SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

In eight days, I will be commemorating three years as a member of SI. I have learned a lot.

I've read thousands of threads during my time here. One thing that has struck me is the number of affairs that "just happened."

Do they just happen? Aren't there things that individuals in a marriage or relationship should avoid in order to protect their relationship?

While this question is primarily for those who can share the hindsight they now have about their infidelity, I would like to hear from those of us who are BS as well.

I've talked about preventing affairs and was scoffed at for even considering the notion that affairs can be prevented. But, despite my personal experience with my WW's infidelity, I do believe that couples can build on the commitments they've made to each other and set personal boundaries in place to keep infidelity at bay.

For example, meeting with people of the opposite sex (if you are hetero) should be avoided.

Developing close relationships with anyone who is actively in an affair or is unrepentant about a previous affair.

What can be done to protect your relationship?

From my experience NO, they don’t just happen. They are a series of choices made.

I am 4 years out as a BH. It’s not easy, and my wife’s rug sweeping and low sex drive have left my marriage in a state of limbo. But last summer, a moment came that stopped me on a dime. My friends wife’s friend made it very clear that she was into me. I had met her a few times, we clearly had chemistry, and she was about 10 years younger than me. She made it very clear that if I wanted her I could have her, and I know she would’ve done things and been present sexually in a way my wife is not / will never be again.

But... I shut it down before anything happened. I went NC, and it’s been over a year. I never had her # and never followed her on social media. I made a CHOICE not to lower myself to that, when it would’ve been so easy to give in. My WW also made a choice, and not in my favor.

It's not the externals that matter - it's the internals.

If I have to stay away from women to keep myself faithful, I'm like a dry drunk. The problem is in me, not in women.

If I have a position of power and/or if I'm doing interesting things, by keeping women away, I'm very possibly limiting the quality of any solution I'm working to find and implement.

Preventing As is a matter of a people deciding not to cheat, no matter what the provocation.

One of life's joys, for me, is to get the hormones flowing and feeling, in essence, sexual pleasure from all sorts of things. A photo of Sophia Loren still gets the hormones flowing. Seeing a young woman (say under 60 for me) in short shorts and a tank top can get my hormones flowing. That's just biology.

Choosing not to seduce or be seduced is a conscious choice. There will be As as long as someone chooses otherwise.

It's not the opportunity that causes an A - it's the person who exploits the opportunity.

I, too, do not believe affairs "just happen." They are typically a series of choices, beginning with small and seemingly innocent choices, that ultimately snowball into deliberate and hurtful choices.

Preventing an affair starts with the individual. No matter how good the relationship is (and most people who have affairs are in pretty decent, good and great relationships), it's an individual choice to lower boundaries and make that series of choices that are an affair.

I think couples can talk until they are blue in the face, but communication is only part of it. I think there has to be a rock-solid commitment to the relationship and an individual commitment to behaviors that do not damage the relationship. It all circles back to the two individuals who have entered a relationship.

For example, meeting with people of the opposite sex (if you are hetero) should be avoided.

I have a lot of admiration for you, 36, but I truly believe this is barking up the wrong tree. This isn't addressing the individual at all, but a number of "rules" designed to keep the individual from having their commitment tested lest they may fail. The focus is on the wrong thing, in my opinion.

I work in a male-dominated industry, and often meetings are male-female. I have had zero issues with having boundaries, and I'm very quick to shut down any conversation that starts to stray into even remotely intimate territory. Believe me, I've seen and heard it all. Never took the bait.

Lack of awareness of one's behavior is another issue that I think plagues individuals who choose to engage in an affair. Whether it's compartmentalizing (often this is the case), or just plain selfishness and lack of empathy, the lack of perspective on how others might view behaviors is another significant factor in leading to an affair. What might be an innocent cup of coffee to discuss an upcoming project to one person may be the first step onto the slipper slope for another. Again, I'm circling back to the individual.

Having been on SI for many years, I can say with some degree of certainty that most people aren't aware of the importance of boundaries in relationships until they are breached. I do believe a lot of success with reconciliation can be attributed to the WS's new awareness of the importance of boundaries and the WS's willingness to act on that new knowledge.

