SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I have been here a long time. I am not some guru but there is a cheaters handbook. They do the same thing. The problem here is your wife is making herself the victim to people particularly the MC.

Your the victim, she should be kissing the ground you walk on. She. Isn’t afraid to lose you. She has demanded you not to talk to her, order for your discovery a third person in your marriage, which she has no intentions of taking the blame for.

I am pretty confident that we all support recovery with remorseful wayward spouses. I would blow up his world to the sports agency. I would explain using the trips to conduct an affair. I would also out her to family and friends and serve her. But conditions she leaves and doesn’t see the kids. You have first right of refusal she can’t move them out of the area. You have physical custody. Taking the hard line will wake her up or call a halt. Either way protecting your children and yourself.

Space ghost thread is a good one to read. He served her and made no attempt to recover. Ambivalent next same thing.

A lot of people will chime in and say dump her. I believe you can recover with a remorseful not regretting they got caught person.

Terms of reconciliation should be complete transparency including gps on her phone and car.

No contact individual counseling. No marriage counseling till you find one who will call her out.

A prenuptial agreement. By filing first you have the advantage it says, no more drama lady, I am either first choice or no choice. But make her leave so it out there and she sees your serious. Then do contact only by text regarding kids and money.

This is a roller coaster buckle up. Either way you look at it it is 3 to 5 years to recover. But if you end up divorced you didn’t waste time with her dictatorship over your allowing her to date another man.

Why don’t think I need additional information and please talk me out of this, is if it is a known and I’ve documented - I’m not sure what else I need to work with beyond that. Thoughts?

If your wife half way comes to her senses and tells you she's 'ended it', a VAR in her car has been very useful for other members in finding out if their wayward spouse truly is remorseful or really has ended it e.g. does she phone the old boyfriend behind your back, or talk to her girlfriends about the old boyfriend and her plans to see him.

Great advice given earlier - anyone accusing you of being a jerk because snooping, send them some wifely screenshots (optional whether to include a fuck off as well).

Good for you for seeing a lawyer, it needs to get real right now for your wife - you want a boyfriend? See him all you want, not as my wife though.

[This message edited by SnowToArmPits at 3:17 PM, March 2nd (Friday)]

I like that MC idea - you find one who will call her out. How does one essentially DO that?

Why do you need an MC to call her out?

She's telling you she wants her old boyfriend in her life. She wants to have sex with him. It's all really simple...

Do you want her to continue to see the OM? Does she know it's wrong to want to have sex with an old boyfriend that is not your husband?

All this dancing around, MC, outside adjudicators, seriously..

Wrong is wrong. There shouldn't even be a sentence let alone a conversation. You pack her stuff up and tell her to go and live with the OM who cheated on his wife. You tell her the next time she goes out to see him you'll have divorce papers waiting for her to sign so she can be free to date and have crushes on whomever she likes.

These are all totally fair remarks. However at this point it is an emotional affair I’m not really concerned about it getting physical or was it physical it’s already crossed the line in my mind. Someone had mentioned being able to identify a marital counselor that would call her out, I guess my interest is in I do believe she will come to her senses at some point and I do not want to go back in front of a counselor that is going to coddle her because she cries about stuff. 95% of the time it’s a rabbit hole of deception and lies and I look like an ass because I try to argue my way out of it.

Yes, there are some who have experience in dealing with infidelity. They won't do the MC part unless the affair has ended and they make that clear to the wayward. Some will meet individually with wayward first for IC to help end the affair and/or deal with after the affair, then MC later. These kind of counselors even know that MC is pointless if the affair continues.

Google and call around. My test question to them would be "who do you think is at fault for the affair," and if they answer it is all on the wayward then I would ask for an appointment.

You interview mcs or get into individual and get recommendations. I recently had to get a domestic violence therapist for my DD. Her psychologist at Children’s deals in pain felt she needs both the pain psychologist and domestic violence. She gave me recommendations for Subaruan shore town two hours from a major area. She had printed them from psychology today website.

Also call your insurance provider, they will recommend people they will call you back and chat or you go in.

The point here is to file you can stop a divorce and get her out to jolt her. Firing the MC. Tell the MC your here to address her betrayal of marriage the way you found out is diverting from the real facts. That you thought her job was to be an advocate for both sides. when all she is doing is buying into your wife’s blameshifting. If your wife is sucidial call emergency services. Take the phone out where she see you recording say your scaring me hit record and call 911. This is tricky.

The tricky part is with her drama she may go to domestic violence. In my mind she is emotionally having a temper tantrum because your demanding her to be accountable for her actions. She enjoyed the ego kibbles. Long term marriages are not the high of new romance and she is having a fit.

Trust me if your kids ask. Say age appropriate things like Mommy had a boyfriend and we are married you don’t do that. Or say Mommy hurt Daddy’s feelings, so she needs to live else where.

I know you don’t believe it was physical I know that doesn’t matter to you. But for your health sake get std tested Incase of a blow job. I am sorry to need to be so blunt.

[This message edited by PricklePatch at 4:54 PM, March 2nd (Friday)]

These are all totally fair remarks. However at this point it is an emotional affair I’m not really concerned about it getting physical or was it physical it’s already crossed the line in my mind. Someone had mentioned being able to identify a marital counselor that would call her out, I guess my interest is in I do believe she will come to her senses at some point and I do not want to go back in front of a counselor that is going to coddle her because she cries about stuff. 95% of the time it’s a rabbit hole of deception and lies and I look like an ass because I try to argue my way out of it.

