SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

twice I am so sorry. It's bad enough for those of us who discovered our H's were SAs or compulsively betrayed for many years but to also feel your situation is so different because the SA is your wife that's an additional burden to overcome.

But twice you can use the same resources as the rest of us. SANON is open to anyone dealing with the trauma of sexual betrayal. For sure the SANON members are usually female and the SA members are male but that doesn't mean you cannot find great support in an SANON group. One of the members of the group I attend is a man; he's been attending for nearly 10 years and continues to come because it has so greatly benefitted him he wants to help others. He feels very comfortable and we feel comfortable with him.

BAN (Beyond Affairs Network) also has support groups and both men and women attend. You might find it very helpful to participate in such a support group.

If you cannot find such a group in your area --many in my group come from more than an hour away--there are telephone and Skype groups to join but I'd encourage you to try to find an IRL support group notwithstanding your situation may not be the typical SA type.

Thanks everyone. It's a little bit comforting to know I'm not completely alone, even if it FEELS like I'm the only BH in this position.

So- he was investing vast amounts of time, energy and money into getting sex from anyone BUT me. How disgusting and undesirable he must find me.

Exactly. How hard it is to NOT feel like the "sexual plan B" in this situation. Sure, IC and MC and everyone else says it's not about the sex, it's about the attention or the escape... but it feels like every other man in the world just says "if WW won't do for you what she did for other men, it's over." But it's just not that simple.

I am sure this problem is just as frequent for women as it is for men however, men do not tend to reach out as much as women so you will see less posts from men.

That may be. I hope so, as sad as that is for other men. It certainly does feel isolating as a husband. Many friends and family members know about WW's first A (since she basically left and I moved in with a friend), but nary a soul knows about the recent SA revelations and multiple other A's.

Your WW is probably afraid to begin having relations with you because she has trouble connecting beyond the physical part of sex. The meaningful pat of the act is lost on her. She knows how to use her parts but not her heart.

I think this hits the nail on the head. She can't look me in the eye anymore--she says it's too intimate. She USED to (sometimes) but I think it was all part of the act... the same act that she'd portray with whatever OM she was acting for at the time. She doesn't know how to truly connect. It's so sad.

I did go to an S-Anon group for much of the last 2 years. I wish there was one closer, but the ~30 minute drive became too difficult while I had 2 little children at home. I did find it beneficial, but--surprise surprise--there were never any other men in the group, aside from a gay "throuple" (which I'd never heard before) and their situation just didn't quite apply to me.

I know many of the articles and ideas regarding SA still apply to me. But there is a little bit of a disconnect, especially when so much of the literature specifically gender assigns "he" to WS and "she" to the BS.

I know we are still 2 weeks away (it will be on the 31st) but I’m still really scared for the therapeutic disclosure coming up.

I’m scared of what I might hear and also scared of what I might NOT hear. The super sucky thing is that of course there is no way to actually, definitively KNOW if he is telling the truth or still hiding things.

I am worried that the disclosure won’t help me feel any better, or that it will make me feel worse. I know it’s not realistic to expect it to fix things 100% and of course I don’t. But if it helps, just a tiny bit ... I’ve been looking for this for so long but now that it’s here, I’m worried it won’t actually give me any safety or security, not even a little.

Twice wounded,

Why don't you post something in the general forum?

BH looking to correspond with another BH, married to female SA

Maybe you will find another man in your situation who is reading but not connecting with anyone. Someone who is too hurt to write, doesn't know where to begin. You could be helping someone which will make you feel better. A "pay it forward" if you will...

I know you feel different from us women, and you are but only becuase you have man parts.

SI connects us by the heart, male, female, we all understand heartache and there is no sex attached to your heart.

We all loved, lost and are trying to find our way.

TW, I think you will find some of the support you are looking for over in the Betrayed Menz thread in the I Can Relate forum.

Admittedly, that thread itself is oftentimes moodier than a bipolar chameleon auditioning to be the lead singer in a Disney version of the Bohemian Rhapsody music video...but you will at least get a variety of betrayed men and multifarious situations to possibly connect with.

I was feeling very isolated and disappointed myself when I first tried to get some support with this shit, even after going on that thread at the advice of the mods, but it just took some time and

a good deal of me opening up on there to feel a lot more at home on SI in general, although I REALLY did basically "write the book" on opening up once I got going, let me tell ya...

Although I personally feel that this thread needs to have the very real BH side of being the spouse of an SA represented and addressed as well.

