SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I just thought at least someone would defend him. Say it's human nature to want variety in women. or something like that. I posted here because I've already heard the negative stuff and I wanted to get another perspective on it. Is there anyone on here who has cheated and lied but still loved their wife? Maybe they could help. People say there's no excuse for cheating and lying. That's true but is it truly unforgivable? Can't I just have an affair and we will be even lol? Or I thought about having an open relationship where we can date other people as long as we are discreet and vow to always use protection? Have any of you tried a marriage that isn't monogamous?

Hi Shanoa, I'm so sorry you are going through this, but I AM glad that you are not married to this guy yet. He does not deserve you!!

I can tell you have low self esteem and abandonment issues. My beloved daughter (32 yrs old) was engaged to a very similar dirtbag. So I would like to speak to you the way I have spoken to her. By the way, she recently got rid of him!!

YOU are a priceless treasure!! You are worthy of REAL love!! What this man is doing is manipulating you, he is perfectly content with having you live with your head in the sand while he does whatever he wants. He does not even have the decency to value you as a meal ticket. You must take a hard look at yourself and see your own beauty, and let it shine! The moonlight proposal was his most grand effort at keeping his control over you, my dear. I am sorry, but before your life gets better, you have to realize that you deserve for it to get better.

You cannot have a deep emotional connection with someone who cheats on you. You say that at age 21 he had a penchant for 14-year-old girls....ahem, this is a pedophile! The tiger does not change its stripes! So if you marry this dirtbag, what happens when you have a precious daughter who turns 14, good possibility she will become sexually desirable in her daddy's eyes?!? If you cannot leave him for your own sake, PLEASE leave him for your unborn children's sake!

Sending you giant hugs! It sounds like your friends have got his number, please rely on them for help in real life. And take good care.

ETA:

I just thought at least someone would defend him

His behavior is indefensible.

@ "open relationship..." Is that really what YOU want?? I am so sad for you.

E.

[This message edited by Edith at 4:57 PM, May 1st (Thursday)]

In an open relationship at least I could have my cake and eat it too --too! Ha just saying if he wants to explore maybe I should too. Maybe we could spice things up in the bedroom with threesomes?

as long as we had threesomes with men and women not just other women lol. That would be interesting I think. Perhaps that's what's missing. We could just have sex with other people together!

Shanoa, you're treating this like it's something harmless. People can have threesomes in a healthy relationship where both partners are willing and have clear boundaries--does that sound like your relationship? No. It sounds like a desperate attempt to hang on by the skin of your teeth to someone who you seem to accept will never be content with monogamy. But does monogamy matter to you? If it does, how does this work?

Believe me, I made many excuses for my exWBF when I found out he had cheated on me multiple times throughout our relationship. He was really insecure about my past experience and this was how he handled it! He couldn't help being driven by his jealousy and I could work with him to resolve those feelings and need for external validation in a healthy way!

He loved me then, by the way. In his fucked up way, while betraying me, lying to me--he loved me. we are broken up now and he says he still loves me. He probably does too...again, in his way. But it's not enough love for him to have worked to change or to actually act to protect me. So, what does it matter if someone loves you when they act to injure you? It is meaningless at a certain point. And you just have to start loving yourself more than you love their twisted 'love' for you.

I don't understand. now YOU'RE talking like a 14 year old. Are you even taking this situation seriously? You don't want REAL advice. You just want people to tell you that what he did was OK, and that you're relationship WILL work out, so you can feel justified about continuing this charade. You want sugar coating!

YOU WON'T FIND THAT HERE.

Look Shanoa, no one is going to defend a child rapist. Period. On any level.

This thread quickly became about you. Not him. You are broken. You need help. You are not well enough to be in any healthy relationship because you are not healthy enough to be on your own.

There are a few here in open marriages who are going to be insulted by your last two posts. Being in an open relationship is harder than monogamy and based on honesty. Neither you or ass hat are being honest with each other.

You want to fuck around, that's one thing but don't insult those that are in an open relationship. You clearly don't know the first thing about it.

