SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hi all.

Really angry here at the moment.

H has always insisted he did not want to sleep with his AP. All he wanted was her doting attention and it got out of hand when she started making moves on him. he claims he had sex cos she made him feel trapped driving him around and refusing to take him home. He had previously kissed her 'to find out what she was playing at' cos she kept insisting they were just friends when she was making moves on him. He couldn't really talk to her cos she would just brush off any talk about their relationship 'we're just friends there's no problem.' As she wouldn't talk and H wanted to end it he kissed her to see what he was dealing with, did she want him or were they really just friends.

When she picked him up from the pub the next night, drove him around for an hour then parking in a secluded spot and pouncing.

He swears he only agreed to get her off his back and to keep her quiet so she would not tell me what they had been doing, texting and kissing. He swears he did not fancy her, never wanted it to go past that kiss. His plan was if she kissed him back to say sorry I like you but I can't do this and if she didn't great they were just friends. It backfired on him according to him

Last night a couple of bits of info fell into place for me. He said he told her he couldn't have sex cos he didn't have a condom. He was trying to stop it. BUt when she said it's ok he went ahead and did it! he didn't even think about sti's cos his special little admirer couldn't have anything could she

My argument is if he could stop and think of a condom how the hell could he carry on just to keep her quiet? Ut makes no sense to me. It was his perfect get out chance but instead he did what she wanted.

He is sick about it now and keeps saying he was not in his right mind. But how could he think of a condom yet still go ahead without just cos she wasn't listening to him and had climbed in the back seat. How could he go through with it. He swears he felt he had to cos he had led her on and it was the last thing he wanted but felt trapped. She was clearly screwed up mentally (I have met her, wow what a mess her head is)and he was scared what she would do and everything he did was pure panic.

Is this even possible. How could he have gone ahead after thinking of a condom unless he DID want to sleep with her.

It didn't seem like it though cos it never happened again and the next morning although he didn't confess he was a mess and told me he was never going out without me again and it was the worst night of his life. Said he was miserable without me there and he had no interest in going out anymore he wanted to focus on his family life.

I wish it would add up but so much contradictory evidence.

ETA - we have both been tested and are clear but we have been referred back to sti clinic as we have oral thrush that won't clear. Got it first time he slept with me after affair - yes he slept with me unprotected after sleeping with her unprotected

[This message edited by olwen at 8:21 AM, November 3rd (Sunday)]

None of his story makes sense. Why did he have to kiss her to find out if she was "just flirting" or if she wanted to be "just friends?" She was flirting with him. If he didn't want that to happen, kissing her wasn't the way to set up boundaries and tell her no. All he had to do was say no.

This is not the first time you have questioned his story. You continue to question it because it makes no sense. Because he is lying to you. If you stop asking him questions,and you just put things together that you know happened and that you know he said to her..if you look at it just going on what YOU know to be true, and you take his story and explanations out of it..it will make sense.

I had the same problem. WH's story didn't make sense. I tried and tried to make it make sense in my head and my heart. One day I had an epiphany. It made no sense because he was lying. I realized..Im an intelligent woman. I do not need to him to answer these questions for me..I already knew the answer. I was in my own fog. I loved him and was desperate to make sense of of this bullshit he was telling me. If I stopped trying to match his words with what I knew to be true,I had my answers.

You do not need him to tell you what you already know.

He kissed her because he wanted to. He had sex with her because he wanted to. Im sure he is sorry and feels ashamed NOW..but THEN he wanted to.

He had planned to tell her no because he didn't have a condom...but one "it's ok" from her..and he decides to have sex with her...because he wanted to.

Im sorry. I know what it's like to have a WH who won't own up to what he did. I lived with that for 2 years. Until WH realized I KNEW. That no longer would I attempt to make sense out if his story. That 1+1=2...not 5...not 16..like WH was trying to tell me. It equals 2. I called him out on everything..no questions. He admitted things..things he didn't have to admit..(nothing big)..and once he told me the truth about the things that previously made no sense..the fog lifted off of him too.

Stop listening to him..listen to YOU.

Edited to add the word "no."

[This message edited by confused615 at 5:46 AM, November 4th (Monday)]

(((((olwen)))))

unfortunately, you're trying to make sense of the mind of a cheater, and there is no sense to be found there. Yes, he thought of a condom. Yes, he could have stopped there. Really, he could have stopped whenever, condom or not. He liked her asking for sex, so he let it go on. That's really all that is. Unfortunately, he went through with it. It seems that was enough to shake him out of his fog.

