SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

TG, first I'd like to say how sorry I am you are facing this heartbreak.

I can see, from experience, how stepping away from SI, IC, or MC can be alright for some and not for others. For some, the A reminder, as awful as it is, may have to be a consistent, constructive action(SI,IC,MC) in order to keep the boundaries safe.

Your post reminds me of the questions that I have asked myself and WSO when I feel he has crossed boundaries:

*Can you see how that behavior is disrespectful to us, R, me and you?

*Is there any correlation in that behavior and your A?

*Is that behavior more important than R and my feelings?

*Why or how do you not enforce the boundaries that I thought we agreed upon?

I think 2 people with different internal boundaries can live together, but after infidelity, it becomes glaringly obvious how important shared M boundaries are for protection. I now recognize how little respect and concern we had for our pre-A boundaries.

I honestly don't think WSO would be too upset if I did some of the things that I now have a problem with him doing, after the A. I'm happy and pleased with my internal boundaries that protect me and our relationship. I recogize that his internal boundary changes have not come naturally, if that makes sense. This has been in stark contrast to years of no thoughts about establishing boundaries, much less enforcing them.

You obviously, and rightfully so, aren't ok with HL and his choices and behavior regarding his co-worker. Your internal boundaries recognized some red flags a few months ago. I question whether some WS/WSO can happily live with the strong internal boundaries of their BS/BSO as much as we question whether we can live with the lack of their internal boundaries?

The real problem arises when our boundaries collide regarding issues like the one you are facing, as well as myself over the course of R. The majority of what I have worked on and changed, occurred after the A. The A had that much of an impact on me.

I remember reading HL's posts and his involvement with SI. This goes back to what I said earlier. He may be someone who cannot remove himself from or stay away from the R and self-healing environment. He may need the tutorials and accountablity that comes with IC and SI to keep his internal boundaries safe. I think that is the case with WSO.

It bothers me that HL chose to continue the behavior with the co-worker after you voiced your concern. He pulled away from you, avoiding the conflict/discussion. It seems that he is relapsing, if you could call it that, instead of proving that he adopted all that he learned. I hope he can share with you how and why he allowed himself to tune out your feelings.

Wishing the best for you and HL.

HI TG - sorry - a bit late to the thread.

You mentioned several pages back that you didn't view it as cheating, but definitely crossing boundaries. I agree 100% here. There's also a serious lack of respect. I know you've each had DDays, so I'm sure you're well aware that how hard those boundaries should be upheld, and how deep the pain is when they aren't. His actions are a bit surprising.

I'm glad to read he's going to IC. It's easy to become 'chummy' with someone at work. However, when a person is in a marriage (or relationship) that has been affected by infidelity, simply 'letting that happen' isn't acceptable. It almost seems like it happened, kept happening, and he never stopped to think about how far down the path they were.

I did want to say this. I'd thank all those women at his work that said so much in front of you. As a woman, and as someone that knows women, if they were not on your side, so to speak, they'd have said nothing in front of you. The fact that they did, as shocking and upsetting as it was, to me says they wanted you to know so that you would be aware of the situation and be able to proactively work to end it. *** We women can be great like that - letting each other know something is very wrong without saying anything more than 'Oh, he and soandso are ALWAYS joking around. I wonder how he'll get over her being gone!' in a joking manner. Translation: Your H spends WAY too much time and energy entertaining THAT one, and we want you to know.

I could be wrong, but it sounds like they wanted you to know but didn't want to do so in a "I'm so sorry, but your H and XXX are verbally making out every day"

*** It's not your job to end it, it's your WH's to not start it. I just wanted to make sure you didn't think I thought somehow you were responsible for your H's behavior.

(((((tired girl)))))

Thanks TG. You are a diamond :) the absolute best in my books :) HL is lucky to have you and you have been lucky to have him.

Yes your story has definitely inspired me in more ways than one. If anything it's to get my shit together and live the life I deserve whether it's been with or without him. I'm going to work towards without him. It's been toxic

Keep fighting and growing. I believe HL is going to work on this and learn new boundaries. I have to work on them every day and they don't come naturally to me. Sounds like they don't come naturally to HL either.

Big hugs TG!! And wow MJ I couldn't agree more. You are a fave of mine lol

((((((TG))))))))

I've been reading and I think you are getting solid advice and support. I don't know what to say right now, but I didn't want to say nothing. Thinking of you.

I am so sorry you and HL have had such a difficult time recently, especially with your ill-health, I hope that you are well into recovery. It sounds like HL has been a great support but fallen back into old escapist ways. Really rooting for you both.

Hugs dear TG

Oh, TG. (((((((TG))))))))

I come in every now and then, just to see what's up. I would have never thought I'd read this. I'm so sorry you're going through this - so, so sorry - and am sending you hugs from down (up?) the road. Please take care of you and know I'm thinking of you.

WJH

I cant add much but want to say how impressed I am with all the support and advice. Betrayal by a spouse or SO is the hardest thing a person can feel and live through! I too have gained much from your advice throughout this site..and to see all these folks come out for you is comforting for others who just 'lurk' these pages...you are strong even if you don't want to be!

Sending you a little more strength!

Well, fuck Tired Girl. Not that this is about me, but this just ruined my day.

