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She wont let me see texts, email, Facebook..

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Dennyden posted 2/12/2020 18:20 PM

This is my first day posting. I've been reading tons of posts and articles. Many of them mention how transparency with texts and email , etc is important.
My wife wont give me access. I've asked and even demanded a bunch of times but she refuses, insisting on a right to privacy. She's hiding something and part of me is afraid to see what it is, the. How can I compel her to give me this access?
She is adamant that the relationship with the OM is over. She acts frustrated because of my doubts, like I'm being unreasonable; and because I've asked numerous times if she is still seeing him.
My wife is stubborn to begin with and she was always sensitive about privacy. She would never open my mail , for example, and wouldn't want me opening hers, and this has always been the case.
IDK if she is still cheating. What if she's not and just being stubborn about privacy like she always has? I want to stay with her but this is something that pushes her away...what should I do?

Marz posted 2/12/2020 18:49 PM

I've asked and even demanded a bunch of times but she refuses, insisting on a right to privacy. She's hiding something and part of me is afraid to see what it is, the. How can I compel her to give me this access?

Iím sorry but there is no such thing as privacy to cheat in a marriage.

Wake up !!!!!!!

You canít make her do anything.

But you can. Full exposure on this.

ChamomileTea posted 2/12/2020 19:01 PM

It's okay, and helpful even, to keep all your posts on one thread. It allows us to view your situation with continuity.

Complete transparency is a must after betrayal. So, the fact that your WW doesn't think she needs to prove her honesty is telling.

First, let's talk about BOUNDARIES; what they are and what they aren't. Boundaries are NOT rules that you set down from on high for a grown ass woman to follow. We can't control other people. It's pointless to try. What we CAN control though is ourselves, our reactions to other people, what we will tolerate and what we will not tolerate in our lives.

So, in order to test the validity of a rule like "You will provide passwords for your tech and your apps", we turn it into a Boundary StatementÖ "I will NOT live with a secretive person, particularly not one who has already displayed a propensity for cheating". Now, your boundary is about you and not about controlling her. It's up to her to decide if she can comply or not. If not, it's up to you to enforce your boundary. So, you begin to see that your boundaries are not arbitrary. They're about big ticket items which you're willing to defend.

betsy62 posted 2/12/2020 19:03 PM

DennyDen,

First, I am sorry you had to find your way here. You will find this is a great site for support and help.
Your W's behavior is a huge red flag.
Before my X started his affair, our cell phones were always unlocked, and usually laying on the kitchen counter. We had full access to each other's phones. We shared a FB page.
After I went online, and found the hundreds of calls/texts to one number, I confronted him. How did he react?
He left the house. He came back a few hours later....with a new cell phone. In his name only. There was no way in hell he would give me the password. And, he was pissed that I went onto our account, and "invaded his privacy"
It was the start of the end of our M.
You are right....she is hiding something.

Jameson1977 posted 2/12/2020 19:16 PM

Those with nothing to hide, hide nothing.

We see this almost daily here at SI.

She is gaslighting you when she gets upset. What would be easier for a WS to do to build trust? I would think handing over a phone is pretty easy and a good start.

She's lying, TT'ing and minimizing your pain.

In some cases, the WS will refuse until given an ultimatum. Lost of times they leave to "find themselves" only to return after wiping the phone clean and had it over to the BS with attitude.

You cant delete every trace of communication from phones these days. I found stuff on my WW's itunes backup file that was years old and had long been deleted and didn't even need her phone!

Dennyden posted 2/12/2020 19:33 PM

There's so much compassion and empathy on here, thank you to everyone...❤

jb3199 posted 2/12/2020 19:40 PM

I want to stay with her but this is something that pushes her away...what should I do?

Denny, the problem is that your quote should be reading....

I want to stay with her but this is something that pushes ME away...what should I do?

