SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

of course, what did you expect?

if she's not "all in" she's going to be saying that you're some kind of childish drama queen. You don't expect her to say, "i'm a horrible person" do you? And her mother will commiserate and defend her.

that's just one more of the fucked up things when you have an unremorseful cheating wife. YOU get blamed.

You may wanna have her served instead of handing her the papers...because she will probably have to sign a acknowledgement of service....which she may not be willing to do.

How about having her served at work since that's where the A blossomed from?

Wow, my WW had a conversation with her mother and I am being thrown under the bus. It's very me, me, me.

I am throwing a tantrum. I don't talk logically. I don't speak logically. It's the equivalent of a child throwing a tantrum.

This is pretty messed up. Her mother, who knows, is kind of right there with her.

Messed up, but common. Your mother-in-law loves you, MIL liked it when you and your wife and your kids were one happy family. MIL would like it to stay that way. I am thinking that if YOU were the cheater, your MIL would be telling her daughter to eat the shit sandwich and go back to you. MIL doesn't care if you are happy, MIL doesn't really care much about her daughter to be happy, MIL wants MIL to be happy. MIL wants the situation to be "normal" again. "My daughter made a mistake, she said she is sorry, she won't do it again, now please get over it already. Why are you being so difficult, just get over it." That is my sense of it.

I am thinking that MIL believes your wife, her daughter, has been truthful and upstanding since d-day occurred, not knowing that your wife STILL is lying almost daily. It that really were the case, you WOULD be halfway over it already. At least you would be full-on reconciling. MIL does not have all facts (I am guessing).

MIL, after all, raised up a daughter who is self-centered. MIL made daughter believe your wife should be the center of her life.

So she is defending herself and not taking blame for what she did. And her mom is backing her?

Guess you know where she got her values from.

Burn it to the ground.

Apple's don't fall too far from the tree. The last thing her mother will want to do is turn her back on her daughter, admit that she may have failed and have anything to do with her daughter's issues, or admit that daughter is just like mom. For some, not all

Glad you got something rolling. Just don't show your hand. You have had a past of giving ultimatums in order to get what you want from your wife...if you don't do this I will do this any longer. Empty threats are somethings that your wife is used to and she knows how to play that. SO DO NOT BREAK DOWN IN ONE EVENING FIGHT AND LET HER KNOW! You can't win her back that and you shouldn't even want her that way.

Keep a VAR on you! She might get even nastier and try to falsely accuse you of domestic violence.

Can you invite a friend or a relative to crash at your place for a while? It would give you a witness in case she pulls any crazy stunts.

Best wishes

One thing you may want to have is a very antiseptic, fact-filled timeline of your discovery and subsequent actions. If she's doing this with mom then chances are common friends will be getting the same.

Your wife may be a narcissist.

One thing she is not is remorseful. She's regretful that she got caught, sure, and she's doing everything in her power to return to the 'norm' (which includes her boyfriend in her life)

By the way, even though she asked to have no contact, OMW will want to know when papers have been served.

So one thing she keeps saying is that I keep being nasty. I lash out. I'm trying to figure jut if I have been. I guess the truth is that I probably have been.

One of the things she said is that she doesn't recognize me anymore. All she sees is a very angry man. Probably true.

Maybe I'd have to listen to it again but I guess her mother is just trying to be her mother. I'd be worried about protecting my children too.

I think there is a lot of bad communication between my WW and I.

I don't feel she is outwardly remorseful. She feels I am very outwardly angry. She continues to say that she is scared of me.

I know this tone is probably a lot different than the last couple of days but I do feel like I've been...not too hard on her, but maybe I need to check myself. Make sure that I'm not going overboard? I didn't have good boundaries before and maybe now that I know where they are I am pushing them very hard.

I don't know. I know that the overall consensus is that the affair is still going on. The evidence so far doesn't really support that.

Before I go nuclear on her and hand her divorce papers, does "Just Friends" go over this?

I guess I am saying that, if there is a chance to R, what if I am pushing too hard and she actually is telling the truth.

I know it sounds bad, but what if I am pushing her to the breaking point when I could back off just a little and we could work things out? Not excuse her from the affair but maybe just not be such a hardliner daily? It sounds silly but hopefully you all know what I am trying to say.

The reason she is acting the way she is is to make you think that you are the bad guy. And by this message is seems it is working.

Self-doubt is going to kill you over the next few weeks as your decision gets some permanence. This is why journaling is so important, and in this case your journal speaks back.