Hi!

My H is a sex addict. I found out Nov 14th. We are both in counseling and we’ve just started the therapeutic disclosure process. I will start putting together the questions next week. I need some place to share all the details of the story (as I know it now) so I can get them out of my head besides to my Therapist. I know there will be more details coming...

H started physically cheating (not sex) on me with AP #1 on our son’s birthday. So now his birthday will always remind me of when the physical cheating started. Then 3 weeks later he had sex with her. Then there was about 6 months without any physical acting out (there was still sex chats, video chats and phone calls going on).

Then he met and had sex with AP #2 for the first time by taking the day off work, bringing her a Christmas ornament to put on the tree in her house to be funny like oh unsuspecting husband...

They met for sex 4 more times over the next 3 months. He also met up with AP #1 once for oral sex during that time.

Then there is another about 6 months without any physical acting out.

Then he met AP #3 in his car for make out session. We went on a weekend trip together that same day and then he met her again 3 days later for another make out session in the car. Then 9 days later he met her for sex. Apparently, he didn’t really like her too well so to make up for that he went back to AP #2 for sex 13 days after that.

He told me about all of this because he was concerned about exposing me to an STD.

We both sought counseling and nowI’m stuck in the place before official disclosure happens in about 3 months. I can’t move forward to start healing because I don’t know what else is coming.

He is very remorseful and committed to getting the help he needs. We are trying to save our marriage. I would love to hear from those going through or who went through similar situation and came out the other side still together. I need encouraging words.

Hi Wrecked123,

Sorry to hear about you H’s behaviour. Your discovery is quite recent so be prepared for a gamut of emotions. You sound very level headed and determined to make this marriage work which I commend you for.

My advice to you would be to hold back on accepting and eventually forgiving this type of behaviour. Make sure you set boundaries’and consequences for his actions.

Too often women want to find a reason why their H acted out, get them help, mend the marriage and move on. In the process we forget about the true victim; ourselves!

Ensure your H is properly assed for SA. This is not a diagnosis to be taken lightly, nor should it be an easy excuse for your H to use because he chose to look outside his marriage.

I am not familiar with full disclosure yet as we have only recently found proper therapists for our situation.

My understanding is that it comes after much IC and with very careful guidance, and only when both parties are ready.

Take care of yourself before you put yourself through such a process. I know it’s tempting to want to know everything right away but if your H is not prepared, you may not get a true full disclosure.

9 months out for me and only now do I feel ready to hear it all. There may or not be more but I know that if it had all come out when I was most fragile, I do not thing I could have functioned as well as a mother. For me, the most important thing was to continue parenting as usual. My children have already paid a heavy price for their father’s nasty habit. They did it need a destroyed mother on top of all of it.

Take your time, it’s not a race and dont make any rash decisions. I know you want I fix it all and move on but there is so much work to be done before you can truly get to that point.

@Dogsnbooks: I hear you on the trepidation over the upcoming Therapeutic Disclosure. It is intended as a way for your SA to own up to everything which means he admits to himself also and faces his shame - that should mean progress in his recovery. For you the disclosure should tell you what you are working with and healing from. It is certainly scary and I hope your therapist has recommended you don't plan to drive yourself home.

His therapist should be working with him on doing the disclosure which means poking away at getting everything out. Of course many SA's forgot timelines and behaviours. They have minimized their actions to themselves for so long they believe their own rewritten history.

MY SAWH did his disclosure about 9 months after DDay. Prior to that I had the tip of the iceberg and he disclosed something I never, ever would have known or been able to find out. He told the CSAT while preparing that this could be a dealbreaker. It was explosive to me but - in a twisted way - was also proof that he was coming fully clean. And when I say fully I mean what he remembers. I know there was more but I know he buried that in the way back recesses of his memory and it was not intentionally held back.

The explosive part was about halfway through and I actually did not hear anything after that. I asked and then demanded a redo which was finally done 3 months later. That dragged it out for him but too bad.

I can't say the disclosure is going to make you feel better - I felt worse afterward - but you will have the most information you can to make your choice on what you can deal with. And it's not going to fix anything. Only he can fix himself and only you can decide if you can stay with an addict in recovery.

Nasty as it was I felt like I had all the pieces to decide whether to reconcile or leave. I chose to stay. And I know you didn't ask this but if I had been younger and healthier I would have D.

Bluetears, thanks for that info. I know our first page needs updating, and Destroyedwife offered to do some editing. Would you mind private messaging those resources to her?

