SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

First, big huge hugs. This sucks. I am so sorry you are going through this.

A few questions.

1. Do you support this woman? How is she hanging out with OM all day long? I assume since he is a SAHD, his OBS is supporting him too? How convenient.

2. Close friendships between people of the opposite sex when married are suspicious. Period. It's not normal to have daily contact with someone you are not married to of the opposite sex.

3. Love letters? GAG.

Here is what I would do:

Unequivocally state that you will not be second fiddle to some loser. She is free to pursue freedom, just not as your wife. There is the door.. go through it. And by the way, don't expect any financial support.

Document Document document.

See a lawyer, or two or three, develop a plan of action. Get comfortable with finances. You dont have to execute the plan, but have it ready.

Go cold on her. Stop talking to her. Stop pick me dancing, it doesn't work. Let her know that this isn't your idea of marriage and if she isn't willing to change, see a counselor and work on this, you are moving on.

You can't negotiate this any other way.

Big Hugs.

I'm certain this was an EA only, but even if it turned into a PA, I feel like I could care less at this stage. WW has literally destroyed me with what she did, and I can't imagine ever getting over it. D is all I can see on the horizon.

I totally get this, BTW. My H had an emotional affair and to me that was almost worse, he turned from me to someone else. That was as bad of a betrayal as anything. Took a lot of therapy for him to see that but he did eventually.

I'm hardly the person to offer you any advice, so I offer you my support instead. May you find strength in every step along this difficult journey and peace in your future.

goalong

it seems you are not checking on WW any longer. And that prevent you from triggers.

I have to say I'm doing well in that department. I used to never be able to resist checking on her, and wanting affection. That's one weakness that I had towards her throughout, I love her touch. She's always had a way of making me feel good and happy. I've stuck to my guns ever since she told me she didn't love me. I'm not really following the 180, but it's very clear to her that I'm not interested.

We were out with the kids today in the car, I was driving, and she surprised me by reaching out and started rubbing my back as I drove (something I used to love). I didn't even flinch. Is this a fucking game of I love you, I love you not!?

[This message edited by arbuom at 7:23 PM, September 1st (Friday)]

The rubbing?

That's an insult.

superchump

Thank you for the support!

This is what's fucked up about my situation. She claims that it's over with the OM, and as far as I can tell, it is. The only thing that I can't confirm is if their are still emailing. I doubt I'll ever find that out because I told her a while back that breaking NC means divorce.

So telling her that I don't play second fiddle doesn't apply as far as she is concerned. The false R hell that I’ve been in, is best described by Bigger’s “inactive infidelity” concept. That’s a perfect term to describe it. But putting all that aside, she solved the problem for me last week by telling me that she doesn’t love me anymore, and never will. That’s all I needed to hear!

The only thing that I can't confirm is if their are still emailing. I doubt I'll ever find that out because I told her a while back that breaking NC means divorce.

So I take it she still isn't being transparent?

Do you have access to her phone , email, and all other electronic media?

If not, you need it...if she won't then the A isn't over, period, so treat it as such.

The only way to effectively R is with complete transparency.

My wife knows that hiding anything from me ends in D, no matter what...yours needs to understand this too.

OrdinaryDude

So I take it she still isn't being transparent?

Nope. Notifications are still off on her phone, and her excuse is that she prefers it that way.

One thing I forgot to mention from our last discussion (when she told me she didn't love me), she said that "she was entitled to her privacy". So transparency is the last thing on her mind right now.

Another thing that has been very clear to me ever since this A started, is that WW has been behaving as if she is single. So in light of that, WW thinks that anything she does shouldn't affect me. As an example, one of the things that completely BLOWS my mind to this day, is that WW doesn't understand why the "love book" upsets me! She thinks it shouldn't.

Do you have access to her phone , email, and all other electronic media?

If not, you need it...if she won't then the A isn't over, period, so treat it as such.

The only way to effectively R is with complete transparency.

Can you see the contradiction in those two quotes?

This is something that I've found very confusing on here ever since I've posted my story. Everyone says that you can't have R without complete remorse, and the full truth (or transparency), yet I'm still being asked to keep digging. Why? How would having access to her electronics change either of those two conditions? Isn't it true that unremorseful WS's will admit to as much as you can prove? So she'll admit to whatever I can uncover, but what about the full truth? And she's definitely unremorseful. I was told that I was afraid of finding out if it was a PA. Same two conditions still apply. What changes if I find out it was a PA.

I can completely understand (and totally agree with) that if R was even a remote possibility, then leaving no stone unturned would be an absolute must!

Does that make any sense, or am I out to lunch?