You need to get your shit together. OWN YOUR OWN SHIT!!! That means pulling yourself together and getting well. You are not going to hear the things you want to hear here. You will hear what matters and right now that is you!!!

And what everyone else said in this thread x100. Go back and read it all again. PLEASE!!!

This only tells a fraction of the story with open relationships/marriage. You seem hell bent on not listening, so educate yourself some:

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=528194

I'm sure there are a few that would be more than happy to educate you. You know what they are going to tell you? You need to fix yourself before open M because you wouldn't be able to handle it.

[This message edited by yearsofpain25 at 5:33 PM, May 1st (Thursday)]

Shanoa, the only person who can complete you is you.

A healthy relationship is based on mutual respect. Can you honestly say you respect this person?

You said he was sweet, considerate, and kind. No hun....he's not. If he was he wouldn't be cheating on you. He wouldn't be letting you be the only breadwinner in the relationship. He would do everything he could to help you be a better person because he want's you to be the best person you can be.

What triggered his marriage proposal all of a sudden? If he's stated he doesn't believe in marriage in the past....why now? Something must have happened that he felt he was losing his "Mommy with Benefits".

Sweetie....have you explored the possibilities that he's staying with you because YOU don't require anything from him?

k9

Shanoa, I have come to this thread after reading another thread you've posted. Upon reading all your posts and subsequent replies I've reached the conclusion you're waiting for one of us to tell you what you want to hear. You desperately want one of us to tell you he'll change and you'll be fine.

There's a reason why none of us have. You can ask a hundred questions each in a different way... But doesn't it tell you something that of all the replies, each person from different countries, belief and value systems WE ALL agree this is no good for you.

I bet even if you ask people down in the wayward forum you'll get the same responses. And they are ones that openly admit to As. You are trying to justify his behaviour while seeking validation from us that you are right. It's toxic. Period.

I'm sorry to tell you like many more have said he raped a minor. He had sex with a child. At 15 you yourself haven't livEd your life.. I challenge you he is not the "love of your life" if you had barely began to live it...

Take what you want from the posts, but you can't ignore what EVERYONE is telling you forever.

Edit typos

[This message edited by Sadmumma at 4:43 AM, May 2nd (Friday)]

Shanoa, as a mother, grandmother and someone with huge abandonment issues with a far less than perfect upbringing, if you can't put yourself first, please think of the ramifications of you having a daughter one day who brings her 14 or 15 y.o. friends home. Clearly this is the age group that appeals to your WF. Can you imagine what your child/ren will have to go through if he has sex (albeit you'd no doubt agree with him that it was consensual) and it's in all the newspapers etc.? Let me disavow you right now of the notion that the 14 year old he screwed was a month from being 15 or she was just as keen as him. It is illegal and he's just lucky it wasn't my child because he'd be in prison.

I'm not going to repeat all the good advice you've been given because, quite clearly, you aren't really looking for constructive advice but are searching to find the one person who will agree with what you intend doing. I do, however, hope if you do marry the fucktard that you wont have children as your rose tinted glasses are so firmly in place, I doubt you'd be able to be circumspect enough to pick up on inappropriate behaviour with girls who would be in his presence.

Shanoa, I hope you are still with us today.

Doesn't look like you heard anything you wanted to hear in any of your other threads. You alluded to the fact that you may have heard "negative" things on other websites as well. You will continue to have these blatantly obvious and truthful points pointed out to you no matter where you go. No matter how many different threads you post. No matter how desperate you are by hoping to cling to an open relationship idea. The truth is this all comes back to you.

Truth is you should not be in any relationship until you get well let alone with a sociopath child rapist who manipulated you. You need to get well.

I do find some kind of weird solace in "being the victim", like I "have something over him".

You have said a few things that say so much about you. This ^^^^^ being just one of them. You need to detach, get away from this guy, and get yourself well. We are going to keep saying that over and over until those rose colored glasses you are wearing start to crack. If you're willing to keep posting, we are willing to keep going at it with you. Nothing will change until you change yourself.

