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CS is not about income disparity. It goes from non custodial to custodial. The amount varies based on the incomes involved, but if you have more than 50/50, she will owe you CS, employed or not. On that note, gather your tax documents from the past 2-3 years. You want to show the court what her income could be. Staying unemployed to dodge CS is an old, tired trick that the judge has seen a thousand times. You can have the CS order issued based on her previous income. She can argue that her circumstances have changed, of course, but if she has a job offer on the table that's a tough sell.

I'm so glad you're taking control and filing.

CS is not about income disparity. It goes from non custodial to custodial. The amount varies based on the incomes involved, but if you have more than 50/50, she will owe you CS, employed or not. On that note, gather your tax documents from the past 2-3 years. You want to show the court what her income could be. Staying unemployed to dodge CS is an old, tired trick that the judge has seen a thousand times. You can have the CS order issued based on her previous income. She can argue that her circumstances have changed, of course, but if she has a job offer on the table that's a tough sell.

Thank you. Now I think I know why she wants 50/50 even though with her job she won't be able to have them 50% of the time. She has been trying to get me to agree to 50/50 under the guise of "what's best for the children."

I know she does want to be with them 50% of the time, but she won't be with this job. ((She will be traveling.)

But she also doesn't want to pay CS according to state law.

I want to go with something like 60/40 but with "open visitation" or something like that. In other words, I have them the majority of the time but in the event that she IS home, she can take them.

(Or am I way off?)

Ultimately stuff to discuss with my attorney....

Right of first refusal. You can have a clause in your agreement that if one of you should need child care during your parenting time, you must first check the availability of the other parent. Sometimes there's a time limit, like if you need child care for more than 2 hours or 4 hours.

Discuss with your attorney, of course.

ETA: I didn't mean for there to be a face on the post. Blame a small touchscren!

[This message edited by roughroadahead at 3:34 PM, July 19th (Friday)]

Can any of you sum up the pros and cons of filing through my attorney and the pros and cons of going through mediation--given my situation?

I've been talking all day to guys who've been through "traditional" divorce and I'm getting a bit scared by their horror stories. Not enough to back off, but I think I need an "itemized nudge," you know?

I can feel myself thinking, "Well, maybe I should keep trying with mediation, hold strong to my position, and of course take the MSA to my attorney. Worst case scenario? If it continues to fall apart? We waste another 1500k. But maybe it won't..."

DUDE.

How itemized do we have to get? Here's the bottom line. YOU NEED LEGAL GUIDANCE. Which means you need an attorney. It's clear by all of your comments that you really have no understanding of the legal process of divorce. Quit asking us, or your friend and HIRE AN ATTORNEY.

Just talking about "dragging the kids through a child custody dispute". You are imagining scenarios that rarely happen. You are more worried about the PROCESS than about the OUTCOME. You need to be focused on the OUTCOME and what is BEST for your kids!!!!!!

I can't believe you're still thinking this can be "mediated". We have here, for the most part, urged legal representation....a lawyer. The lawyer works for YOU. She/he is NOT an impartial mediator. The attorney will work hard to protect you from YOURSELF. All along in these threads you've made some wild assumptions about the divorce process without understanding it. And the best place to get an understanding of it is with a LAWYER.

Please, I beg you, stop the dithering. Quit asking questions that only a lawyer should answer for you. But, most of all, please, PLEASE take steps to ensure what is best for the kids. You are creating scenarios in your mind that are paralyzing you.

So, hopefully, this won't go another 19 pages before you make a solid decision and go with it. You can stick with mediation....and it will be drawn out MUCH longer, and you and the kids will get a raw deal. But, in mediation I believe you will continue to talk to WW....and THAT is what I think you don't want to give up.

One of the best things about using a lawyer? THEY TALK FOR YOU. It's that simple. No emotions, no drama (that you see). No manipulations.

Please, I beg you. Get that attorney and file. You are going in circles, and the ones that will get hurt the most from you inability to make a decision and seek the PROPER guidance, are your kids.

ETA: You've asked for advice over and over. You are unable, or unwilling, to hear it. You are so unclear about the process, even after all the questions and talk. I just don't understand why you won't get proper legal advice, from an attorney whom you have hired and have a retainer agreement with. I don't get what is holding you back from just doing that. "Talking" to a lawyer friend is not the same thing as hiring a lawyer, who works for YOU and is obligated to get YOU and your kids, the very best deal. Even if you decide to go back to mediation, at least you will have proper legal advice.

[This message edited by SadMad2012 at 4:34 PM, July 19th (Friday)]

I must admit to some confusion. I thought you had your lawyer file yesterday.

