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Pineapple posted 7/15/2017 13:23 PM

Hello all. First time poster, found this site a few days ago. Twenty years married, two kids together - one in college the other HS. My first marriage, her second.

D-day for me was ten days ago. W stepped out to go shopping on the holiday, something just seemed wrong about it when she was leaving the house, couldn't put my finger on it exactly. Usually she says where she is going but didn't this time, and hesitated just the slightest when asked. Turns out she was just going shopping afterall, but the strange feeling led me to look at her phone in the middle of the night later when I awakened and came downstairs because I couldn't sleep and found it sitting on the table. I know her code which she shared with me a few years ago, but don't think I've looked at her phone but maybe once 2-3 years back.

Found text messages with OM, former coworker, married guy with no kids. He recently left their work for a new job a few months back. Text messages included W asking OM if he had work reasons that would take him to an out-of-town location where she occasionally takes overnight work trips. My heart dropped into my stomach when I saw that. W used emoticons with OM, never uses them when texting me. Could sense from tone that W missed seeing him. I took pictures of the texts to save just in case.

I have always had an uneasy feeling about the OP, met him a few times, former combat military alpha male type, purple heart recipient. Wife has always insisted he is a friend only. I told her early on I wasn't very comfortable with her being friends with him. She arranged for me to meet him a few times over dinner with her so I would be more comfortable that he was an okay guy. They took lunch almost daily for years. Semi-frequent group happy hours that I'd hear about. A handful of overnight business trips where they'd both be on the same trip (at least there were a handful that I've been told about, no idea how many other trips he might have actually been on where I didn't hear about it).

After seeing the texts I told my wife I was extremely uncomfortable about her friendship with him but didn't let on I'd seen her phone. She assured me they are friends only and she hardly hears from him any more since he left for a new job. Confronted her again the next night and asked if anything was going on with them. She again denied it, and I asked if they really rarely talked or texted any more. One thing led to another and she agreed to show me her phone. Next she tells me she'd deleted his contact info and all messages earlier in the day. I ask why she did that and what the recent messages were. No real good reason about deleting things other than I was making her nervous and she didn't want anything misconstrued. She says the only text in the past month was about a mutual friend of theirs asking about him. That's it no other texts. Are you sure about that I ask? Stares straight into my eyes: "Absolutely. There's nothing to worry about. I love you. Nothing's going on. Nothing's ever gone on. I would not lie to you. I don't find him attractive. I'm not even sure if his body parts down there even function due to war injuries."

Then I confront her with the screenshots of the texts. Her story changes. Oh, I forgot about those she says, I didn't mean anything at all by it. I wasn't even thinking that it was out of town. I was only thinking of meeting for lunch. Me, I'm not buying her story, get upset and tell her I'm not an idiot. You don't go fishing around to meet a guy friend at a place where you're overnighting away from your husband. She says that yes, this looks really bad, but truly she forgot about it and didn't mean anything. What else don't I know I ask? Then she admits she met with him while I was taking the kids on a camping trip the month prior (she doesn't go on those trips because she doesn't like to camp and enjoys some alone time she has always maintained). Lied to me about it, said she was taking a girlfriend from work to a concert when in fact she went with OM. Alarms are going off at this point. Tells me she has been going to happy hours pretty often with him alone and sometimes groups from work for quite a while and lying to me about working late instead.

So our relationship has been in crisis mode since then. As appears to be the norm with people going through something like this, I've had that horrible sick feeling in the stomach now ever since. Haven't been able to sleep well for over a week, not working out like I usually do every morning early. Very sad, struggling emotionally now on and off throughout every day.

Last night I took her phone and used software to recover deleted text messages. Because her phone is so full, I think a lot was unrecoverable. But I didn't see much of anything. It didn't even find the messages that were there recently that I had taken pictures of.

W says our marriage means everything to her, vows to drop all contact with OM. Insists that there was never anything physical out of marriage. What's funny is she cites her lack of sex drive as evidence, but now in trying to make up to me she has shown me a sex drive the likes of which I have never seen from her in our entire relationship. So I know she can be that way. She begrudgingly admits how I could view her behavior as an emotional affair, but does freely admit that she was wrong to get emotionally close to another man. Says she'll agree to whatever terms and bounds I set. I've told her no more alcohol without me, no more happy hours. NC with OM permanently. At one point, oddly, she asked me to hit her as punishment. I'd never do that, never consider it, told her as much and brushed off the suggestion. We've been talking a lot now ever since, both of us acknowledge we've grown apart some over the years. I think she carries some strong resentment because I pushed her hard to get her to go back to work several years back after I supported the family on my own for a decade so she could stay home with the kids when they were younger. I don't think we've ever totally been the same as a couple since then. Last two years I've had some outside stresses on my life, I tried not to bring them up to my wife since I really don't want to bring stress into our lives, but eventually I did talk with her in hopes of getting some moral support from her. Instead she just got angry, really dumped on me, and tells me now that afterwards she said demeaning things about me over this issue to the OM. I found some hints of that in the other texts that I saw.