You are in a dynamic that is absolutely soul-destroying for you--wanting to stay with a remorseless, actively cheating partner. I say active because she told you that she wouldn't contact him while you attempt to reconcile, and she went behind your back to meet him again. And she actively won't give you transparency. You have no option to believe that she is still concealing from you.

This gives you (2) options:

1. Learn to accept exactly what you have. You stated before that you can't imagine losing her. Therefore, don't make any waves, and happily accept what she is giving you. And if you don't like this option you need to...

2. Learn to respect and appreciate yourself once again. You've been a loyal, dedicated provider---and to be treated like this.....FROM THE ONE WHO TOOK VOWS WITH YOU....is an absolute slap in your face. It's actually worse than that.

You are going to have to dig deep in yourself, and ask yourself why you are willing to accept what you are receiving. You may not believe that you are accepting of this, but your in(actions) are saying that you are. Every minute that your wife refuses transparency, refuses to acknowledge your pain, and does this not only to you, BUT HER OWN SON, you are silently saying that this is acceptable.

And I in no way say this to kick you when you're down....just the opposite. I can guarantee that you are a person with far more character than your spouse. You are a good guy, who for no reason of your own, are being treated terribly by a pod person that you used to call your wife. It's beyond unfair....and I am furious for you. I wish that I could shake your hand in real life, and tell you, with certainty, that you are going to get through this. That you will be happy again....with or without your wife. And the sooner that you realize this, and no longer tolerate the behavior that you are receiving, the faster that you will get out of this disaster called infidelity.

START PLANNING A LIFE WITHOUT HER. It is going to take time to detach. If your wife somehow pulls a miracle, and gets her head out of her ass before you lose interest entirely, then maybe she can try to salvage a destroyed marriage.

But you cannot count on this. Nor should you.

WontBeFooledAgai posted 2/12/2020 19:43 PM

I am sorry WW but I just don't believe you. The trust in our relationship is gone, and it went away when you decided it was OK for you to be opening your legs for POSOM behind my back, when I was busting my ass at work to support all of us.

Meanwhile I do hope you are moving forward w seeing an attorney to know your rights.

[This message edited by WontBeFooledAgai at 7:44 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

fareast posted 2/12/2020 19:53 PM

Let me echo ChamomileTeas excellent advice. You don't demand access to invade her privacy. You can only control yourself. Frame what you need to continue in a relationship with a proven cheater and liar. This is about what you can live with after infidelity. She is free to agree or move on.

[This message edited by fareast at 7:55 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

Beachwalker posted 2/12/2020 20:11 PM

Denny: I am so sorry you have been put into this crappy situation, but Iím glad you found us.

Everyone has said some pretty wise stuff to you so far, and I agree with all of it. Yes, your wife is hiding something. Plus, when youíre married, the only privacy you are entitled to any more is a trip to the john. I appreciate you giving your wife latitude by respecting the ďquirkĒ (if it can be called that) she has about privacy. However, she abused that privilege when she used it for her own selfish acts of adultery. I did what Chamomile suggests: I told my WW that if she wanted me to stay in the relationship, this is what I need and demand: (insert your list here). At that point, it is up to her to demonstrate if she really wants the relationship to continue. If she doesnít comply, you have your answer Ė game over.

She acts frustrated because of my doubts, like I'm being unreasonable

Oh! YOUíRE being unreasonable!? This is called blame shifting and/or gaslighting. Is she saying itís NOT unreasonable for her to sneak behind your back and screw some other man, all while lying to your face about what sheís doing, with whom, where, and etc. But, you having doubts about her truthfulness after such a hideous betrayal?! Why, how dare you insinuate she would lie to you after having lied to you! (sarcasm) Really?! This is just a game sheís playing to get you to leave her alone. And to leave her alone to do what? Probably to continue the A and/or give her time to pull a Hillary Clinton by deleting incriminating information.
I want to stay with her but this is something that pushes her away

Providing her an avenue to prove she isnít lying anymore and to rebuild your trust in her is pushing her away?! I donít think so. Rather, it sounds to me as if sheís been doing a lot of other stuff with other men (maybe) that she doesnít want you to find out about.
what should I do?

