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At the surface level, this is a boundary issue. The familiarity she is presenting/projecting is over the top. Especially given that you've not indicated any desire for a friendship, etc.

With that said, if your entire intent is to find out if she is a OW. As Psychmom stated, play it cool and casual but if she is an OW, expect that she will be lying and probably not admit anything.

What I would do is mid way through the casual conversation (knowing best when to incorporate it), insert the topic in an innocent manner. Such as "you know WH name speaks so highly of you and talks about you so much, one of my friends questioned me as to whether or not the two of you were having an affair, can you believe that? Then laugh as though its ludicrous. Then watch her body language and eyes. Does she shift her eyes away from you before and during her response), has she been sitting still the entire time and now she starts tapping or puts her hand to her neck, etc. Then listen to her reply. At that point if she doesn't admit too it, there isn't much you can to other than follow with "I myself have wondered about that, from your perspective is there any truth to that?"

Just my 2 cents

Meeting in a public place. If she admits to an A with him, I may hug her. The whole situation surrounding this woman has been strange from day one. Looking back, the thought of him giving her a swan shaped vase and one red rose is almost more shocking to me now. Cause she was sad her husband had passed 8 months before? With no card? Plus he made two quick calls to her that same morning. Then her calls to me, usually starting with "Hi Girlfriend! How are you doing?" I'm not her girlfriend! The most telling thing was shortly after he finally confessed to her being a close friend, I told him he was going to call her, on speaker phone, and that I wanted him to thank her for a recent business cheque she had put through early. It was two days after Christmas. Before he could call, he raced down the stairs. I was distracted for a few seconds then realized where he went, with his phone on him. I followed him down the stairs quickly and he was urinating in the downstairs bathroom. He came out and I asked him what he was doing. He said peeing! I said, in the downstairs bathroom?? We have two upstairs bathrooms and one was literally two strides from where he'd just been. Then he came up and called her, and the normally very extroverted lady was quiet and simply said oh hi...like it was the most boring thing in her world. She didn't say hey, how was your Christmas right away or anything. Not her typical personality at all. This has been on my mind since this happened in December 2017. Today should be interesting, indeed.

Good luck Starmoon!

Remember, don't let her control the conversation. Don't come across as desperate for the info, you should keep it looking as if you already know and really just want "her" side of it... otherwise she might just be using this as an opportunity to gaslight more (with his prior coaching).

Brennan's advice to watch her body language, eyebrows, even her hands will be important to get the vibe of whether she's being truthful or not.

After the meeting, I'd even recommend letting her leave first & then perhaps trail her (from a distance) for a bit, just to see if she immediately calls him and/or heads to meet him.

I truly hope that everything becomes easier for you after this no matter how the convo goes.

So I met her. She came across as very charming and more attractive then I thought she was from her facebook pics. She told me he had in no way ever come across as pursuing her and that if he did she'd cancel their business relationship and slap him as well. She said she is in no way attracted to him whatsoever. Hmmm...her deceased husband was about the same height but chubby and not really a handsome man at all. My husband is younger, very handsome and slim and fit. She and my FWH have all the same interests...from almost the same age to motorcycles to old cars to country living to grandchildren to eating healthy and taking vitamins. But she's not at all attracted to him? One possible big thing...as we were getting up to leave the restaurant, a friend called her and she said, "I'm just finishing a long lunch, I'll call you back. It went good" "It went good"? Is that what you say to a friend who just happens to call when you're having lunch? Nope, don't think so. Now no further ahead than before. Think she's lying. Think she may be a really good liar.

Cheaters do not get to have friends of the opposite sex. And yes, women will befriend someone just to see "what's she got that I don't have?" It feels like you two are both doing it since I have never heard of meeting someone for lunch that is not my friend. It's odd. It reminds me of h.s. where two girls fight over a boy and try to best each other while the boy just stands there.

I so would not be a part of any marriage where I had to befriend my wayward's female friend to see what they are up to.

Boundaries.

Boundaries.

Boundaries.

