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Shattered & Heartbroken

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SaddestDad posted 3/6/2019 11:20 AM

Surv, what's DARVO?
That's a good question. Main AP is not Jewish.
The other one (which, truthfully was lesser severity than the main one)is part of the Jewish community but opening that up would also cause us to be shunned and excommunicated.
I still have not determined a way to have the OBS #2 told in a way that doesn't ostracize us for life.
Pureheart, thank you for the kind words!

It's been a month since DDay and last night/today I have slept more than ever. Last night, slept almost 10 hours & today I slept another 5.
Still having fucked up dreams... but today I slept through them.

Is this normal??

farsidejunky posted 3/6/2019 13:09 PM

DARVO

Deny Accuse Reverse Victim and Offender

It is a tactic/technique to gaslight.

SaddestDad posted 3/7/2019 11:38 AM

Gotcha. Thank you, FarSide.

Yesterday was odd for me. It was a good day in terms of us - we even went to pick up my new wedding ring that she bought for me... and yet... I was feeling like shit all day. Just depressed and not wanting to do anything. Was moving like molasses even when I was getting ready to go get the ring with her.

It's the exact ring I wanted when we first got married, which I compromised on because she didn't like it. The first of MANY compromises from my side that continued over the years. It looks perfect and I know it's heartfelt (plus I don't have to look at my original ring and feel that it represents a falsehood) but I just can't seem to get happy.
I'm trying to. REALLY trying to... can't even get out of bed except for going to the bathroom.

We're doing so much better and I feel that all of the truths are out - she's been working on her timeline a little at a time and we go over it with each chapter... she hugs me and cuddles (all of which she never used to do) and we have been having more sex than ever before (again, what she always shied away from).

I know it's all from a good place & that we both truly love each other so.... why am I SO unhappy the past couple of days???

Skadu posted 3/7/2019 13:16 PM

Your logical brain has outpaced your emotional brain. You know you're taking the right steps, but it doesn't feel right because you're moving forward to quickly to fully process the emotions that come from the process.

Maybe I'm projection but our shit coming up very similar.

SaddestDad posted 3/8/2019 09:07 AM

Your logical brain has outpaced your emotional brain

Skadu, so how do I speed up my emotional brain? I cannot function like this.
No exaggeration. I literally cannot function this way.

ARock posted 3/8/2019 09:59 AM

...so how do I speed up my emotional brain?

I don't think you can speed it up. The best you can do is trick yourself into disconnecting from that part of your thought process while it catches up.

It'll take an effort to get started, but immerse yourself in something. Extreme physical exertion is one way: running, a heavy bag, lifting weights. Something that gets you in a 'zone' that leaves no room for stray thoughts.

At least then you don't have to be fully involved in the 'processing'. It'll still happen while you're busy.

fareast posted 3/8/2019 10:11 AM

SaddestDad:

From my experience your depression or sadness is very normal. Unfortunately, the only way is going through it. You canít avoid it. Are you in IC to help you process. Look, I went through the same thing when my fWW confessed her A to me. I demanded to separate immediately, and three weeks later I filed for D. After five months of little or no contact my fWW tracked me down and pleaded for another chance. She showed me all the work she had done on herself and I tentatively agreed to try. That was decades ago in our fifth year of M. This last October we celebrated our 45th wedding anniversary. During our five month separation my main emotion was sadness. I did not hate her. My emotions would change from day to day, but sadness prevailed. Eventually, after we got back together and started to recover, the sadness and, yes,anger, began to dissipate as she did everything she could to prove she wanted the M.

You have been put through a shitstorm of emotional turmoil, and when the drama subsides, and the adrenaline stops pumping, it is normal for sadness to set in IMO. Are you taking any ADís? You might check with your physician. In any case, good luck.

sisoon posted 3/8/2019 10:29 AM

I haven't read this whole thread, but I've read all your posts in it.

...so how do I speed up my emotional brain?
IMO, working with a good IC is the only way to speed up healing - but no matter what, R is going to take 2 years to establish and many more years to 'complete.' (IMO, it never completes. R just morphs into M. R deals with resolving issues associated with the A. M deals with resolving day-to-day issues. Same process, different inputs and outputs.)

