SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

SumOfOne,

I'm sorry you are here but frankly can't quite figure out what you want from this forum. In your first post you say this

I know she will never stop though. Why would she?

And then you ask for help. What you are told is that without consequences up to and including Divorce you will not be able to affect a change in your WW and you have already agreed with that assessment in your first post. And yet you will not consider leaving her. You state

I am not going to leave her.

So I am at a loss for what you can do. I would like to ask you one thing though if you don't mind giving some additional information without maybe exposing identities. What did you mean with

She gives up a lot to be involved in my life and the kids life.

What does she give up to be involved in your life and the kid's life? I don't understand what that means.

I had decided to take some time and reflect on what people have said in here. I have also been reading a lot of what others post. I have some notes written down of what will be a lengthy post if I ever make it.

For now I was wanting to just ask opinions on a few things that have happened in the last week or so.

My original story is so full of holes and confusion. I plan to re-explain. I was trying to make it short and had screaming kids interrupting me the whole time.

So we did the no contact thing and she blocked him on all social media. I noticed the other day that she no longer had him blocked. I asked her why, and she said at first that she was going to contact him and ask him to contact me to confirm her story about nothing physical happening but she quickly said no, the truth is that I went to see what he was up to, I then tried to block him right back and it won't let me re-block him for 48 hours.

Thoughts on this? How concerning is it? I took it both bad and good. Bad that she did it but good that she attempted an honest answer. I can't help but wonder if she contacted him or sent him info on how to reach her so I wouldn't know.

Secondly, she has given me free domain over all her accounts and her phone but....she resents it. Thinks she deserves some privacy. My reply was to tell her she lost that when she did what she did and if her privacy was more important than her marriage then she could have it but not with me. It really pissed me off honestly. I can't imagine how she thinks she deserves anything like that right now.

Thanks for any insight. I think I was a little raw when I made my first post and not as recpetive as I should have been.

SumofOne:

She unblocked him because she is addicted to the attention. Period. It’s that simple. As others suggested she needs therapy to deal with this, but you have noted, she won’t do it. The ball is in your court because she will f8nd a way to get the attention somehow. At least that’s my opinion. I could be wrong. Be vigilant in any case.

You were absolutely right in your response to your WW’s whining about privacy. Why does she need secrets from her H? There is a difference between personal autonomy and privacy, and carrying on secret relationships in your M. Your phone and devices should be open to each other. Good luck.

Sorry to hear about your situation SumofOne.

Your wife likes the attention of other men; you know this. She's not going to give that up. She's also got the attention of someone locally and because of her checking up on him, I'd suspect she wants to reignite that connection. Most of the time this means she'll do whatever the other man wants in order to reconnect; that usually results in a physical relationship because that's what guys are ultimately after and attention hungry women are willing to go there to get their attention fix.

A good wife and mother doesn't seek the attention of other men. They don't do it because they're so focused on their family and they also realize the destruction that could result. Your wife is not a good wife or mother. She's too busy focusing on herself, her appearance, and how sexy other men see her.

As her beauty fades, it's fading as we speak and she's feels it, she'll get more desperate for that attention and she'll start taking her actions even further to feel that she's still attractive. If flirting, sexting, and photos stop working she'll start giving physical favors; it sounds like this latest other man might end up becoming physical soon. This will continue until she either comes to an epiphany that the attention she's getting is undesirable or until she gives up because she's so used-up that nobody wants her anymore.

A narcissist needs hard consequences in order to be shocked out of their own self worship. Most of the time it takes the loss or near-loss of something they cherish to wake them up to what's important in life. Your wayward wife is a difficult situation because she's still young and maybe decent looking enough to find someone else, and she already doesn't respect you. It almost sounds like she sees you as her father rather than her husband. This isn't due to the age difference, it's more due to the relationship dynamic that's formed over your years together.

Whether she's taken it physical or not, you've got a serial cheater on your hands. That's a difficult behavior to resolve and ultimately she has to gain a reason and desire to change her destructive ways. You can start by changing the sexual dynamic between you two, working on your own desirability, and reigniting the flame that got you two together in the first place. Changing up the family routine helps also and starting date nights and weekends together might assist. If you've ruled out the divorce option then you're left with counseling for her and mimicking Don Juan. She also shouldn't be trusted with free time. That's when her activities seem to occur most; aside from at the cliched gym apparently. You've got an emotionally stunted child on your hands who's self worth comes from other men's opinions of their sexual market value. Now that you realize it, you might have a chance at helping her mature and avoid the natural digression into physical affairs.

Of course this is all just my opinion. I don't know your relationship dynamic so I can only guess and give thoughts. Like the other commenters here, take from it what suits and leave what you don't feel fits. I do wish the best for you and I hope it does work out for you and your family. Take care of yourself.

