SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Warning. 2 x 4 incoming.

1. Your wife fucked her ex's brains out on that trip. And probably elsewhere. Most likely quite recently.

2. They are still in constant contact, but have taken it far underground. And are laying low while your "unreasonable" attitude changes regarding their "meaningless", simply for fun affair. (Except it isn't simply for fun. She is in love with him.)

3. She thinks she has committed a minor transgression and is pissed that you keep bringing it up. For God's sake she doesn't think she wants a divorce. At least not right now. She just wants to fuck two guys. How unfair of you to stand in the way of her happiness.

4. Your wimpish actions have caused her to lose whatever respect she ever had for you.

5. Until you take charge and lay down some unbreakable rules and actions, your marriage is doomed. Why would she want to remain married to a wimp she has no respect for?

6. Why would you want to remain married to a lying, cheating w---- who is in love with her ex?

7. Time for the nuclear option. Blow their world up. Tell the OBS. Tell everyone you know. File for divorce and rid yourself of that incredibly selfish piece of trash--unless she finally, truly understands that she killled your marriage and becomes truly remorseful and does EVERYTHING she can do to resuscitate it.

[This message edited by montana79 at 6:29 PM, July 19th (Wednesday)]

a this point bunkering down to weather the storm is the worst thing you can do. it tells her all ok. is it ok? is it ok shes having sex with some other guy?

if so do nothing.

if its not ok then you need to change the equation to get a different answer. lots of ways to change tje ewuation are being given. time tested ways.

pick one, implement it.

please. for you.

A quick response. Montana, i want to party with you! I feel like we could fuck some shit up!

I am now TPain.

Here's something we haven't talked about. Triggers.

So we are running errands. She asked what I did today and I said I got a lot done. She said that's good, she sees work as a welcome distraction.

A fucking distraction from what?

Man I'm not sure if you're rubbing it in T-Pain, but like I said, I stupidly didn't use a gosh darn VAR when I should have. So no I have no idea which ones are good to use. :)

I looked through some threads here to see if I could find advice on that b/c I definitely remember seeing folks post specific ones they recommend, but I couldn't find anything. Maybe someone smarter than I can respond and make a recommendation because honestly, I think that VAR may be your ticket to truth (TTT).

What is MMSL>

Generally speaking Mmsl is about "gaming" your wife. Men are either beta (nice) or alpha. Women are sluts or wife material. Gaming/Manipulate your woman is good. Men's value increases with age, women decreases (hit the wall).

im trying to see what my wife does. i want to see what actions she takes

>

That's passive. Why not show her what actions you are taking? Remember she has allready showed her actions. Her affair.

I think you need to remember you are worthy of a loyal partner. You are worthy of SO much more. Strength

T-Pain,I keep coming to your thread to see if you finally get it.

She isn't afraid of you doing anything, because she knows you. I guarantee the minute you finally put your foot down is going to be the first day you feel better.

I'm the biggest procrastinator, laziest, most passive aggressive guy you ever wanted to meet...or I feel that way at times. My life didn't turn around until I stood up for myself.

You have to change the tone of this. Stop the wait and see attitude.

Get so mad that it hurts!!!! Get angry and use that to wake her ass up our wake yourself up!

I knew when I had had enough. My wife knew all of my demands when she came back.

My wife was just like yours. She was cold and couldn't really figure out why that I just couldn't let it go.

I broke one of the rules we often give the betrayed people here. I showed her this site.

It opened her eyes so wide, she sat in the bed and just cried after reading the Healing Library.

It finally clicked. She doesn't post, but I'll send her particular threads to read that I find interesting or want her to comment on. It's been well over a year and we spend nearly every waking moment with each other.

We recently remodeled my parents home after my mom moved out. We worked together for nearly 10 months without killing each other! Now we have a fresh start and SHE is doing the heavy lifting. You aren't there yet (I understand), but until you get there, you're going to struggle with this until it kills you. Stress kills. This shit kills too. Ulcers, heart attacks, your body isn't meant for this kind of stress.

Come on man! I keep thinking your next post is where you finally put your foot down. You finally did the right thing and told his wife.

I'm going to stop typing before I start yelling at you. You need to be yelling!!!!!

Edited..Because of spucking fellcheck!

