SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I agree with Stinger.

I am a firm believer in disclosing the truth. If you don’t disclose the truth, you will ultimately and inevitably be the victim of a whitewash of the history of your marriage!

“Oh I tried for year after year. But I could no longer take the emotional abuse!”

“Oh, I never told anyone, but I suspect that he was having affair after affair from the very beginning of the marriage.”

Personally, I would disclose. And like Stinger suggested, keep it relatively low key. Don’t come across as vindictive. Just tell the facts.

As for the kids, a betrayed spouse should ALWAYS keep it age appropriate! But keep all the evidence in case they want to know the real truth once they are old enough to know it.

Worse case scenario, just tell them that it was your fault. You didn’t like her new boyfriend. (Just a joke to lighten the mood here)

[This message edited by Newlifeisgreat at 2:39 PM, October 20th (Tuesday)]

SeeYa:

That is totally understandable. If we think we had some semblance of control at the onset, we can believe that we could have perhaps changed the outcome. Unfortunately, this becomes an exercise in futility as the outcome is already at hand. Furthermore, the variables in the equation are far more complicated than X+Y=Z.

It sounds as though you had no idea she had this fetish. That would have required transparency from her. Instead, she concealed who she really was from you...for years. Her concealment, along with the urges fueled by denial, are likely how the affair went from 0-100 so quickly. But...that is my speculation, and I am an internet stranger, so take it for what it's worth.

Lastly, you owe it to yourself to do one thing, and one thing only: to identify ways in which you could be more true to the man you want to be.

Eventually I think you need to tell the truth to your kids and in-laws and etc.

While you can argue about punishing or not, I believe the consequences should be more certain.

One of those consequences is the loss of reputation at large and respect within the family. The length of the affair and that it was physically sexual and who the OM is should be enough.

If you rob a bank your name gets published and you lose some of your standing in society, how much more so should you lose your standing when you destroy your own family?

Another powerful reason to tell is that you don't want to be part of their secrecy scheme, or in a sense they have turned you into them.

I don't think it is a great idea to sit someone down and tell her you are divorcing her when you are already separated. My wife actually attacked me. At the very least, you will have to go through hysteria.

She thinks you are going to R,so what do you think her reaction will be when you say you want to come over and talk? And then drop the bomb?

Seriously, why not just talk on the phone? Do you think you owe her something?

SeeYa,

Getting it out can be cathartic.

Better it be here, on an anonymous forum, then to have it running circles in your brain all day.

What happened over the past three years to damage the amicable nature of the parting? Her choice? Just curious as I look ahead.

Thumos: Short question, Wall of Text to answer, and I don't want to thread jack, this is about See Ya. SO I sent you a reply via PM.

KoN

While it has really done a number on me by reading the info on the phone, I think in the long term it was beneficial. A lot of people never get the amount of detail I have and I guess that's a double edged sword. But right now its pretty bad. I have taken the week off. I can concentrate on the lawyer search (update on that below) and really get these things out of the way so I can get back to as much of a normal day to day routine as fast as possible. It also helps me by not having to deal with all the bull from work. They won't leave me alone and are wanting to negotiate my staying and all I want to do is leave.

In a very perverse way you are one of the lucky ones. While you cannot unsee what you saw and read, any doubt that you should divorce this woman is quelled, I assume.

You know who and what she is.

A question for everyone...whats the best way to approach informing the STBXWW about the divorce. I have told her I plan on divorcing her but I am sure she thinks its just a threat right now. I am of the opinion that I need to sit her down and let her know face-to-face. Try to be civil about it as long as I can to try to make it more likely we can come to a mutually agreeable plan. I fully expect her to get an attorney but before that maybe lay the ground work for a more amicable split.

No. You're dealing with a crazy person.

She is not going to be reasonable/amicable/etc. she is going to be crazy.

You're putting yourself at undue risk and there is a huge risk in getting caught up in her lies - she will lie, you will say that she is lying - she will swear she isn't, you get angry as she lies directly to your face, the potential for fireworks is too great.

And fake domestic violence reports are a real thing.

I realize this is probably not a realistic approach. But to me cold serving her papers is a broadside that shocks and then more than likely will produce anger that might poison any civility between us.

What civility brother? A woman who stabs you in the back, then stabs and twists it further once you realize she was stabbing you, then lies to you about stabbing you further for years, then melts down when she sees her co-stabber... I don't see the civility.

