SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

yeah I would imagine that any statistics on this would be weak at best.

Even the 50% of all marriages ending in divorce accounts for all marriages including second third and fourth marriages. so presumably there are some serial "monogamists" out there wrecking the curve. Almost everyone I have ever dated has come from an intact family but I don't. I was one of the only kids in my class with divorced parents.

the reason I brought this up was the anecdotal evidence I was seeing lately of BS's leaving a rather good relationship with a decent reconciliation due to the fact of infidelity.

It is ironic that most people think that after cheating or being cheated on the BS will bail and as we have all seen here that is hardly the way it goes. Most of us want to reconcile initially much to our own and WS's surprise. But does that feeling last?

I was one of them but I also knew in my gut I wasn't getting over this. and honestly as far as WS's go mine was rather innocuous (other than the abusiveness of the affair and the lies)

Not a whole lot of cruelty just a tremendous amount of sudden coldness, some relationship history revision, and the usual blame.

We didn't have kids so there would have been no reason to reconcile except for the desire to. I think the new version of her would have killed off my old love sooner or later. And indeed that began to happen anyway.

AT this age (39) I'm able to date people who have a track record of no infidelity in their past which actually is one of my stipulations. My current gf hasn't had infidelity in any of her adult relationships. My ex did as a BS and later a WS (different marriages). So I'm placing my bets elsewhere.

I really don't believe infidelity touches every relationship. It certainly hasn't been part of my familial history not even with my parents who definitely had a rough marriage due to my mother's mental health issues.

[This message edited by Syzy at 12:53 PM, August 5th (Tuesday)]

Wow - what an insightful thread. I keep reading posts and thinking, "I need to quote that in my reply" but then I come to the next post and think the same thing.

I am 3 1/2 years out from D-day and for me it has taken this long to come out of the shock and evaluate our relationship. So many times I look at what my WH is doing and wonder "Would OW put up with this? (obvious answer - NO) So why do I?" I too like Lost&Hurt feel that WH is purposely withholding the words that I need to hear that he deeply regrets and is remorseful. I could agree with so many of what you are saying but this post would go on forever -- so just one big -- I'm where so many of you are at!

I love having a partner (a husband) who loves me and accepts me in spite of my faults, and to a large degree, I'm willing to do the same thing for him.

Here's where the devil is in the details, and each case so different. This is a major stumbling block for me, as I have always been willing to forgive, forgive, and forgive some more, because I figure I also am not perfect. But then I found out he was not doing the same for me, that through most of our marriage, he was not only running me down to my face and to the people he worked with, that I knew about, but having these 'friends' and complaining to them about me. Apparently, he DOES think he's so perfect that he can sit in judgment on me, and even now 3-1/2 years out, is gaslighting, pretending this is not what it looks like, etc. So despite all his 'efforts,' this is one of the things that may lead to me being one of the ones who tried for 3 years and finally gave up.

This is by far the best subject on any forum that I have yet to see. Every single answer IMO is right on the money in regard to the effects and aftermath of an a and what truly takes place inside the mind of most BS's.

I will keep reading with much interest. Thank you "Syzy"

thanks ticked.. this is just not something I have found ANY information on and I have been looking.

I haven't seen it discussed on SI either. Just the BS's filing in divorce because reconciliation was such a sham (false) or the WS just didn't get it. Which is so different than what I'm specifically trying to address.

What if you just can't get over it? What if good reconciliation and remorse just aren't enough? I'm sure the guilt of the BS is higher in such circumstances particularly when there are children involved.

I was a little alarmed at some of the attitudes of friends towards these BS's which was to suggest they had plenty of time to get over it, acted like they were over it and somehow "deceived" their partners into a false sense of security.

OH MY GOD I thought you guys are out to lunch! Wow talk about blaming the victim for not being able to get past it after actually trying. The WS's seemed blind sided in these situations, felt terrible, and had the sympathy of those around them.

But it was as if there was more integrity in the BS leaving right after DDay. I don't think anyone would blame a spouse for leaving years after just one incidence of physical violence so why lay this at the BS's feet.

I think it is fair to say that I thought X,Y, and Z would be enough but it wasn't. Maybe you have even forgiven your WS but the one thing you really want they can't give you which is what you had before DDday. I do not mean an idealized notion of love either but a love without this serious breach.

