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Oh please. She is suddenly agreeing that you need to split, that it wouldn't have worked, blah blah blah. She is just convincing herself because she doesn't like not being in control. She's really just off the deep end.

The next time she starts talking about 'him' and this twin flame bullshit, just chuckle and tell her to have fun spending her life alone while her 'twin flame' is willing to sleep in a trailer to prove to his wife he loves her. Have fun being alone while her 'twin flame' has sex with his wife, takes vacations, is with her for holidays and birthdays, and they grow old together, in love.

She's a fool, truly. She can't admit she's destroyed her life for nothing so she's clinging to this 'twin flame' bullshit. Tell her that one too.

I'm sorry she's so delusional.

I have to say that she stated the conversation talking on how the arrangement with the kids could be if we split. Them it turned into me telling her that he does not love her and know her, I DO! and she has screwed me and the kids life up. I am pissed of the inconvience . Then she tried later to talk about the kids issue and I was pissed.

Oh well, I will move on and continue my 180 and the journey

[This message edited by Felco at 10:06 AM, December 30th (Monday)]

Felco,

It pains me to see you going through the "push/pull" abusive shit I endured for too long. Believe none of her pretty words, but believe every one of her heartless actions.

Also, her behavior is going to get more erratic. Start to document EVERYTHING she does. You need to keep the coolest most level head you can muster.

As others have said, you can always stop the divorce at any time, all the way to the end. But don't divorce as a tactic to win her back or make her "snap out of it." Her behavior after the divorce begins will show you what she really is.

She is now totally treated me like its over and we should be planning on how to handle time with the kids and living situation

I am/was panicking because she is moving on and acting like its done.

I guess it maybe, hard to accept

First - it's probably manipulation to get you to feel fear, along with her desire to 'stay strong' so she is pushing the plans.

Does it make sense that she is already demanding to discuss time with the kids? No, but she is pushing it to make you think and to give her something to think about besides her actions causing this.

If she is stressing you out, don't engage. If she asks again, tell her that the lawyers will figure that out, and that she should spend her time thinking about how her actions caused the children's time to be split in the first place.

Don't let her control this, at all. Keep her focus on her actions, and yours should stay there too.

When Mr. Twin Flames is out of her life, and that will probably happen eventually, this soul mate garbage will evaporate. She has her life to lead and such ridiculous unrequited love sentiments get in the way of a productive future.

I don't believe that if she was ultimately convinced the OM wasn't coming back she wouldn't try to save her marriage. Why end up with the loss of everything she values if her spiritual mate was gone. Too high of a price for an affair that didn't work out.

I think you are doing the right thing working with the BW. Maybe you will get to find out just what the OM and your WW are planning. Remember if you file you can always call off the divorce if she comes to her senses. Meanwhile the threat of divorce will put her under some pressure. Either way you need to find a way forward out of this mess.

Have you thought that if your wife can get you out of the house then a space has opened up for the OM? He can move out of his uncomfortable trailer right into your home. Your WW may be hoping to dangle this temptation in front of him if you separate and you move out.

[This message edited by OK now at 11:57 AM, December 28th (Saturday)]

I don't believe for one minute these two are not in contact.

I think she is blowing smoke. She wants the upper hand, you took it away so now she is playing the other side. If she wants a separation give it to her. NOW!!!! Let her see what being a single parent entails. Go out, get away don't come home until late. Don't tell her where you are of where you have been. Shut her off make her a single mom now.

They are in contact and planning on going underground. Don't believe a word of what she says. Cheaters lie. She is playing the hand the long way, wait out OBS....

Have you seen what tagalong posted on your other thread? About the source for the “Twin Flame” comment? I think that can be VERY relevant. Do you have any clue that your wife might be listening/reading from the person tagalong mentioned?

Look – Affairs are fantasy. Breaking that fantasy is a key element to ending infidelity. If your WW is being fed white-knight stories and Fabio-fantasies then your best tool is shoving reality into her face. HOWEVER – coming from you any bad thing about OM is irrelevant and even counter-productive. So don’t mention OM in any negative sense. All you do is make sure your wife knows that there is NOTHING from you keeping her from seeing him.

She went to counciling and discovered that she hasn't been happy in a while

First of all: What sort of counseling is this? Is it a certified IC?