Follow the advice given. Get yourself tested for STDís/STIís. Consult a lawyer (or 3) to see what your rights are and what life after D would look like. Implement the 180. Get into IC and suggest your WW do the same. IF you can find out the APís name, expose the A to the OBS, and do this without your WWís knowledge. And, this is just to get started.

Post often and keep us up to date. We all want you to live a healthy, happy life. And remember that here, you are not alone.

The1stWife posted 2/12/2020 21:12 PM

Take a step back and say this was an employee or someone who reported to you. Would you accept this type of response?

Probably not.

I agree with others. You should be willing to state what yiu expect from her. And if she refuses, then she needs to know what your next steps sill be whether itís separate, divorce, whatever.

Get a game plan together. See an attorney to understand your rights if you D.

Get a complete understanding of all your finances including retirement accounts etc.

Open a separate bank account in your name only. Cancel joint credit cards if she refuses to change her position and be transparent. Itís called the 180. Read up on it.

Start putting your needs FIRST. If sheís not on board at some point, you need to re-evaluate your marriage. Sorry to say.

Trdd posted 2/13/2020 06:52 AM

Brilliant advice here from the SI gurus. One thing to reinforce... you need to be strong after stating your need for transparency due to her cheating. There has to be a consequence and she has to feel it. So that means you should figure out what is a dealbreaker, tell her that and then hold her accountable if she continues to hide messages etc. Words need to lead to actions so she gets it. No transparency means you are more than likely still in infidelity... so her continuing her bullshit privacy story means you need to act firmly to get out of infidelity...180, file for D, etc. If that doesn't change her tune then so be it.

Kintsugi posted 2/13/2020 08:40 AM

You can't rebuild anything on a faulty foundation. R for me was impossible without complete transparency and truth. My exWW said the same thing. When she did throw me a transparency bone, it was only what she wanted to show me. It had already been cleansed. Anything past that she told me "if I have to do that the M is already over." I allowed it for awhile, and then saw an episode of Dr. Phil that used the opening sentence above, and my light bulb went off.

My friend, reading your post about her frustration and stubborn about privacy behavior is like reading my own story. You have big trouble there. Read and have her read "How to Help my Spouse Heal From My Affair." It's available online in pdf. It's her job to take the steps needed to help you and the M heal.

The1stWife posted 2/13/2020 19:31 PM

I think you need to stop 🛑 letting her control everything.

My H played that game. I stupidly allowed it.

At dday2 I put my sanity and self respect first. I stopped allowing him to call the shots. I stood up to him. Best move I made.

[This message edited by The1stWife at 6:38 AM, February 14th (Friday)]

Serpico posted 2/13/2020 20:05 PM

Hire a lawyer and have them draw up a divorce proposal, but do not file it.

Go home and let her know that you have had a divorce proposal written up but also let her know that, unlike her, you have the decency to let her know where she stands. Then, show it to her.

Tell her that if she does not give you full access to her e-mails, social media, and so on, that you will be filing the divorce proposal first thing in the morning.

squid posted 2/13/2020 20:53 PM

She's trying to to control the situation. But she is in no position to do so. She broke the marriage thus she has no say as to how it should continue.

This all stops when you say it stops.

Consult an attorney, fill out the paperwork and file. If she really wants this marriage to work then she has until the divorce is final to prove that she's worthy of another chance.

Time to draw your line in the sand.

TheGuy123 posted 2/13/2020 22:13 PM

Who cares what she wants...at the end of the day she is simply just not a safe partner....she never was. Hence the OM!

Now that this M is on thin ice she continues to be an unsafe partner.

You don't know who you are really married to. It's been like this the whole time. Hasn't it?