Your wife is still having the affair and will continue to do so as long as she is at this job. Don't you think it's her who is being 'nasty' by putting you through this? Not saying playing the matyr but part of reconciliation is her accepting her actions and helping you through your feelings rather than making you feel like shit about them. You have been MORE than fair

Actions, not words.

She needs to decide if her job and boyfriend are more important than you and then you need to decide if you want to offer her the chance for HER to run the reconciliation process.

You're not doing anything crazy, you're just asking her to decide. And when you do ask he to decide then I'll be you $1000 that instead of deciding she'll put on a gas lighting show for the ages. Again, when you ask her to decide, you guys are not leaving that room without a decision. Do not let her consult her boyfriend (she will)

You need to be hard during this process, because being soft just means putting off decisions and haunt her avoid consequences. If you decide to reconcile is the time to then try alternate tacts.

[This message edited by eric1 at 4:20 AM, August 5th (Wednesday)]

Yea I know. It's just that what I tell you guys is all from my warped perspective. I am sure that I am leaving out some finer details.

Probably just fear coming out. I actually think that there is a 99% chance of her choosing her job when I give her the divorce papers. Having confirmation of that will be tough.

The divorce proceedings in our state are rather quick if uncontested. No 6 month wait period.

Honesty she's on the hook for a lot of child support. If be able to maintain what I have today with her paying that much. So I feel I have a pretty good safety net there.

I just don't really want that I guess in the end. I know, you have to be willing to lose the marriage to save it. Just venting and I have a little bit of self doubt here. Even the Just Friends book says to wait 3 months. It hasn't been even one month yet, but I do want to make sure I am out of infidelity.

Of course you're an angry man, your wife has been having an affair! What did she expect, that you'll be all smiles and roses?!

But I'm wary of her saying she's scared of you, it's seems she's setting up a DV charge -> again, VAR up, have a friend stay with you and confide in at least one person in real life about her infidelity before she's served with papers!

I wouldn't wait any longer to hit her with D papers -> if she's really remorseful, she'll show it and you filing for D won't make her unremorseful. If she's not, why spend another day married to an unremorseful cheater?

Best wishes

How many VAR's did you buy?

You need another one. One for gathering evidence..and one for you.

You need to keep one on you at all times. Stop talking to her. Stop arguing with her. Kids and finances. That's it. And anytime you are in a room with her..have your VAR on...always.

She continues to say that she is scared of me.

And she is trashing you to her mother.

She is setting you up for false DV charges.

Don't think it would happen? Unfortunately, in the last 4 years I've been a member of SI, I have seen at least a dozen BH's falsely accused of DV.

Your WW is a vindictive bitch. You need to act accordingly.

Yea, I have to accept that what you all say is possibly true too. Life sucks. There should be more transparency and less lies. Deceit isn't really my thing and it takes its toll on me. Both hers and mine lately.

I only got the one VAR but maybe I need to get another.

Actually the lawyer gave a good idea in this case. Typically the WS will block a doorway and try to have you shove them out of the way then call the cops. She said to call a friend. Let them know what is happening and that will probably diffuse the situation right away. Then call the cops if they are still threatening.

Good advice. I hope I never have to use it.

I saw the beginning of this thread and am now 'catching up'. I'm so sorry you are going through this and please don't feel bad about it taking a few weeks to "catch up". Some of us road the crazy train for months/years.

Please read confused615 again. You are on the path to being set up. She knows you have been the primary parent. She knows she will be on the hook for child support. Get another VAR (or 2), protect yourself.

You do not think this way because you care and have feelings for her. Because you are honest and want to do what is right. She is a liar and manipulator. She is capable of doing anything that benefits her regardless of the impact to you- act accordingly.

You're making her break up with her boyfriend - you monster!

You have her a chance to make the work thing work, you shouldn't have, but you did. Since then she's done absolutely nothing to assure you it's DEAD.

She broke no contact (and getting the call from him about exposure isn't the only time)

She already started setting the groundwork for fuckathon 2015. Serious, what was going through her mind even telling that to you? In no universe is that ok.

The book says wait three months. Fine. We're talking about divorce papers. She's lied to you for over a year. She probably still had his semen in her when you found your first evidence. She is still talking to him. She got angry at you for throwing a wrench into her love affair by letting the dude's wife know. She's trashing you to her mom because of how you're acting after finding out that she had a boyfriend. What. The. Fuck. Fuck dude, she even asked for time to decide between you two.