Here is the good news. You are amazing. All of the work you have done that make you such an inspiration to me is going to carry you through this.

I have to tell you, this scares the Hell out of me. I'm working so hard at going "all in" and there are these little things here and there that are keeping me from doing it, things that just don't sit right and keep me thinking that maybe he just doesn't fully "get it" yet. Its the self protection piece. The thing is, I don't think you were wrong to go all in. You have worked so hard and come so far, and we all have to go all in at some point. That is the goal, right? It is such a hard balance.

At the end of the day HL made a series of bad choices, that were all his. This will either force him to take the look at his boundaries and need for violation he should have a long time ago, or it won't. Either way, you will get the information you need to make your choice.

I'm so sorry for you pain. Continue to care for yourself.

I don't have any advice to offer that is better or different from the amazing support you've gotten. I just want to add my voice to those that are reaching out to hold you up and send you LIGHT. Make sure you take care of tiredgirl....

I am amazed, touched, and stunned by the amount of support that all of you have offered me. To those of you that have come out of lurkdom to do so, thank you. These posts have all given me something to think, smile, cry, and cherish. This is why I love this place. Thank you all so much. This has been exactly what I have needed the past few days, you all have no idea. You just don't. My son saw me tear up today over lunch after reading a post, he asked if it was good or bad, I said it was good, it was something a friend had written me. Thank you to all the friends that have taken the time to support me, offer hugs, advice and just offer the fact that they are thinking about me. You all rock.

Hey TG. Been away. I can't offer any advice that hasn't already been said but wanted to pop in and let you know I have been thinking of you. Continuing to send strength and courage your way.

First, I am sorry for the set back that you are currently dealing with and I wish you all the strength needed to endure.

I wanted to comment on this:

However, he will be a few pay grades above her so apparently the chances of them being near each other are small. According to them. I guess we will see.

My WH was 3 levels above MOW, working in the same department. They did not have many business reasons to interact but they interacted every single day. It was all too easy. She passed his office each AM and stopped in, they went to lunch frequently, he stopped by her cubicle, they lingered at the coffee station, they met up in the office whenever it was convenient and time permitted.

Please don't "rest easy" that the level difference will restrict any contact. Working in the same company can be problematic. Working in the same department can make it worse.

I agree that the problem is him, his boundaries, and yes, this could occur no matter where he is working. It just makes me wonder how much added stress this may add to your life knowing that they are working in the same area. Personally, I would never allow it because I would never survive it.

I do understand the desire for advancement and a larger paycheck but now may be the time to pause and assess your priorities. My WH ended up resigning, moving, and securing a new job which involved a 10K pay cut, a 2 level job title drop. It is what I needed and he did that willingly.

My WH is truly a changed man, I have witnesses this over the past 3+yrs and for this reason I can say that there is hope. When a WS genuinely wants to change, they can change. I completely understand your desire to give him that chance, yet again, to fix himself. I just caution you not to give too many chances.

Wishing you strength.

[This message edited by RidingHealingRd at 11:01 PM, August 19th (Tuesday)]

Just hugs.

(((((((tg)))))))

I don't know what to say right now, but I didn't want to say nothing.

That's a beautiful line. Sometimes all we can do it be there.

Tired Girl,

I just wanted to post about the positives of this situation…for you and for anyone reading this post with fear seeping in-in all directions.

The positive of this situation is in YOU! It is visible.

You have changed. That is what I see. Someone who is hurt and sad and angry, but not devastated; you are not "pick me up off the floor, I can't function at all".

^^This is growth. This is R- when we choose it and when we, the BS, work on ourselves to change, to become less codependent, less controlling of the WS and their healing and to become more independent, more focused on our own healing, more happy with just ourselves and more secure with who we are as a person.

You have grown!!

You sound like you know that you won't stay if HL does not make some significant, REAL changes. You are, however, secure enough in you to give him time to do that. This is growth. When BS first learn of the first A, we usually turn to mush and can't function, we can't imagine how we will put one foot in front of the other. This is a normal reaction of someone who is blindsided by infidelity. However, we can make sure that we won't turn to mush again if there are other d days if we as BS put real effort into working on ourselves. We gain confidence and independence in a way I cannot explain. Doing this is what protects us from not turning to mush again. This is you TG. You have done the work!

I really want to point this out to you and to all those reading. When we decide to R, there are no guarantees that R will work or that our WS will get it or not falter. I commend you, TG, for doing the hard work, for being strong and courageous when you have been hurt again. I see growth. I don't want you to lose sight of that fact!

Hugs!

[This message edited by brokensmile322 at 9:10 AM, August 20th (Wednesday)]

Brokensmile,

You have brought tears to my eyes. Thank you. That means so much.

No advice, just dropping in to say, that I have nothing but faith in you and your ability to navigate this troublesome situation, no matter the eventual outcome. ((TG))

Also dropping in to say hi, offer e-hugs, and say that I'm thinking about you. I hope today is a good day and that you and HL are able to have some productive discussion.

((HUGS)) lady.

TG, I hope you're feeling better today.

HL was the *first* person to ever PM me on here and he gave me some really good advice. You guys are two of the people on SI I think about often.

I hope he can get his shit permanently together.

Thank you Ascendant, I firmly believe that he will.

Wert thank you for your post yesterday. I read it to HL, he agreed.