Sure....if she wants to take a crap let her shut the bathroom door for some privacy....but she has been hiding her true self the entire M and continues to so even after her betrayal.

How safe can this relationship be for you to commit to this stranger you call a wife?

I think the only way to heal from her infidelity is to get out of infidelity by just letting her go. In time you can find a partner that makes you feel safe!

Booyah posted 2/13/2020 23:11 PM

It's a horrible thing to go through life letting fear control you.

It's ok to be afraid at times, but you man up and face it, you confront it instead of letting it seize control and keeping you frozen like a Deer in the headlights.

Why are you "asking" she give you her phone?

You look her in the eyes and say "Give me your phone now or we're done".

And you damn well better be prepared to leave her and file for D and to expose what's going on to both of your family's and friends if she doesn't hand it over IMMEDIATELY.

Why are you trying to make this a discussion or a debate??

It is a command and someone who's been BUSTED LYING AND CHEATING on their spouse has NO FREAKING RIGHT TO CLAIM MORAL HIGH GROUND.

"PRIVACY"? "PRIVACY"?? "YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PRIVACY "???
*in a Jim Mora voice

If she doesn't give you the phone immediately there's your answer. You don't have trust and she's flat out looking you in the eyes and taking you for a gullible fool.

When's the last time this cheating princess of yours has heard the word "NO"?

She's treating you like a toddler.

QUIT BEING AFRAID and get the answers you need and you start calling the shots for your life.

You get one chance at this thing called life.

Is this how you want to live it scared of your shadow?

I know the answers can and WILL hurt but not knowing and allowing her to play this charade with you will hurt significantly worse and it will go on and on until you lose your mind or stand up for yourself and say "NO MORE"!!

Choose wisely.

You can do this!

DoinBettr posted 2/14/2020 10:53 AM

Denny - Lets look at how this all plays out in a couple of years based on your potential actions.

You continue to try to convince her you are the right guy and become someone she can be with. -You will forever feel like you had to earn her back. She will feel like she settled for you and cheat again once the time is right. Why wouldn't she? When she did last time she got you to jump through hoops and become all engaged. (This is why we don't recommend this.) She will cheat again and doesn't see herself as wrong or hurtful in what she did.

You pull away, file for divorce. She gets rejected by this other guy or leaves him at some time. She gets scared she won't be able to get you back. She gets scared and starts doing anything to get you back. She realizes her actions broke the family not yours. (This is why we recommend this path.) Her cheating again may happen, but she will know its outcome and you will be in control of how you handle things going from there.

If you see a different path, throw it out here. You can't nice a WS back. They need to realize that the spouse they thought would be waiting for them at home will leave due to there bad behavior. It is like hoping the dog stops peeing on the carpet because you praise it when it doesn't pee on the carpet. It is a dog. It doesn't understand when it did something wrong. Cheaters are the dogs in this analogy, FYI, they don't see their behavior as bad. They are finding love! Or escaping emotional abuse! Or improving the marriage by supplementing the sex in the marriage!
All lies they tell themselves.
Denny - Do you feel safe and secure with her? What is she doing to improve that? What would you expect her to do?
Know you will be ok without her.

sisoon posted 2/14/2020 11:58 AM

She's hiding something and part of me is afraid to see what it is, the. How can I compel her to give me this access?
I see this as having 2 aspects.

The first is about boundaries, and ChamomileTea is right on about that.

The 2nd is about manipulating your W into R. I strongly counsel against that.

R is difficult, and the WS has to do a lot of very unpleasant work - she has to look inside, figure out how to change from cheater to good partner, and then she has to change herself.

She needs to be willing to do the work. If she has to be manipulated into R, it will be harder for her to do the necessary work, and it will be easier to betray you again, one way or another.

So set your boundaries and maintain them. If she violates one, impose consequences as appropriate. Easier said than done, of course, but essential if you're going to R.

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