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I've been thinking about divorce. Is it ok for me to want to move on with my life without my BW? We've been married for 20 years and she has stood by me through depression, heart disease, and my destructive LTA . She's family in the truest sense of the word. I could point my finger at her faults as to why I feel this way and I'm sure that I could justify leaving her to myself. But the truth is, I'm just tired of living this way. It's just not there anymore.

After all the pain that I put her through, do I even have the right to leave her? I know that this is all about me and not about her. I just dont know what to do anymore. She acknowledges that she needs help but refuses to get counseling. We tried MC but she didnt show up for half of them. We just dont enjoy life together anymore. All she does is sit in her recliner and watch T.V. Its been 3 years like this. She's depressed, wont get help (says that she's afraid to deal with her issues), even says she wouldnt blame me if I had another affair (which I will never do). I try to help her as best as I can. I talk to her, I listen... Lately I havent been spending enough time with her because its breaking my heart. At what point do I say enough and start taking care of myself? I need some help. I dont want to do this anymore. If she doesnt get help, I really think...aww f*ck.. I dont know. I cant abandon her in her state. I dont know what to do. HELP!!!

BS here, hope you don't mind.

Are you in IC for yourself?

Was your wife depressed like this before your affair? You can't make her get help for this, she has to decide for herself if she can forgive you and heal and if she wants help for herself.

I am sure she is tired of living this way too. We BS didn't have a choice in our lives being turned upside down by our WS affairs.

You ask do you have the right to leave her in this condition? You have the right to leave her, no matter what, but are you sure that is what you want? Or are you just tired of her not being able to get over your affair fast enough?

Is your BS getting any help for herself? Friends, family etc.? Sounds like she needs some help and it doesn't really sound like she is getting it from you. What are you doing to show her remorse? Sounds like you have given up.

2x4 needed? You need to tell you BW how your feeling.

Reading over your old posts, it seems that you have been questioning D for quite a while. Your feelings haven't changed.

Your A story is different in that she encouraged your A even when you wanted out (your words, not mine)

Personally, I think you have the right to make that choice just as easily as your BS does. Don't stay married just because you feel you owe it to her. Eventually you will begin to resent her and that is not good.

Be honest with her, tell her how your feeling. If its hard to talk to her, print out what you wrote here and give it to her.

Hmmmm. Depression is a disease. I'll bet there were multiple times during your illnesses that she wanted to pack it in and walk away. It isn't easy to care for a sick family member. But she didn't, right?

IDK. I think you need to keep trying.

You can't fix her. But abandon her? Well, you did that already during your LTA. Don't rub salt into the wound.

I'm a BS.

She sounds like she needs help, but I want to point something out.

So did my WH during his self pity parties. When I discovered his affairs, it shocked some damn sense into him. Now he has some better self esteem, and will hopefully be better to me. But I was ready to leave in a heartbeat, still am in fact. I am not letting him drag me down with him.

Isn't this sort of the same thing? You can't make her change, not your job to. I had to be willing to destroy my marriage to save it.

We demolished the shaky building that it was, and are trying to rebuild with something better.

You ask do you have the right to leave her in this condition? You have the right to leave her, no matter what, but are you sure that is what you want? Or are you just tired of her not being able to get over your affair fast enough?

We dont dwell on the A anymore. She has forgiven me. I dont think anyone ever really gets "over it", and thats ok, its part of our history now.

I'd like to think that this has nothing to do with the A but IMO, she is suffering from PTSD that was caused from the A. Either way, I dont know how to help her and its frustrating me to the point of I dont want to deal anymore. I hate feeling helpless all the time. We talk openly about it and she tells me that she knows that she needs help but never does anything about it.

I'm whining. How do I help her?

Isn't this sort of the same thing? You can't make her change, not your job to. I had to be willing to destroy my marriage to save it.

You know, honestly, I could care less about our marriage anymore. It's her that I want to help because I still love her. Marriage or not, I just want her to be happy and get help. It's not about affairs or needs anymore.

FS: I apologize for saying this, but ...

She's a big girl. If she won't seek help, she doesn't feel like there's a problem or she doesn't feel like the "help" provided will be worth it to her. I could speculate as to the reasons she won't seek help, but that presumes there's an underlying problem and assumes a great deal about your BW that I don't know, so I won't.