Cat

Sissoon,

If I have to stay away from women to keep myself faithful, I'm like a dry drunk. The problem is in me, not in women.

That really struck me. That required some major self assessment. I admire your courage to share that and the fact you know that about yourself. And are taking steps to keep yourself an honorable person. Well done sir.

No they don't just happen.. Some people when faced with all the temptation in the world will never cheat.. And there are those who will cheat no matter what..

My wife liked to say it was fate she met her AP.. but it wasn't fate when two weeks in of chatting online she sent him pics.. Or within 48 hrs of arriving in his country of being in bed with him.. They are CHOICES.. very very deliberate choices..

They happen because people CHOOSE to cheat.. I love diving.. I was in mexico on my own gor a week.. Diving every day.. And relaxing at night.. Surrounded by beautiful women.. Some of whom made it clear they were interested. I chose to not cheat... That's just not me.. I believe in my marriage vows.. Even if my wife didn't..

I mean, come on. I mean this kindly but you've been here awhile.

Do you really think affairs just happen?

Do you really think you can prevent a spouse from having an affair if they are hardwired in their character to be selfish, narcissistic, entitled, lack empathy, have poor boundaries, have low EQ, and have poor executive functions for thinking through consequences?

There's no affair proofing a marriage. And affairs are willful intentional adultery. They don't just happen.

-50 percent of all marriages end in divorce

-70 percent of divorces are initiated by women

-Men and women are essentially at parity for adultery now, if the latest surveys are to be believed

-Adultery rates in marriage are high and increasing. On the low end 20-25 percent. On the high end, 40-50 percent.

This means -- at a minimum -- if you know two married couples at least one of the four has cheated or will cheat.

If 50 percent of marriages end in divorce, we can assume that it would be illogical to say that half of all marriages are bad, meaning adultery happens in the middle good marriages all the time (thus the idea of "affair proofing" a marriage is already specious on its face).

We can also assume that the majority of divorces are being caused by infidelity, with some smaller amount caused by addiction, abuse, mental health issues or simply incompatibility (which would be the lowest cause -- after all, if half of all married people were truly incompatible we'd be in trouble as a species).

So a quick review of the statistics suggest affairs don't just happen. Why so? Because if they "just happened" with this frequency we'd probably have to declare a national emergency and the institution of marriage would be completely untenable and unworkable.

We'd be faced with the prospect of a toxic danger to society that just sort of sneaks up on people unwittingly, almost like a mind virus. It would be terrifying. Without the stability and social capital provided by marriage, our survival as a civilization and perhaps as a species would be increasingly threatened.

Now of course, we know this isn't true so we're not running terrified of a mind virus that sneaks up on people and "just happens" to some people. No, we know that people make choices and carry out actions through free will. So we can hold people accountable for those choices. This is called responsibility.

I do believe we are facing some kind of crisis around the institution of marriage in the West, because increasingly infidelity is celebrated and both women and men seem to have trouble keeping their pants on. But that's based on shitty choices and willful actions.

EDIT to ADD: The idea of "affair proofing" a marriage strikes me as very much akin to the idea of having to play hall monitor for a spouse the rest of your life. Neither appeal to me. I want to be with someone I can trust.

[This message edited by Thumos at 3:08 PM, September 17th (Thursday)]

I agree with much of what has been said. It's based on the individual, and the internal more than any other predictor.

I am responsible for my own happiness. Therefore my boundaries within my relationship have to reflect time for personal interest and things important to me in my own journey. If I don't like something, I have to speak up. My husband had no idea I was miserable, nor that I had built up resentments towards him over time. Outwardly, our marriage was fine - we got along, had sex, did things together, generally have similar sensibilities, etc.

And in his absence, I should have acted the same as I would in his presence. Which was true, until it wasn't.

On the surface, I could have claimed it just happened. Someone paid attention to me in a vulnerable moment, it felt good and I clung to it. But, that's not true. It was a culmination of many things that added up over time, and it was a series of choices that I made. Those decisions were not based on my marriage or my husband, those decisions were based on my own dysfunctional inner world.