Thank you!! That's all I needed to hear. Plus a divorced friend IRL just told me (shouted at me) the same thing.

Hi, Friends,

I want to share something exciting with you:

Today is the second day in a row where I have NOT felt the following since this all began nearly a year ago (D day):

-No crying

-no longing

-no "what ifs"

-no despair

-no irrational, delusional hope that she will change

-no depression (sadness, yes, but even this is rather distant)

-My kids are with her, I am alone in the house. I just said goodnight to them in FaceTime, and though I miss them deeply, I am not falling into a heap now. I know I will see them Sunday.

I feel strong, together, my mind feels sharp. My appetite has returned, and I look forward to returning to work.

Again, I don't exaggerate when I say that today, and to a lesser extent yesterday, is the ONLY and FIRST day this has happened.

I can only attribute my radical change in my emotional state to the following:

-I have not seen her in days

-I have not taken her bait in phone conversations, not today, not yesterday

-I hung up on her for the first time ever

-I am resolute in filing for divorce, and her inevitable fury be damned

-I feel anger, outrage at what she has done, but it's a quiet, calm anger

Her power over me is weakening!

Is this the beginning of the holy grail of indifference?

Now, the real test will be 1) when I see her, and 2) (the REAL test) if/when she love bombs me.

But I suspect she is out of ammunition. She is pissed that I am rebuffing her. She senses she has lost The Power.

Now, this could change and I may very well cycle back into the roller coaster tomorrow. But right now I am thrilled and very proud of myself!

I finally know I will, as you all have assured me for so long, that I will survive this. I will be OK!

Thank you, everyone!

See, it does get easier.

I want to go with something like 60/40 but with "open visitation" or something like that. In other words, I have them the majority of the time but in the event that she IS home, she can take them.

(Or am I way off?)

First right of refusal, with your parenting time written in stone. With a manipulative person you want to have that document to fall back on. ALWAYS. It s a bindng agreement.

You don't want her playing games with you over this.

You also want to have CS funneled through your state agency. That way the state has a paper trail, and the state will follow up. How do I know this? Well, I was stupid and trusted the manipulative FT. He ended up with a garnishment and the money funneled through the state. Oh so much nicer as I never have to speak to him about it. But it would have saved me a lot of anguish and worry when he stopped paying Nov. and Dec. when i was a stay at home mom!

[This message edited by Chrysalis123 at 9:19 PM, July 19th (Friday)]

I can feel myself thinking, "Well, maybe I should keep trying with mediation, hold strong to my position, and of course take the MSA to my attorney. Worst case scenario? If it continues to fall apart? We waste another 1500k. But maybe it won't..."

No. worst case scenario - You lose your home. You lose access to your kids. We've been telling you this for months now. For the love of god wake up before this happens and file. Your spouse is going to realise it's real sooner or later and when that happens she is going to do everything in her power to take everything from you. She'll go for the house, she'll go for the kids. All the time she will be smiling and playing mrs reasonable. All the while she will talking about mediation. If it comes down to her word against yours, and you are still falling for this bullshit, she might just get everything too. It doesn't matter if you are the best dad in the world and she is the antichrist, it will come down to who is the most convincing. In a battle of wills between a ruthless, selfish WS and a dithering indecisive Bs, the WS will win every time. So for the love for God file, before you end up being yet another person on here posting "oh my god you were all right".

Why are you still asking questions about mediation. You've already seen it's bullshit with a WS that has their own interests at heart and nothing else. I think you are just still looking for the one exception to the rule that will go "oh yeah I ignored everyone on SI and it all worked out fine" so you can justify your procrastination and fear to take the next step even though you know it's the right one.

Your wife is gone, your marriage is done. I'm sorry, but that's the truth. File and start your life again. Her affair might be a defining moment in your life, but you do not have to let it define your life.

AD, PLEASE listen to SadMad and LonelyHeart! You need to file ASAP, and you need to file for the absolute maximum that you can get as far as custody, the house, CS, and SS. Things can always be adjusted later as far as visitation goes with the kids, but YOU need to protect those kids. Do you honestly want those kids spending the majority of their time with your WS, where her POS OM may be at any time? And as far as your thinking you may have reached "the holy grail of indifference", that's ONE of the reasons why you need an attorney to speak FOR you - so it doesn't matter if you're indifferent or crying into your beer - she won't know it. Your attorney, if you have a good one, is your shield and your lance in this battle. And make no mistake, it is a battle at this point. You're long past the point of mediation being an effective tool for dissolving this marriage. Please file and let a professional handle the legal details about which you have no knowledge; you will end up saving yourself money and heartache in the long run.