I plan to get to see a MC with her once we get back from an upcoming family vacation. Still, despite all her efforts to make up with me, the fact that she's actually been extraordinarily nice to me for a whole week now, opening up sexually with me like never before in twenty plus years together, and a very poignant email that she wrote asking forgiveness, I feel this recurring horrible unease that I can never truly believe her account of things. I want to believe her, but given the lying and deceipt, it's soooooo hard. I can't accept someone would lie and deceive to cover up only friendship. Never ever thought I'd find myself in this place with her. Ever. I've tried so hard all these years to be a great dad and an understanding husband, standing by her side through her medical issues in the past, being there when she needed it. Really tried to shoulder the load since she returned to work, fix dinner for the family during the week since my work is closer, dropped the kids at school, took my son to sports practices, even coached one year, take care of the house, the pool, the yard, the finances, the bills, much of the grocery shopping, etc.

And this is my reward. This is tough. I'm struggling.

Dorothy123 posted 7/15/2017 13:42 PM

Welcome to SI.

So sorry that you hurting but I'm so glad that you did find us.

Your wife is engaging in TT (trickle truth).

She will only admit to what you can prove.

Most WS (wandering spouses) will do this.

Most likely she did have sex with the OM more than a few times.

I'm so sorry.

Please go get tested for STD's.

I will copy and paste my response from another post because it I think you may find it helpful too.

"I want to leave with some threads of mine that I think you may find helpful.

Your obsessions are normal.
"Top 5 things you obsessed about? Dday til now"

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=597356

It is very normal to obsess about the A all day , everyday for a long time.

Here is proof.
"The A Has Taken Over"
http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=606592

The physical symptoms of the A that you are having are normal too.

Here is proof.

What physical symptoms of A did you have?

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=597986

Here is how long the physical symptoms may last for you .

"Physical symptoms "
http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/archives.asp?tid=524902

Sending you hugs, peace and strength.
Walking with you."

Others will come along with more advice support

Kalma posted 7/15/2017 14:01 PM

She is definitely holding back on you. And people don't usually ask to meet at a place away from home like that unless they have done that quite often in the past. So prepare yourself mentally for what you will do when she finally confesses the whole scope of her relationship with OM. Right now she is only admitting to what you know about. Perhaps it is time for you to nuke this A? Tell the OBS, thats the only way you can be sure its really over. And check the phone bill, although thanks to iMessage and various apps (looking at you - Words With freaking Friends) you can never be sure they are not covertly communicating as those do not show up on the bill. I wish you luck. Get your ducks in a row and nuke them from orbit, its the only way to be sure.

[This message edited by Kalma at 2:01 PM, July 15th (Saturday)]

TimelessLoss posted 7/15/2017 14:07 PM

Pine,

So you know she is a practiced, confirmed liar. She has consistently minimized the extent of the affair. The truth is trickling out of her mouth only based on what you know. She is finding the sweet spot where her disclosures don't go beyond what you know or can prove.

99.9999% likely that they had sex. That's what adults do in an affair where there is physical proximity. Her remark about "I'm not even sure if his body parts down there even function due to war injuries" confirms it in my mind. She is a liar, she minimizes and gas lights you.

Says she'll agree to whatever terms and bounds I set
Just one right now. That she has a one time opportunity to be honest and transparent about her fidelity to you throughout your marriage. And that she is willing to take a polygraph so you have a basis to begin to trust her after all of her lies.

Drive a stake into the affair and kill it by contacting the other betrayed spouse (BS). Don't tell your W you are doing this. Understand that it is likely that your W has already told the OM that you know about the adultery and they are matching up their stories.

The sex she is giving you is to hoover you into accepting she she has told you and rug sweeping the affair.

Your not going to find much support here for MC at this point. It will become a mindfvck that shifts blame to you for being a factor that cause the affair.

Please know that nothing you did caused this adultery. It is all on her.

Stevesn posted 7/15/2017 14:52 PM

You each need IC, not MC at this point. And it should start next week.

My first thought if I were you is that I'd immediately kick her out of the house.

You can't NICE her back into loving you.

You must take control here. Show her this will not be tolerated and if she wants any chance with you in the future she can't ever be in contact with him again.

Of course physical violence can never be tolerated but you must show her how hurtful she was in her actions and deception.

You tell us if she is truly remorseful. If she is not there is no hope for R which you may not believe now but it will take 2-5 years until she can make you feel safe again.