You're being civil. What she is right now is in desperate self-preservation mode. That is not civil. That is trying to save her own ass.

Serving her papers may push her into crazy insane mode.

As far as I can tell, crazy insane mode is already there, just barely restrained. It's coming no matter what you do.

You cannot guide or control her. That should be evident by now.

If I can approach this in a way that we can talk it out and, I know this sounds manipulative, leave a little glimmer of hope of possibly later on we try to date or something afterwards, it would make her more rational. I have already asked my lawyer and she suggests to wait and let her work up a proposal and then she and I will discuss it. She has seen it work (sitting down with the STBX)more than you would think but has seen it go really really bad too. But I would like to get others perspective because you may have experienced or think of something I have not.

I urge you to manipulate her in any way to get what you need out of this, but to not put yourself at risk. Being around her is putting yourself at risk. Particularly when telling her the end is upon your relationship.

The prudent move is to just serve her.

Any carrots such as "divorce then date" can be dangled after she has processed her shock for a bit.

Just my two cents!

Morning Brother;

A question for everyone...whats the best way to approach informing the STBXWW about the divorce.

Have a face to face with her at the home when son is out and about.

Just lay it out that:

"I have started the D process as I cannot handle the continuing lies that the R was built on".

She will interject with her version and side of the relationship; so to try to continue to work on herself to R.

Then just get the burner phone and place it on the table. Again engage in conversation that: "I have seen all photos and videos, read all messages, it is burned into my mind and cannot accept R. But you and I can move forward together for a non contested D for the benefit of the children, public record and mutual respect for each other in this time of turmoil and continued betrayal.

I will always have a love for you as the mother of our beautiful children; but not as a woman who I can spend the remaining years of life with in a loving two way relationship".

If Mr Angry rears his ugly head. Time out re coupe, re breath and when anger is back in the box continue. When you depart contact her family and have them come round for her support. Provide a version appropriate version for the children and have them contact their mother again for support and love.They will always be her and your children.

One day at a time.

[This message edited by Buffer at 12:02 AM, October 22nd (Thursday)]

I like Buffer's approach, but I wouldn't allow the physical phone anywhere in her presence, certainly I wouldn't put it on the table where she may grab for it and a physical struggle may ensue. Even if it is in your hand, pocket, etc. she may desperately try to get it from you.

If you decide to go that route, maybe just put a picture of her burner phone on your phone, perhaps with a choice screen displayed on the screen of that picture.

Do not put the phone anywhere near her. I wouldn't bring it if you feel you must have an inperson conversation with her.

I’m pretty sure he put the burner back after downloading it’s contents.

Anyway SYO, I like the approaches mentioned here. Gives you lots of options.

Honestly I would keep it even simpler. Here are my thoughts and it doesn’t include talking about the lies (well not much anyway) or the burner phone and it’s contents which I recommend you reserve for later if necessary or even after the D if not.

Just sit down with her alone but perhaps in a public space away enough from people so no one can overhear.

Wife. This experience has been awful for me. I’m sure it has been for you as well. And while I do feel you are in pain, I want you to know it cannot compare to what has been inflicted on me. I trusted you. And then I gave you the gift of trying to rebuild, and then you destroyed all the work by what happened when you saw him.

What do you think. No need to bring up the lies or what you found. If it works, and she agrees, you can discuss how the process will roll out. Let her know she’ll be served next week and how mediation or whatever will work.

I’m hoping she can see the value in the way you approach it and not make trouble, especially if she wants a chance down the road.

And after the D finalizes and months or probably years from now you discuss the possibility of trying to rebuild, if you want to at all, you can start by discussing the messages you found, and what those meant and how you need to see her become someone who would never do those things again.

It’s a long shot you’d ever get to that point. But whatever. Leave yourself open to all possibilities for now. The real objective is to have as smooth a separation and divorce as possible.

Just my thoughts on what I would try. Use it along with the advice here from everyone to craft your own path thru this.

Good luck.

[This message edited by Stevesn at 2:05 PM, October 21st (Wednesday)]

If you could take Buffer's and Stevesn's advice and meld them together you would have a good roadmap on how to confront her.

I would also say something to her to the effect of "When looking through the videos and pics on your phone, it is obvious to me that you are only truly sexually satisfied in a dom/sub relationship, and that your kink is being sexually humiliated. Well, you know I could never do those acts for you, nor could I ever bring myself to treat you the way your OM does when you have sex. I will never be able to be that kind of partner for you, and that's why it is in your best interest that I am letting you go..." or something to that effect.

