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I just don't learn. The Princess wanted to talk to me when she picked up the boys tonight. 13 has been getting serious about a girlfriend, and we wanted to present a unified front in setting boundaries for him.

Then she says, "13 tells me you have a pile of unopened mail on your counter. Remember that's what you were doing before you attempted suicide."

That's where I should have thrown a handful of crickets. Instead, I said, "This time I don't have the added stress of feeling unloved by someone I was desperately in love with."

Her response was an angry bulldog face, and, "I don't want to have this discussion." Fuck me gently, do I know that face.

The discussion was fine until I got uppity. I have to confess that when I said it, I was thinking she just might apologize. What'n fuck was I thinking?

And now I feel like shit. I felt like I had been making such progress lately. Now I'm pissed off, and just want to weep.

She doesn't get anymore looks into my heart. I've gotta stop this horeshit.

It takes a long time to reach the land of indifference and to untangle ourselves from their masterful manipulations. You will get there.

I would strongly suggest that you keep all communication about the kids by email, text, or, if she insists, by phone. Face to face is rough and that's when they seem to get the best of us.

She loves to try to bait you. Try to come up with a stock answer for when she gives it her all. Mine is usually "yep" and then the conversation ends.

Im so sorry. you may get an apology years later and even then it will feel good and make you cry. mine just did it this yr. 4 yrs later.

i think what you said was fine. but then I think you could have said, perhaps my mail is piling up cause I have been busy w my personal life and lack of sleep (with a big wink at her.) whether or not its true, it may make you feel better for her to not look at you as pathetic.

dont be mad at yourself tho. and perhaps think of a few one liners to stuff like that for the future.

when I hear bs lines or blaming, I just say "k." that seems to work well and make me feel good.

You will get there! Indifference is pretty sweet. Today, I realized that it would have been my 23rd wedding anniversary. It barely registered.

I've pretty much mastered crickets. But then, it's been 3 years. About the only time I engfage is when he's treating my kids badly.

Indifference is awesome, but I kind of liked your response. There's a lot to be said for calling a spade a spade. She tried to diss you and you gave back as good as you got (& won that little altercation). Crickets can teach WSs to shut the fuck up, but so can well placed smack downs. Your's was on the money

I don't think anything you said or didn't would have made a difference. The game is over For me I choose to hold off indifference and stay with anger. I like it here. You will be fine. All the best

I'm with cayc - I think you did fine with this one. The other suggestions about having a couple of short and standard responses ready for the future are good too.

And don't be so hard on yourself pass - we all fall off the horse sometimes. The trick is to just get right back on...((Hugs))

I thought what you said was fine. It sounded like, "shut the fuck up, bitch" to me.

Stop expecting an apology. If it does ever happen, I have a feeling it will feel very shallow.

Pass, seems every time you and she try and have a convo about the kids it always turns personal. I know all too well that scenario my brother. May I suggest you have no more face to face conversation with her. Keep it to e-mails and text from here on in. And don't use those forms of communication to lob verbal grenades at each other. One day it will end. But till then try your best to ignore her.

As SBB often tells me, "Don't expect in separation what you never got in marriage."

The Princess was totally incapable of apologies when we were together, so it really is crazy for me to think I'll get one now. That would involve her admitting that she has been wrong about something.

Thanks y'all. I really can't wait for sweet, sweet indifference.

Stick to email or text. Face to face is hard! Try to avoid it at all costs.

I don't know if I am at indifference yet but I am close and I am strictly NC. Ever since I made the NC decision and stuck with it, it has been liberating! I only answer a question that absolutely requires an answer such as, "Can I drop the kids off early?" Other than that, it's all crickets. And I never, ever contact him or ask him anything. Ever, if I can help it at all.

Pass,

You are doing way better than me with the crickets... But I must say I don't see anything wrong with what you said. She has no place in your heart as a caring soul, so you shot her down, as you should. You feel bad? Don't. Get up and keep going friend. Hugs to you!

This is a perfect place for a NIK-ism:

"They know which buttons to press because they installed the fuckers!".

I was a crazy spitting banshee for those first few months, brother. None of us get this right straight off the bat. Not on purpose, anyway.

I had to hurt myself enough to get to done. I don't want you to have to go through that too but I kinda think we all do.

She doesn't get anymore looks into my heart. I've gotta stop this horeshit.

Right you are.

This is going to sound weird but how good at faking a giant sneeze are you? I used this tactic on guy at work who is getting a little too friendly for my liking since he found out I was divorced (technically no but I prefer the fait accompli at work). A work conversation veers off course into banter and I bring out the Oscar-worthy sneeze and hold my face like I have a handful of snot - exit, stage left to the bathroom.

End of conversation. Like.a.boss.

It doesn't stop him coming around again later that day but its the best get out of jail card right now.

Funny as hell and it works.

Pass! Read my latest post. I'm right there with you, brother. Let's take it easy on ourselves. We are human, we are sensitive. They are barely, if at all. Deep breaths.

The best way to get to indifference is no personal contact. It takes awhile to get there, but eventually you will. It also has the benefit of letting them know they can no longer get to you. It is none of her business if you have unopened mail, 10ft high. If it is not kid related, say nothing. My XWH#1 tried it not too long ago when he found out that WH#2 and I were having problems due to his infidelity. He said something about he heard we were having problems. I did not respond at all to his inquiry and changed the subject back to the kids and acted like I did not even hear him say anything. My life is none of his business and I'll be damned if I discuss my problems with HIM. Keep the conversation about the children and do not respond. Until you get to a place of indifference, keep all personal contact at a minimum. If she wants to talk about the kids, tell her you are in the middle of something, but she can e-mail you later and you will respond and leave it at that. It takes practice, but you will get there eventually. It also has the added benefit of letting them know that your world no longer revolves around them and their opinions. It actually drives them crazy and is the best Karma that you can deliver.

Im in the middle on this one because I am dealing with the same issue smyself. I had been doing the crickets thing for the last few months and exploded on my STBXW last week. While you don't have to correct every stupid thing that comes out of their moouth some shit just begs and screams for a response. IMO, my response while probably not the best explosion, served to show her that the old 7yrs is dead and gone replaced by someone that can and will verbally defend myself. Since I can't legally or physically go flip over cars I just go to the gym and work out my agression on a different kind of "dumbbell".

That being said I am sticking to crickets going forward as well. Letting STBX know that I am still mad let's her know she still has headspace even if it's all fire and brimstone. I'm right there with you pass on that trip towards indifference. Let me know the way if you get there before me.

[This message edited by 7yrsflushed at 8:58 AM, October 21st (Monday)]

What a wench.

It's really hard, Pass. She sounds a little like the XPerv who wants to "talk" on his terms and then skip out again. There are always little digs, but in the background when he is with DD, I hear him compliment me. Wha???? I think it's throwing me a bone and I do not reply with words, just with crickets.

Maybe online there's a picture of one of these bugs we can print out and show it to ourselves whenever they're showing up?

Or a tattoo like DD has that's a faker that'll wash off to put on the inside of our hand as a reminder?

I did such a good cricket this weekend that the XPerv left sputtering and red-faced, but he crossed lines lately and finally muted me completely.

Do you know what he wrote? "I want you to talk to me. I want to be friends." With this kind of friend, no enemies are needed!

FWIW, I get apologies, but they're meaningless air noise with the A still going and the cruelty with it.

[This message edited by Ashland13 at 1:36 PM, October 21st (Monday)]

Yep, it's funny how they want to be friends now. The Princess wants to skip right over the part where she makes it right, and get to the part where I forgive her - not that she did anything wrong, of course!