One thought that I've had on my mind. I saw the excitement that WW had for her "friendship" with the OM, she thought he was wonderful, it was similar excitement (if not stronger) to the one she had for me when we first started dating. Even if I dug and found everything that I needed to know about the A, I will never know if she was (or still is) madly in love with the OM. I find that profound. I guess that's what happens when you lose trust. How can I continue a life with her not knowing who occupies her heart. How can I share everything I have with her when I don't know if I'm the number one person in her life??

Do I have no self-worth?

[This message edited by arbuom at 5:46 AM, September 2nd (Saturday)]

You should be the most important person in the world to her unfortunately it seems your not even a close second

The sheer contempt of still ensuring her privacy says it all your pain and suffering has had no effect on her empathy for you

As I already wrote dating another man as if she was single as if you were just some incignificent random hanging around along with the privacy shows this going no where fast while you sink into a very horrible place

Do you think it might be time to draw a line in the sand and rescue your self at least.

bobdobalina

Do you think it might be time to draw a line in the sand and rescue your self at least.

It's absolutely time.

I've already started marching our marriage to the gallows. There is no turning back now. I have one more lawyer to see this coming week.

Execution day is around the corner.

Best of luck and strength to you

As I wrote early on you have an unremorseful WW and so you are acting and proceeding accordingly. Keep on the path. See the lawyer and move forward with the D.

If a Remorseful WW shows up some day you can then decide for yourself if it's too late for R.

Can't remember if you are in IC. Having someone to talk to might be worthwhile for you to explore.

Strength to you.

privacy - closing the bathroom door to poop.

transparency - open and sharing without secrets.

your ww has proven she doesnt deserve the trust to keep her phone inaccessible. she abused the trust before.

ask to see her phone. no warning, no time to run and delete whatever. her response will tell you tons.

run drfone on it to recover deleted texts, etc. if she skypes there is a program that can recover this too. google lay store to see installed apps to look for dodgy ones.

a condition should be open electronics with no passwords, no deleting browser history, etc

Your intention is to divorce her. Time for snooping and detective work is paused indefintitely. Have her served. The true test is what she does next. Does she freak and beg you back? If so and you want to consider reconcilliation there are steps that must be taken. For now the 180 is a must. Not doing the 180 is sending her the signal that you are fine the way things are. She thinks you are back under her thumb. Literally you are accepting back rubs. She thinks you're an idiot for believing her bull anyway. You should have just gently removed her hand and fake smiled at her.

Have you downloaded the books you were advised to get. Your position is weak because you havent understood why all this is happening.

What changes if I find out it was a PA.

Arbuom

It gives you a more dramatic reason to get a divorce. Friends and family will have a more difficult time objecting. I may have missed something but as it stands now your wife will spin it that you’re breaking up the family due to inappropriate flirting.

I saw the excitement that WW had for her "friendship" with the OM, she thought he was wonderful, it was similar excitement (if not stronger) to the one she had for me when we first started dating.

Arbuom

To understand this search for a TED TALK by Helen Fisher: Why We Love Why We Cheat.

What changes if I find out it was a PA.

Since you have almost given up and nothing much to lose, you can test WW by saying if you do not come clean or do a poly that will be the end of marriage.

I agree with arb's view of this - an affair is an affair whether it was physical or not. Since it looks like it's headed for D why even rock the boat at this point? You'll just make her angry and more likely to fight in a divorce.

The goal right now is TO BE THE BEST HUSBAND IN THE WORLD. Still run the 180, but don't be cruel, let her do WHATEVER SHE PLEASES. You are making her fat and happy so that when she gets legal paperwork from you she'll be least likely to put up a fight.

Then you want her happy because for better or worse the better you can coparent the better off your kids are.

Stevesn, william, Chappie, Michigan and goalong

Thank you all for all the support! You don't how much that means to me!

Sharkman

I agree with arb's view of this - an affair is an affair whether it was physical or not. Since it looks like it's headed for D why even rock the boat at this point? You'll just make her angry and more likely to fight in a divorce.

The goal right now is TO BE THE BEST HUSBAND IN THE WORLD. Still run the 180, but don't be cruel, let her do WHATEVER SHE PLEASES. You are making her fat and happy so that when she gets legal paperwork from you she'll be least likely to put up a fight.

Then you want her happy because for better or worse the better you can coparent the better off your kids are.

I can't thank you enough for this. You've hit the nail right on the head, and reflected exactly how I feel.

I really want to get out of this with the least amount of pain. God only knows how much I've suffered in the last year. I know I might be dreaming, but I really want a speedy amicable divorce for the sake of everyone. And the last thing I want is a crazy WW.

Also, this is something I haven't mentioned before, but it's gonna make a HUGE difference for me mentally to file first. I want to have the last word. It may sound stupid, but this woman robbed me of so much self-worth (I know that I'm at fault for that), and I want to leave with something left for me to stand on. Until I get my ducks all in a row, which shouldn't be much longer, I don't want to give her any hints.