Destroyedwife80 - are you still up for editing the first page? We're just about to page 50 and need to be ready for restart. Lionne has opted out currently and has been the consistent starter.

dontsaylovely - I sent Destroyed a PM. She can relay to you. Anyway, just so you know, I am also more than willing to do anything to help out with editing or whatever you need. Let me know okay?

Dontsaylovely

Thanks for the response. It certainly is scary. I probably will be driving myself home because I sure as hell won’t want to share a car with him. Our MC therapist did recommend that we each have an individual therapy session scheduled within 24 hours of disclosure, so I do. I also already requested the day after disclosure off of work.

I’m not sure if I’m more scared of what I might hear or what I might not hear. Because if he doesn’t disclose anything additional from what I already know (just more details, no more events on the timeline) then ... what if he is just holding it back? There is no way to definitively KNOW if he is telling the whole truth and that’s what’s driving me crazy. I was hoping for this to be some way to make me feel at least a little safer ... but now I just don’t know. I guess I’m not sure what I’m expecting out of this anymore, I’m not sure what the hope or goal is, and that’s probably not good.

Our MC says that even if I don’t trust that he’s telling the truth, that he’s sharing all, that he WANTS to do this for us (which I don’t, I think he’s just consequence-avoiding) ... that at the very least, I can look at this as him respecting a boundary that I’ve set. So I can at least fall back on that.

[This message edited by DogsnBooks at 5:29 PM, January 18th (Friday)]

Dogs The general purpose for disclosure is to begin a new way of relating that is rooted in total honesty; the disclosure process is a type of cleansing--the betrayer sheds his sordid secrets; the betrayed is taken out of the dark.

Formal disclosure is typically done with both ICs present; the betrayer's IC is to help enforce honesty and the betrayed's IC is there to help the betrayed deal more calmly with what might be more traumatizing. Learning more doesn't necessarily make one feel safer though it may help to know that your H is willing to disclose and work to become a healthier person; maybe in that sense, disclosure can lead to feeling more safe.

Marji

I have heard that about having both ICs present - but shouldn’t it happen in MC since that’s a neutral space? Are we really supposed to have 3 therapists present?? At this point I don’t think we could coordinate schedules to get both ICs there too. Do you think it will be okay with just the MC??

Dogs, Im sure it will be alright--as alright as such a thing can be.

Haven't heard about it taking place with an MC but Im sure it's done. My H and I never did it but I know several others who have; it can be very painful; it can be traumatic and so it's recommended that the betrayed be supported by her IC and not a neutral party. The betrayer on the other hand has theoretically been working his butt offto heal and has been coached by his IC for many months and disclosure is supposed to occur only when the SAs IC thinks SA will be honest and that the disclosure will be helpful and setting the stage for the SA to restart his life as a honest person of strength and integrity.

You say you don't think "at this point" you could coordinate with the two ICs. If you have any concerns I think you should discuss this with your IC. If you are working with an IC who is familiar with the disclosure process I would think she or he could advise you about the best way, the least harmful, the most helpful way to go about it.

So sorry for everyone on here struggling with such a topic.

I joined this thread a while back and have a question only for people of this group...I am just looking for some side advice...

Within days or weeks of my WH stepping out (via flirting texts, sexting, previous affairs or who knows what else-he is a master at deceiving me) he also tries to have sex with me. He is constantly grabbing my ass, asking for sex and when I turn him down he then gives me the cold shoulder and silent treatment. We then are walking on egg shells for a while. Then a few hours later he asks how about just a blow job or a handjob! Wtf right, completely unremorseful for the continued pain he puts me in. He even has the nerve to say “well not having sex at 40 is getting old” in response to me addressing my feelings. He expects saying sorry is enough for me to forgive and forget. He doesn’t know I know about his most recent sexting But I no longer see a point addressing it!

So any tips to navigate this?

He has not stuck with IC and we went once to MC which seems a waste until we both did IC. Truthfully, I do not see change as a possibility and reconciliation would be another failure. The serial cheating, pathological lying and substance abuse for 10 years has done a great number on me! I no longer feel love but feel paralyzed to move.

I feel that when I have sex with him I am nothing but an object. It is shameful for me now not enjoyable. I had sex with him a few times over Christmas as it put him in a better mood and I wanted a half normal Christmas for our children (5&7). We now have a trip to Disney in one week and I feel pressured to have sex with him to improve his mood so the family trip is easier. I feel I just need to get through the next few weeks but will have to have sex with him to do so just to shut him up and get him to stop trying to touch me.