Simple point: she's her own big person. If she doesn't want to change her life in that way, you can't make her ... which it kind of sounds like you are trying to do.

If you are feeling helpless and hopeless about the marriage, maybe she is too.. Maybe she's sensing you are feeling this way, and it's making her even more hopeless and helpless about it..

I agree it's time to have an honest conversation with her about how you are feeling.. Maybe some truth and honesty will bring a spark back for you guys. Maybe not. But it sounds like you are ready for a change, so I would give honesty a shot and see where it leads..

Good luck.

I would try to get her out of the house as much as possible. Go out to eat or a walk in the park. Take a trip some where fun and exciting. Depression sucks and it makes you so tired. Your affair probably desroyed her view on life itself. She needs to know you will be there for her thru sickness and health. Bring back the love you both had in the beginning of the marriage. Don't give up on her, she didn't give up on you.

Would you leave if she had cancer? Three to five years. Commitment. Good with the bad. You married for life, not just when you where first in love. You are supposed to support her when she is sick, not just when she is serving you. How about you act like a loving supportive spouse and show her that you are there to stay for the long haul. That is what marriage is about.

I'm sure it would be easier for you to walk away from the mess you created, how about show her what your vows really meant and stand by her until death do you part, not just until she doesn't make you happy anymore.

Would you leave if she had cancer?

Well, she doesn't, thank God. The comparison is not the same. If she chooses not to get help, I cant make her. At that point, I have to make a decision about my own life. We have been married for over 20 years and I will always love her and be supportive. She is my family. That doesnt mean that I have to accept her behavior if its destructive to all of our lives. I want to and have tried to help her out of love for her, not about what I want for myself. I have reached the point that if she doesnt want my help then there is nothing left for me to do. It's time to let go and move on. It's not something I want to do but it might just be the thing she needs to snap her out of it and start taking care of herself. IDK... its all confusing. I dont want to leave her but I want us to start living life again. If she doesnt want to, then I will have to start living my life apart from her.

BTW, I am the only one who can "make me happy". That doesn't fall on her shoulders.

I'll share a similar story about my FOO.

My father was diagnosed with bipolar disorder when I was 15. His particular disease took the form of long, protracted periods of deep depression (where he rarely left the couch---literally, he'd spend 23 out of 24 hours there most days) mixed with less frequent periods of highly manic phases.

During the manic phases he'd spend money (he put himself & my mom tens of thousands into debt without her knowledge); harass us (and later, after I moved out of state, my mom and brother) verbally and sometimes physically to the point that they had to hide behind locked doors to get away from him---and once he broke my brother's bedroom door off the hinges; and roam the community causing trouble---getting banned from almost every business in town including the library, and being arrested multiple times (disturbing the peace, menacing, disorderly conduct, etc).

Many times he was "pink-slipped" or involuntarily committed to a psychiatric facility. He was prescribed drugs that would help him---we knew this because for periods of time he was forced to comply with taking his meds and he was better---but he wouldn't take them unless he was forced. So he continued to get worse. He denied there was anything wrong with him. Or, he'd admit there was something wrong but laugh in our faces at how much the effects of it were hurting us as a family.

Eventually, my mother divorced him. She just couldn't take it anymore. Yes, she promised "in sickness and in health" when she married him. But she was unaware, at that time, of what she was signing up for. (They had many bad marital problems for years before the bipolar diagnosis.)

So I don't know the answer to your question. There's the "in sickness and in health, lifetime promise" answer, but there's also the "life is too short for this shit" answer. It's a personal decision. I do know that I believe in each spouse, regardless of "W" or "B" status, having the right to make their own decisions for their life.

WS here... I'm fresh off a fall. I have horribly done things to my BS for years.... No physical abuse but all of the emotional, mental and any other absolutely caused her physical abuse. She has forgiven me time and again and I have abused those chances. I am now in SAA and askew of other therapists and counseling.

Even after today me falling and hurting her again. She's still here.

I don't care how long it takes her to get over it, not be mad, anything she wants because god knows I have taken from her.

I love and am in love with my BS... My past actions may not show it but I know what is in my heart and head.

I love my BS and will wait and walk through Hades' burning lands for an eternity if there is a chance at any life with her and the possibility of gaining her love, trust and have her look proud at me again as her husband.