"WH, she seems lovely. If I find out you two are in touch in any way at all--even the teensiest text message--your stuff will be in garbage bags on the lawn and I'll be moving on! Love you, sweetie. Goodnight. Don't forget to lock the front door."

And then do it.

I would not, no how, never play these games with another woman in my marriage.

It took me 3 weeks to dig out of him that she had become a close friend, behind my back, after he'd already had a 2 year affair with another OW. I was livid and finally ended up calling her

To be clear, here is where you went wrong.

1. Behind my back = garbage bag his stuff

2. Called her = why? Who cares about this woman? It is NO women in his life.

3. You did not enforce your boundary.

Then lunch?

Yikes.

You are barking up the way wrong tree.

If you keep giving him more chances, he will keep having inappropriate relationships. He will. Because you always buy his stories. Even if you don't, you just punish yourself with stress and anxiety and sadness. He sleeps fine and gets his extra lady ego kibbles. Only you suffer.

I have a thought. That was your husband on the phone.

Was there a pause before “it went good?” Could someone have interjected a question such as “I was just calling to see how your biopsy went?” If no pause then that suggests the caller knew what the lunch was about....

And DO check his phone records to see if he called her. And check credit card records to see if he may have bought a burner phone. Search his car and install a VAR.

Starmoon, check his call log. See if he called her during your meeting.

I still think you should keep digging. I wouldn't trust this woman one bit. But even if you find nothing, despite a mountain of circumstantial evidence that all points to this being AT MINIMUM an EA, what boundaries are you going to put in place to address this? What consequences will your WS have for this inappropriate friendship? And why should you accept him having a friendship that he places above the security of your marriage and your feelings?

I don't want you to think for even one second that you can't do anything about this even if she is telling the truth. He's acting as if this is an EA/PA. He's putting her above you and the marriage. You need to do something about this for your own peace and sanity even if the evidence ends here.

On the other hand, if you find out she is a full fledged OW, how do you see this playing out? What outcome are looking to get?

Well, I have enforced boundaries since his last DDay over 6 years ago. I found out about the friendship with her a year or more after he had given her a rose, in a swan vase, in an email where she thanked him. He said he did it be cause she was down about her husbands death 8 months before. I went through hell thinking he'd had another affair which he denied and denied. I had no proof it was anything else, and then finally called this woman to ask her about the friendship. Convinced there was no A, I tried to forget about it all. She started calling me and after a while I decided to take her up on her offer to go out for lunch. She had known him through business for 15 years or more. It could just be friendship. She did say several times including looking me in the eye and repeating again that at no time was there anything inappropriate between them. The reason I don't fully believe her is because she did have several messages come in during which she'd look at her phone and smile to herself. Then that last call where she said she'd just finished a long lunch and "it went good". It was a very odd comment. She talked a lot about herself during lunch too, bragging about riding motorcycles and skydiving and loving to have fun.

In the past several years I have monitored his phone, and put a VAR in his vehicle. I watch him like a hawk. Now I check the iPhone finder. But if a man wants to cheat, he will. Any phone number can be forwarded to another phone and of course the iPhone finder will show the actual phone where he's supposed to be. If he is lying, you have to find proof. My FWH is an amazing liar, looks you straight in the eye and unwavering tells you a lie. Is he doing that anymore? God, I don't know. He also turns silent during serious discussions, so you're left with nothing at the end to go on. I only hope he's being faithful and if not that I find out, soon. I just want the truth, please.

Can you really stay in a marriage that you describe above? Can you wake up every morning planning your agenda of monitoring and policing? Can every kiss come with wondering where else his lips have been?

Let’s assume you never, ever find any evidence of further cheating. Can you still live checking up every day to make sure you have not been fooled?

This sounds like a horrible way to live, cheating or not. It's enough to leave. I would not need any more. I don't need to win or get his agreement. "Dude, I feel crappy in this marriage, you always trying to get away with crap. You should want me happy, so bye!" That's that. The only one you need to explain to is your gut.