Did they have oral sex? The thrush is concerning. It can have many causes, but it is the same infection as a yeast infection and yes, it's contagious. I'm sorry - I know that's awful, but you both having it since immediately after the affair is odd. Perhaps she just had oral thrush too.

I'm so sorry that the details aren't adding up. I'm sorry that your head is reeling. You really can't make sense of the mind of a person in an affair. None of it makes sense. It's just such a desperate grab for attention - its something that the 'normal' mind can't comprehend.

615 - I totally agree. You have tried telling me before and cos he got angry I believed his story instead. Problem is I swallow it but it won't stay down. I know I don't have the truth.

The problem is I can't move forward without him admitting the truth. I feel like he is taking me for a fool and he just sticks to his story like glue. I don't know how to wake him up to the truth. I really feel he believes its true cos he can't face the truth himself.

I am fairly sure he didn't give her oral. As far as I an tell he was carrying it asymptomatically until we had sex. Next day he had spots on his bits and I had vaginal thrush. TMI but as we were hb we had oral sex and that's how it became oral thrush. Cos of my dad's death, the affair and my mental health problems I think the extreme stress is stopping me fighting it. We both agree it came from her cos neither of us had it in our lives.

I am going to get him to sit and talk to me and if he doesn't come forward with the truth he can suit himself and I will move forward with my life

Is vaginal thrush a yeast infection??

If so, my husband gave me them multiple times during his affairs, constantly, every time we had sex. My vagina apparently did not like his AP's vaginas. I even got bacterial vaginosis.

Honey, you're getting fed a ton of lies.

You have tried telling me before and cos he got angry I believed his story

The truth has no anger in it. He is angry because he's being exposed.

I bet you're right about the stress making it hard to battle the illness. It happens. Try to relax - I know, easier said that done.

Exactly. No anger, no defensiveness.

He is lying.

Is vaginal thrush a yeast infection??

Yes, according to WebMD

http://www.webmd.com/skin-problems-and-treatments/guide/candidiasis-yeast-infection

So your husband saw you having all of these 'female' problems and never thought that maybe he was bringing these things home?

Damn wayward fog!!

[This message edited by painfulpast at 9:12 AM, November 3rd (Sunday)]

Samantha - yeah it's all the same, a yeast infection. I haven't had it vaginally since the first time. We both get it whenever we kiss so our bits aren't picking it up anymore so sure affair has stopped.

painful past - I couldn't agree more. He hates me coming on here. I just want him to admit the truth, I can't move forward without it

He hates you coming on here because he knows you're getting the truth from us. He knows you're getting stronger by getting information here. He wants you to remain blind.

If you want the quick version skip to the end *

This is so frustrating. he admitted to a whole load of stuff a few weeks back then took it all back saying he was just telling me what I wanted to hear.

Now it turns out the truth is somewhere in between. It really does sit with me as the truth. He hasn't knowingly lied to me to hurt me, he has been lying to himself and refused to face the truth. He broke down telling me and is disgusted with himself and now convinced I will leave him.

He has told himself the story he gave me from day one. Even when he was cheating he was telling himself that story to justify what he was doing.

I hope you don't mind but I showed him your replies and I could see on his face I was going to get the truth this time.

He has always maintained he didn't fancy her, want her or want to have sex. He said all he did was trying to find out what she wanted as her actions were confusing. I never really swallowed that.

The truth is as always very hard to swallow but I actually feel better right now. Am sure it will hit me hard later. I tried so hard to stay calm and reassuring as he said things that cut me to the core.

From the start he was flattered by her attentions. He admits he saw her as a 29 yr old busty ex barmaid who was full of laughter and confidence and doted on him. He couldn't get enough so his morals flew out of the window. He couldn't believe 'someone like her' would want him. Cliché! He didn't care about her as a person or love her it was all about what she was giving him. Attention and ego boost. And the fact she was younger.

She fawned all over him from day one as did he with her and he told himself the text affair was something to make himself feel better as he was very low at the time and handled it badly cos she was there and became a distraction and a temptation.

He didn't actually fancy her but she was 'good enough' Then when she put his lighter down her top he admits he got a buzz out of the forbidden although he didn't look or grope her, he did enjoy doing it. The physical come on from him made him wonder how far she was willing to go and how far he was willing to go. He never thought it would lead to sex because he didn't think she really wanted him and was only flirting.