If you love her...truly lover her...nothing else matters.... You would wait and not cut bait.

You can call me Strydr

I'm a sex addict and a WS

If she stood by you through depression heart disease and a lta, why do you get to cut and run when things get bad? Maybe its the change of life for her, maybe you just need to love her through it. Maybe its your turn to stand by her in sickness, cause you apparently where good enough for her to.

I don't have much for advice, but I am a BS who has been abandoned after a 20 year marriage. I, too, suffered depression but admitted it and also lupus and chronic arthritis. For a long, long while, STBXH was my lifeline and when he had his own life's hardships, instead of working with me together, he turned on me.

I understand that you aren't having hardships maybe as he was-job loss, insecurity and so on-but I can tell you that as the abandoned spouse, I may never recover fully, nor our child.

It's only been four months since I learned the real reasons for the change in him-OW-and my life and mind are forever changed. He is already very annoyed that I am not healing faster and was that way during false R the very first week.

I am sooo glad to hear you questioning your thoughts, FS, for it means you have a conscience about leaving and that it's wrong. FWIW, I will wish forever that he talked to me -he never told me about OW, he snuck out in the middle of the night twice and slammed the door in my face twice-I don't know how your wife feels about you, of course, but for me, it has messed up my mind and blackened my heart for a very long time.

You see, one thing that I struggle with for myself and child is that he is the only one who had a choice and chose to ruin our lives without even letting us know face to face. I have never known such pain and I have never known such a sense of entitlement and such a jerk as he's become, now that he is away from me physically.

He hides behind electronics and cannot face me and bullies now.

Sorry for my long-winded story, but if you do have real caring for your wife at all that's left, I beseech you to really think.

And yes, the posts that ask if you've had counseling yourself, I agree with.

One thing that's happened here and with another family I know is that the husbands abandoned their families and do you know what? Years later, they are not happy, my ex included. Changing the people in our lives doesn't seem like it works other than a bandaid and for the other people it affects, it can alter their minds and hearts forever.

Yes, by being human you certainly have a "right" and in my mind, aren't any more bound because she has depression. Have you tried to engage her at all in special interests or maybe you have already?

My ex stopped doing that and it compounded my difficult feelings, for what it's worth to share that.

Forever_Sorry,

Did she have depression issues prior to the A?

BS here... no, it's not ok to move on without her...

If she is like me, she is screaming for her H to help her and love her and she is likely deep in depression... some of which you need to take responsibility for (not all, but some)....

She needs help now and it's obvious she cannot do it on her own anymore... if you feel she is truly depressed then it's time to get her help... her family may be willing to help as well...

I'm sorry, but I just don't feel that you cut and run when the times get hard... especially if she had stood by you when you were at your lowest points...

Did she have depression issues prior to the A?

Yes she did. It's a complicated story and not as one sided as I have made it sound. I've stood by her through a lot as well. I'm just tired. I'm not looking for happiness somewhere else, not interested in another woman or anything like that. The kids are all grown and I just want some peace.

Sounds like I've made up my mind and that I want someone to tell me that its ok to leave . Maybe thats the case. I'm just tired and feel like I am in prison.

I've been in IC for a couple of years and even my therapist thinks its time to let go and move on. That it might be good for Mrs. FS to stand on her own two feet and be responsible for her own life for a change. IDK. Just wish I had the answers. Or the guts to make the changes that I need to make.

ETA: I cant help her if she refuses help. I would never turn my back on her.

[This message edited by Forever_Sorry at 1:55 PM, May 19th (Sunday)]

FS, I'm coming out of lurkdom because I just can't let this one go. So here I go....

So it seems that you have made just another decision on that will affect your wife's life without communicating to her.....

You need to man up and have THE TALK with her and let her know where you are at with your situation. If you love her like you say you do, you will give her the opportunitity to have a say so in HER LIFE.

OK so she has depression, and may have had it for a long time. Well I know what that is like. Yes she needs to be the one to make the decision to get help. That is on her, but there are things that you can do to try and help her further. However you need to have the talk with her.

It is not fair that you have made your mind up without even talking to her that you are thinking about leaving if things don't change....

This is just cruel and selfish at this point in the game, and frankly from the sounds of it, it's something that you should know better....

Wish you and your wife luck. Please be kind to her and talk before you have the "my mind is made up and I'm leaving talk"