Second: Making her happy is not your job. Creating a loving environment where she has all the possibilities of being happy… that might be in your job description. Her comment remind me a bit of my teenage son who opened the fridge, looked at the left-over turkey and stuffing, the beef-roll, the cheeses, spreads and toppings, the yogurt and all the other options only to complain loudly that there was nothing edible in the house. And if she needed a shrink to tell her she wasn’t happy… well couldn’t have been serious unhappiness.

What I will give her (if her IC is qualified) is that affairs tend to happen for a reason. That reason tends to be because of some insecurities or issues within the WS. So your WW might have been unhappy, but that would be an unreasonable unhappiness she should have dealt with in another way. For example: she might feel age coming over and be concerned about her looks or what she has attained in life. The affair is her attempt to get validation that she can still pull in a man, the fantasy an escape from a monotonous job.

Felco – Don’t argue with her about the divorce. Don’t replace her fantasy with another one. In fact – you don’t need to start the D process formally ASAP. What you need to do is start the process of initiating divorce. For example: address the issue of when to tell stakeholders in the marriage (ABSOLUTELY refuse to hide the reason your marriage is threatened!). Stakeholders are parents, in-laws, siblings, friends, children. Start getting financial information. Start figuring out how you will cope with a single income. There is a long path ahead and as long as you walk along then the pace is irrelevant.

It is hard, Felco - we understand - we really do!

What she's doing is Doubling Down on manipulative shittiness. She's attempting to push your fear buttons...she is pushing your fear buttons.

It is manipulation. It is not real.

What she's doing is trying desperately to not grow up and face consequences.

People like that will try one mask on, then another, just to see what gets a reaction.

You stay strong stay with the 180, getting into you and your healing. Period. Minimize contact, explanations - everything! except kids and finances, and then tell her what another poster suggested; "The lawyers will work that out."

Stop engaging with her.

I predict that if you stick to your guns

A. She will shed the moving-forward mask, and try another one on, it will probably be

B. Oh baby baby, totally fake remorse, trying to hoover you back in.

Stand firm!

When you do, I predict you will see

C. The scheming, screaming baby throwing temper-tantrum, trying to make your life hell.

Prepare. Protect Yourself! I suggest getting several VARS placed around. Keep one on you.

Don't leave the house - it will be spun into "abandonment". Get as many free consults as you can asap - she's already looking for L's. A side benefit? She cannot use any that you have consulted with. Beat her to the punch.

It's ok to post about your fears here - we will help to strengthen you - just don't show her anything!

She does not deserve access to your heart.

Good Morning Everyone.

First I would like to express my deepest Thank you to ALL of you who are here. It is nice to have a place where people understand and are encouraging.

Today I am at work and I will not be coming home until Wednesday evening. I am very sad to leave my kids but I have to clear my head.

Working can be tough at times because I work alone so I am in my head, A LOT.

My WW came to me last night and says, "you know I don't hate you" WTF, why would she, I didn't do anything! She really, really screwed up and it is not only me who she has to deal with.

She had the nerve to tell my 3 year old that momma and papa may not always be together and you may be in a different home but know that we love you. Really, I think it is a little to soon.

Her friends, family, everyone thinks she is off her rocker with this Soul Connection BS.

I am mad that she is not even trying. No "honey I want to be with you and I will do whateve it takes" or "I am really trying to figure this out" nothing except I am going to IC and let time figure it out. But all the while she is listening to some $150 TWin Flames audio book!!!

What I am doing??????

I told her she is going to look back and go WTF did I do.

You leaving your home does 3 things:

1] Tells the OM that your marriage is failing and your WW will soon be 'available'

2] Gives him a place for sexual liaisons without having to leave his home, or pay for a traceable, expensive motel room.

3] Its a big temptation; if his own reconciliation hits a sticky patch and his wife throws him out, he can now move in with your cheating wife.

No wonder your wife is happy that you could be leaving and in essence she is telling her children there could be a new daddy on the horizon.

Throw her ungrateful ass out of the house; don't make it easy for her to cheat by leaving the marital home.

Really? I don't hate you? I hope you said "That's probably why I'm the one that decided this was over." She is convincing herself that she wanted this. Remind her that YOU are the one that decided being treated like shit wasn't an option.

On telling the kids, I would have had her head on that one (figuratively). Those are your kids too, and you BOTH should have decided when and how to tell the. I would be very clear that she is NOT to discuss any more divorce issues without you being there.

