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Ok, so I read everyones advice about not giving an ultimatum to her. I am so glad I am not acting and doing these things before I get counsel on them. In retrospect everyones advice makes sense, it's just that I am amazed at how fuzzy my brain gets when it comes to this and thinking clearly is no longer normal for me. We had another long talk and in doing so I have realized that she is not only using blameshifting to turn her affair back towards me but it is something she has always used in our arguments in our previous conflicts. I just never knew what it was and how it applied. It is like being slapped upside the head for being hysterically stupid! She had the nerve to tell me that I should get off my high horse and stop being the victim! She also told me she didn't like the fact that I was "sharing" our personal problems with strangers on the internet and in one of my very rare moments of clarity, I responded to her by saying That I didn't like the fact that she was "sharing" her mouth and her vagina with another man's penis! Needless to say she couldn't blameshift that! The conversation was essentially over after that, but at least my balls have dropped back down and I am not feeling like a pushover any longer. She still is not showing remorse, but I can see the struggle she is having internally and my confidence is growing daily as well as the callus on my heart!

She had the nerve to tell me that I should get off my high horse and stop being the victim!

And what if that means making that final break and kicking her out of your life forever? Would she be so insistent then?

Happy New Year I just spent the last six hours listening to how this "just" happened and I didn't want this, that I forced her into this because I was neglecting her! That she wanted to love me but I wasn't trying hard enough and she doesn't really love him he's just fulfilling her needs right now and fucking give me a break I sat there and played her game with her doing everything the way I shouldn't have and it just freakin hit me. I tuned her out and started thinking about all I have read here and all the support and wisdom you guys and gals have given me and at 6:02am I interupted her and I said you know what I have had enough, Fuck you! You are no longer worthy of my love and understanding! and I walked out! I have completely blown past angry to I don't know what. What I do know is I have more than earned my way out of this mess and I do not want to look back! I have been a naive fool for so long and I can guarantee you that if I hadn't have searched out for help here I would have been in this shitpile for a very long time!!! I feel like puking right now but, I feel better for some reason too. No more thinking for me until I can sleep!

Finally !!

You've taken a step in the right direction.

Now it's all up to your WW.

I think this is a great comeback," I responded to her by saying That I didn't like the fact that she was "sharing" her mouth and her vagina with another man's penis! ".

Really tells it like it is.

See your lawyer ASAP, in fact see a few, the more you talk to, the fewer your WW can hire.

[This message edited by toomanyregrets at 8:24 AM, January 2nd (Thursday)]

toomanyregrets gave some sound advice there

Here is the email she sent me after I told her F you, you don't deserve my love and understanding. Does any one have any thoughts or interpretations on this. Now that I am in full blown anger, nuclear meltdown stage, I see everything as negative and F it, and F you. So in essence I still can't think straight. Here is what she wrote... "Hi, I am truly sorry for all the pain I have caused you! I Never wanted to cause you or anyone else any pain. I can not change any of the choices I have made and I know I have made a lot of bad choices. If you think this is easy for me, or that I am not dying inside as well, you are wrong. To have to let go of so much history, you are a part of my family- how ever weird that may sound, is unthinkable to me right now. I am numb. I think- you think, I am having this wonderful grande time, (rainbows and unicorns is what you said) when the fact is I am barely functioning and it shows. Your right I am in a fog. I have no right to ask or expect you to be willing to wait for the fog to clear. You need a resolution/decision/choice immediately, but for me, to be put on the spot to make a decision right this minute, is more than I can handle. I have made so many bad choices lately- I don't want to make it worse, if that is possible. To make a pressured, pushed, hurried, impulsive decision would be a mistake. I am sorry- I need time, I am confused, I don't have an answer. I am in a big mess, and those kind of decisions are what got me here. I know I hurt you terribly and I do feel so so bad. To say goodbye and never have contact again, is also so unthinkable to me, but I have no right to ask anything of YOU. I am not going to fight you on your decisions because I know this is what you need to do for YOU."

I can't interpret this because I'm so angry,I am holding on to the anger so the old me doesn't do the usual obvious stupid thing. I don't know what the right thing is to do? HELP!!!

I read it as pure victim bullshit speak. See, she might want to believe she made impulsive decisions to have an A, maybe she did, maybe she didn't. THAT choice was her bad choice. It betrayed her vows (which presumably she did not make rashly), she betrayed you and betrayed herself. Telling her to stop NOW or get lost is not asking too much. Boo f-ing hoo to her.