SumOfOne,

Hey man. Sorry you are in the situation that you describe. Thank you for sharing it and trusting us to give you advice and opinions. Take what makes sense and applies to you and leave the rest. Is your chosen member name about the Warrant song by any chance? When I saw your screen name that is the first thing I thought of. It's an appropriate song.

Anyway, here are some cliff notes on my situation and you can do what you want with them. My long-term live-in girlfriend was always sending pictures of herself to other guys and it seems to have gotten progressively worse as she got older. However she would say that she was not cheating on me. Only flirting. My definition of cheating is different than hers.

Nonetheless, anytime your wife takes time and energy and attention away from you and shares it inappropriately with another man then that is being disloyal and cheating in my book. When you are in a committed monogamous relationship and especially if you get married, unless you have a different arrangement, then certain things are exclusively reserved as the right of the spouse only.

I would make excuses for my girlfriend who I loved dearly. She did not get enough attention from her father when she was a child. Her mother did not set a good example for her. She is a child of divorce. She has low self-esteem. Whatever.

Bottom line is that she was continuing to make a choice to disrespect me and her promise to me and to act inappropriately and disloyally.

Here is the thing. As much as I was trying to be understanding about her always being on Facebook Messenger and chatting away with other guys and sending naughty pictures to them even though it was gradually killing me and emasculating me, I later found out that she was being even more inappropriate with them than I realized and was juggling multiple guys at a time to feed her ego.

And then when I had the nerve to say it was a problem she just said I was being mean and insecure and controlling.

Does any of this make sense? Man I can tell you it was breaking me, breaking my heart. And she could see that. She knew it and did not really care. She just tried to hide it better. My girlfriend claimed to be a good person and have empathy (even though she actually had none) and I tried to tell myself all those things too. But the only real healing came when I decided that she was not a good person if she could treat me that way and I deserve better treatment and won't tolerate it anymore.

Now is my girlfriend an addict? Well she is addicted to the dopamine hit and the thrill and the high of constantly having her ego stroked and her attractive appearance validated. But at what cost? The very high cost of it gradually killing me on the inside. I was paying for it with my own self-esteem and self-respect, which actually made me less and less attractive to her as time went on. I could not win at this game. It became a self-fulfilling prophecy.

My girlfriend ended up telling me so many lies and half-truths. She too would break up and leave and then come back. I have found out about approximately 10 guys now that she engaged in various degrees of infidelity with, from sexting and phone calls all the way up to sex.

The question is not how to help her. It's how to help yourself. How much can you take or are you willing to take? Certain behavior is completely unacceptable no matter what the reason and should be non-negotiable especially in a marriage.

ChamomileTea is right when she says:

If infidelity teaches us anything, it teaches us that we cannot control other people. You only have control over yourself. And you've only got one tool in your arsenal, which you've already taken off the table. There's no magic cure. There's only our sincere determination not to allow any further abuse.

If you're dealing with an addiction issue, groups like AlAnon and CoDa can help you learn not to enable. But the first thing you'll learn is that you can't choose FOR the addict. They have to choose for themselves. Even if your WW goes to IC regularly, she would need to be willing to embrace that therapy. Not saying you shouldn't recommend it, only that it's still HER choice. You can lead the horse to water but you can't make her drink.

@fareast, thank you. A part of me feels like invding her privacy IS wrong but at the same time I know it has to happen right now for my sanity.

@Dismayed2012, wow, is all I can say. It's almost like you know her. Some very insigtful stuff without just attacking her ( its sad I still feel a need to protect her but it's probably typical of a BS). You put in words things I have felt but couldn't express the right way. Thank you

@LightningCrashes, Yes it is from the Warrant song. It made my day someone recognized that. I take it your name comes from the song by Live? Jani Lane and Warrant have provided many songs to the soundtrack of my life. Your story was gutwrenching. It really hit home.

So today is our anniversary. I don't know if I had a breakthough yesterday or not but I woke up in a great mood and it was quickly ruined. I knew that I had to be away from home for most of the day and my WW would be home. This is when she always sends pics. She has time and opprotunity. So I told her that today might be rough for me. The day proceeds and I feel like she is just making no effort to comfort me. She did attempt to keep herself busy doing housework butI know she is on social media often because I can see her. She spent most of the day texting with her friends when she had time. She did at I don't know, something in me just snapped. I can't keep pouring my all into something that she is just giving token effort to. She also sent a picture. She said her friend had asked what she was wearing when we go out Saturday so she set it out and took a picture. When I asked to see it she said she deleted it when she deleted the thread between her and her friend (see below). I think she is telling the truth on that but what it shows just how little she is considering where I am at. Right now I don't even want her taking pictures, certainly not sending them.