I have a lot of admiration for you, 36, but I truly believe this is barking up the wrong tree. This isn't addressing the individual at all, but a number of "rules" designed to keep the individual from having their commitment tested lest they may fail. The focus is on the wrong thing, in my opinion.

Cat,

There is nothing in me to admire, I haven't made the choice to be cautious around women because

I fear I may ne tempted. I made the choice out of respect for my W, respect for women and respect for men who might be in a relationship with any woman I might meet with.

I appreciate Sisoon's honesty and is position. But, I think it makes sense to do what I can to mitigate damages to my relationship or anyone else's relationship.

I live in a nice, safe neighborhood, but guess what? I still lock my doors. I have am alarm system. Am I truly worried about a break in? Not particularly. But, having been burglarized many years ago, I know it can and does happen. I just don't want it to happen to me.

I stopped drinking any alcoholic beverages because, in my position I don't want to cause someone else to stumble. I don't have a religious objection to alcohol or alcoholics in my family, but for the sake of others I choose not to put myself in situations that could leas to problems. It's a shame at times because I do enjoy a nice bottle of Opus One. Excellent wine.

I prefer to live my life without affecting others negatively. I also prefer not to put myself in situations that may cause my spouse concern. She makes up enough stuff in her mind without me adding to it.

The bottom line for me is this: whether I succumb to an affair or not, is totally up to me. Gotta take personal responsibility.

This post will get a little bit NSFW. You have been warned.

The term "just happens" is very vague, IMO. Everything "just happens".

If by "just happen", you mean done without any prior planning or forethought, then yes, I think many do "just happen". I wouldn't be surprised if most As were caused by impulsive decisions, with the WS then retroactively revised their motives for doing so to make it appear planned. Rewriting history is a famous part of many WS' repertoire, after all, when in truth they were just aroused. Research regarding how sexual arousal affects inhibition and disgust have found that arousal reduces one's sense of moral disgust, among other types of disgust.

Borg et al., 2012 provides insight into how arousal affects disgust. The researchers separated a group of 90 female participants into three groups; a non-sexual positive arousal group, a sexual arousal group and a neutral control group. These groups performed a total 16 tasks, with the sexual arousal group being given sex-related tasks, such as lubricating a vibrator, watching an erotic film, etc. All groups were then tasked with drinking water from a film cup contaminated with a dead fly. More women in the sexual arousal group drank from the cup, and displayed considerably less disgust than the other two groups, including lower disgust in regards to the contamination of the cup, and moral disgust. These results would indicate that sexual arousal general reduces women's disgust in immoral or generally unclear actions. This study has limitations, of course, such as not determining whether or not the same thing can be said about males, and the sample size is a little too small, but that does not mean the results are insignificant. I've tried to find research regarding the same phenomenon in males, but I couldn't find any. I wouldn't be surprised if the same patterns were found in males.

I went on a considerable tangent there that wasn't a direct answer to the question, but I thought it was interesting. I should note that I am not attempting to justify or diminish WS' responsibility for their actions, just trying to provide a potential answer that is accurate.

Reference:

Borg C, de Jong PJ (2012) Feelings of Disgust and Disgust-Induced Avoidance Weaken following Induced Sexual Arousal in Women. PLoS ONE 7(9): e44111.doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0044111

[This message edited by VaeVictis at 3:06 PM, September 17th (Thursday)]

Do you really think you can prevent a spouse from having an affair if they are hardwired in their character to be selfish, narcissistic, entitled, lack empathy, have poor boundaries, have low EQ, and have poor executive functions for thinking through consequences?

The only person I can keep from having an affair is me. And because it is up to me, I choose to behave in ways that decrease the possibility of an affair happening.

There's no affair proofing a marriage. And affairs are willful intentional adultery. They don't just happen.

I think think your first sentence is disproved by your second sentence.

Yes, affairs are intentional. They are willful and they certainly don't just happen. But they can be prevented. You may not be able to prevent your spouse or SO from cheating but you can put up firewalls to keep yourself from cheating.