Tell her not making a decision IS a decision. You have your answer. Bakery closed on your end.

So sorry stanley, she's clinging to a false self-image and image of her A.

Stanley----What do you want?

Be honest with yourself, and look at the best possible outcome from where you stand right now.

If you have had enough, and want to divorce at this point, then the path is easy from here. Through the state laws and processes, you work on dissolving the marriage.

But if reconciliation is the goal, in my opinion, you still have to work toward the path of dissolution....although it doesn't have to be as rapid as possible. It starts with you giving yourself ultimatums---how much you will or will not tolerate, as she "tries" to defog. I always believed in a set of bare minimums....rebuilding blocks....if you will. Things like No Contact, a verbal promise of recommitment to you and the marriage, Individual Counseling for her, and so on. These are things that we shouldn't have to ask of our exclusive partners, but alas, here we are....doing just that. But at least it is a starting point. Without these minimums, consider it to be a total LACK of commitment, and proceed toward the inevitable(divorce).

I will go into detail on my next post, but I wanted you to at least consider what I am saying. Don't accept the current status quo. Have her commit...knowing that there is a LOT of work along the way...or head in the opposite direction.

I totally agree with justwow, she's telling you stop playing the victim. What an insult. That right there shows she has no respect any concern from you and your feeling. She's well aware of what she's been doing. don't forget that and now she's playing the victim. Filed for divorce and apply the 180

Stanley - kick her out. NOW. Please. My WS is heading out the door tomorrow and I am going to lose all my retirement funds to support him financially for just over a year but I am holding my breath waiting for him to go. I found out about the A 3 years ago. I wish I'd kicked him out the night I found out and divorced him immediately. Once they repair the damage they have (and they have damage self inflicted not your fault!) then and only then, if you love her, can you even consider reconciling. IMHO.

BBW

PS hUGS and

She also told me she didn't like the fact that I was "sharing" our personal problems with strangers on the internet and in one of my very rare moments of clarity, I responded to her by saying That I didn't like the fact that she was "sharing" her mouth and her vagina with another man's penis!

was effing BRILLIANT.

PS and by damage I mean SHE has an ego or whatever problem, and needs help. You can't provide it. But she can drag you down. I was the codependent fixer in our relationship and I am now for the first time in my life having mental health issues. Do not go there, there be dragons...

The brass nerve. From reading her e-mail I gather she is saying that, in essence she cannot choose between you and the OM. At this moment she is in a deep fog and just cannot select the 'lucky' candidate. You will need to wait until she is in a better frame of mind, then you will be notified of her decision. Of course, she dispenses sexual favors to the OM while she deliberates on her situation.

Then she asks you to understand how much pain she is in knowing she is going to have to disappoint one of the candidates for her affections. Such arrogance.

The process of falling in love with the OM was not immediate, she allowed it to happen and so created the present dilemma.

I suppose she agonizes about being torn between two lovers etc.

I would file tomorrow. You should have more pride and self-esteem than accept such insulting behavior.

My response?

*Crickets*

Cut her out of your life without another word. Why? Because her response is a load of self-serving delusional crap. You're supposed to feel bad for her "pain". Is she for real? Do not get sucked into any kind of debate or discussion.

It should be simple. She should be able to see she made a bad decision in cheating on you with OM. She should be able to see undoing that decision is the right choice. She doesn't. Why? Because she doesn't want to give up OM or you. She wants more time to cake-eat. What she wants is for one of you to either "win" her or cut her loose so she doesn't have to be an adult and make the decision. These are the actions of a child. A thoughtless child who made a horrible mess and wants sympathy for feeling bad about the mess and then whines when told they have clean it up.

You deserve better. You've given her more than one chance to try to hold on to you. She is the one who killed the relationship you had. What you wanted her to do was to choose to try to build a new relationship. She won't do that. Move on.

Oh, and she claims she can't make a decision. Guess what...that IS a decision.

Brandon808 +1

She wants more time to cake-eat. What she wants is for one of you to either "win" her or cut her loose so she doesn't have to be an adult and make the decision. These are the actions of a child. A thoughtless child who made a horrible mess and wants sympathy for feeling bad about the mess and then whines when told they have clean it up.

I whole heartedly agree, but pulling triggers and setting things in motion is hard. I have no doubt I could "win" my WW back, but I am not playing that game. It's me or him, make up your mind. Period. I'm not interested until then.

stanley - I feel your pain. I've got a string of texts that are almost verbatim what your email says. I think it's Chapter 4 in the cheater's handbook. And it's all bullshit. I'm confused?? Heard that a million times. So, I unconfused my WW.