I find out she had deleted some text messages from her mom and best friend. I asked her about it and she said her mom told her that some conversations are sacred between a mom and a daughter and I should respect that (I never read their messages, never 1). The best friend basically told her the same. Tell me if I reacted appropriately. I told my wife that right now, anyone who can't respect that we need total transparency isn't supporting our attempt to recover and reconcile. She needs to explain to them why deleting anything right now is detremental to the process.

On the brigthside, I had told her of the articles here and when she went to bed she read some of them. I had told her that so much of what she is doing and the way that she is thinking is not what a WS should be doing. I think it really helped for her to see for herself instead of me telling her.

You told her NC, and to block OM. Then you confront her a few days later, when you discover OM is no longer blocked. She didnt unblock him to tell him to tell you the truth. She unblocked him to tell him what she told you,so they could get their story straight.

Now she is deleting her messages and telling you they told her to delete them.

There should be NO social media. And NO deleting. And NO excuses. If she is actually addicted, as you believe, then you are enabling her addiction.

You are continuing to believe someone who has been deceiving you for many years.

She knows what she is doing. You are the one in a fog here.

It's unfortunate that you showed her this site. But,now that she does, you should make it a requirement that she sign up,and start posting on the wayward forum. We have some wonderful former waywards that can help her.

[This message edited by HellFire at 8:41 AM, July 18th (Thursday)]

Hi Sum - you are getting some good advice here, and I'm glad you are taking it all in even if some of it you are not quite ready to hear or act upon. I was also married to a sex addict, which looks very much like your wife's behavior. It is an extremely difficult addiction to overcome, and has a near 100% recidivism rate. It requires intensive therapy to overcome. It is also progressive, meaning sexting turns to meeting, and the addict becomes less discriminating in their sex partners (no boundaries for age, gender, etc) or as we have heard it put here - in the dark, a mouth is a mouth.

I haven't seen anyone recommend to you yet an excellent book by James Dobson called Love Must Be Tough. It is an easy read, and helps the BS to understand how sometimes you must be willing to lose the marriage to save the marriage. In your original post you said you would not divorce your wife over some pictures. It is not about pictures. It is about the lying, betrayal, destruction of trust, and tossing around the intimacy that should be sacred in your marriage.

I wish you the best as you navigate this.

My girlfriend is 55. Your wife is only 35. The reason I mention this is because in my case my girlfriend just had to know that she was found attractive by other men and her need for validation only got worse as she got older. Just had to. Could not leave them alone. The amount of stuff I discovered was enough for me to walk away even though I loved her. She would say to me that at her age she just needs to be objectified as a sex object. And let's be honest that is what men are after. There was not one guy that my girlfriend was chatting with and sending pictures to who just wanted to hold hands and eat ice cream and go to the library.

In fact it is amazing how quickly things escalate. The conversation is usually sexual pretty quickly. This new age of internet and cell phone and social media connectivity combined with more liberal sexual acceptance in society makes it okay in some people's minds to be aggressive in stating exactly what they want even from another married person. And my girlfriend would indulge in that kind of talk to satisfy her own inner need to feel good about herself and attractive and wanted and lusted after. She would say she was just toying with these guys and they were "just friends" and she was just flirting and it wasn't cheating. So that attitude crushed me more than sending the pictures because it showed that she did not value or respect my feelings, and in actuality that she did not love me, at least not enough. She was putting her feelings above mine and even putting these other guys above me!

To make matters worse she would say that I was insecure and controlling and that she is entitled to her privacy and that if I don't trust her then we have some real issues. Now what kind of corner is that to be backed into by the one person who is supposed to be your best friend and biggest supporter in life? She is the one who was creating the trust issues! And then she ridicules me for expressing my concern. It takes whatever hurt you are feeling from the actions of betrayal and pours salt in the wound to make the hurt that much worse. She was hurting me and did not care.

I tried to make excuses for her. I tried to help her. I tried to show her articles and books and get her to go to a therapist. I tried to love her through it. But at the end of the day if she is not willing to address the issue with serious commitment and dedication, then it is very difficult to have to live a life of being a policeman or a warden in your relationship. It is soul-sucking and emasculating and no way to live.

In my case things just got worse. She learned how to hide things better. She deleted text messages and social media posts and chat that was incriminating and that she did not want me to see. She ended up eventually changing her passwords and would not tell me what they were. Big red flag there. She had other ways to communicate that I did not know about. She used apps. It was like I was dealing with a child.