Take her audiobook, smash it and throw it in the trash. Tell her that if he's her 'soulmate' she wouldn't need a book to confirm it.

Did you hear anything back from OBS since you sent the text?

I see what your saying but we have a live in nanny and she needs to be home at certain times and there is another family we co share the nanny with and they and the Nanny know about the A.

If they are going to be together they would be

I truly believe they have NC. But I know it is a possibility but again they will be together anyways. I will text his wife and let her know I am leaving so she has the heads up.

This is MY time to be away from her and figure it out. She has no family around and is a nursing mother so it is easier if I leave.

If you need to help clear your head, then do it. This would be a good time to line up a lawyer, get some information about the best way to progress, line up a separate banking account, and start thinking about what you will propose for a in-house separation. How to split the finances, who watches the children when, what chores are yours and what are hers. All of those decisions that you need to make when you are operating as co-parents and not a couple. Because when you go back, you will want to have a clear idea of what your next steps look like. Be strong, even if you don't feel like you are. Be decisive. Project determination, not weakness.

If you have not done so already, why don't you go to the I Can Relate forum and look up the guys on the Betrayed Men's thread. They are highly experienced and I think that you will find a lot of support there as well.

I agree with what Skan says.

If you need to be away from her to clear your head then do it. I found I was always stronger if I had more time away from WS. That was when I could gain some perspective.

This is a great time for you to make your to do list on how you are going to take care of you and your kids, and number 1 should be to see a lawyer ASAP. Get advice on how this can play out what your responsibilities are, and what you can do to protect yourself.

You also need to accept the fact (and I think you are getting there) that no matter what you do at this point and time you are not going to be able to force her to change her mind, or see what she is doing. She is deep deep deep in the fog. You can make life really uncomfortable for her though, and I would urge you to take those steps. Let the OM's wife know what's up, cut back on the Nanny hours to essential times only, quit paying for everything, and only talk with her about finances and kids.

(((and strength))))

Hello everyone.

So, I had a good night with friends and family.

It was hard being away from my kids.

My daughter was crying on the phone to me because she missed me.

Breaks my heart.

I am now really trying to stick to the 180 and not try to fix or change her. So hard when I feel like I have the answers.

I was feeling strong this morning and then SHE called because I texted and asked to talk to my daughter.

She asked me how I was doing, how was my sleep, my drive, etc.

She said my daughter was good and she said "I don't want my parents to be apart." WW said to her something like "sometimes parents will not be together but we love." I told her that she needs to stop talking about this issue until we talk to her together and it is to soon to start doing that.

I think she did not like that much.

Of course that made me get that sinking feeling.

Geez, this process is so raw!!!

I would like to say THANK YOU to all of you for the help and support.

I really rely on this forum

When she trys to get info from you, like how did you sleep etc, that sucks you back in. Weakens your resolve.

You need really separate yourself from her. Do not engage her in this small talk BS. Tell her outright that you have no interest in this stuff, and you will not engage her as a friend, as a partner. She has made her choice clear.

Then 180 hard. When she asks how you slept your response should be, I wish to speak with DD. Do not engage her. She is not feeling any consequence for her choice.

((((and strength))))

Actually, if your daughter is asking questions, she deserves and NEEDS an answer. Her little life has been torn apart too. She is scared and confused. NOT talking to her about it will only cause her to feel worse.

Age appropriate info needs to be given. I don't know how old your DD is, but it is perfectly reasonable to tell her that when people get married they make promises to each other..when one of them breaks a promise, the marriage is no longer the same..and mommy broke promises.

As a BS, we all know one of the worst things about all of this shit is all the damn lies. Kids deserve nothing less than the truth..again..in an age appropriate way. IMO, one of the biggest mistakes parents make is lying to the kids about why mommy(or daddy) no longer lives with them..why their family disintegrated. They deserve the truth. They need to know they have at least one parent who will give it to them.

I only answer her with short answers, how was the drive "good only to 40 minutes", sleep well "slept good", how are you " doing well, busy".

My daughter is 3 and I do agree she needs to know but I don't think she should be the one soley telling her. If asks questions to one I would be honest but short.

Maybe that's not the right way but I don't know, have never thought about it.

WW did mention that she will be going to therapy with my daughter, good step.

I hate that she has good ideas about how to manage the future.

Must be nice to have a clear head....Bi$ch