SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

HOP

You need to sharpen your comprehension skills or read what Mike7 just wrote. I believe Red Baron alluded to something like all infidelity being evil to some degree.

You are one of the biggest offenders of attacking anyone who disagrees with you on aynthing so I'll leave it and thank you for your service.

You might be better off trying to help him rather than just running your mouth before you think you understand what the words mean.

Now you can rant at me or PM me all you want but you got it all wrong and like Mike7 just said all infidelity has some kind of something bad in it and you can call it whatever you want to. I guess you think it was kind of her.

That entire post I sent was to urge him to seek the truth before making any decisions but you seem to rather argue with someone than recommend anything positive.

Maybe you should go back and read the whole thing again and maybe the second time your head will understand before your mouth.

FOCUS ON RED BARON. Not on me . You do not intimidate me oin the least and he needs the advice from you, not me.

[This message edited by nononsense at 11:36 AM, December 26th (Saturday)]

HobbesTheTiger

How are you feeling today?

I can't say I am better. Even though today I had her move out of the house and I moved back in. So I feel very lonely of course, besides all the other existing grief in me.

But I do need, for my own sake, my life to be as normal as possible in these circumstances for my own sake. To be able to work on my own self. It took me 23 years to quit smoking, a year and half ago, and I was very successful and happy for it, it was one of my proudest achievements. This situation made me lean on that vicious crutch again, stopped working out, and have been generally neglecting myself, lost in dark thoughts. SO I need to get out of that mindset first, I feel its a downward spiral that I do not want in life, not now not ever.

So wish me luck in that, I can deal with the shit in my life better once I am myself stronger.

Thank you all again for the strength and support.

This was devastating for me of course, I had just began to mildly come to terms with it, and this felt like day 1 to me all over again.

This is very common and only a few WSs realize that with each new truth, it starts the clock all over again.

With each new truth, it starts the hurt cycle all over again, and that might one of the most important a WS understands...hopefully your wife understands that now.

The polygraph should be done, if nothing else to find out anything you need to ask and if there were any other guys.

Once you get to how many times, and it goes over 5 times, it might not matter, 5 or 6 or more.

Just keep working on staying healthy. If I understood you correctly, you started smoking again, and that is another misery in itself. You might consider eCigs instead of smoking.

It does sound like your wife finally gets it, that lying can be as worse and at times even worse than the deed itself.

Greetings TheRedBaron,

my first post on your thread, I haven't read every page but I just wanted to lend my support.

I also suffered through double betrayal, maybe triple, quadruple... my WH was sleeping with friends and customers of our business, all of whom knew we were married and who pretended to be my friend to my face while fucking my husband behind my back.

The backstabbing pain went on for months, a year before I finally bailed. I was desperate to save my marriage and twisted myself in knots. I also love him, adored him, thought we had a great thing going. When he started in with the cheating he started to show signs of discontent and started becoming emotionally abusive. It took me 6 months to discover the first of something like 6 different affairs. I literally wanted to die and had suicidal thoughts, and felt the unbelievable agony of betrayal over and over.

I lost nearly everything in the process of divorce. I was homeless and penniless.

I wanted to let you know that despite all that I went through, I am now happy. Happier than I've ever been. I'm a better person than I've ever been.

I can deal with the shit in my life better once I am myself stronger.

Focus on this. I have been in therapy continuously since D-day. My journey through self-discovery and self-enlightenment has been thoroughly transformative. I feel I've gotten more out of this education about my psyche than I got out of my fancy education at an ivy-league university. And it's cost a lot less, I still owe more on my student loans than I paid out of pocket for my therapy. My post-infidelity therapy has added so much more to my life than the degree I got.

I write because I want to encourage you to become a dedicated expert in the 180. Find your way to focusing on yourself. I won't say forget about your WW, because it will take you a while to process what has happened, make your choices, and then set forth on the next phase of your life. Whatever that is, whether it is with her or without her, make your new life the place where you put yourself on a pedestal, you put your own self-care first, and you put your health and well being at the top of your list of priorities.

I will bump a couple threads I wrote a while back. One is about my story of healing. The other is about a technique (changing my thoughts) that has been vital to my sanity.

Your WW may have destroyed your marriage. But you do not have to accept that she has destroyed YOU. You will get through this, there is a future in front of you that includes a return to happiness and bliss. Trust me.

