SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I have no idea how you can be so patient. I would have been all over her the second I thought she was up to something. As was the case with my FWW. When I thought my wife was up to no good I started checking her computer and when I found an email account I didn’t know about it was on. My anger only grew when I was unable to access that account. So I decided to bluff her and see what see would tell me. She was on her way home from work when I decided to download and install a file recovery program on her computer. It was a free program and to this day I have no idea if it even worked but it was supposed to restore any and all deleted files. As she walked in the door I told to take a look at her computer and notice the program that was running. I told her that it will pull up everything she ever deleted and she had better come clean to me right now. Well she came clean and hit the floor like a ton of bricks. She thought her life was over. Lucky for her that I love her enough to give her a second chance. Here we are 6 months from dday and R is going well. It's not easy by any means but if you love one another enough it can work.

I just don't have enough info to make a strong case

You can make a strong case that your sanity depends on resolving some important issues.

The critical case you need to be able to make to yourself is that you can trust your W to tell you the truth. Put differently what would it take for you to believe what she says?

If she says no, can you, will you believe her?

Imho, if you have no hard evidence when you decide to confront, and she denies anything is going on. I would demand that she poly up or sep/d.

CO,

I know there are those that truly believe, or hope, that by confronting, maybe bluffing, that you can get necessary answers and she will be truthful.

Me? I truly believe I would live in limbo for as long as it took to learn the real truth.

After you spend 735 consecutive days knowing in your gut that it was more than one kiss and a bunch of inappropriate emails - you will do absolutely anything to avoid going down that road again!

But by lying, minimizing, etc.. A WS pulls the 'freeze play' on you. Just like a quarterback that looks to the left when all the while he knows he's gonna throw to the right side. The defense is 'frozen'.

You don't know whether to stay or go - you don't want to leave and live with the thought that you may have over-reacted - you don't want to stay while continually feeling you're being lied to... So you are completely frozen - and AT THEIR MERCY..

Once you confront, you have shot your wad.(Punn intended)

You are helpless to learn anything else, and will forever be dependent on what she decides you NEED to know, or not.

And needless to say, secrets that are intended to be taken to the grave are seldom something they want you to know!

After more than 2 yrs, FWW finally admitted to OM performing oral on her one time....

Now, I am supposed to believe that they were alone in a motel room at least 2 times (confirmed) and this one time she was naked, or at least de-robed to the point of 'access', he gives her oral to the point of orgasm, (she admitted) and he got nothing? And somewhere in the midst of having an orgasm she conjured up the mental awareness to 'deny' him?

This is the kind of bullshit I will live with for the rest of my miserable life. All because I confronted without finding out the real story....

Just something to think about..

Good Luck,

Still

Thank you all. Hearing from other BS's always seems to help maintain my clarity. Good advice. I can handle the limbo for the time being.

What's your take on hiring a PI? I know they are costly but seems most productive way to get the low down on her when she's in another area. Or else, find someone to watch DD and secretly go yourself. I personally can't think of any other options on this. You certainly can't plant a recorder in her suitcase or purse, she will find that and then watch out. God this sucks, waiting patiently with you as are hundreds of others. Prayers with you.

If I could give you any advice at all, it would be to wait, wait, wait. Like others have said, she will more than likely take things to her grave and you will never know. It will haunt you. Hang in there my man.

What's your take on hiring a PI?

It's a great idea, if she goes on a trip where he is (or he comes here). The problem is that they are in the same city very infrequently, and I have no idea what his schedule is. If there's another trip where he is there, I'm definitely going to plan on it.

CO ~ I totally admire your patience. I probably did everything wrong. I acted on a hunch, demanded answers and my husband admitted to "some" things. I, by no means, feel I know even the half of it. I compiled no proof, have no real ammunition and have given him the opportunity to now hide, delete or destroy anything that can be used against him. Brilliant!

What a painful journey we are all on. I hope you get the answers you seek. Good luck.

CO

Like probably all others that have read your thread I think there is something going on. I have tried to sort out the red flags and the not so red flags. I’m an old timer here. I think I have an iron-cast anti infidelity rep. I feel I need to say this because I don’t have any doubts that the next comments will be badly seen by some.

