell him that once he's old enough, to please contact you, even if it's years from now.

So even if she moves away (which I don't think she will, considering her family,..., is in the area, if I understand), there's so many things you can still do that sooner or later you will be able to have contact with him, if he will choose to. And even in the mean time, you can still put your time, energy, money,..., towards helping him have a better life now or in the future (like I said - trust fund, letters/videos with advice, pictures of you and him, of you, ...). You can create a public website, youtube channel,..., and give him the www address on it. You can post stuff on there (sports, music, advice for young people,...) that will seem to be for anyone, but he'll know it's your way of thinking about him.

Don't give up on him. He's the only father he truly knows/has. And to continue to be a great role-model and positive influence on his life, you do not have to remain with her! Don't let her use her son as hostage against you.

Having read the recent developments, I believe all of this is still relevant. Please, talk to your lawyer about all this.

Also, ask your lawyer if (s)he's be able to at least get a judge to sign off on you seeing the boy "one last time", at least in the presence of some third party (preferably no one on his mom's side/relatives).

Talk to your lawyer and a therapist on what to say to the boy or what to ask a friend/third party to say to the boy.

Be creative!

Best wishes

When I called and told my sister this she just told me I am now seeing her true colors. That she says when she or others brought up things about her I always had a reason or something that excused it. I guess I didn't realize I did this.

I just don't want to believe that this whole person that I loved is this bad the whole time.

I expect to have a similar conversation with my brother someday. The only difference is he knows something is wrong with his wife. And he took on parenting not one but three of her boys as a single child-free guy. The boys are grown now and have almost nothing to do with her. I hope you can maintain some connection with your DSS, because I guarantee you that your DSS will have major problems with his mom in the future.

She is too self-centered to avoid it. She only sees people for what they can do for her. You being the only father her child knew? Your feelings? They don't matter to her. She can't relate.

And just who is talking about she says "two lives will be ruined"? You and her? Her and her son? She is only talking about herself in both those instances. She has the power to make her son's life better, but she just wants money.

If she could have had an affair with a wealthier man, she'd be leaving you right now for him. Zero tears while doing it too.

Thank you all for the help. It does make a difference to me. I am doing what some poster told me couple weeks ago, I am writing him in a journal and will give to him one day hopefully to show this was never about him. Its all I can do really.

I am just so over this whole thing. I know people on here have way way way worse marriages and spouses than what I have, but still it sucks.

I hate that I allow it. I mean she is the one that ruined this marriage yet I am the one that is feeling bad. I bet she is not really in such distress over it.

I hate that she can get to me thru my step son. I was finally starting to feel good about myself too before this. I was getting settled in for now in the apartment, I was getting her out the house and going to get it sold. Just feel its one step forward and two back with her.

If anything this confirms my choice to leave here when I can. I was hesitating before cause I wanted to be around my step son. But if I cant see him I want out of here, I want away from her, her family, so called friends, the gossip, all of it.

What a fabulous idea about the journal or videotaping or something online. Things are different these days, and there are lots of ways to stay in touch.

One thing, please don't take it personally if your son drifts away from you as this whole thing progresses. I certainly hope he won't, but it's hard for us to imagine how hard all of this is for him.

Also, many posters are right - that he understands more than you might think, and his mom is digging her own grave for later down the road with him. However, at his young age, with you out of the picture, he will cleve to the closest thing to security for himself - which, sadly, will be her. And God only knows what she and her family will be saying about you!

My step daughter (from a previous marriage) was about your sons age when her father and I divorced. One weekend visit I was there, and the next I wasnt. I can't imagine what she thought or what they told her.

I hope you get another chance to be with him. I hope you can tell him a child safe explanation of why you are not in his life as you were before. And assure him that you will always be there for him.

But please also remember that she is his mother - pathetic as she is. Anything hurtful, vengeful, and even some of the truth that is negative ..... None of this will be helpful to him now or in the future. Why trash the only constant in his life at this point? Based on what you have posted - you understand this.

One poster was dead on when they said that if you continue on the high road with him - not trashing his mom to him - he will remember. One day that could pay off for you in spades - if you get the chance to resume a relationship with him.

And if not ..... At least he has not lived his whole childhood reliving your negative feelings toward her and what you could tell him about her. No matter what she is - especially at his age - she is his mother. And in your forced absence, she is really all he's got.

What a sad situation for you and him. Neither of you had a hand or a choice in all this. She is so immature and selfish. I'm so sorry for your step son - that he has her for a mother.

[This message edited by WhatsRight at 4:49 AM, June 1st (Wednesday)]