It turned into more and more egregious behavior on her part. I could tell you a hundred stories and I should have left her after the first one. At least it may have shocked her into addressing the seriousness of the issue and if not it would have preserved some of my dignity and saved even more heartache and wasted time.

One thing to consider is that even if your wife has not engaged in physical cheating yet, and that is a big if, the problem I had is that the groundwork was being laid. When my girlfriend would say she was just flirting, I would say well what are you flirting with? She would say just a friend or just some guy. And I would say you are flirting with danger and you are flirting with sexual fantasies and you are flirting with escalating this situation and you are flirting with permanently damaging and maybe even destroying our relationship. And for what? Because you need to feel validated? Is our relationship not enough to validate your existence? The fact that I choose you every day?

Another thing to consider is this. I don't know about you, but I don't have a bunch of women on my social media that I am chatting with about how hot they are or that I am sending sexy pictures to. Those are high school antics. But if I did I would certainly be guilty of at least sending them the message that I was interested even if I was not available. Even if we were "just friends". The point is that it undermines the primary relationship. In your case it undermines your marriage. It damages it. Your wife is guilty of being an opponent of her own marriage by this behavior. It is not being on the team. It is being off the team and playing for the other team as an opponent, a foe, an adversary. These actions cause great harm to you and to your team, which she is supposed to be on.

And because there is always another guy standing by at the ready to offer gratuitous effusive words of praise and delusions of endless romance, there is no way for us to effectively communicate our very real need for that activity to stop without us looking like the boring old fuddy duddy insecure controlling father figure, which makes us even less attractive and the other guys even more attractive since they are perceived as more fun and understanding than we are. The other guys are romanticized while we are trivialized. It is an impossible situation, one that is not of our making or choosing, but that we have been placed in by the very person who claims to love and respect us.

Finally, one other thing. In my situation these guys were always ready and available to entertain my girlfriend's need for attention whenever and wherever she needed it. There will always be an endless supply of these guys, by the way. So what that created was a toxic environment in our relationship. Because rather than see the harm it was causing all she could focus on was the dopamine hit and the high it was giving her. So there was no way we could have healthy conversations about conflict resolution because she had been tainted by the false notion that these other guys would treat her better or love her better or have sex with her better or whatever. She was not able to see the fact that her selfish behavior was killing me and killing us. So our relationship became a fair-weather relationship. As long as I did not say anything contrary and as long as I tolerated things and did not rock the boat, then things seemed to go along okay. But they were not okay, especially inside my broken heart. And because of this toxic environment that she created we were unable to make any meaningful progress on real-life issues because she was living in fantasyville and lala-land where rules and consequences did not apply to her. I was basically dealing with a child.

I later found out that this emotionally stunted child was capable of going all the way with some of these guys. One night in particular we had an argument and she stormed out and did not come home and I could not reach her. When she same back the next morning I asked her where she stayed and she told me that she could not remember. And then she said she blacked out. And then she blocked it out. And then she had too much to drink to remember. And then she told me she actually called one of these stand-by guys that she was keeping as a source of ego-boost and she ended up at his house and they drank two bottles of wine while she complained about me and then she spent the night with him. Now how about them apples? And that is just one story that I know about. I can't begin to tell you the damage that did to me. But she justifies it and does not want to talk about it or be held accountable or have consequences for it.

If you have to live your life wondering if your spouse is always going to use another person as leverage or if the knowledge of them having other people waiting in the wings keeps you from being able to prosper in your relationship, then that is called "triangulation" and it is what narcissists do. Look it up. You are never going to win that game. I had to move on from her and it was extremely difficult because I love her and I am not the kind of guy who gives up on things easily. Very very very hard. I cried a lot. But I am feeling a little bit better each day and I have my self-respect. I am a good and decent man and I deserve better treatment and I know there is a woman out there who will love me in a healthy way. And my girlfriend is already with another guy. Big surprise.

I have seen Warrant in concert and met them personally. I talked to Jani for a while here at a local music store back in the day. Listen to "Stronger Now". You probably already know it but Jani wrote that song about his wife Bobbi because she cheated on him and left him for Tommy Lee. It is one of my favorite songs of all time and epitomizes the way I feel.