Enough of the preaching. Take action. Action is louder than words. What would you like to see as step 1 for yourself in helping yourself.

STEP 1 - I see step 1 something simple like, actually reading up on the 180 that was mentioned in this thread multiple times. The links are there. Go read up on it.

STEP 2 - I see step 2 something like, since you said you were already willing to go to IC, actually go to IC even if ass hat does not want you to go. That is a big fear for him because going to IC will make you stronger. Make an appt for today. Talk about more than just your anxiety. Start talking about your FOO issues and start getting to the heart of your problems. If you already know what those are, then start discussing actions you can to do to better yourself.

STEP 3 - Do you have any family members or close friends that you can turn to? Can you contact someone to help you start to extricate yourself from ass hat child rapist (no I will not stop calling him that until you see him for what he is)? You need to get strong first so you can do it, but start lining up people to help you.

What do you see some actions for yourself consisting of? Do you think you could do these simple 3 steps?

Thoughts?

yop

I'm on this site because my worlds fallen apart. But I choose to sign up to ask for, and TO LISTEN TO ADVICE! It may not be what I want to hear, but it's WHAT I NEED TO HEAR, from people who have been there and got the t shirt.

I agree with ever faithful, and pretty much everyone else......

The man (I use this term loosely) is 30 years old and he can't keep a job and support himself? And he's sleeping with 14 year old girls when he's 21? That's statutory rape btw.

Honey, there are REAL men out there. And when I say REAL, I don't mean because they don't cheat. A real man is one who supports himself, and takes responsibility for his actions. The GOOD and the BAD. Many other things make a man (and a woman!) as well.

I also agree that you don't write like a 27 year old......but someone much younger.....

Shanoa, honey I just read through all your posts, on this thread and others. I responded last night to the question of open marriage, and gave a resounding no, Open marriages are not a good choice when still dealing with the shitstorm of indifidelity.

Now I read through this post, and I see so many things jumping out at me, I'm not sure where to start. So bear with me here this may be a bit jumbled. But know that the advice I give is not to be mean, or to say you are a bad person. On the contrary, however you need to stop glazing over the real issues here and really listen to us. We can help you through this, and help you be a stronger, smarter, more capable woman, but only if you listen, and take action based on our advice. We speak from a place of experience and wisdom of what worked, and didn't work for us.

So Issue Number 1 - YOU.

YOU - Are horribly co-dependent, you have had a really crappy childhood, and sought and escape from it as soon as you could. You have never stood on your own, been responsible for just you. Found your happiness within yourself. Put you and your needs first. Valued yourself, and lastly loved yourself to the point that you know you need NO ONE, other than you.

I see you starting in on a cycle of crap that is going to lead to a horrible life, and in 30 years you are going to be one of those people that have a litany of horrific life events, and those will be the fault of all around you.

Or you could stop where you are and eliminate the dysfunction from your life, and figure out who you are, and become something spectacular, that demands the love and respect you deserve.

You need to stop focusing on your broken relationship right now. You both have major issues, and if you continue down this road you are going to end up with kids that will also be horribly dysfunctional. Not a fun way to spend life.

Learn who you are, learn that you have value and worth within yourself. Learn that you can be happy and whole without some damn dysfunctional man in your life. This is essential. You are 28 years old, but your posts are very much like that of a lost teen, and you are emotionally stunted because of how you started out in the adult world. That isn't your fault, but if you don't take the time to heal, and learn who you are and value that person you are going to be forever stuck in this cycle.

HIM - He is not well. You want to gloss over the fact that as an adult man he chose to have sex with a child. This is not normal. This is not healthy, and this is a pattern of behavior. He chose you at 14-15, a kid that was lost in the world due to your dysfunction. When you started to find your feet in the world who did he reach out to? Another kid at 14 that he could be the smart, mature, worthy, man. She probably came from an unhappy dysfunctional place as well, and saw him as her Knight in Shining Armor (KISA). This borders on pedophilia, and you need to face that fact. He committed a serious crime, that if pursued would have him listed as a child sex offender. He has his own issues, and no matter how much you love, and coddle, and excuse him that doesn't heal him, and doesn't get him to be responsible for his actions.