[This message edited by Westway at 1:32 PM, October 21st (Wednesday)]

I like Stevesn's note, but to me it falls into the Mike Tyson quote of "Everybody has a game plan until they get punched in the nose" category.

The thing is if you don't let her know that you know more, she will swear on a stack of bibles, her family, etc. that there is nothing more.

At a certain point you have to drop on her that you know she is a liar, that she does not respect, you, herself, or her family, and that she has fucked things up past the point of no return.

So by all means try to resolve it without mentioning the evidence, but I would have it in reserve to smack down the lies that are sure to come your way and probably infuriate you.

At a certain point you have to drop on her that you know she is a liar, that she does not respect, you, herself, or her family,

100% agree. Since you're pursuing D it doesn't matter much until after she signs the papers. Then let her know that you know the full truth and go from there. Regardless of whatever else happens she needs to make a full accounting for what she did, and the lies she told to continue her affair, if for no other reason so that you can both move on from this, either separately or together.

SeeYa’s lawyer said not to let on about knowing if the existence of the burner phone just now so I think that using it is off the table.

You might get further with a more mysterious “I have been made aware you have not been honest with me” which allows you to let her know there are reasons for you doing this now, but still without any indication of how or what you know.

However you do it, I hope that it goes ok and just know that you will come through this.

From our conversation the things I will be on the hook for as it pertains to him I would have done anyway.

Yes, you would have paid for your son but she is still partially responsible as far as the numbers. It will be an expense on your part that is factored into the equation, making her alimony and other items add up to less. Don't just throw that away as a 'would have anyway' as far as she and her lawyer are concerned. She gets less because this is a family expense. I'm sure your lawyer has it factored in but just in case.

Again thanks to everyone. I am reading your responses and appreciate your time and honesty.

Just to clarify a few things.

I DO NOT have the phone. I put it back where I found it after getting all of the information off of it. There could be deleted data but at this point it does not matter.

The list of people that are aware of her affair three years ago, other than the two of us, is as follows:

Her mother. How much she knows I do not know but she is aware that it was physical.

My father. He knows everything except what I found on the burner phone. I'm not sure telling him would be prudent. He never really got over the news of the original D-Day and it has been very tense between them. I will tell him eventually though.

Her best friend, who is also her first cousin. She was told by STBXWW about four months after, during a phone call. She appears to have known nothing about it prior to that.

Our daughter. She over heard the phone call I mentioned above. The call was detailed so she knows quite a bit. We were not aware she knew until after the episode last month. At the time she found out three years ago she was 16.

Our son. He was told last month. Since I had moved out it was best he knew why. Our son is 17 and will be 18 in January.

Jerry, my best friend. He knows everything from the original D-Day right up to what I found on the old burner phone.

I DO NOT plan on doing anything until my lawyer says so. I just want input from others that have been there. I do like Jambomo's wording

You might get further with a more mysterious “I have been made aware you have not been honest with me” which allows you to let her know there are reasons for you doing this now, but still without any indication of how or what you know.

Chances are I will use a combination of all these or, I may actually get to a point I just don't care. I doubt that will happen but who knows;

Small update

Posting yesterday got me a little frazzled and I had to take a break. I took care of some errands, did some chores, and did some exercise and by the early evening I was exhausted enough to go to bed early. I woke up this morning and of course my mind went to all the stuff I had seen and read on the burner phone. I am now more than ever convinced there is a huge piece of this puzzle I am missing. Will I find out what that piece is? I don't know. I met her 24 years ago in an emergency room. I had cut my hand and needed stitches. She was doing her clinicals for her RN degree. A lot has happened since that afternoon. I never dreamed it would end. Definitely never dreamed it would end like this. But, I'll set that aside for now.

Thankfully, our son is in a solo session tonight and I won't have to interact with the STBX. I'm just expecting a summary via email from the therapist. If it goes well I expect my son to request to end the sessions. He feels like that the initial shock was what had him act so out of character and honestly, he appears to adjusting faster and better than I am.

What is it that makes you think you are missing a piece of this puzzle?

I DO NOT have the phone. I put it back where I found it after getting all of the information off of it. There could be deleted data but at this point it does not matter.

Can you get it back?

It's community property in the marriage. It doesn't belong to her alone.