Tell us if she is exhibiting these behaviors. If no to any of them then you need to show her you are not ready to work on this until she is.

- She would be inconsolable with the thought of how she was the cause of so much pain to the person she loves most in the world.

- she would be begging to know what she could do to make it right.

- for you she would want to let everyone know it was her that screwed up, not you.

- she would want to read books on how to support her BS

- she would be in IC as much as possible to figure out what went wrong with her and how she could do this to the person she loves most in the world

- she would feel your pain more than her own and put your happiness ahead of hers.

- she would give you an open timeline of everything that happened.

- she would write you a letter of apology highlighting how she must have made you feel

- she would focus most on your well being, ignoring her own

- she would realize what the OM really is and start being sick at the thought of him/her. She would start calling him/her names like POS for how he helped her destroy her life.

SilverStar posted 7/15/2017 15:13 PM

OM is married, you say? You need to tell his BS about her husband meeting another woman on out of town overnights. Tell OBS what you know and provide whatever evidence you have. But do not warn your WW you will be doing this - she and OM will put together a story.

This is not a revenge thing. The OBS has a right to know what is going on in her own marriage, and it is morally right to give her this information. Secondly, when OBS is in the know, it can help destroy the A as the AP now has to fight to save their own marriage.

Pineapple posted 7/15/2017 15:33 PM

Thanks for the responses and understanding. I really appreciate everyone's feedback and input. Yes, deep down I can feel that there's a very decent chance it was a PA. I wouldn't feel sick to my stomach much of the time if I didn't sense that very real possibility. I guess I'm holding onto hope that it wasn't. This probably isn't an unusual reaction if I dig into all the resources here. Sorry it's hard for me to post more thoughts, I can't get more than a minute alone today it seems like. I will continue to read the responses, the linked threads/articles you've provided in response and dive into other resources here when I have the chance.

Sharkman posted 7/15/2017 15:39 PM

How to get in a good position

1. Expose to her boyfriend's wife. This will kill the affair DEaD. You wife has admitted to at least an emotional affair. That's enough.

1.a. Do not tell your wife you are doing this

1.b. You will quickly find out how no contact they are by if she finds out you exposes

2. Have her write a full timeline, no lies

3. Take her up on her 'anything you want' promise and poly her with that timeline in hand

If you do those three things you MAY have some hope

Marriagesucks posted 7/15/2017 15:48 PM

I haven't had the chance to read through all the replies... but my very first thought was to ask your wife to take a poly. That could be very telling and damning just from her reaction. Always listen to your gut. It's trying to tell you something isn't right. You certainly have reason enough to suspect something with all the red flags. I think that would be by far the easiest way to find out without all the drama of searching and watching etc. This crap will drive you crazy if you let it. If you go the poly route be sure to follow through. Many here have gotten parking lot confessions as an end result, and sometimes they still lie even during the poly.

Good luck!

Pineapple posted 7/15/2017 15:58 PM

Did ask W if she'd be willing to take poly. She said possibly but she wants to research it first to find out the false positive rate.

Few days ago I offered one time only shot to forgive her if she'd fully confess to everything. Said I would not forgive later if I learned more. Obviously we are at the point of only acknowledging improper friendship, some lying and deceipt. So that tactic did not work. Or there was no more to confess. But obviously there is more to be disclosed. I don't have near all the details even if the latter. She seems to have real good memory of some things, and then gets conveniently fuzzy. Hence the former option is most likely.

I didn't want to confront her initially, I wanted to watch and wait and see what I cold learn secretly. Unfortunately I wear my emotions on my sleeve and the issue ended up needing to be forced. She can look at me and tell exactly how I feel pretty much any moment of the day.

Probably can't post again until tomorrow. Family buzzing around me, and then I am tied up. Will keep reading responses from everyone. So greatly appreciated, thank you all. Thank you.

Phoenix1 posted 7/15/2017 15:59 PM

Welcome, pineapple. I'm sorry you are here, but glad you found us.

Please spend some time reading in the Healing Library (top left). There is a wealth of information there. Also, read the two posts at the top of this forum (Tactical Primer and Newbies). You are amongst thousands (sadly) that have walked in your shoes. We get it and understand what you are feeling. There is also a tremendous amount of experience here to tap into. Right now, this is your safe place to share and vent. Don't tell your WW (wayward wife) about it.

Trickle truth is a soul killer, but very common amongst waywards that have been found out (my ex did it ad nauseam). They will give just enough info to corroborate what you can prove, but nothing more. Every time you uncover something new you will get the same, "Oh, I forgot about that." Waywards tend to follow a fairly predictable script. It is so predictable (in many cases) that we refer to a mythical Cheater's Handbook they all follow.