The term, "just happens" can be viewed many ways. So there's really no answer to it.

I mean, two people don't turn a corner, bump into each other, stand back and start ripping each other's clothes off. That's pretty much hw I think of the term.

To betray is a choice. Meaning, every betrayer has the option to not betray but simply do so anyway. So, to me, betrayals never "just happen".

I live in a nice, safe neighborhood, but guess what? I still lock my doors. I have am alarm system. Am I truly worried about a break in? Not particularly. But, having been burglarized many years ago, I know it can and does happen. I just don't want it to happen to me.

I think you're making a category error here. The more accurate analogy would be if you were afraid someone you knew, a good friend, was going to decide to rob you blind -- and so you took extreme precautions to "burglary proof" your home from your friend. In which case a lot of people would say "hey man, maybe you shouldn't be friends with this guy, he doesn't seem trustworthy. Maybe call the cops on him."

you can put up firewalls to keep yourself from cheating.

I don't need to put up firewalls. I just don't do it.

The term, "just happens" can be viewed many ways. So there's really no answer to it.

Let me offer a possible definition for "just happens."

I was minding my own business when I tripped and fell on his erection. I was minding my own business when I noticed this woman underneath me moaning with pleasure.

Obviously affairs don't "just happen."

I think you're making a category error here. The more accurate analogy would be if you were afraid someone you knew, a good friend, was going to decide to rob you blind -- and so you took extreme precautions to "burglary proof" your home from your friend.

Taking precautions for the known is not as effective as also taking some precautions for the unknown.

But the idea of affair proofing a marriage is the same as expecting a friend to rob you. In both cases you're anticipating the strong possibility that someone you ostensibly trust is at high risk for violating that trust and committing a transgression against you. And if it's the case that we expect a spouse to have a high danger for violating our trust and betraying us, what's the point of marriage again? Seems like a raw deal and not a good deal on paper or otherwise.

A very effective way to disabuse a WS (or anyone else for that matter) of the notion that affairs "just happen", or are a result of a "mistake", is to have the WS go through their timeline in excruitiating detail. Helps to have a skilled counselor willing to ask the WS to reflect on their thought processes *every* step of the way. Works like a charm.

Also--I do feel that there are certain behavior modification techniques that can be employed post DDay while a WS is developing their self-awareness and learning to create and maintain boundaries. This can also increase a sense of safety for the BS. But this is like a set of training wheels--not intended for long term use. What BS needs or wants a 40 year-old who needs training wheels for the rest of their life?

What BS needs or wants a 40 year-old who needs training wheels for the rest of their life?

Exactly, and this is among a variety of reasons why I chose to move toward divorce. Why would I want to spend my life that way?

Do I think my WW is at "high risk" for giving me a repeat of this shitshow? Well, probably not, but we see it happen all the time, don't we? And I certainly never thought she would do it in the first place.

In fact, I suppose like most BS's here, in the initial days of my suspicions during the affair I was at war with myself because I simply could not believe my wife would ever do such a thing.

Now of course I know otherwise and I see her in a completely different light. She several times wanted to go down the "mistake" "just happened" route and I cut her off completely from doing that.

But as -- ironically -- I just told her today when I was reminding her that, yes, I'm really serious and, Yes, I really want a divorce: "I don't know you. I mean, I know you, obviously. But you're a stranger to me in so many ways now. For whatever reason, I don't think you're willing to confront these things in yourself and really give me a true accounting for who you are and what led you to do this."

But the idea of affair proofing a marriage is the same as expecting a friend to rob you. In both cases you're anticipating the strong possibility that someone you ostensibly trust is at high risk for violating that trust and committing a transgression against you. And if it's the case that we expect a spouse to have a high danger for violating our trust and betraying us, what's the point of marriage again? Seems like a raw deal and not a good deal on paper or otherwise.

I can't affair proof my marriage. I can only affair proof me and my behavior. It starts with the decision that faithfulness to my spouse is important to me. From there I can make choices that best help me honor that commitment. That doesn't mean my spouse will honor her commitment to me.