I think many BS's finally look around at other relationships and marriages that don't have this in them and begin to long for that again.

Many of us have been cheated on in more than one relationship, it is easy to assume infidelity is EVERYWHERE lurking behind every promise.. but I am assured, it is NOT. I think sometimes the desire for that finally outweighs the love that may remain and it can take several years for that to hit fully.

I so understand this, although my second XWW wanted nothing to do with reconciling or admitting the affairs.

In my first marriage, I divorced at the urging of my WW's sister. A few years ago, my first WW tired to tell me she still loved me. I was repulsed. There is no way I would stay in a marriage with this forever looming in the background. I deserve better than a tainted marriage.

In my opinion, any time a WS (or FWS) says "I did everything I could to make up for my A" with a sense of entitlement to the relationship, they're essentially saying they've made amends.

There are no sufficient amends for infidelity. None.

NC, transparency, all of that shit -- those are minimum standards for creating an environment hospitable for R. They are not anything "above and beyond the call of duty". Making a habit of flowers, gifts, caring & selfless behavior -- those aren't amends, either. That's, once again, minimum standards for being in a loving, exclusive relationship.

Too often, I hear "I did everything", where "everything" translates more accurately to "I did what 99% of married people do in marriage". Why that seems to be exceptional behavior that deserves special consideration, I have no idea.

I so agree wil. These are actions they should've been doing in the first place!!! They weren't doing these of course that's why they ended up committing an A.

Right now my plan is to leave my marriage in two years and four months! It will be 11 years after the affair ended. We never reconciled because he never changed. He did what most women dream of in a marriage but that isn't enough after an affair. As others have said, a WS has to go above and beyond.

For personal reasons, I didn't want to put myself through what a divorce would have cost me before 2010. The reality is that we will divorce only because he cheated on me.

As far as the law goes, since the infidelity was beyond five years ago, that can't be grounds in my state. So if we were a statistic, we wouldn't fall in the infidelity category. But that is the true reason.

I am at the 3+ yr mark (2.5 yr if you count trickle truth) and am probably closer to filing than I ever have been. Yet, ironically, the marriage itself is better than it ever has been. In actuality, I think that is the sticking point.

As long as I could still see progress that could be made, I had hope. But having reached the level of what I believe is a truly remorseful spouse - and one that is trying to do what he can to make amends - I still find that I LIVE with this hole in my soul....a longing for an unadulterated trust again.

And having learned to survive in the earlier months (years) following d-day, I DID develop a take-it or leave-it mindset toward the marriage....certainly not part of the vows that I originally made.

I know how much I think about leaving...and every investment I make is done with an almost unconscious consideration that I may not always be in this marriage. There are already conditions (other than infidelity) that I know would play a factor in my leaving the marriage if they were to come about. Sometimes I feel really ashamed for that...and I often wonder at this point if *I* am not now cheating him.

I still feel a love for my H. - and even a respect for the efforts he has made/is making. But there are things that are different within me now...places that I can't go back to. And honestly, probably the biggest factor in me having not left yet has to do with the question of whether it is the marriage that is broken - or if it is ME that is irrepairably damage. In an odd way, it is often why I consider an A. myself - not revenge or validation...I just wonder if my heart still "works" anymore. The main reason I haven't pursued such is because I'm just not sure I want to know the answer to that yet - either way it may go.

It's as bittersweet as it has ever been....and yes, the guilt of it sometimes almost overwhelms me. I have choices...but I cannot see that any of them are really good. So in the meantime, I take ADs to quiet my heart and I also look for ways that I can grow as a person. It's a push-pull within myself that I must keep carefully balanced at all times.

Oh my God, I have been thinking of this subject all week.

My D-day was a looong time ago, and I still love my FWH and he still loves me. Everything on the surface looks like it's "back to normal" but we all know there is no "normal" following an A.

My kids are grown now and it wouldn't be so hard on them if I wanted to divorce but I think I would be divorcing for the wrong reasons.

You know the saying "where ever you go, there you are?" No matter if I leave or stay this will always be in "our" history.

Living alone or trying to find someone else doesn't matter because I will always be a BS.

I have lurked here for a while and this topic made me want to post.