I told my WW to get out. I've felt better since. I also told her I've got a time limit, and then I'm out. That limit is coming up soon. You have to push them off the darn fence, or they'll just sit on it forever (what it seems like in my case).

You have to "draw the line in the sand" and stick to it. Otherwise, you're setting yourself up for this to happen again one day.

Good luck brother.

Hi Stanley,

Welcome to SI. I am so very sorry for your pain.

I can't interpret this because I'm so angry

Let us help you.

IMO, what her bullshit letter says is this:

I need to buy time to see how things are going to work out with the OP. He is still with his wife, and I need to see if he will commit to me and dump his wife. If he will commit to me and dump his wife, then I am going to dump you Stanley. But I need time to see how this will play out. Because if I dump you right now, and things don't work out with the OP, then I will have no one. So, I have keep you, Stanley, on the hook until things are settled.

Stanley, you MUST come down hard. You can not waiver. The only hope of saving this marriage (if that is what you want) is to be willing to lose it.

In my case, it wasn't until I saw a lawyer, and then moved out, that my H realized that I meant business. He suddenly found his 'remorse', and was literally on the floor, crying, holding onto my feet, begging me not to divorce him.

Stanley, "you must do the thing you think you can not do". Eleanor Roosevelt

Stay strong Stanley, you can do this.

PPGA

[This message edited by painpaingoaway at 8:52 PM, January 2nd (Thursday)]

Her inability to deside is her decision. She cannot give up her OM and commit to you. Tell her that. Reply with something like:

"If you cannot deside to be with me, then you're telling me you cannot be without him. I cannot accept a relationship with you on those turns. If you need time, you got it. All the time in the world. The D papers will be sent shortly. Good bye."

Then crickets. Let her stew.

[This message edited by Twitchy at 8:14 AM, January 3rd (Friday)]

Staley......

Your wifes fog, you want her out? heres how:

Dude.....does the OMs wife know of the affair? Have you talked to her?

Your wife is NOT a good source of this information....cheaters lie.

One more question....are "they" still in any contact....any at all???

R...should you choose that.... WILL NOT happen if they are in any contact...

Your wife is a cake eater....

To make a pressured, pushed, hurried, impulsive decision would be a mistake. I am sorry- I need time, I am confused, I don't have an answer.

This is WW code for "my OM hasn't left his wife yet"....

You have the power to turn off that oven - and take away her fork.

You need to knock her off that fence....she needs a reality check. She is disrespecting both you and your marriage....

My wife sounded just like yours.....till I had her served papers. Set your limitations - convey them to her - then....back It up. I heard the same old bullshit....blameshifting, the rewriting of our marital history...

I NEVER once believed that crap either.....as long as she is in any contact with the OM....or believes that soulmate bullshit....R will NOT happen....

You have 3 in your marriage - time to get your ass out. You filing for divorce will NOT push them together - hell, theyre together now....

Your wife is in a ego stroking, escape from reality...shits and giggles affair - till her fog lifts...shes just humping your leg....I think its time for you to quit trying to reason with her - with the unicorns, rainbows and fairy dust she got up her ass - you can not negotiate with her.....of course theyre soulmates - otherwise shes got to accept that shes a slut....

got her off that fence - you do not have to take this....

keep us posted...

reread the healing library...hit the 180....hit it hard....

Bufffalo

It didn't take you WW long to make the choice to cheat on you, so why should it take any longer to make a choice to R?

Give her 24 hours, no more.

Give her 24 hours, no more.

Agreed. And that's being generous.

I agree with Brandon and Buffalo.

Yes your WW is 'confused' because she has conflated feelings with reality. You kicking her off of the fence will clarify that distinction.

'Needing time' is ridiculous. You have a marriage already, she already supposedly chose you, there is no new contest. That being said, as your WW is completely irrational and self-delusional, she probably truly believes that getting more time makes sense. She is not acting out of cold rational manipulation, but as an immature ninny like Brandon suggested. A spoiled child.

You need to be firm. You don't need vitriol or anger or cruelty. You need just firmness, resolve and clarity. You have been married long enough for your WW to decide if she wants the M. 24 hours seems to be enough time.

Plus, when you enforce your boundaries and kick her off of the fence, you will find yourself filled with more self-respect and as a more attractive human being.