CO – Be open for there not being an affair going on. Be open for something else. Be open for other options.

To me the big red flags are the texts in the posts, the expensive presents and the secretive behavior with the phone.

The “not working for me” items are the missing panties, semen test and nightie.

You yourself throw out one of my red flags – the gifts – as being “normal” for your wife and the office environment she’s in.

The panties? It’s a no-win situation: Since she didn’t miss them some suggest that’s a clear indication of infidelity. Somehow I guess that if she had asked about them then that too would be a clear indication of paranoia because of an ongoing affair.

The nightie? Maybe she just got it to sleep in. Getting a new nightie is no more an indicator of having an affair than if you got new after-shave. Yep – getting a new aftershave is high on many “20 clear indicators that he must be having an affair” lists. The nightie IMHO is way too vague to be a red flag.

Semen test? Well CO – by your own admission you got a negative result right away. It was only after some time outside the given instructions that you got a dubious positive result. The one that you sent off to be confirmed. In a nutshell this shows the paranoia we BS inadvertently fall into (and it’s normal – happens to all of us).

The fact that the VAR hasn’t gotten anything…

All I’m saying is that MAYBE you don’t find anything because you are looking for the wrong thing. There can be major issues in your marriage but maybe not infidelity.

I suggest the following:

Try as you can to be normal. Try to ease the tension at home and get things at a calmer and better level.

Keep your monitoring ongoing. Despite what I’m saying I’m NOT refusing that something could be going on.

Give your monitoring a goal: If you don’t find anything to substantiate ongoing research then cut it off after a certain period of time (say 90 days).

I know that suggesting this on SI is akin to posting a pork recipe on a kosher food site but I learned as a cop that SOMETIMES the reason you don’t find what you are looking for can be because you are not looking for the right thing.

CO,

I too have read the various pages, and though I mainly lurk here, I wanted you to know that I often to check in on the post to see how you are doing. From my own experience, I know that pre-confrontation can be one of the most difficult parts of the entire experience. There were many red flags in my previous marriage and I confronted many times without concrete evidence. It wasn't until I caught him red handed with proof he couldn't deny (on a VAR) that he ever admitted to anything. The constant wondering without hard evidence will kill you. I did it for three years until I was able to catch him. Like many have said before me, its hard to wait around, but its even harder to never know for sure what the truth is or was. It may fade in time, you may not think about it as much, but you will always have the thought in the back of your mind. It ate at me, and by the time he admitted to what he had done (after I caught him for sure), I was so angry about the previous years, I couldn't forgive him. I was so mad that it took so long, the anger had built up so much, my soul was drained, my love was slowly deteriorated. I couldn't move on in our relationship. Find the truth, and whatever the outcome, you will find peace.

In the meantime, I am sending strength and positive energy your way.

<3

Bigger, I always appreciate your insightful posts -- they do make me think hard about things. I'll address some of your points:

-the nighty is not new, I've seen it before but extremely rarely. She usually wears sweats to bed at home, 99.9%. It's somewhat see-through throughout, and basically transparent over the cleavage/top of the breast area. The last I saw it on her was when we were trying to conceive years ago, I think.

-she still hasn't asked about the thong. I don't know what to make of that. She has two full drawers of underwear.

-not too surprised the VAR hasn't been fruitful. Like I said before, they are infrequent in communication outside of the work environment. I don't know how often they email, but there's usually one email either to or from him every few days (usually it's only the last one that isn't deleted). She doesn't aggressively delete her other emails from friends/coworkers. The email list on her BB goes all the way back to when she first got the phone.

It's not impossible that there's no PA (or maybe wishful thinking on her part that there would be). My main goal these past few weeks has been to find just exactly that. I just don't know. I really fear that if there is, she'll deny it all the way to the grave. And I'll be screwed.

Despite that, I do really like your suggestions. I've been on edge lately after flying blind on the communication front, although things are perhaps looking better in that department. You are absolutely right that I do need to settle down and aim for calmer waters. Will continue my monitoring, albeit not too aggressively. I was kinda on an investigative tear (rhymes with bear, not fear) last week, but I'm at a point where don't need to be so aggressive.