My XH had an A, we worked through it, completely R and everything was fantastic. Then about 3 years later things went down hill. No A, but I asked him to move out. Not really intending to D but give him a wake up call. He happened to run into the OW after I asked him to move out but before he did. He told me everything they talked about and was completely open with me about it. Then she called information for our phone number and started calling. he would let me listen so I knew there was nothing going on but we still had the other issues. A few weeks later he told me that she wanted him back and that if I made him move out he was going to her. i told him to go and we are now D. They were only together for 3 months the whole time he was asking for R though.

wow thanks everyone I feel you are giving me a view into what could have been an alternate reality for me.

One at the moment I'm rather glad I don't have to tackle. But yes even in my new R I still remain a BS to a large degree. I'm only two years out from dday but I'm still having hurtles to trust that are extremely agonizing.

I wish there were more reliable statistics on infidelity, male/female percentages and divorce cause numbers. Should have added it to the census! Once you discover that your partner has betrayed you, they've rolled the dice on 'marriage over'. I agree that it takes time to process such a body blow, weigh the options and decide on a course. None of the options are easy. I put that statistic at 100%!

I actually said in MC that what she did ruined the M for me.

Her reply is that it was already ruined.

I guess that doesn't draw a real solid picture of our futures together.

I am one of those people who divorced after many years of a "successful" R. It was 6 years, actually. And my now XH said those same things, about how he'd changed and done everything in his power to prove to me he was sorry. But it wasn't actually about his infidelity any more. It was me seeing us in a different light. I wasn't unhappy with our M, but things were just not fulfilling any longer. I didn't look at him the same. I didn't trust him, not completely, yet I didn't question him either. I lost all respect for him and felt like I had become his mother, not his W. We were just co-existing and raising a child together.

I cannot say 100% that his infidelity caused our D years later, but I can say that the ideal of "Happily Ever After" was dead after dday, at least w/him.

There has to be more input on this very interesting subject. Anyone else?

P.S. "mouse".........I actually know more men than women that have divorced after they caught their spouse in an a.

[This message edited by TICKED OFF at 11:11 PM, August 5th (Tuesday)]

The other thing I wonder about is the loss of resilience in dealing with unrelated things that occur subsequent to the A. For instance, let's say a couple had financial difficulty or health problems or some other sort of stress.

I wonder to what degree does the residue of previous damage just put the marriage that much closer to the edge. In other words, the A certainly played a role even if it wasn't the only cause.

The reality is that any marriage to going to face challenges over a period of years. It's understandable that a BS might be more inclined to bail after going through an A and the R process.

My H and I are currently separated.....not sure if we will D but, I have lost any and all respect for him, and really, feel like I don't love him anymore, either. Right now I am focusing on myself, not the M. I want to fix myself before I even start thinking about R. We were happy before, and during, the A. Well, happy together, my H obviously had some issues! If we do D, yes it will absolutely be due to the A. I don't know how he could ever regain my trust and like someone else said, it's like there is a big hole in my soul. And in the M. I know you can "choose" to have a new M, but you know what, I don't think I want that. I would rather take my chances with a new person than stay with my FWH. I think the damage that he did to me, and us, cannot be repaired. I don't feel that I will ever get over it. I know I will be happy again one day but basically, HE BLEW IT!

i BELIEVE ONE HUGE ISSUE for a BS is that an A corrodes the margin of error in any marital R. In another words, all R's go through the peaks and valleys.

The sense of trust in one another carries each through the valleys. One can have the perspective of looking through the prism of the M and saying "OK, look at the great times we have had, we will get there again." This carries us through.

Once we have had to endure the pain of the A, even with a truly remorseful spouse. we lose the luxury of looking in the rear view mirror and seeing that resilience.

In my case, my W has not been particularly remorseful. I believe bringing up her A is punishing her, so I don't do it.

She acts as if it were no big deal, and in many ways, my fault. But I still feel it, and it has corroded my faith and trust in her, and my respect for her values and as a partner.

Too often, I hear "I did everything", where "everything" translates more accurately to "I did what 99% of married people do in marriage". Why that seems to be exceptional behavior that deserves special consideration, I have no idea.

I would bet this contributes more to the feeling of dissatisfaction in the end more than anything. I can totally see in the future if the relationship doesn't develop on a deeper level the BS deciding to move on. What your WS does to you and your marriage during and after the affair is premeditated, intentional and emotionally cruel.

It takes more than simple consideration to build a marriage, and it takes a hell of a lot more emotional depth to rebuild a marriage and a partner that has been nuked by affairs.