[This message edited by Wool94 at 9:00 PM, July 19th (Wednesday)]

So we are running errands. She asked what I did today and I said I got a lot done. She said that's good, she sees work as a welcome distraction.

A fucking distraction from what?

From having to talk about or deal with the affair of course. She does not want to be the bad guy.

Triggers do suck. I had many of them and have worked through most of mine in IC. My triggers are of a different variety (my wife never cheated) ranging from mild to extreme. Triggers are a result of the trauma that you are going through.

I can't comment on having to do investigative work, such as restoring texts on a phone, as everything was hand written and handed to me on a silver platter.

However, I can comment on VARs. Someone did say on the previous page that it can be used to hear what your WW is saying to others, not ncessarily to her AP. So true. In my experience here there have been a few that were busted directly talking with AP but more often than not it's usually a conversation with someone close to them is how they get busted. Not only are VARs helpful in finding out what your WW really thinks about you in her conversations with friends and relatives, but VARs are also useful in other ways.

Luckily (if there is any good points in this shit mess) is that you haven't had to deal with any personality disorders or extreme mental illness which is why I have a pair of VARs. VARs for the most part are not permissible in court and in some states can be illegal to record a conversation, however, they can be used to play back the scene for first responders. False domestic violence charges are a good one. Cops show up and WW says you did xyz just then to hurt her and the kids. Ummmm no officer... this is what really happened and you can hear her threaten the DV charges. In my case it was suicide. Threats of suicide as a manipulation tool. The recording can be played back for anyone that is in a position to help, again helps first responders. Only use my VARs around the extreme bat shit crazy. My mother and stop mother. I put this here for other people if they have those circumstances.

For you tpain they make for a good investigative tool.

Both of mine are the same make and model. I picked them up at Best Buy for roughly $50 I believe. Here's one of them if you're curious:

Hope you're doing ok today tpain.

"Let go of the outcome"

yop

eta - man my grammar sucks. I went from plural to singular in the same sentence. Had to clean that up.

[This message edited by yearsofpain25 at 7:14 AM, July 20th (Thursday)]

good morning to those of you that are still here...

last night we were talking. she is trying to reach a counselor that she used a long time ago. she has yet to be successful but says she will continue to try.

Again, I talked about any sign or interest in our marriage, because im needy and stupid like that.

she said she just didnt know. I asked what she didnt know. She said after the past couple of weeks, she didnt know if she can trust me. WTF? apparently, she takes exception with the behavior i exhibited in the wake of her ripping the rug out from under me and hurting me more than ive ever hurt.

yelling at her, calling her a whore, telling her that i would tell everyone she knew including everyone at her office and especially his wife and tearing up the clothes she chose specifically for her date with him, was a bit much for her to take.

being the peristant co-d asshat that I am, i walked her through how things went down.

She agreed that through the 15 years we have been together, there have been a handful of times that i spoke to her in a mean manner. every time was a result of my immature ass being out drinking with friends, which i hardly ever do. serioulsy, we are talking about arguments that have happened less a handful of times in 15 years.

She also agreed that I never would have done or said what i did in response to her affair, WITHOUT THE AFFAIR.

I told her that she is trying to find a way to hate me or at least dislike me to justify her actions. we NEVER fought.

I told her that it isnt possible to backfill the reason she cheated. she cannot use my reaction to her affair as justification of the affair.

i told her that she continues to brutalize me. she said shes not trying to. i said you are telling me that you arent sure you want to stay married to me because of the way i acted in response to her affair. (mind you, she doesnt use words like affair or cheat) but that will shock exactly none of you.

on one hand, marriage, happy children, good life, man who clearly loves you more than air.

on the other hand, divorce, miserable children, public humiliation, destroyed family, wake of divorce and coparenting.

i told her that the fact that she cant immediately strike divorce from her head is brutal.

she told me that she wasnt ready to commit to anything and that she needed to talk to someone. she needs to know that my response was "normal."

i walked her through the action and reaction.

i also pounced on "commit." i said, you committed to me when we got married. you committed to our children when you brought them into the world.

this girl is lost inside her head. its sad to me that she just doesnt get what she did, nor that shes lucky i didnt throw her shit in the front yard and light it all on fire. shes lucky i didnt kick the front door open of her boyfriends house. shes lucky that i didnt unleash utter and complete destruction on her reputation.

im stupid but im not an asshole. how am i the asshole???

hugs and kisses.

building strength,

tpain

She can't trust you? What a pile of horse shit. GMAFB.