I held you for a moment in my hands

The moment with you slipped away like sand

Through my fingers now

In front of me a choice I have to make

To carry on or simply fade away

I lose you either way

I'd like to say that it was easy

It was hard to say goodbye

I thought that I would die

Letting go of you was so hard to do

And I thought that it would kill me

But I made it through somehow

And I'm so much stronger now

I gave to you my love and my respect

But I could never make you love me back

I denied it so

I grew bitter watching you grow cold

My life became your prison, took it's toll

I decided

Like a bird that's trapped

Inside a gilded cage

It's right to set it free

It hurts to watch it fly away

Letting go of you was so hard to do

And I thought that it would kill me

But I made it through somehow

And I'm so much stronger now

[This message edited by LightningCrashes at 11:24 AM, July 19th (Friday)]

Take my post for what it's worth man. I am not saying that your wife will end up doing any of the stuff my girlfriend did. I am just saying that it is a problem and for you to be vigilant. Upon reflection I do not want you to think that I am assuming the worst. I truly want and hope for your relationship to heal and survive and thrive and prosper and last a lifetime. It's just that this kind of selfish behavior makes it more difficult to attain that goal because it introduces unnecessary problems to the relationship. Marriage is hard enough already without us making it harder by our own actions!

Alright, I have re-read this thread. I am off of work today and have plenty of time! Haha. Anyway, I think I have talked too much about my experience when all you were really asking is how to help. So here are some observations and suggestions. Remember they are worth what you paid for them!

If your wife derives a good feeling about her appearance and likes to take pictures of herself, have you ever thought about making that a thing in your marriage? I mean you could really make this into where you are the photographer and she is the model. Role play it into sexy time.

You have three kids ages 14, 8, and 5. That ought to be taking a lot of her time up. Does it? I am just wondering how she has so much time to be on social media and chatting and sending these pictures. So my suggestion is to ramp up family activities especially around the kids to remind her that she is a mother and that is her chief assignment in life that she should feel good about! Schedule more time together as a family. Maybe you already do a lot of these things. But schedule more of them. No one is ever on their death bed and says I wish I would have spent less time with my family. Take trips if you can. Get outdoors. Do a camping weekend or a beach weekend. Something that does not really allow for technology and connection with the outside world but requires focused attention on the importance and joy and benefit of your family as being the absolute best thing in life and reminds you that you would never ever want to do anything to risk losing that in a million years.

Find a therapist who specializes in what you are going through. Go for yourself independently and definitely try to get her to go independently.

Oh man it's 1:15 and I have a 2pm appointment. Let me get back to you in a little bit. I hope some of my posting is able to help a fellow Warrant fan out!

[This message edited by LightningCrashes at 12:15 PM, July 18th (Thursday)]

I love the song Stronger Now. Jani was a great song writer. It helps to know what others have gone through and what I might expect. We have been doing this for years. I am pretty experienced in dealing with this which as everyone has stated is part of the problem.

I have been working on detaching and I have also been working not being co-dependent any longer. I feel the strongest I have in years in many ways. My wife feels it too. It's probably not the "shock" she really needs but my recent behavior has sparked some change.

Today I am dealing with this. I would really like some opinions, My WW went to breakfast with a friend. She is a female friend she made at the gym. I am 100% sure that is where she is at and what she is doing. My problem is this, she has been gone for 1.5 hours and I only heard from her once. Where she is eating is in this guys town. So over the course of this 1.5 hours I have worked myself up a bit. Not playing movies in my head, but mad at her insenstivty. She knows anytime we are apart I get triggered and especially since she is in his town. Am I being overly sensitive? She knows I need check ins right now. She just texted me and was like I am soooo sorry we just got to talking blah blah. It means nothing to me. We should come first. She said she didn't want to be rude and be on her phone. She is putting her friends feelings ahead of mine.

So again am I being too sensitive. Is this big issue or one I should just communicate the things I just said politely to her?

Quick response for you. If you are 100% certain of where she is at and what she is doing, eating with a girl friend, and she has only been gone 1.5 hours, and she did text to say she is sorry they got to talking and she did not want to be rude on her phone a lot, then I would not get myself overly worked up. Pick your battles.

Of course you are allowed to communicate your feelings and needs to her no matter what they may be. If you need her to text you every ten minutes then you are within your rights to tell her. I am just saying that I don't think it will make the situation any better. According to you, she already knows how you feel, especially since you get triggered. So I would just remind her gently and tactfully. Besides, you did say that you are working on your co-dependency.

Now if you have concerns for her doing something wayward or inappropriate or you have proof otherwise, then all bets are off. But that is not what you said was going on this morning. So my advice, try to enjoy the rest of the day and not get overly worked up.

The problem is turst is broken. Now you just don't know.

Pretty normal. Time will tell.

You don't want to be a marriage but it's not a good situation to be in.

I am sorry you are in this situation. When trust is repetitively broken the relationship cannot heal. From your posts it seems you are in a one sided relationship. In my opinion you should start detaching so that you are fine with or without her.

You are being the marriage jailer and she is busting any boundaries the two of you have implemented.

Is she doing anything to address her infidelity, sexting, and continued wayward behavior?

Without doing the work she will never be a safe spouse.