I agree with nononsense. I hate it when posters here attack other posters for 'being too hard; on others or telling the op to ignore some but of course never those they agree with. If I was Red Baron, I would be turned off, not by hard advice but by those who coddle me then opens fire on other posters. There are some who coddle, some who are aggressive and some who just says 'we're here for you'.there's nothing wrong with any of those ways. We're supposed to be here for the Red Baron, not to beat our own chest. I agree with the advice Nononsense, wk55 and im gone have given here. I agree with certain things others have said too and yes I feel ALL infidelity is evil. But I also feel that those who call for civility need to be civil themselves. I've stayed off this thread because I have been busy but cooler heads must prevail.

[This message edited by Western at 5:11 PM, December 26th (Saturday)]

I'm glad you went home, RB.

Nononsense, you give good advice that I've recognized in threads. I thought we were done with the evil discussion in this thread when you brought it back up and I reflexively responded. So apologies for my post.

RedBaron, feelings are hard, actions are easy. We struggle to understand our own, so be careful in making decisions on what you think hers might be. Keep watching her actions and her responses to yours. Keep testing her.

Sending strength!

Thanks for the reply, and I'm wishing you luck! Kicking smoking after 20+ years and being off of them for more than a year is a big achievement, so I'm quite confident that this is a sign of your inner strength that will help you eventually come out of this strong and happy. Maybe you can start by some small steps so you don't feel overwhelmed? What are some little things you could do in the next few days?

Btw, I also want to emphasize that this is a huge traumatic event in your life and it is normal that you'll feel very disoriented etc. for the foreseeable future. You deserve and need a period of time of your system running "suboptimal efficiency" until your body&mind recovers from the biggest immediate impact of the trauma. So be easy on yourself for a while and don't rush yourself into healing etc. As long as you don't make any really bad decisions in this time (like harming yourself etc.), this starting period won't harm you in the long run.

Also, please, make sure you're not alone on new year's eve and new year's! Have company! If necessary, volunteer...

Are there any specific things we could help you with at this moment? Any questions you have, advice you want on specific things?

We're here for you!

It took me 23 years to quit smoking, a year and half ago, and I was very successful and happy for it, it was one of my proudest achievements. This situation made me lean on that vicious crutch again,

You are suffering from a horrible trauma and you need to give yourself a break regarding the "crutches" you lean on. You quit once, you'll quit again when you are ready. Same for the rest of it. Right now it is your emotional health that is in crisis so pay attention to that.

I'm very glad that you are not living in the same house as her - that was a very wise decision. Not seeing her all the time helps cut down on the triggers and mind movies.

I agree HOP and the Drifter. Very well said by both of you

HOP

Apologies accepted

Now let's convince Red Baron to get the fucking truth so he can make an informed decision

Red Baron she wants the polygraph now. Give her exactly what she wants and give yourself control of your destiny with the truth

RB,

You have done well in moving out and asking her to leave.

She has already changed her story and more than likely will continue. People like to use the lie detector but I feel it is not needed in most cases.

By asking for the test you are saying that you somewhat think she is telling the truth. Just do not accept it and continue to day you do not have the whole truth about OM and possible other men too.

As long as you are in control it will not matter. What difference will it make if it is 6, 10 or 20 at this point. Once is more than enough,

RedBaron,

Thinking if you this morning and hoping your Christmas was as good as it could be given the circumstances.

Regarding the poly, there are a few reasons to keep to it and none of them have to do with how many times or how many men.

1) It shows you are holding her accountable and will follow through.

2) That as a result of her actions, she is no longer trustworthy and that words are cheap - actions are paramount.

3) That openness and transparency are a must. A poly helps towards getting there. Whether you see a future with your wife or not is something. For a later date, but I'm sure you agree there can be no future if she is not completely open and honest with you. How can their be if she continues to lie? So a poly will help determine where she's at from that standpoint.

4) That she can't cake eat. Many WW's think they can have it all. That she can keep you at bay while still have OM. A poly will expose whether that is the case.

5) It will force her to open up to unpleasant truths if there are still some out there. There can be no healing until one is honest within oneself. Otherwise any work is just a sham designed to placate the BS. This will help prevent that, thereby protecting you from future pain of another DDay (which you've already experienced).