No one including an MC is going to fix this for you. You are the one who has to do it based on your actions. If you can't stand up for yourself you will live in infidelity.

[This message edited by Marz at 6:59 PM, March 2nd (Friday)]

I do not want to go back in front of a counselor that is going to coddle her because she cries about stuff. 95% of the time it’s a rabbit hole of deception and lies and I look like an ass because I try to argue my way out of it.

That's why MC should be put off. If this affair....physical or not....is enough for you to be willing to end your marriage if necessary, then it is crucial that you deal with this affair in its entirety before you consider setting foot in a MC's office again.

Right now, there are 3 people in your marriage. The old bf is near and dear to her heart---something she should have NEVER allowed, and would have easily been able to avoid with proper boundaries. There is no way on Earth that you should be in a counselor's office....discussing MARRIAGE issues....when your marriage isn't even exclusive at this point. And a demarcation line in your household with a no-discussion policy? Does this even sound like reconcilable material?

I know that you want to reconcile. Many of us do/did. But you can't save a marriage by yourself. And the best chance that you have of saving this marriage....BY FAR....is to show her some firm boundaries. If she isn't willing to be OPEN, HONEST, TRANSPARENT, AND COMMITTED TO ONLY YOU, then you simply aren't important enough in her life. And you deserve better.

And one quick expletive riddled rant---FUCK THAT NOISE about 'snooping'. That word pisses me off so much when I see it, because it is the immediate 'go to' for trying to flip the script on being caught cheating. That marriage counselor can shove her opinion right up her ass about this----and I'll shove it right up there for you. It's beyond disgusting that cheaters hide behind this cloak of 'privacy' when it is nothing more than hiding in the cloak of secrecy. Since I ever owned a cell phone, my WW could pick it up at any time to look at it. As I would expect to be able to do with hers. I thought a healthy marriage was based on honesty. With honesty comes transparency. With transparency comes openness---particularly for communication. And so on, and so on.....

But ultimately, you are at a marriage counselor to work on.....I'm guessing.....communication?!!!

[This message edited by jb3199 at 5:17 PM, March 2nd (Friday)]

The advice from PricklePatch in cluded:

Terms of reconciliation should be complete transparency including gps on her phone and car.

No contact individual counseling. No marriage counseling till you find one who will call her out.

And you jumped right to finding a MC to call her out. I think you've got this backwards. Getting a MC is a much later step after she has ended the affair, you are sure she has ended the affair and she has some idea why she had the affair in the first place. You seem to be looking for a third-party to tell her she is doing the wrong thing here and thinking that she will magically believe it. She won't. Until the affair is ended there is no marriage to counsel.

You are all right. The MC was an attempt to get a third party to show her how backwards she was because she wasn’t listening to me. I thought it would help and it backfired, lesson learned for sure.

There was definitely a bias towards her tears and my insistence that these were lies.

I thought the MC going to work some elaborate Jedi Mond trick

T/J on “working on communication” in MC.

Jb3199 brought it up. Biggest load of crap IMO. It basically means only bring up topics that doesn’t make the other person cry.

Right now if you do anything stop the affair by filing. She will hear you then.

The problem is you are abiding by a marriage counselor who is bad. But my understanding she is dictating the terms of what she gets to do. Date during your marriage. If you immediately start another she is going to say you bought one on your side, yournthe manipulator.

My suggestion is to take back your power by filing. On how you would image yourself and your children living in a healthy environment. Then after she agrees to a post up written authorization for transparency and everything else you can find an MC.

Think of it like this you are asking a different professional to stop her from engaging in an open marriage. It isn’t going to work because she has in her mind found a credible ally in her fight about her privacy being more important then the betrayal of your marriage.

Honestly, this is a fail. She is openly in control. That is just not how reconciling works. You get the gift of giving her recovery. Since she won’t examine anything but her right to privacy you can not recover. Next option stay stuck with an unrepentant wondering wife or file to live in a healthy environment. Once again to save your marriage you must be prepared to lose it. File and serve her hand her a letter of what she must do for you to reconsider getting back in the house. The minmuim should be written authozation for you to monitor her by what means are necessary.

Individual counseling for why she feels entitled to an affair. Marriage counselor after to get your relationship on track. You show her if she continues her selfish toddler ways what divorce looks like. You can stop a divorce or remarry, can you live with a narcissistic bitch?

[This message edited by PricklePatch at 10:03 PM, March 2nd (Friday)]

Again - best thing that’s happened in weeks has been this forum. I do have my paperwork in. That’s been the biggest weight offa me in so long. I’ll know if I sleep soundly tonight or not - it’s been a while since I got a full nights sleep.

I'm glad your able to take the advice being given. You are doing very well.

She shouldn't have anything to hide from you. Anyway, by the time us betrayeds go looking there's usually something going on. I only wish I looked sooner

MrA, you havent posted for awhile. How are you? Is there any progress at the home front?

Sorry for the long time w/no update. It went down like this:

1. Met with lawyer - lined up all the paperwork needed - lots of time spent there

2. On an random Friday evening my wife informs me she was going to spent the night elsewhere (hotel) and would be seeing the OM.

3. I presented the papers to her right then and there

4. After hours of complete surprise and griping on her part - she finally sits down to admit everything

5. since then it's been steady progress at rebuilding "us" again - definitely not pretty at times and lots of IC involved along with MC (which has been super frustrating).

but in all - hanging in there and definitely in a better place with some sense of hope at cobbling this all back together and maybe improving.