"You can survive this. Talk to others that have"

cocoplus5nuts posted 2/13/2020 09:55 AM

This came up in conversation with my H this morning. He said he wouldn't prefer it, but he would be ok with it. IOW, he would stay married to me even if I said I never wanted to have sex with him again.

I asked him, again, wh he doesn't file for D. He said he doesn't want D. He is committed to me and our family. I, basically, told him that's not same as wanting me. He changed his tune and said he is committed to me because he wants me, not because of any obligation.

So, then, I asked him if he wants to be happy. He said he is happy. I told him actions don't show that. His actions show that he is very unhappy. I told him maybe there's a disconnect from what he wants vs. what he really feels. Maybe he should examine that.

I said all of this because I want him to really think long and hard about whether or not he really wants to be with me. I think he's lying when he says that. He may even be lying to himself. I want him to think about whether or not he is ok with living in that lie for the rest of his life, bot truly being happy.

PSTI posted 2/13/2020 17:57 PM

Some people have lower sex drives than others. Some people are asexual, and that's OK too as long as it's something negotiated with your spouse.

I don't think a spouse is ever under any circumstances expected to have sex. On the other hand, there are obviously going to be consequences for not doing so if there is a mismatch in desire levels. I cannot blame a spouse who openly says to their partner, "I love you and I want to be with you, but I need sex and if you aren't interested in having it, then I'll be having it with someone else." Honesty counts. And it's not like a nonsexual spouse got consent from their partner to change to a sexless marriage, either.

So how do you feel about what your H says? Do you want a marriage that is basically roommates? Is he telling you that he doesn't feel desire any more in general?

pearlamici posted 2/13/2020 18:16 PM

I don't even know if what I'm about to say makes sense but here goes ... If my husband was totally honest and said he did not desire me and wanted OW. I would initially be hurt but be thankful for the total honesty and want out... I would rather out than continue a marriage where he stayed for other reasons but still desired someone else.

He is committed to me and our family. I, basically, told him that's not same as wanting me. He changed his tune and said he is committed to me because he wants me, not because of any obligation.

My sexuality is heightened when I think "I" am desired ... unfortunately since Dday that is now highly questionable... So as a result sometimes sex is great (depending on where I'm at mentally in the healing from betrayal trauma process which is anywhere from we're good to fuck him I just feel like fucking ... So we definitely don't have a sexless marriage (likely more sex now since we're older and nobody is really home anymore) But sadly those questions never go away ...

crazyblindsided posted 2/13/2020 18:27 PM

This is another major reason for my deciding to S is that I didn't want to have sex with STBX anymore (given my STBX was a real pig in our M). I wasn't ever able to get back to a level of being vulnerable to sex when he wasn't making me feel loved and wasn't working on himself.

I hope my sex drive comes back one day. I feel like that part broke in me.

secondtime posted 2/13/2020 18:33 PM

So. Sex with my husband only happens if I'm feeling safe.

Sometimes its alot. Sometimes it's once every 2 months.

It's my boundary. I can't have sex if I'm feeling unsafe. If I do, I feel awful and used. Neither one of us want me to go there.

My husband says he's fine with this. Of course he would like to have sex regularly, but he accepts that there are consequences to his choices...and, well, this is one of them.

I mean, I figure if he didn't want to be with me, he would leave.

And if I don't want to be with him, I'll leave.

Unfortunately, you aren't really privy to knowing if your husband is lying to himself or not, right now. If you are interested in reconciliation, then you have to take the risk that he's not.

If you are still wanting to divorce eventually, what does it matter if he's lying to himself?

EllieKMAS posted 2/13/2020 19:58 PM

Coco - what do you want? A lot of your posts lately have been about your H and what he wants and what he's doing. I know those thing for sure affect you, so I'm by no means saying they aren't valid. But you seem to focus an awful lot on him, imho. So what do YOU want from your life at this point?

cocoplus5nuts posted 2/13/2020 20:53 PM

Ellie, honestly, I just want to chill. I don't really want anything. I'm doing my thing and having a good time. I've got casual, light work. I'm busy with my kids. I've got friends. I think you're misinterpreting my focus on my H.

I think you all are misunderstanding a little. My H didn't say he doesn't desire me sexually or that his sex drive is low. On the contrary, he said he thought I didn't want to have sex because of how I've been feeling lately. He was giving me space, waiting until I showed interest. He says he does want to have sex with me. He didn't want to push it if I didn't want it. But, apparently, he's ok with staying married even if I don't ever show interest again.

The stuff about wanting me was about marriage, not sex. IOW, I'm not convinced he's staying married to me because he wants to be with me rather than put of a sense of obligation and/or wanting to keep the family together, or maintaining his image as a good guy.

If it takes me a long time to respond again, it's because I'm having trouble with the website. I've been trying to get back on all day, but it wouldn't load.

earlydetour posted 2/13/2020 23:24 PM

Hi Coco,

I know how I feel when my H says that he wants to stay M'd - it feels like he's focusing on the practical stuff. That it's about him and what he gets out of the arrangement.

This was one thing in early MC that rubbed me the wrong way - the MC asked H in front of me (after meeting with H separately) if he wanted to be M'd - MC was working with my H to tell me that H didn't want to leave me for the OW. Working from the assumption that I was afraid of being abandoned and I was grossly misunderstanding this "friendship".

And the backtracking. Yep. Feels like H is telling me what he thinks I want to hear at the moment.

I know I want my H to see M with me as an outward expression of how he views me as a person & a woman - someone who he wants in his life. Not as someone filling the role of wife and what he gets out of being M'd.