Anyway, continued best wishes. Stay strong.

-W

You can and should accomplish all of the above without the poly.

You have already taken one of the strongest actions you could which is getting her to leave. That is far more proactive than taking a poly.

Another strong step is seeing an attorney is another. Starting the 180 is something else you should do as well.

Keep doing the strong proactive actions and you will get the truth. Do you really want to be married to someone who will only be truthful with you if you do a poly?

Final thing, what happens if she passes?

Yesterday was a pretty bad day for me.

I had not really been angry till yesterday, never cursed or got rude or used any harsh language.

But yesterday it was like all barriers broke for me, over messages and over the phone, I lashed out violently, was abusive and cursing. It was a surprising how much came out of me once it started.

And its not like I feel vented now, I assume that will take a long time yet.

I do have a lot of questions, but I think the answers can mostly be found here in this site plus in the recommended books. About how to heal, about how she can contribute to the healing etc. I have been hearing a lot about the 180, going to search what it is and see if its something for me.

Thank you all for your support. Sometimes it seems like I make progress and days like these come and push me all the way back again. Oh well, gotta keep trying.

Sometimes it seems like I make progress and days like these come and push me all the way back again.

Just part of the rollercoaster. Your anger is in the early stages. What you are experiencing is normal.

Don't let these episodes stop you from getting the truth. If you want to even contemplate reconciliation, then you have to keep pushing.

Have you yourself spoken to OBS about what was done? You need to....do not trust he said she said. You speak to her. And get that poly. This is a complete truthful time line?

Is there any other inappropriate relationships besides him.

Kissed any other men during our marriage?

I know what the others have said above and while I respect some of their positions, I do think a Poly will provide you with the correct answers. You already know what you personally saw and the 6 times she admitted to it. That is divorcable right there. Find out the remainder but don't let her prepare for the poly, just drop it on her at the last second and maybe you'll get more of a parking lot confession and then do it anyway.

So I normally agree with the Rambler but not above.

Walloped has done a great job overcoming his situation and I like the fact he continues to contribute here but I do disagree with one of his 5 points. it does matter how many times and how many men. Each case IMO is a new and individual betrayal, a new battle in a larger war. Is a ONS worse than a one year passionate affair where they have met up 100 times and you know what ? .... Both are horrible but clearly one is worse than the other. It also shows her character..

Her character is already flawed being with the other man within feet of your tent while you sleep etc..

Look, as I believe I have said here on this thread but if not I know I have said it on this board. I am not a big fan of R because it's my belief that the mind movies and triggers will always be there, though they may diminish over time. The same person who smashed you in the face is still the person who you have to wake up next to everyday for the rest of your life. There are other options. If I was clearing the slate, I would measure out what I have to lose as opposed to what you have to gain by staying here. Most who have reconciled successfully have stated that it is like a whole brand new relationship once successful R begins. However, one of my relatives who survived this stuff had to practically wipe out all of his memories including anniversary date just to get past it. I'm not really sure what you will do at this point. However, I would suggest the paramount decision you have to make isn't whether you love her or not. It is what the cost/gain factor is combined by if you can and are willing to make the hard sacrifices of rebuilding things from here on out as opposed to starting a new with someone else at some point or taking time to do some of the things you have always wanted to do.

You have made some strong steps so far. Moving out and then back in and making her move out and lining up an attorney are positive steps.

Getting the truth through a poly will give you closure (to a degree) and you will be able to make an informed decision then but at least serve her with the D papers first and get that clock rolling.

Other questions to consider

1) You did tell the OBS personally. How is that person doing and what did they do to the OM ?

2) How is she reacting now ? How do you know there is no contact ? If she was still seeing him now, would that not be betrayal ?

You have a lot to think about but I would certainly treat this as a case that's headed for D and watching her reactions for the remainder

You are doing well

[This message edited by Western at 6:52 AM, December 28th (Monday)]

As I said earlier, I have been constantly in touch with her, and yes I did tell her personally. And we do exchange notes and discoveries. In this case though he does not tell her anything, only accepts when my wife tells me something and I pass it on.

They are not in touch I am certain of that, also the fact that they have both been out of town for at least past two weeks.

As I said earlier, future decisions are on hold until I have worked on my own self first.

Cheers for the great support and advice.

We're here for you. Bro-hugs!