SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

With respect to the boy you might ask the lawyer if you should ask her if you can still take to a ball game.

It may that not asking about the boy may be interpreted as an indication you are indifferent to his well being.

Just a thought - I have no idea the answer.

I left my house on my own doing. I knew this was going to be hard enough on my step son and when this is over it will be a hard adjustment for him. I wanted to make it somewhat painless for him till we got there.

Gary

Right now she is going to fight that I have no chance to be allowed to see him which I am sure is just a ploy for money.

Gary

Read the above Gary. Why do you hold yourself to such a high standard and your wife to such a low standard? Here you move out to make the adjustment better for the kid and she wants to blackmail you to keep seeing the kid.

If you and the kid love each other so much don’t you think that it would make his adjustment harder not seeing you? You care about her kid more than she does and she cares about money more.

Don’t be blackmailed. Tell her that you would love to stay in her kid’s life but that’s up to her. If she prevents it then that’s on her. Why would you be the bad guy for not paying enough to see him and her not be the bad guy for keeping you two apart over money?

We were married and I let her not work so not like I would not give her something.

Gary

You LET her not work and stay home with her kid?

@#$%^$*& That is me cussing Gary.

Do you know how many working women would love that?

You will have to pay her something because the law will make you but why do you owe her anything? You supported her and her kid while she had sex with another man. That was a great deal for her that I’m sure she would still do if she had it to do all over again.

I’ll tell you what Gary. You support me and my kid while I have sex with my wife. You can do all the housework too. Then we can go our separate ways and you can send me a check. How does that sound?

[This message edited by Graywolf at 1:40 PM, May 17th (Tuesday)]

Redsox13, well my wife last week said for me not to take him so I think its best if I just wait to see what happens before getting involved in that.

Graywolf, not sure I know how to respond back to your post. I am sorry I am not acting the way you want. I know I am not doing everything 100% correctly with this. Would you rather me just say I am doing this and that so it suits the advice I get here. I do take what people have told me here you included, it has helped but I think some things are easier said than done. Yeah I can read be like this or do this but doing some of this stuff is not easy.

I have done my best to take what you all have told me and I have not gotten defensive when people have told me this or that. I appreciate all the help. But I am sorry I don't have it in me to just be this cold calculate guy in this. I am not trying to be this nice guy to her but I feel that I cant be a dick too.

What good is doing all I can not to support her in the least? Am I really making myself feel better? This woman was once my wife and the love of my life. My marriage was not always crappy as the last 6 months were. Yeah she has been pretty crappy and it hurts but is being crappy back making me a better person here?

I am sorry I am not kicking her to the curb and doing all that people want me to do. I cant do that yet. I am fighting to still have some type of relationship with my step son. In the cutthroat divorce world does that make me not doing all that should be done to get out ahead? Probably not and that is my road to travel. But to see my step son I don't have a good hand at the card table to do that.

I know it is easy to not know my marriage and my wife and say cut her out of this or don't give her that. Its not that simple for me. I cant stop being me or what I feel is somewhat right. Yean man I know my wife banged a guy in my house why I worked my ass off. I think about it all day and every day. Think its easy for me to know that and deal with all this crap. So no I wont take up your offer to pay you while you sleep with your wife. I know you mean well and trying to help and get me see what you see, but the place I am in currently and its not a great place personally that wont do it. Sorry to say.

I did not tell you to do anything. All I’m saying Gary is that if you can make excuses for your wife then you cut yourself some slack. You’re a great guy and don't have to be a saint.

[This message edited by Graywolf at 2:22 PM, May 17th (Tuesday)]

Gary

You are talking to a guy who didn't take his own advice. I could have had my wife and the OM fired in my first divorce, and I could have probably received a pretty big settlement. But there were kids involved. And I didn't hate my ex-wife.

My lawyer told me - "take Newman to the cleaners". Hammer you wife Michele !

So I let her walk. Because I wasn't a dick. And she never even knew my lawyer was telling me that. She never knew I even spoke to her.

All I am trying to say is you are in a negotiation. Let your lawyer try to get what he can. You always have the option to give more.

I apologize if what I suggest is making things more complicated for you.

[This message edited by redsox13 at 2:46 PM, May 17th (Tuesday)]

Graywolf, thanks man I don't mean to sound defensive. I take what you say seriously. And you are not wrong. I just want to explain why I do what I do. I am not trying to seem like I just am being an idiot in this and give some reasoning.

I know in the end I will be on here telling you all I messed this or that up. I can feel that. Some days I feel like I am handling this well and some days I feel I am not. Maybe this is one of those days.

I do thank you for taking time out to post to me all the same.

Gary - you are doing fine in a bad situation. I think folks are just worried that you will be overly generous.

Do yourself a favor and let your lawyer do their job. Listen to the lawyers advice and don't get yourself on the hook for more than you are legally obligated to do.

You may not believe it right now, but you will come out at the end of this thing and move on with life. It will be much easier to move on in life if you are not locked into a long term obligation that you don't have to be.

Keep strong. Keep focused. Your doing fine!

Gary,

I understand where you are coming from.