I don't know how to find out their real motivation except by talking and watching actions.

Is this what you were getting at?

cocoplus5nuts posted 2/14/2020 06:39 AM

someone who he wants in his life. Not as someone filling the role of wife and what he gets out of being M'd.

If I were interested in reviving my M, yes.

What I want now is for him to be completely honest about what he wants. Idk why this is so important to me right now. I know I can't make him do that. I can't make him see how he's lying to everyone, including himself, maybe. Maybe it's just my way of reinforcing to myself that he's just not capable of being honest.

The fact remains that there's nothing he can do at this point to get me to believe that he loves me.

JimmyB posted 2/14/2020 10:29 AM

Sex in my marriage only occurs when I initiate it. I'm told she has no libido, no desire even though during her A she seemed to have more than enough of both. I even asked her why she makes no effort and was told that she thinks she wants me to pursue her! Well isn't that just peachy for her?

Anyway, I really see no reason to believe she "wants" to be married other than to maintain the comfort, convenience and financial benefits it provides her. She had multiple A's because she needed to feel wanted, when do I get to feel wanted?

I actually believe these situations happen far more than people will admit, specifically WS's.

TKOGA posted 2/14/2020 10:36 AM

I thought I read that you were done with this marriage. That might have been another poster. May I ask what was the point of this conversation? It reads to me like you brought up something purely hypothetical in order to start an argument to see how hard he wants to fight for you? You've stated that you don't believe him when he says he wants you. What could he say/do to change your mind?

northeasternarea posted 2/14/2020 11:11 AM

IOW, I'm not convinced he's staying married to me because he wants to be with me rather than put of a sense of obligation and/or wanting to keep the family together, or maintaining his image as a good guy.

It's likely all of the above.

cocoplus5nuts posted 2/14/2020 11:23 AM

Sex in my marriage only occurs when I initiate it.

This is how it's been mostly on my M, too. My H has initiated sometimes, but those times are few and far between. I never felt like it was because he didn't desire me sexually. I think he's afraid of rejection, which explains why he hasn't tried anything for so long now. He knew I was angry, assumed I didn't want sex, and didn't want to risk the rejection if he was correct. Of course, it never occurred to him to just talk to me about it.

TK, keep reading to find out what I want. I didn't actually say I was done with this M. I said I was done. Done emotionally investing in it. I don't know if/when we might D.

Where did I say a fight ensued? We had a calm conversation, actually. No anger, no hurt, no raised voices or even disagreements. Just a conversation.

I also think I answered your last question. Maybe that was on another thread. So, I'll answer again. I don't think there's anything he could do or say at this point to convince me otherwise. His actions before his cheating were a lie. His words during and after his cheating were lies. His actions don't match his words now. It's pretty obvious he's not being honest about something.

During the conversation, I did ask what he thought love is. After he listed off everything, I asked if he could see why I wouldn't believe he loves me based on his actions in light of what he thinks love is. I told him I see a disconnect somewhere. Maybe that's something he should examine. Does he really love me, or does he just want to love me kind of thing.

pureheartkit posted 2/14/2020 11:36 AM

Maybe try some touching and tenderness? If you don't feel the warm feelings for that then maybe try more talking. It's so hard after trust is broken. You need to feel safe with him.

sewardak posted 2/14/2020 12:04 PM

watch Outlander together.

PSTI posted 2/14/2020 13:23 PM

coco, do you think he's actually lying to himself, or do you think that maybe he just hasn't even bothered doing the self-examination to figure out what he wants?

Just curious about that.

cocoplus5nuts posted 2/14/2020 15:02 PM

I think he hasn't done the self examination. He just recently acknowledged that maybe some of his reactions to me stem from his FOO. For a long time he refused to even consider that his childhood wasn't idyllic.

He says he knows he has a choice. He can leave. He's not staying put of obligation. I don't think he's lying to me. I really think he doesn't really know how he feels and what he wants. He has always done what was expected without question.

Pure heart, I don't feel unsafe. I'm not looking for help on how to spice up our sex life. If I want sex, I know I can get it. He's not wrong that I was mad. That's why I wasn't initiating. I also know that it's not likely that he will initiate.

I really just found it interesting that he said he'd be ok with a sexless M. I think from now on I will state at the beginning of my posts when I'm just discussing something rather than looking for insight or help.

Darkness Falls posted 2/14/2020 15:07 PM

Coco, my H and I have been sexless for almost a year. It’s the same deal with initiating, so I stopped and we never talked about it. I’m not interested at this point anyway with him.

I think he would be willing to live this way in perpetuity. I can to a point, for our kids. Idk how long. Haven’t decided yet.

Justsomelady posted 2/14/2020 18:57 PM

I really just found it interesting that he said he'd be ok with a sexless M

Wondering if he really thought this was the “ultimate” way to show you his love and commitment? You hear about spouses who are there for each other through the worst of things and never stray...maybe he was trying to say he was at that level now....he’s here for you even without sex? Seems like an odd thing to say otherwise (unless he actually wanted that as a lifestyle and was floating it).

My H did not have sex w me for about a year and it was definitely some untreated depression, fwiw.

[This message edited by Justsomelady at 7:02 PM, February 14th (Friday)]

cocoplus5nuts posted 2/14/2020 19:27 PM

DF, don't you want sex, though? I do. I don't have an aversion to having sex with my H. I've just been feeling blah about it lately and haven't made an effort. I've got some physical issues going on with perimenopause that are troublesome.

Justsomelady, I guess that could be it. It's not something he wants. He said he would not prefer it, but he could live with it.