YOUR RELATIONSHIP - You have an odd parent child relationship that tends to go back and forth for you both. You as the mother, being the breadwinner, and provider, him as the father, as he rescued you, and made you feel safe and protected from the world. Both of these are illusions to the reality of the situation.

Please consider stopping the relationship for at least 6 months. Focusing entirely on you, and encourage him to do the same for himself. In 6 months if you both feel you can't live without the other, then figure out a healthy way to reestablish your situation. IF you don't you will be miserable, you will never have his respect, and you will never know what real love is.

I urge you to find a therapist one that specializes in adult children of abuse, because the uniqueness of your life puts you in the same mindset of an abused child.

Please keep reading, keep posting.

(((and strength)))

Please listen to tushnurse (and everyone else here for that matter). tushnurse is among the wisest here at SI. When she takes time to write, I always take time to listen to her posts. She of course was able to articulate what I have been trying to say much better than I could.

You need to give yourself a chance and listen. Really listen.

Last night we finally had "the talk". A lot came out. His "fear of being happy". How he "pushes people away". He said that he "needs to be punished" for what he's done to me. He said that he proposed because he loves me and knew that's what I wanted, but is still scared of "a normal life". He said I am so amazing but "the little things" get to him too much. We talked about separating. He said that wouldn't help him. That he already knows he would be miserable without me. That it would make him realize that none of the "little things" should matter. He'd rather be in a dirty house with someone he loves than alone in a clean one.

When I dug deeper on why he texted her and he said he just wanted to "feel connected with someone" as I don't seem to "understand him" sometimes. He also mentioned that the OW asked him to "take a trip" to see her but he said no. He said she isn't being completely honest with me. He said he felt betrayed that I texted her. That we would have been better off if I didn't know everything that happened because we'd still be happy and could move on faster. He said he's sick of "being that guy" - emotionally abusive, liar, cheater. I gave him the ring back. I said we are separating. He said "I am worried about you. Will you be able to afford the house?" and when I said I'd be fine he got really sad, "I don't know why that makes me sad. Like the little bit of money I bring in doesn't even mean anything". He said he is immensely depressed about not having a job. He said I deserve better. I still think I want to forgive him but I think you guys are right about how we both need to figure ourselves out before we can have a successful relationship. I want to be strong. But I also just want us to keep building our lives together because we are such a good team. I love him.

Good for you for returning the ring and saying you will separate. Follow that up with kicking him out.

With this type of man you are likely to see a lot of intense declarations of flowery love; he knows you can't catch flies with vinegar. But words are meaningless. Only actions matter. No matter how much he plays on your sympathies with his 'poor me' card, his confession of brokenness is just a tactic to keep you invested in him, to be mixed later with hurtful words and anger to beat you down. Stay strong and get a counselor lined up for yourself to help you through this, as well as any friend's you can trust. This guy is totally capable of blaming you for not standing by him, or else of throwing a melodramatic act of no longer wanting to live--anything to keep you hooked. After all, you provide for all his needs, and if you cut him off, he has to find a new victim. Remember that and do. not. listen to what he tells you.

Hi Shanoa. Glad to see you are still with us. What you are getting from him is called trickle truth (TT). I guarantee you have not heard all of it. As such, you cannot take what he says as gospel. You already know this.

This is a huge first step for you and I'm very proud of you. Taking first steps is very difficult. I know this hurts, both him and yourself. I still want to focus on you though. This is really about you. What are your plans for the second step? Any thought about getting to the route cause of your issues in IC?

I don't understand. now YOU'RE talking like a 14 year old. Are you even taking this situation seriously? You don't want REAL advice.

I've kind of wondered since the beginning of this thread whether someone was pulling our collective legs - and I'm betting on 'yes.'