[This message edited by Ripped62 at 1:10 PM, July 19th (Friday)]

I’m not educated enough to diagnose your wife but I cannot help but see that you are dealing with a child. Physically she has grown up but emotionally she is really a very, very young child. I don’t know what happened to her to cause this or if she was just born this way. I am not going to say she has a personality disorder because that sounds like a diagnosis but truthfully there are people who are born without the ability to have any empathy. You can’t make someone have empathy. Once they are grown they either have it or they do not. I’m not you going to suggest you leave or stay. What I will say is, based on what you have written, this is all you think about all day long. My question to you is can you do this for the rest of your life?

I have a soft timeline on things but mostly I just want to see progress. I do think there is slow progress taking place she suffers from thinking this is going to be handled in the same way as the past.

I am an over thinker. It’s terrible in these situations.

Before I say this, I know this is defending her and I know nothing I did caused her to stray, but right now during reconciliation I do think I am guilty of setting her up to fail. I set impossible standards at times and find fault in everything she does. I think I am justified in how I felt today. She knew it was a trigger and made no effort. That’s what I’m upset about. I know she wasn’t doing “bad”. However, I feel like I overreacted and it would’ve been better to just communicate more calmly my feelings.

What I told her is I need to see from her the kind of effort she gave to him. It took a lot of effort and energy to do what she did. Now, that’s what I need to see for our marriage if it’s going to work.

I hate how needy I’ve become. I feel so small, like less than a man.

It helps me to put my ongoing struggles down in here. Especially when I go back and read them later. It saddens me to think I’m the one who wrote it.

I am absolutely working on detaching. I am also moving forward with financial plans that will enable me to walk away if that becomes needed.

Hey man. I am just checking in on you. I know this stuff hurts and can drive a man crazy when all you really want is peace of mind. Anyway, I had a couple thoughts I wanted to share with you. Take them for what they are worth!

Her reckless behavior is more proof that she has an addiction. I want to help her with this addiction.

Are there any addiction counselors or clinics in your area?

I would love to hear ideas on things I could be doing and things she should be doing.

If a person does indeed have an addiction, what is the most basic truth that is universally accepted in order to get better? You know the answer. THAT PERSON HAS TO STAY COMPLETELY AWAY FROM WHATEVER IT IS THEY ARE ADDICTED TO. Alcohol, cocaine, heroin... Whatever it is that is causing the problem has to be eliminated. Sometimes a person does not have the strength to do this on their own and has to be committed to a facility or program for however long it takes to break the addiction habit. Family members have to practice tough love and not make excuses for the person or minimize the behavior or blame themselves. That last one can be tough sometimes. As far as what you can do, keep reading...

Her complaints towards me is that I can be mean (accurate) and she feels powerless in our relationship (also accurate).

Stop being mean. Why does she feel powerless in your relationship? You need to figure this out or it will only get worse. A woman who feels like she is not an equal partner in a relationship is going to grow weary of that and may look outside the marriage in order to feel like she has value. You asked what you could do. Make sure she knows how much you value and appreciate her.

I set impossible standards at times and find fault in everything she does.

Stop setting impossible standards and stop finding fault in everything she does. Praise her appropriately and show her appreciation for the good things she does.

I see someone who is damaged and broken. She struggles with this and fails even though she wants to do better. She is so empty she HAS to hear, "OMG your body is amazing."

Purchase a copy of "The Self-Esteem Workbook" by PhD Glenn Schiraldi and have her complete it. You may have to help go through the workbook with her. Your wife has low self-esteem and has a need for inappropriate validation from others. It hurts you and it threatens your marriage. Do the exercises and complete the course of that workbook. I bought one for me and my wife and she still left but hey man we have to throw everything we got at this right now. It is not going to fix itself.

Those of us in here have a lot of pain. I will ask again here at the end. What does she need to be doing to get better?

She needs to recognize the seriousness of the situation and take whatever drastic steps are necessary to make sure this does not continue happening. Go on Dr Phil. Whatever it takes. I remember your first post...

She has had many affairs over the course of our marriage. The great majority of the time I find out because she has to either split up or cause trouble in our marriage to have these exchanges with others.

About 2 months ago she started acting distant. After a week or 2 she said she wasn't happy and was going to make plans to move out. As I stated above this is her routine for when she is having some type of relationship outside of our marriage. She protested that she was not but knowing her like I do I set up a hidden camera where I know she likes to take her pictures. About 10 days ago I had to watch her taking nude photos and sending them to someone. I confronted her and she confessed that she'd been talking to a guy from her gym.