ANd bringing up incidents from 15 years ago - she is rewriting the marital history, painting you as the bad guy.

She doesn't know what she wants? Another GMAFB. How about what YOU want? How long are you prepared to put up with her shit? She is going to continue to not know what she wants indefinitely. Right now SHE is in control. It's time for YOU to take control. Start the 180, see an attorney and find out what divorce would look like. Get yourself out of the passenger seat and into the driver's seat.

You are beating your head against a wall, do you know how to make the pain stop?

Stop beating your head against the wall!!!

She is seeing no consequences. Make her choices for her at this point.

File for D! 180!

[This message edited by Wool94 at 7:58 AM, July 20th (Thursday)]

Until you decide to love yourself enough to stop this ridiculousness, the madness will continue.

It is like medicine. It will taste like shit going down, but will start to heal you afterwards.

She is abusing you and you are eating it up.

You need to get out of the abuse cycle. This may be one of the worst cases of Stockholm Syndrome that I've ever seen here.

Expose to her boyfriend's wife. The affair is still going on.

Go 180

See a lawyer.

It's not your decision to stay married at this point. You need to protect yourself. The good news is that these actions that you *have* to take will not only protect you but also be productive, mature, time-proven ways of ending the abuse cycle.

Or you can just keep on using your method of calling her a whore. It's up to you.

only called her a whore when i found out she spent the weekend with him. just sayin'.

She can't trust you, because you might tell her boyfriend's wife about the affair?

That's some serious manipulation.

The betrayed husbands have told you, repeatedly, your passivity is hurting you,and the entire situation.

Stop trying to nice her into reconciliation. As a woman, I can tell you, she is seeing it as you being weak. And you can't respect weak. And it's not attractive.

Mind you, as a BS, I don't see you as weak. You're in a great amount of pain. It's all understandable. But it's also not going to work.

Blow this shit up.

[This message edited by HellFire at 8:36 AM, July 20th (Thursday)]

I am going to post this, as you seem hell bent on doing the pick me dance, and then I will quietly watch from the sidelines for a while.

Find your way to the place that allows you to place more value on principled decisions than specific outcomes.

In order for that to happen, you will have to fix your cranial rectal inversion.

Good luck.

T-Pain

You want proof that the 180 works. It's right in front of you because she is using it on you!

You need to let go of the outcome. You cannot script it.

You can only focus on you. Read the 180 again. And again.

You need to be in IC. She may never get there. Get in IC for yourself.

Call a close friend or family member you trust and let them know what's happening and you need their support.

Make an appt with a lawyer.

You've been told many times you cannot NICE yourself out of this situation.

She's in control right now. She should be begging for forgiveness.

Read these words over and over: you have to be willing to lose the marriage to save the marriage. Because of that there is a good chance this M will end. But if you don't use this strategy it's almost certain to end.

In your strategy you will end up still in a marriage where she is either actively in an A and not care what you think or not mentally present, pining away for the OM and all she fantasizes about him.

Implement the 180. Kids and finance only. Lawyer. IC.

You have been dragging your feet way to long.

[This message edited by Stevesn at 9:01 AM, July 20th (Thursday)]

You want proof that the 180 works. It's right in front of you because she is using it on you!

^^stevesn NAILED IT! ^^

TPain, please take your power back! 180 and lawyer consult STAT.

And please, get the book "Love Must Be Tough" by Dobson. I promise it will be an eye-opener for you.

It is obvious that she has no clue what damage she caused. I hate to say it , but unless we betrayed shut the bakery down and quit playing nice the wayward will continue sitting on the fence. They will continue to abuse us, not take ownership of the damage and blameshift.

You are dancing around trying to get your wife to do the right thing. The problem is she isn't who you thought she was. There hasn't been the line drawn in the sand yet, so she's waiting you out, throwing a bone here and there . The reality is she is just hoping you rugsweep the thing and just drop it. The absolute worst thing you can do is nothing. That's why you are in limbo hell. Like or not you have to take control and set boundaries and expectations for R to even happen. But you stall because you are afraid your wife will just throw in the towel, but the reality is do you want to be in this type of marriage?