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You dont realizt it but you hold all the cards. Everything you need to say can be said with actions not words.

You have all the proof you need, you have lived through it and blithely watched it happen.

What you dont have at all, is a remorseful formerly wayward wife.

She is still trickle truthing you, and only making enough concessions to match the threat level of your actions. Then you go to sleep again, and she further gaslights you.

She is showing no genune remorse whatsoever. By the way you cannot make someone remorseful. Bringing consequences can help them become remorseful, but only if their core person has a still workig moral conscience.

Winning and argument, or getting a win by enforcing your will are all a waste of time until there is genuine remorsefulness.

I get the feeling that she just feels that it is just, "cheaper to keep him", not that she wants a honest relationship with you, or feels like you are irreplaceable to her.

Honestly I dont see how you save this and become someone she repects, and someone whose feelings she cares about.

Dont fight with her and think you are making progress, take action, and when you get honesty about what she has done, and willing transparency (without threats), and the hard work of investing inthe relationship, then and only then will you be making some progress.

You are in danger of missing the whole point of reconciliation.

[This message edited by Decorum at 5:24 PM, December 28th (Friday)]

The only thing worse than a cheater is a blatant, remorseless cheater.

Divorce her and save yourself a lifetime of doubt and pain.

[This message edited by LivingWithPain at 5:42 PM, December 28th (Friday)]

To build on Biggers comments. Ask her if she wants to join you on your journey out of infidelity....

Add her to out her money where her mouth is. Ask her to sign a post-nup. She is already the bread winner, so you will be getting some form of alimony. Put in the post-nup, that if she falters in any way that triggers you to D after this point, that your alimony payments will be increased by a set amount. For example 25% more per month. You want to be reasonable with the offer. Consult with a lawyer to learn more about this and others if things go south. Knowledge is power. Knowing about D will give you a perspective on how you want to proceed with R if she shows to be a worthy candidate for it in the future. Presently she is. Blameshifting in any form shows that she isnt ready for R.

Shit really hit the fan now!! Asked to look through her phone she said if i did it would be the end of our relationship! she handed it to me and i started to scroll through messages she got frantic and said she wanted it back and i said do you have stuff to hide on here that will hurt me etc? she said yes and was frantic about getting the phone back i refused and she tried to physically take it . I said no im keeping it. She said if I read it that is the end of our relationship? I said what do i do then? trust you to not do it again? Came back on me that i control her etc. I took the phone and locked myself in my car started to look. she came out of the house and approached me. I said if i give you back the phone right now what happens?

She said she didnt know. Stupid me gave it back she immediately smashed it and drove off after a bottle of wine. She said she had already approached family violemce hotline and had a plan to make a safe exit. That hurts I'm not a violent man i get upset rarely angry but she is scared i will kill myself her kids etc. I would never hurt her or the kids thats not me. If i didnt have kids I probably would be here today would have ended it years ago

[This message edited by AnonGuy3333 at 6:40 PM, December 28th (Friday)]

This tells you everything you need to know. The only difference you giving her the phone back made is you will now never know the details, but her reaction is enough.

Go directly to Wal-Mart and pick up two or more voice activated recorders and keep them on your person at all times. She's about to file false domestic violence charges against you.

She just declared war on you and your marriage. Time to end the marriage and get out of infidelity.

Dude, why did you give it back to her. Why are you letting her act as if you're the abusive one here. Stop indulging this woman!

She is a known cheater, who acts as if she is not only a safe partner but entitled to complete trust in a situation where most everyone would feel uncomfortable and question the relationship even without such a history.

Stop enabling her, stop indulging her, stop trying to hold onto this relationship. She full on admitted this is another affair and you knew it, rather than find out by looking through it you gave the phone back so you wouldn't know and could hold onto the belief it's not and there's something to salvage here. There isn't!

Get a paternity test for the kid(s) too while you're at it. Stop being a complete chump. This woman is nasty beyond belief, abusive and worse.

AG, I agree. Get a VAR and keep it with you always. It sounds like her and the POS OM are trying to set you up for domestic violence charges.

So now you know without a doubt that she has no interest in being transparent . Getting her to promise to break no contact won’t do any good because her word doesn’t mean anything . Her actions tell you everything you need to know.

Get the smashed phone and remove the Sim card.