I think the goal of the posters, like Graywolf, is to help you separate the emotion of the divorce from the business of divorce. Being able to do that will protect you, the Gary1995, we are all here to support through this process. The emotion of the divorce should be separate from the business of divorce.

The emotions of divorce are all mixed in a blender of the positive past, the feelings of love, the feelings of betrayal, the hope for the future, the hope of some sort of understanding, and a need for some feelings of positive from the horror of infidelity.

The business of divorce has nothing to do with those. It is simply the division of assets. Sadly, this includes the time with your son. The call to protect yourself is rooted in this unemotional reality of what divorce is.

Investing your emotions is risky because you run the chance of getting hurt even more. It opens the door for long term resentment after your feelings settle into an even keel as you heal from your wife's debacle. It can subject you to years of additional torment at the hands of your soon to be ex wife. It is already taking its toll on you as a supportive parent to your step-son. It is tainting a support system (the community yo u live in) against you because of the lies your wife is spreading.

I made this mistake. I am sure others made the same mistake. None of your SI support wants to see you suffer the long term damage these mistakes can cause. In your case, it will be financially damaging for a very long part of your future and damaging to your time (if you get any) with the son you love.

Sometimes the responses seem (and are) harsh. But the ultimate goal is to help you get to a future you deserve. A good positive future for you.

I know it is hard. I did not listen to SI advice. I forced my lawyer to play nice for some the same reasons you mentioned above. There was absolutely no nice in return. None. In fact, the nice was used against me. Still is. Don't let your nice get used against you any more than it already has.

If possible, let your boy know you would like to be at his games- that you would like to be there for him. He needs to know you are not bailing on him- let him know any way you can.

Also, if you were helping to coach his team, get back into that role. Contact the head coach and get on board. He is horribly confused, scared, and insecure because of these abrupt changes in his life. He needs you there. Nobody can run you off from coaching (that you were already doing) without a serious reason. If it makes his mother mad- so what?

Feel the emotions- you have to. Share them here. Vent here. Weep here. But keep them out of the business side of the divorce- for your own well being.

Let your lawyer do what he thinks is best for you. That is your advocate for the non-emotional aspect of the divorce. Let him protect you. Let her lawyer protect her. It isn't your job anymore. She made the mistake of firing you from that.

[This message edited by quedagh at 2:45 PM, May 17th (Tuesday)]

Yeah you guys are right thanks. I know people here are coming from a place of help and prior experience. Its just sometimes I can read and see it here and be like yeah do this or don't do that. But I get home and when you have to actually do things it can be tough sometimes to act a certain way.

But again I do appreciate all posts on here, from the ones just giving support to the ones that give me a good kick in the butt. I need them both really.

I am trying and really taking all that is said here to heart and to set in motion. I think my post today didn't come out right but I want to say I am not trying to sound defensive really. I don't feel that way. I think I just am not having a good day and going to chalk it up to that.

I forced my lawyer to play nice for some the same reasons you mentioned above. There was absolutely no nice in return. None. In fact, the nice was used against me. Still is. Don't let your nice get used against you any more than it already has.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Actually, quedagh's entire last post really sums it up.

Yes, you will have to pay spousal support(fellow New Jersian). It is virtually a formula, and the assets/liabilities are near 50/50. I am sure that your lawyer already explained most of this, and it is you, not her, that has a grasp on reality here.

But that doesn't mean that you need to overcompensate. Like it was stated, you can always give more back that what is awarded. And you really need to think about the future, in a generality if nothing else. I will assume that you would like a relationship in the future, and you don't need to financially hamstring yourself any more than the law requires. It is so freaking difficult to separate the emotions from the business side of this----that is why we suggest that you let your lawyer do most of the handling...to help ease your mind.

There is no victory to this tragedy. The best result is to come out of this with the least damage possible, and to be able to move forward. Hell---you only started your story here a month and a half ago. It is hard to wrap up an entire marriage in this timeframe.

But you will.

Gary this is an awful situation to be in. I don't know that anyone will make it out the other side without having done something "wrong". Your lawyer will have seen this played out over and over and they have your best interests in mind at all times. Maybe try to let them do their thing and if something they are doing makes you uncomfortable you can always ask why it needs to be done that way or share your concerns with your lawyer that you aren't comfortable with that. Then you can make an informed decision that you feel comfortable about. But in the back of your mind remember you deserve better than how your wife is treating you and you deserve to be ok at the end of this process. I hope that makes sense.

JB and Quedagh are right Gary. BTW, I too was from NJ until the end of High School and for a few years after college, now Maryland but most of my friends are still there, half are divorced and I shared their pain through the process.

DO NOT overcompensate. She doesn't deserve it, you'll be hurting enough as it is and you still have a life to lead. That may include someone else someday who will ask you why you are still getting fucked over by the ex instead of letting you grow again and what will your answer be ?

I get why you moved out but it was YOUR HOUSE. But I get it. Make sure you protect your rights there.

Gary, we offer advice with your best interests at heart. None of us take offense if you take our advice or not. That is the beauty of this place. You get advice from people of all different walks of life, who have been cheated on and screwed over. You are free to use the counsel that will help you and discard the rest.