This is a huge problem. Your post indicates that your wife told you she is not happy, that she wants to move out, lied to you about there being anyone else, then you had to play detective to get evidence and confront her to get the truth. She seems to have no issue with splitting up and moving out and it coincides with her having a relationship outside of your marriage. She seems to think your marriage is optional and disposable when she should be guarding it with her very life and viewing it as the most precious thing ever.

Man I am just spitballing to come up with anything that might help you out. Is your wife a reasonable person? Can you ask her to commit to a 90 day period of no social media? Does she have a hobby that she can focus on? Can you guys join a bowling league or a gardening club or something? None of these things are cures in themselves but she has to find fulfillment some other way in something else that does not hurt you or threaten the marriage. Do you guys go to church? I know that some of the worst offenders are churchgoers but if a person has a purpose-driven life then it may help. Do you guys workout together? Not only would that help but going to the gym together would be a protection and also there is usually an increase in sexual desire afterwards so you guys could benefit from that aspect of intimacy and bonding.

And finally this wisdom courtesy of ChamomileTea…

She needs to be going to therapy in order to root out the reason she seeks out male attention. She needs to develop true empathy for the people she hurts. She needs to establish an accountability network. She needs to define her values and notice the gap when her behavior doesn't reflect her own beliefs. She needs to respect herself (and others) enough to be honest about those things.

Have your wife read "How To Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair" by Linda MacDonald. And if you think it would help you can have her read some of the responses here, though it is up to you whether to reveal this website to her or not. It is your place of sanctuary.

Hope some of this helps you man. I'm going to listen to Warrant now!

[This message edited by LightningCrashes at 10:44 PM, July 19th (Friday)]

I have been wanting to amend some of our back story. It's just not accurate both in the good and the bad. I hope it is taken as me trying to improve the advice I get and not me trying to justify staying but if that is the general feeling I will listen and examine all input.

OK, so my WW is 14 years younger. We met when she was 18 but we just talked and texted for almost a year. I was going through a divorce and I was very isolated. Even though that relationship ended by my choice I was very lonely. We became friends but I wasn't ready to see anyone. The general thought on her was she was trouble. The main thing I was told is that she was a tease and had to have everyone's attention. I had no intentions of being serious with her but she was young and hot and 32 year old me got a self-esteem boost from being with her. So things turned romantic. I thought it was just a casual fling. Then...we find out she is pregnant. So here I am feeling pressure to be with someone I know isn't right for me and here she is 19 and going to be raising a baby when all her friends are out doing what 19 year olds do.

The next 5 years were as horrible as you might expect. Not just her, but mostly her. When I said she would always leave me to go cheat this the main time stuff like that would happen. She couldn't bring herself to cheat while we were together so she'd always break up so she could go have fun. It was during this time that the only known sexual interaction took place. I didn't find out until years later when she voluntarily revealed it to me. She cried not only because she felt guilty but because the guy was very forceful and what she described to me sounded like a sexual assault at the very least. Said she tried to push him away and he pinned her etc. I was unaware this took place but I did notice she changed and became more grounded in our relationship.

The whole time her mom is pressuring her to get married because we have a child together. I am thinking we turned a corner because things have been so good and we get married. Now comes probably the lowest time of my life. I think about 3-4 months in she just leaves. I know her routine. I am sure she was talking to someone. Things are a little foggy on the details of this split. She moved to another town, closer to her work. We were apart for about 3 months and had divorce papers drawn up. I signed them but they never got filed. I know she sent nudes to a couple of guys but I don't think she carried on non-stop with any one person. I don't think she slept with anyone but I do think she is lying about another aspect of this time. I think some physical stuff took place but she told me she was afraid to be alone with anyone but me, so we were still getting our sex fix from each other. Here's where you guys might tell me to GTFO, I slept with another woman. I was at home asleep and my phone starts blowing up. Its a cashier from the gas station, telling me she is in my driveway. At this point, I had signed papers and had been away from my wife for 3 months. She had always told me she was gay. So anyway, a night of terrible sex takes place. Guess what happens next? Within a week my wife tells me she wants to get back together. We do and I don't tell her of the sex and she doesn't tell me of her boys either. Fast forward 8 months and this almost exact things happens again. At the 3 month separation mark I call her and ask her if there is any going back and she says no. I told her to be sure because I was going to move on and she repeats that we are over with no chance of reconciliation. So guess what? I sleep with another woman about 2 weeks later. At an exchange of kids in a parking lot she is noticeably more friendly and hugs me and before I know it we are back together. Again, we don't tell each other much about what was going on while we were apart.

Better times/Rock bottom?