The divorce papers are you saying 'this shit is stopping now'. And for that shit to stop she needs to leave her job. If you are 99% sure she's taking the job over you, then brace yourself for the blame-shifting gas lighting performance of the year. Just remember, we could have kept her job and her marriage if she didn't get a boyfriend on the job.

"we wouldn't be having this discussion if you didn't have an affair" is the only thing you need to tell her.

!!!!Red Alert buddy!!!!

She is setting the table for a DV charge. You need to record every conversation. She is going to play dirty. No matter what she has said she is going to fuck you over if you don't start being proactive and protect yourself.

Do not raise your voice. Do not block her. Remain calm with the flatest of affect you can muster. This will really pissed her off and make her sound like the crazy one on tape.

So last night while my WW was at IC, my youngest daughter grabbed hold of the counter top while I was pulling her chair out. She fell off her chair (these are the counter height chairs) and landed on her chin. She busted it open and had to get 6 stitches last night.

I'm a little shaken from that. She was on my watch.

I guess I'm trying to be retrospective too while I am at it. The 180 say be happy in front of your WS, and I really haven't done a good job of that for the past couple of days, and several days last week and certainly not the week before that.

I thought I was doing the 180 but in hindsight I guess I really haven't been. Some but not all.

The job thing is critical. I know that. She knows that. She keeps trying to tell me that the A is over and that she can do it. She can stay in the job and keep it professional. Yes she messed up once but she knows now that it wasn't a good idea. She thought that she could talk to him about business and then he blindsided her with non-work stuff. She says that she found out that it was just too hard and she should have never talked to him on the phone.

All those pretty words aside, she continues to tell me that she is going to have to go to Oxford at some point for her job. Probably not until October or November. I told her to try and feel it from my side.

She's said that she isn't going to Philly even though she really needs to, and that's for me.

Last night we talked about how we are starting some conversations. How they aren't being started in healthy ways (my words). This just causes fights. We're both guilty of this.

She's given me access to her accounts but I can't ever seem to remember her work laptop one. She's very paranoid that I will read her journal which is on there. I've promised that I will never read it. That said, she doesn't like how I am sneaking around and checking her stuff when I am not giving her access to mine. I told her that I need to be able to check and that every time I check it just helps me build trust when I find nothing.

She also said that everything I am doing is just all so sudden that it makes her feel uneasy. Working out a lot, doing more stuff away from the house, buying new clothes, the dance classes...all of it. She says that I should be doing that stuff but it was just all very quick that it took her by surprise.

When I took off to go out shopping and stuff at night, she thought that I was punishing her. I wouldn't always tell her what I was doing, just that I was running out.

Just some new information that I'd thought I'd share.

Edit: She also asked me last night how often would I like to know when she has to email the OM and interact, even if they are just in the same teleconference. I told her probably for now, every day would be good. She then told me about the day and their interactions.

[This message edited by ICanOvercome at 7:25 AM, August 5th (Wednesday)]

Don't worry about your DD, these things happen. Is she ok now?

It's good that you're observing actions instead of words! It will help you tremendously!

Best wishes

Your wife’s view that you’re mean and punishing her is consistent with her thinking that what she did wasn’t so bad. Women are typically more upset about the emotional part of an affair and men are more concerned about the physical.

This has a very primitive biological basis. Women want the man to stay around to help raise her kids and men want to make sure those kids are also his.

A WW will tell her BH that it was only sex because that’s what she would want to hear if the situation were reversed (i.e. the relationship is safe). What she doesn’t realize is that it’s probably the worst thing she can say to a man (i.e. you can keep doing your husbandly chores while I give your sex to someone else).

In your wife’s mind she only committed a misdemeanor and you’re punishing her for a felony. It was only sex and you’re breaking up the family.

EDIT

She also said that everything I am doing is just all so sudden that it makes her feel uneasy. Working out a lot, doing more stuff away from the house, buying new clothes, the dance classes...all of it. She says that I should be doing that stuff but it was just all very quick that it took her by surprise.

This again illustrates how she thinks what she did wasn’t all that bad. She f@cked another man and the above makes her feel “uneasy.” If I had done want she did I would be very reluctant to voice my feelings of uneasiness. I would at least preface it by saying “I know I have no right to complain but I feel uneasy.”

[This message edited by Graywolf at 8:30 AM, August 5th (Wednesday)]

She's never downplayed what she did. She tells me at least that she's down a horrible thing and she is so, so sorry about that.

I was, and am, far more concerned about the emotional aspect of this all. This would be so much easier if this were a ONS.