I never married. My fiancé fucked me over before we wed. So I am not 100% fully qualified to advise on a wife. But kids? My sister gave me her 2 son's to raise, which I did from 2004 - 2013. When she ran off with her lover, she striped me of the boys. I had no power, no legal recourse, even though the youngest still calls me his dad, and as his uncle, my blood runs through his veins.

To maintain a close relationship with them, I bought her a car and maintained it until it was worn out. Last year she needed another car, I am now disabled, so me and my parents have provided her with another car, that the three of us maintain. For what purpose do you ask? So we can have them stay with us a month this summer in our home. And visit them a five times a year.

Brother, remember this. When it comes to infidelity, no matter how innocent we are, we have a price to pay. Good fortune to you brother.

Gary,

With all due respect your wife is banking on the fact that you are a good guy. She knows this about you. She knows you have a good heart and a soft spot. And as much as you may wish to believe that "showing her" your good side will somehow make her more reasonable, it places you in a vulnerable position. While you do not need to be cruel, you need to protect yourself financially, emotionally and physically. You can only control you, not her or her reactions, etc. She has shown you who she is and you best believe that is the real her, as painful as that is to accept.

I wish you the best in this very difficult situation.

There is no text book answer for any of this. Follow your heart. At the end of the day, be good with who you are.

Gary let me use some numbers and hyperbole to make a point in your situation

Lets say the asset value at stake here is 100 units.

Lets say both of you play nice and are fair to one another. You win 50. She wins 50.

She tries to fuck you over while you try to play nice. She gets 80 while you get 10-20.

You try to destroy her while she plays nice and fair. She gets 20 while you get 80.

You both try destroy one another. Both of you win 35. And the remaining 30 goes to the lawyers.

What should be the best strategy and the safest strategy here Gary ?

What is the worst strategy ? Especially after you know what you know about your wife ?

Thank you all for the help and advice as always. Sorry I was like I was yesterday I was having a bad day it seemed. I try to not let that happen and nothing specific happened just felt all of what been going on hit me.

jb3199, thanks for the tip and it helps to see what others experienced in our court systems. Yeah good point on doing the least damage for me. I will remember that.

freedomfromabuse and sadeyezagain, yeah I am trying to follow my heart and let my lawyer handle from there so I don't do anything that messes it up for me more. And I need to remind myself that my wife is on the other end knowing how I am and will use that to her advantage. I need to stop blocking myself from knowing she is going to do that to me.

Western, thanks I forget that this could impact me in the future. I seem to forget that I can have one again. Other people talk to me about it and such and I just don't pay it much mind. I gotta make myself know that this is not the end although it can feel like it.

kimichi, thanks and point taken. Looking at in those terms it is very clear what is the best and worst options.

Basically I am glad you guys gave me the hard talk when I needed it. I read on here at times and see what others are going thru and its like a thousand times worse of a situation than me and I am like snap out of it Gary you don't have it that bad as others. I think my other problem is I don't talk about it much outside of here. Like when I went out for drinks after work the other day. Some of them were talking to me about it and I just shrugged it off and moved on to something else.

Gary, you are going to have good days and bad days (or hours/minutes). They don't call this an emotional rollercoaster for nothing. You are doing great. You are taking action, despite your aching heart.

People here just see what a good and honorable guy you are. No one wants to see you taken advantage of. We don't want you to "finish last". You are getting pushed because people just want you to make sure you are protecting yourself. It's hard to do that when you are still in pain sometimes.

The SI peeps are like the manager outside the corner of the boxing ring between rounds. They see you're bloody, but they try to get you motivated and back on your feet for the next round. They give you advice on what they see, how to protect yourself, and what to anticipate. Sometimes they encourage, sometimes they can be "harsh". But they are all in your corner and want you to win.

Let your lawyer negotiate the best deal for you. Sadly, even if you gave your wife "everything", she likely would still not be satisfied. That just seems to be how she rolls. And, yes, I think she will try to use your "niceness" against you. Stay strong.

A few legal things based on my recent NJ divorce.

Alimony will be based on what she CAN earn...not what she is earning. Term will likely be 1/2 the length of the marriage. You can use other assets to negotiate the amount or length.

House: We were both on deed but I was solo on mortgage. House had no equity and received no offers at my break even price. Options were a)sell & split the loss or b) She buy house from me or c) I keep house and she waives her ownership rights.

I kept the house !! Here's the kicker...my keeping the house was taking a DEBT..not an asset. Not only did I keep the house but she had to give up part of my 401K payout because I was taking the house & it's negative equity.

Debt & assets acquired DURING the marriage will be split by default...but again...you can negotiate. Assets will be used to cover debts before anyone takes any money to the bank...so your WW could easily walk away in the hole or with nothing. But she won't be "cleaning you out" unless you let her.

Still Standing, thanks for the words of encouragement and I loved your boxing analogy. That was funny and made total sense.

Sybo, thanks for sharing, it helps to see what others went thru and the results especially where I am. I will pass along to my lawyer and compare what she thinks.