********

I think you've missed one of the main messages of SI, and message that I think is true: the A was due to a failure in the WS, not a failure in the BS or the M.

That means your euphoria over how you're doing together and her words of love are bonding and potentially healing, but they're not worth a lot unless your W works on herself to change from cheater to good partner.

What is she doing to change? Has she found a good IC? If you're in NYC, that shouldn't be difficult.

***********

If she's doing a timeline, IMO you need to expect her to come up with new memories and new information. If she comes to you with the info, it's probably not TT; it's probably just a memory that came into consciousness as she did the TL.

If you uncover new info in conversation, it could also be just a new memory triggered by something one of you said. Of course, it could be TT. You have to use the nonverbal evidence you have to distinguish between them.

************

The other one (which, truthfully was lesser severity than the main one)is part of the Jewish community but opening that up would also cause us to be shunned and excommunicated.
One Jew to another, does your community really punish the messenger? Emes, Emes, Emes. First truth; then, mercy or justice. (Or do you say 'Emet'?)

OK ... I understand not wanting to leave one's home community. But to stay means you have to accept a very nasty falsehood. How is that good for you or for anyone else?

[This message edited by sisoon at 10:11 PM, March 8th (Friday)]

Jduff posted 3/8/2019 10:54 AM

SaddestDad, this process is physically exhausting as well. Sometimes, what we feel we think is attached to emotion when in fact it is our body telling us "slow down and let me catch up". You mentioned the 10 hr followed by 5 hr sleep and being able to sleep through the dreams. Dude, your mind and body were exhausted.

In the middle of all this upheaval of truths and emotions you need a little island of your own to treat yourself well. Take longer breaks to just empty your mind for the moment to enjoy the simple things in life. Maybe find a nice place to enjoy a beverage and a bagel while reading your favorite magazine, go to a museum for the day and get lost in there for a bit.

Cooley2here posted 3/8/2019 11:05 AM

SD, use the right words. You are grief stricken. Grief. Stricken. You are mourning a death. That takes a very long time. You cannot make it go faster. Please get some medication to help you. You do not want to be stuck forever.

One of my dearest friends is Jewish and explained Yom Kippur. The day of atonement. I think it is so powerful that your religion asks that you get forgiveness from others on that day, if possible. Although she has explained her faith including all your high holy days she and I have never discussed shunning because she does not practice that. I donít mention this forum to others so I donít know how to ask her, so can you explain? You have done nothing wrong. Would you be required to give her up to remain?

Mods, I understand we donít discuss religion but I am trying to find out how this works since he is so caught in the middle.

[This message edited by Cooley2here at 11:07 AM, March 8th (Friday)]

SaddestDad posted 3/10/2019 14:07 PM

Sissoon,

I think you've missed one of the main messages of SI, and message that I think is true: the A was due to a failure in the WS, not a failure in the BS or the M.

I've definitely not missed this. I'm well aware that the issues and her actions stem from her and not from myself nor us. In a way, that's somewhat scarier because we as people don't have power or insight into another's mind and only know that which is told or shown. To be afraid that the underlying cause isn't going to truly be rectified and can therefore be the cause of another A is terrifying.

What is she doing to change? Has she found a good IC? If you're in NYC, that shouldn't be difficult.

She's doing a LOT to change. She's been working on her timeline. She spoke to OBS after I broke the news to OBS via text and answered everything she could. Whenever OBS reaches out, she drops what she's doing to tell.
She's no longer acting or speaking selfishly. She's been opening up emotionally and intimately regarding her feelings and thoughts. It's extremely difficult for her to do so, and I see the efforts and appreciate them. We're close to the city but far enough that finding an IC (for either of us) is challenging. It's a challenge compounded by the fact that I'm still looking for a job and her job doesn't provide benefits. Add 2 kids under the age of 3 to the mix... you get the picture.

community really punish the messenger?
....
But to stay means you have to accept a very nasty falsehood. How is that good for you or for anyone else?

Unfortunately, yeah. It does kill the messenger. It is what it is regarding remaining a part of the community.


Jduff,

Dude, your mind and body were exhausted.