Buy a replacement phone and insert the Sim card.

kids are 100 percent ours 99.9% sure this emotional affair was not physical but was definately leading there eventually. I have her laptop still but cant get past her facebook password

[This message edited by AnonGuy3333 at 8:22 PM, December 28th (Friday)]

What I think you will find at the minimum is that your WW was sexting with masturbation, orgasm is physical.

99.9% sure this emotional affair was not physical but was definately leading Bthere eventually. I have her laptop still but cant get past her facebook password

Interesting, based on what you posted alone I would be 99.9 % sure it WAS/IS physical, they've had plenty of alone time, remember physical also includes kissing, groping, BJs, etc., but the way she acts and the fact that she's a proven cheater and a liar makes me put my money on a full blown PA, but that's besides the point now, your WW is not wife material and doesn't give a dam about you and your M, please drop her like a bad habit and file for D, what exactly are you trying to save here ? cut your losses and save yourself from more heartbreak and infidelity, life's too short.

Dont know how i feel now angry hurt confused relieved all rolled into 1

[This message edited by AnonGuy3333 at 3:18 PM, December 29th (Saturday)]

ok Anon, she is a serial cheat. We know this.

Things were so bad on that cell phone that you would dump her in her mind if you saw them, then isn't that a sign to you ??

Did you take Robert's advice and get the sim card ?

Now she's driving off drunk to see the OM and indicating and setting you up for false DV charges.

And you are trying to justify in your head that this isn't true ? What devious person does that kind of thing ?

You are handling everything wrong in my book so far.

You needed to be decisive and early on. You missed that opportunity.

So now what is your gameplan ?

Did you look for the Sim card ? Did you get another VAR to wear on you ?

Did you make copies of important documents, backup clothes and a few important valuables and move them to a place of safety for when she kicks you out based on a false charge ?

Have you talked any further with any attorney ?

Proceed to divorce and be aggressive and defend yourself. Otherwise, you will lose your kids, lose your house, lose your self esteem and squander an actual chance to be able to collect alimony from her and secure your future.

So what are you going to do ? It's your life, not mine

Cheaters are going to cheat. She has done it before and she has probably done physical stuff with this new guy. Every time you tell her you are depressed or really upset she is turning the tables on you and telling other people. She is actively cheating and she is running a side campaign to destroy your reputation to anyone who will listen.

You are digging a deeper hole. It is time to protect yourself and and your future custody of your children. I think you should see a lawyer.

Basically my wife friended a guy down on his luck after nearly killing himself.

My mental health nose dived to the point of nearly ending it.

Ironic, isn't it?

She continues to carry on an A with this asshole right in front of you, and makes you feel guilty about it.

What did she (or the two of you) do back in 2006 to deal with that A? Based on her current behavior, probably rugsweep, right? She obviously didn't work on boundaries or her "whys". She's acting more like his wife than yours. He needs a ride? How about I take the day off and at a minimum go to a pub with him. He's a damn adult, let him fend for himself. And sexting him while sitting right next to you? WTF?

How much more of this are you going to stand for?

There is no need for any more proof on her FB or phone or laptop. You saw the "I'm topless" stuff, YOU KNOW she has been over there alone and drinking with him, you KNOW she's had previous affairs. You know she is having an affair now. If you REALLY need more, get a PI on her asap.

You need to blow this up NOW to her family, your family, your friends, etc.. Tell them she is cheating, and you are going to divorce her and then DO IT.

Sounds like you rug-swept this in her first affair, and now it is back to bite you in the ass. Divorce her and get on to a better life. She IS NOT who you think she is and she is NOT your friend. She will continue to drag you down. She is not worth it -- she is a cheater.

Your wife is a serial cheater. She has no respect for you as a husband. She will never be a safe partner for you. She knows that her cheating is going to hurt you yet she continues to do it. Then she claims that you wanting the truth about her current affair is somehow detrimental to the marriage.

Do yourself a favor and get out of infidelity.

Get that broken phone and take it to a repair shop. Odds are they can recover all the info and texts even if they cannot repair the phone.

It is extremely sad to see a BS that’s too afraid to take the necessary steps to get him/herself out of infidelity. You are giving your wife the necessary power to literally destroy your life. Please, please re-read k8la’s post & take it to heart:

Go directly to Wal-Mart and pick up two or more voice activated recorders and keep them on your person at all times. She's about to file false domestic violence charges against you.

She just declared war on you and your marriage. Time to end the marriage and get out of infidelity.

Your wife is your enemy and you need to take action to protect yourself from her.

[This message edited by JpnHeartBreak at 4:18 AM, December 29th, 2018 (Saturday)]