Sorry, I meant LonelyHusband, not LonelyHeart. My oops!

Friends,

Again, I have an appointment with my attorney this Wednesday.

I.

AM.

FILING.

And I will let you know that I have as soon as I can after my appointment.

Thank you as always for your support.

I.

AM.

FILING.

Glad to hear it. Now make sure you ask for the MAXIMUM. You can negotiate down to 'reasonable' if/when necessary.

Also: make sure that when you get down to the final agreement that EVERYTHING IS COMPLETELY SPECIFIED IN WRITING. You CANNOT trust your WW to be a reasonable partner in your D.

I am specifically concerned about her wanting 50/50 on paper (presumably in an attempt to avoid CS) but leaving the children with you most of the time 'off the books'. Then it will be fight after fight of who/how much/when and a scheduling nightmare for you because she will be CONTROLLING YOUR LIFE until the children are grown.

You need to have the percent custody on paper reflect the reality, and your WW's visitation (or custody) times specified in writing. You can include right of first refusal both ways. You can specify what happens if someone is late for pickup. But make sure that it is ALL there, with nothing wishy-washy, so that when (not if, but WHEN) she wants to go around the agreement you have that document to fall back on.

Good luck with your L, I hope you have a SHARK who knows how to fight for you.

((((AD))))

Hi, Everyone,

I am completing my financial affidavit to bring to my attorney's this week. Man, that form is so detailed. Very difficult to be accurate with stuff like values of possessions, monthly home expenses, etc. Must I really be so accurate with the "little stuff"?

Any advice?

Also, I have gone back and forth with our home: I want our kids to stay, I want to move out and start anew, I want to move out...

Now I'm back to staying put as long as possible. Just seeing them a few days ago SO happy to be back in the only world they've known, with all their friends.... To take them away from this on TOP of the divorce...well...

Problem is, after mortgage and everything else, I would barely break even every month.

My wife could easily help, as she makes over 100k and I make 60k, but do not believe I qualify for spousal support, as we have been married for only ten years. Maybe a little SS, which would help pay the bills.

What to do....

That "little stuff" can add up fast and come back to bite you in the butt afterward. can you come up with a spreadsheet for all your household expenses based on past bills? that way you have actual numbers that are reflected, not WAGs. Also, for values of possessions, I believe there are common guides that are used for insurance valuations, unless you have some rare antiques or artwork that you have had appraised (hopefully). Or, the alternative is that you have kept records of the purchase prices of major household goods and can just do a depreciated value of them. It all adds up to more than you think. As far as the house goes, you are really going to have to take the emotion out of the equation out of the situation. i know you want to keep it for the kids, but if keeping it will make the finances so tight, then you will be constantly stressed out over finances, and that won't be good for the kids either.

Hi,

I just met the WW on the side of the road in between our places to trade off one of the dogs. Our kids were with her.

She got out of the car and threw herself into my arms, would not let go, and looked tearfully into my eyes.

I am so upset (angry) not just because she has the audacity to do this, but because my son was right there, beaming with hope looking at us.

The good news is that I feel no pull.

I'm sure this will not happen again once she learns that I've filed and she is not going to get her way. Then the poison will return, and with a vengeance.

Still, very upsetting.

yeah... she's pretty much a bad person.

i mean, if she's still banging her AP, then this is just pure manipulation. and she's manipulating your kids as well.

Please check with your lawyer about spousal support. It his highly unlikely you'll get it for the rest of your life, but for example, waffle and I were married for 10 years and both Ls agree that I get 3 years of SS. He is well established in his career, and I'm just starting mine, so there is the necessary income disparity. It may well be different in Florida, but don't make any assumptions, and ask the question.

i know you want to keep it for the kids, but if keeping it will make the finances so tight, then you will be constantly stressed out over finances, and that won't be good for the kids either.

Thanks, WW.

I did some numbers crunching, and I think I can "technically afford" the house. It would be tight, but....

I net 4600.00 a month.

Mortgage + miscellaneous come to around 4000.00. (This is a high estimate, and I can make some sacrifices and pinch pennies.)

WW will likely pay at least 1000.00 in CS. Again, i don't think i qualify for SS, but my attorney can inform me of this. I am willing to stay put a few years and draw from savings to cover any deficits.

I really want to get the WW off the mortgage and pay her half of what little equity is in the home. This would also free her to be qualified for her own mortgage and buy a more-than-decent home.

I'm hoping she will go for this and not let her irrational vindictiveness rule her actions. After all, she is "all about the best interests of the children."