Please prepare yourself for the likelihood that it was a PA. Sometimes asking them to take a polygraph can result in last minute parking lot confessions (but be prepared to follow thru if you do go that route, even with a confession).

Also, be aware that you may not always receive feedback you like or agree with. We have a saying here to take what you need and leave the rest. Just know that it all comes from a place of caring and understanding. Many simply want to help you avoid many of the pitfalls they fell into.

You are just starting on a long road to recovery. Your emotions will be on opposite extremes for a long time to come, which is why we refer to it as a rollercoaster. Buckle up because it's gonna be bumpy!

But you've got an army of almost 60,000 that have your back. We are here for you around the clock. Lean on us.

((Pineapple)) <------ (that's a hug )

[This message edited by Phoenix1 at 4:03 PM, July 15th (Saturday)]

Sharkman posted 7/15/2017 16:28 PM

He research of the poly will clearly tell her they they're not reliable.

She's already back pedaling. Trickle Truth straight from the dictionary. At least it's overt. If it wasn't you'd spend mo the ripping your hair out

Marriagesucks posted 7/15/2017 16:31 PM

She said possibly but she wants to research it first to find out the false positive rate.
This is another red flag when their more worried about false positives than eleviating your fears. She should jump at the chance... after all she admits to being emotionally involved for sure. You can get a lot out of that just by watching her reaction. Bottom line is she should be more than happy to take the poly to eleviate your fears and prove no wrong doing on her part. If she refuses to take the poly you would have no choice other than to play detective. And that certainly is NO fun and is quite draining, and could take months.

As others have said call the OM wife. That is the number one way to kill an affair. You certainly have enough to go on already to do that. And you just might find some more information. If you call OM wife DO NOT tell your wife you are going to do that or your wife will give OM a heads up.

Marriagesucks posted 7/15/2017 16:38 PM

By the way... suddenly getting constant... and good sex is called sex bombing. Its a common ploy to get you to forget about her indiscretions and move on.

Pineapple posted 7/15/2017 16:45 PM

One more item then I truly need to go for day. There was one potentially damning text I found last nite, forgot completely. Wife walked in on me moments after I found it and I was attempting to restart my heart at that point (figuratively speaking of course).

Nite of OM's goodbye party,W texted me at 7:30pm and said "got here late." In hindsight, gee, I wonder why she was late to the party? She texted me a pic from the party at 8:30pm. W sent a text to OM at 9:05 pm that was either a pic or emoji, unable to tell that.

This next text was the killer. I forgot because my wife walked in the room right as I saw it and started talking with me about it, started getting somewhat aggressive about the whole thing of me reviewing old texts. W downplayed this next text saying OM was referring to party nite, happy hour. Here is what he sent her the following morning:

"Last night was great as always. Enjoy [city where W was taking kids for the day] it should be a beautiful day."

I know, when I saw this it was worse than the initial text I saw from my W to OM that kicked this all off. Then wild sex from W ensued with me and I forgot all about this gem. W explanation could make sense. Or the obvious. Which is how I read it, and I am sure nearly any disinterested 3rd party would see that text, too.

I have to go now for real. Check in tomorrow. Thank you for listening and your help.

Marriagesucks posted 7/15/2017 17:01 PM

Last night was great as always.
Yes... a very damning text from OM. You certainly got enough to go full steam ahead and push hard for the poly. I suspect she will refuse so your next step should be to call OM wife. Don't let your wife find this site as you don't want her to stay two steps ahead of you. Seen that happen several times.

Adlham posted 7/15/2017 17:08 PM

I'm going to second what everyone else has said.

Also, the big flashing red light with alarm bells going off (this is way past a red flag in my opinion) is her wanting you to hit her as 'punishment.' Not that violence is EVER acceptable, but if getting her to admit to an emotional affair was like pulling teeth, that seems like way over the top in terms of her feeling the need to be punished. I could totally be wrong but to me that just screams that it went well beyond emotional and crossed into physical.

I'm sorry that you are here. I'm sorry that I believe you have barely scratched the surface of her infidelity. I hope for your sake that I'm wrong.

Ponus18 posted 7/15/2017 17:30 PM

Oy that text is pretty clearly damning. And the worry about false positives in a poly? Please.

I think you know where this is going.

I would insist on a poly. It's not optional.

I would also put a VAR in her car and see what that produces. For sure that's what I would do.

Hang in there buddy and steel yourself for the worst.

Sharkman posted 7/15/2017 17:34 PM

Your gut is telling you what the truth is

nutmegkitty posted 7/15/2017 17:56 PM

She said possibly but she wants to research it first to find out the false positive rate.

HUGE red flag. This is a stalling tactic. If she was telling you the truth there would be no reason for her to worry about a false result. Additionally, if she was telling you the truth her answer would have been YES, not "possibly".

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