After Disney, I plan to see a lawyer. The continued disrespect, trickle truth, false R and lying is too painful to continue to endured...

[This message edited by Somber at 6:50 AM, January 20th (Sunday)]

@Dogsnbooks if your MC is not CSAT certified or specializes in trauma they may not be the right person for you right now.

Typically the formal disclosure is done with your IC's and you and your SAWH. The Marriage is not currently the problem and counselling that is a bit of a moot point until the SA is well into recovery. Don't mean to muddy the waters for you but MC will NOT be your best support through this.

In any event don't delay the disclosure you've been waiting so long for. And do have a backup plan ready for travel home, ie cab/uber and get your car later.

Good chance you will be even more unsettled after the disclosure. BUT you will know what you are dealing with and whether you can deal with that information and do the hard work of reconciling.

I could not have chosen to reconcile without all the secrets laid out by him and spoken to me by him. There were many and they were bad but they were no longer secret and removing the secrecy made a huge difference to me. After I recovered from the shock!

Whatever happens it is definitely a step in the right direction.

I submitted the pieced together starter page to Don'tSayLovely- based on Lionne's original intro, resources PM'ed to me by others and some of my own recommendations. Feel free to edit or add whatever needs to be done.

So- in addition to a second D-Day (I found him propositioning men on CraigsList last week)...I uncovered the very early beginning of an EA- or what I think is/will become an EA with a COW.

We REALLY have to tune in and give thanks to that gut feeling. It is astonishing. Red flags:

- He sent me a pic of a work function (they went sailing as a team building exercise); he is only talking to one other person in every pic- the only woman there. She is talking only to him, no one else. These pics are taken over 3-4 hour period.

- He began texting her to 'vent' when he's stressed out at work

- She says "I wish I was there to help you." "I wish I was closer." etc

- They have began to incorporate personal situations- caring for aging parents in their venting

- He NEVER mentions me or being married

- He doesn't know I monitor his texts/calls/emails so I will specifically ask "Who called/texted/emailed." (I know the answer) and even if it's 100% work related- he lies to me about her ONLY. IE- if John or Jim calls/texts/emails he will say John or Jim. If it's her he says "Someone from work" or "John/Jim".

He has NO idea I monitor his shit- so I am stuck between wanting to say something and playing dumb to gather more evidence. I have a VAR in the house/car right now.

Anyone else at odds to either confront prematurely OR keep your cards close until you have more?

Destroyed eofe80,

On the advice of a PI who won’t slot of time with me on the phone, free of charge (nice man), I waited and watched for 10 excruciating weeks.

During that time I knew he was seeing prostitutes at massage parlours and their private homes.

We work together and I started to identify a pattern of absences from the office

This was supported by secret access to his phone which gave me his location history. I cross checked some of the locations with some of the Craig’s list ads he had accessed and they matched.

Once I had wrapped my head around what he was up to, I saw two separate therapists to determine if they were a fit for me and to listen to their advice regarding confrontation.

Even though I was I’m shock mode, and to a certain extent I’m denial, they helped me role play what I was to say and how to avoid the common traps of accepting blame, rug sweeping or gaslighting. I had full control of the conversation which took place very calmly in a restaurant.

I am a calm person who prefers information gathering. Others confront immediately. There is no right or wrong but I felt I needed the time to have a strong case and did not want to tell him to aoin for fear of him being able to cover up and diminish.

I knew that if he had a good cover up story I might just buy it I’m order to shield myself from the hurt.

Deep down I always knew something was wrong but never dug. That’s why I’m in IC now. 12 years of denial is well worth exploring. I owe that to myself.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

I do have tons of other proof like you are talking of- all from escorts/massage parlors/craigslist meet ups. I used Waze (GPS), ATM withdraw date/locations, googling the #'s he called right before going missing for an hour, making a fake # to set up a fake meeting so I could learn their address. It was like a sickass game of connect the dots and I was real good at it.

So I KNOW he has done the things I am accusing him of- even though he still denies and won't answer questions or speak about the issue at all.

I guess what I am afraid of is every time I have confronted him about things like ATM visits, Waze, etc...he then begins to cover those things up. I have to get more and more creative. Like, he doesn't think I know his work phone password. I am going to wait it out- I need to review the VAR audio from this weekend while I've been at work.