Looking forward to sitting poolside in the sun, despite all this bullshit I've been dealing with. I do need a break.

Thanks everyone else for your helpful input, too!

Hi CO,

I don't know how you do it. You have some mighty fortitude.

Just my 2 cents: Even if you never find any proof of a physical affair, the way your wife carries on in texts and emails is highly inappropriate (I don't care what culture she's from) and disrespectful to your marriage. The OM is also behaving in a way that is highly inappropriate and disrespectful to his marriage. If my husband was carrying on that way in texts and emails with someone else, I would certainly want to know.

At some point you'll need to make some important decisions for your future. Are you actively seeking employment? What are you doing to take care of yourself other than enjoying some time poolside?

I worry about you...

Hi Ipanema (now I got that song going through my head). Oh yes, it's very inappropriate and disrespectful to our marriage.

An email exchange from last year, talking about a European city (which I think he's originally from):

OM: If we have any meeting here I would love to show you around. Some special hidden places, some enjoyable activities, some pleasures stimulating of your senses I know you will love, with and without butter.

WW: Wow!! I will be counting on it. Xx

OM: Let me know some of your preferences.

WW: Many kisses for a wonderful Holiday season. XXX

OM: But you did not answer my question!

WW: I am not sure, I will have to see the menu..

OM: But you must know what you like. Then you may see new thing you may want too, right?

WW: True..But I have gone through phases of changing tastes..Haven't you? Inhibitions are tough..It would be wonderful to leave them all behind.

OM: And what have been your tastes? And current ones?

WW: Ok I'll tell you one main change..it used to be strictly boys but lately it has been girls too..

This is the kinda shit that really burns me.

I managed to access her Amazon purchase history recently. For Christmas '09, she sent him an unrated version of a foreign film and a book, both of which are highly sexually charged. The movie is basically an artistic porno (makes 9-1/2 Weeks pale in comparison). Now this exchange makes more sense to me:

OM: Thanks again for the book and the movie. Quite good! And, as you said, no cuts, so very enjoyable. What did you like about it? And what did you like the most? I will bring it to you next time so you can see the whole thing.

WW: Unfortunate and sad things happened but in the end it was optimistic. The sex scenes were very artistic.

OM: The picture, the music, the story, ... the art of cinema. Probably you are right and you saw the movie with some cuts because sex is pretty good. Although can get better.

Like I said, there will be a confrontation at some point, with or without PA evidence.

[This message edited by ChoppingOnions at 2:48 PM, April 28th (Thursday)]

um.....holy crap.

When did you access this email that she wrote last year? Recently?

To say that it is inappropriate and disrespectful of your marriage has to be the most understated remark I can imagine.

Onions - I would have to say that you already have concrete evidence of a PA. This is it. NOBODY writes an email like that to a friend, even flirtatiously. They both sound as if they are trying very hard to be coy in their writings to each other, being very careful not to explicitly say what they want/plan/have already done to each other.

Yet it is incredibly sexually explicit to me. You do not write things like that to man unless you are having a sexual relationship with him.

I honestly don't know what more you think you need to confront her.

sorry. computer glitch

[This message edited by emptyheart at 5:51 PM, April 28th (Thursday)]

oops

[This message edited by emptyheart at 5:50 PM, April 28th (Thursday)]

my apologies - multiple posting - my computer went haywire. sorry

[This message edited by emptyheart at 5:49 PM, April 28th (Thursday)]

Hmmmm.... Quite a tease. The pretense at restraint is ....ummmm....hypocritical at best. The words casting couch keep coming to my mind with this thread.

Okay, these latest revelations of past emails have MY blood boiling, I can just imagine what your's is doing. And your patience is incredible, believe me. I, on the other hand, tend to work off of emotion and then evaluate, not the greatest attribute but it's mine.

Given everything you have posted so far would have sent me off the deep end for sure. What I would of done I can't publish for fear of being banned on this site but it would not be pretty.

Something for sure is amiss and at this point not really sure if an intimate encounter, whether proven or not, matters. I now understand what earlier posters were saying about your relationship with your wife.

My question is this: If this situation goes south fast are you ready for the consequences?