The next 4 years are pretty good. We become a pretty good couple and I think she's maybe outgrown all of it. She is in her mid-20's now. Then one day I find out she has been up to chatting again. I have a very public job. One that requires me to be pretty conservative. Basically, most of the town knew she was doing stuff but me. She was chatting with guys but not like back and forth with anyone of them and most of it just superficial flirting, like telling the local lifeguard she liked the view at the pool today and asking if he did. One though she exchanged nudes with and it was actually a girl. This girl shared the photo with several people and it got back to my work. I was f'ing done, or so I thought. After living in the same home but not interacting for 3-4 months somehow one night we have a blow up. We reveal every thing we had done before our marriage and all of our bad after the marriage took place while we had those 2 separations. She revealed that she had sent pics during both separations and that she had slept with the guy that got rough while we were dating but broke up.

Clean slate

We start again and I really felt like we had beaten the odds. For 6 years I feel like we had a dream marriage. I even find an email from a dude she had sent nudes to from the past and he is trying to reconnect. She tells him she can't be talking to him and he is not to ever contact him again. Until just now I had forgotten to send him a note telling him if I say him again trying to contact her I would tell his wife. Anyway, things are great. Which leads us to the last 7 months. On January 20 I get a message on Facebook from a woman who tells me her husband and my wife have been snap chatting non-stop for over a week. My wife admits they had sent nudes, that he was desperate to meet but she had no interest in that. He lives far off. I was filled with rage. I was in scorched earth mode. I was mean, distant, you name it. At this point, I will say that she and I had communicated and grown where she could tell me a lot of her desires. She had told me she was attracted to women. I am sorry if this is too strange or people think we are freaks and "the poor kids" stuff but we had an open door about her carrying on with women regarding chatting and pics. We were no longer a traditional marriage. She didn't do it much, but 2-3 times she had her friends and I was perfectly fine with it. She'd get charged up and I would get to reap the benefits of it. So, sexting became normalized to an extent for us. I was allowed to talk to girls myself but I don't get the thrill out of it so I really didn't much except once. So it wasn't a great leap to forgive this yet one more time.

I couldn't get past the breach of trust and things were terrible. She wouldn't give me access to anything, she wouldn't do anything to rebuild trust. She tells me she isn't happy and is going to move out. Even though we haven't separated in 10 years I know what this usually means and I was right, unfortunately. This time things were much different. It wasn't some guy that lived a few states away. This was a guy she saw every morning. She also had been chatting for about 6 weeks. She claims that it didn't turn into sexting until the last 2 weeks and that a total of 8 pics were sent. 4 from her and 4 from him. They did have somewhat graphic conversations but no videos, and nothing physical.

I know everyone thinks I am a fool for buying her story but I do have a lot of circumstantial proof that she is telling the truth about the physical stuff. Life360, some chats that I have read between them, this is gross but I kept a close eye on her undies in the hamper no evidence in them of excessive fluids, she never brushed her teeth before going to the gym because she would come home and have coffee and like to brush after that, but maybe the main thing is her own behavior. She has thrown it in my face several times that I am the only one that has ever physically been with someone during our marriage. I know in my head I feel like what I did is different (and also worse) but maybe I am wrong and justifying my actions, but I know her. If she had messed with this guy there is no way she would do that. She would deny doing anything with him until the end of days but she wouldn't come at me like that. Also a chat snippit that said she can't be physical as long as she and I was still together.

Currently

She has given me total access to all accounts, resisted at first but as she has educated herself on rebuilding trust she has embraced it. She has had some set backs for sure, mostly she is guilty of not being sensitive to my needs to be set at ease. In all of our troubles I have never seen her work at change. She just says that she is done with all that and going to do better. I am seeing a moderate effort but it isn't where it should be. She has looked for counseling but barely. She wants me to do it for her but I am refusing. I told her after she found a few I'd be happy to look with her. It is important that she work her way out of this for me. Nothing that comes out of her mouth matters to me at this point. It is all about her actions. There is just enough work going on to give me hope. I am working towards detachment, independence and financial autonomy. I hope she surprises me. I will do all I can on my end to help but I have little faith in her.

The rest is all here. I am sorry if things don't add up with my originally story or that I left out important details but fear, embarrassment and being distracted all took part in my first few posts. I know we are a mess. If it matters most of my friends that know our history and recent events all think we should try to reconcile and some don't really care for my wife. I was absolutely surprised by that.

Thanks for all the advice I have already been given.

You are desperate and we hear you. You are feeling helpless and probably hopeless. One of the reasons is because you are smart enough to recognize that you are going around in circles in a rut that gets deeper and deeper. No one who loves their spouse wants a divorce. We want life to be what we deserve. As you can see by the numbers on this forum that dream has been stomped on. When I was your wife’s age I had three kids. I never once thought about cheating. Please go to a licensed therapist who can help you see reality. If you stay married you are going to need a boatload of support.