Agreed. The plus side is that I'm getting better in that regard as well.

Cooley,

Please get some medication to help you.

I've been taking Trazadone as a sleep aid in conjunction with ambien for a while, I just take the Trazadone a little bit earlier now so that it can help me with the depression. I THINK it's been helping but until I find an IC, can't really know that definitively.

Question:
OBS hasn't contacted either of us in about a week now... am I supposed to (or SHOULD I even) reach out to her to see how she's doing and to make sure she and her kids are ok, or should I just leave them be?

((Edited for format-fixing))

[This message edited by SaddestDad at 2:09 PM, March 10th (Sunday)]

SaddestDad posted 3/10/2019 14:10 PM

Mods, I understand we donít discuss religion but I am trying to find out how this works since he is so caught in the middle.

Good question. How would/can we know if the mods permit or not?

k8la posted 3/10/2019 14:27 PM

As I read the guidelines on religion in discussions it's the debate part that is prohibited. In other words, discussing difficulties that arise as a result of community cultures/religious adherence is not prohibited. But stating that the religion is wrong for their rules, and starting a board war over it is definitely wrong.

Please show respect for others - people of all types, beliefs, and cultures populate these forums. There will be no political statements or discussions, and no religious debates

NoOptTo posted 3/10/2019 18:08 PM

Saddest Dad, if you are on LI, there is a very good Gottman philosophy counselor in Great Neck.

wifehad5 posted 3/10/2019 18:23 PM

Religion can be discussed in the context mentioned. It can't be debated.

SaddestDad posted 3/11/2019 17:11 PM

Rough night last night.
Rough morning today.
I'm exhausted.

I'll try to update & respond to you all later.
WifeHad5, thank you for clarifying that I may explain the added religious complexities in our context. I'll do so without turning it into debate.

I'm so bombed. I'm so worn out.
Starting to think the Trazadone isn't helping me after all. Ambien isn't helping me sleep anymore either.
This shit sucks.

faithfulman posted 3/11/2019 17:15 PM

Saddastdad, try Klonopin and/or Xanax, those are pretty solid ways to deal with anxiety and get some sleep.

Stay away from alcohol if you are using them

survrus posted 3/11/2019 18:58 PM

The Jewish sub-thread here is interesting since that's were a great deal of Western sexual morality comes from.

I understand why he is reluctant to break from his community, since such communities give meaning, structure and purpose to one's lives. His children may have absorbed that identity as well.

How close are these OMs within a few miles? do you see any of them even sporadically? This can keep you triggered forever, or about 30 years as I found out.

JT4588 posted 3/11/2019 19:30 PM

SaddestDad,

I haven't been posting much and haven't read all of the thread on here regarding your situation. However, I noticed what you wrote today about Trazadone. I'm not sure what doctor gave you Trazadone (apparently for depression?) but it will not help you with depression because it is a failed anti-depressant. Years ago it was used to treat depression but was found to be ineffective. It is now almost exclusively used as a sleep aid for people because it will help you with getting sleep and it is a non-addictive sleep aid. I know all of this because it was given to me by a psychiatrist as a sleep aid about 5 years ago when I was struggling so much over my husband's infidelity.

So, if you're taking it as an anti-depressant stop taking it because all it will do is make you sleepy and you'll be dragging ass all day. Check with your doctor about it - I'm really surprised anyone would give that to you to treat depression.

Starting to think the Trazadone isn't helping me after all

[This message edited by JT4588 at 7:31 PM, March 11th (Monday)]

marji posted 3/11/2019 20:41 PM

What is she doing to change? Has she found a good IC? If you're in NYC, that shouldn't be difficult.

Oh boy is that problematic. Yes, NYC has therapists galore--all types of therapy-all types of therapists but the more experienced are extremely expensive; those with LCSWs tend to be the cheapest but their fees generally run about $200/session. There are clinics but they are typically staffed by graduate students or newly graduated. Added to the cost of it all, is difficulty in finding a good therapist who is taking new clients.

After discovery several therapists were highly recommended by very knowledgeable people; none of those therapists had openings.

Totally agree that a good therapist can make all the difference--but it's very difficult to find them.

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