Then a few days later they were on a fag break and as he passed her she lifted her head and looked at his mouth and he wanted to kiss her so he did. He admits he was showing her he was up for whatever she wanted. It was just a peck though so he went back for more in the afternoon. She did not respond to either kiss and he says he was relieved as he didn't like kissing her. He thought then they would go back to EA.

He clearly found her physically attractive enough to want to kiss her and later touch her.

When she drove him round the next night he knew she was up to something and wondered what. He was confused as she hadn't kissed him back the day before. So he was sat there knowing something was going to happen but not what. He started to get uncomfortable and told himself he had led her on to this point, which he had and he did panic. But when it came down to it he masturbated her because he wanted to. He wanted to see what it would be like with someone new. Horrible as it turns out - ha! serves him right!

Here is where things get interesting and I do believe him. Once he touched her he started to come out of the fog. He was disgusted by the feel of her as well as the realisation of what he was doing and wanted to stop but carried on for a short while so she wouldn't be offended. Then when he stopped she asked him to get in the back seat. He was shocked cos he really hadn't tried to please her and thought she would get the message he was not enjoying it. He really didn't want to so said he had no condom. He was too chicken to say no and risk offending her so he was hoping this would put her off. She said it's ok and he says by this time he had realised he had ruined our marriage so he may as well do what she wanted and get out of there and at least keep her happy cos he had lost me. He struggled to do it and stopped after seconds. He says it really hit him what he was doing as he did it and he couldn't carry on no matter what. He said it felt horrible and he felt horrible for doing it.

After that he hated her and himself and spent the next 3 wk trying to get rid of her without her telling me. He was not thinking clearly at all.

*Short version, he found her 'attractive enough' loved the attention and when she made moves on him he was happy to take whatever she offered even turning EA to PA. He thought he wanted a PA until he actually touched her bits then he woke up with a start. He wanted her til he got her.

[This message edited by olwen at 11:30 AM, November 3rd (Sunday)]

There is a lot of stuff in there I really didn't want to hear so I am assuming it's the truth. He says he had forgotten some things and refused to accept others. He agreed with my version of events but was adamant he didn't find her too attractive to resist or that he wanted sex when it actually happened. His reaction in the car fits with the H I know. Living in fantasy land wanting things to be how they were when he was young with no responsibilities but when he gets what he wants he finds he doesn't actually want it.

I call midlife crisis as well as changing to a new stressful job and dealing with my diagnosis. He has pulled away before when times got very tough. He always wakes up in 2/3 weeks and is horrified. He did it when ds was born and withdrew for two weeks. I threatened to leave him and he was back to his wonderful self. Couldn't help enough and so loving. He did it two years ago when an ex contacted him on facebook. He actually told her he wished he could be with her. Thankfully she brushed him off and he never pursued it.

he has never gone 'looking' for another woman, but he has taken what's on offer and flirted to get compliments.

His bike has gone up for sale and he wants to use the money on IC. I am already in IC for my bipolar.

It's a relief to hear the truth. The emotions surrounding what he was doing seem foggy maybe, but that's probably what happened physically. He was justifying things to himself in order to continue, and he may be diminishing the excitement he felt during, but you know now.

Allow yourself processing time.

Hugs to you.

I asked my fwh about the use of condoms after dday #1 he said he used condoms sometimes.

Didn't make sense that you "sometimes" used condoms and at other times it was not important and it was with the same person!!!

After TT he said if he said he never used condoms it would be worse for me to take.

How I look at if he used condoms is if he took the time to get condoms, or made sure she had condoms the. It was planned. I now know it was never planned. He would get drunk, they would flirt and hang all over him and it would happen....and happen anywhere close by.

That's a really good point. Somewhere in WH's (I have refused to put the W before but am so hurt I feel he now deserves the W) twisted logic saying he didn't have a condom was a half hearted attempt at stopping the sex. He hadn't enjoyed the touching so he didn't want to go further.

It was unplanned and cos she said she couldn't get pregnant and he was besotted with her he didn't believe she could have anything. God they are so thick!

He said cos she went ahead and climbed in the back seat he felt he HAD to. I think he forgot where his brain was in the tidal wave of the ego boost.

So he's saying he stopped the sex before completion? Do you really believe this?? Because honestly, I don't. I hate to say that, but I dont.

My husband never used condoms, but there was still plenty of planning. No condoms don't absolve planning and forethought.

This is going to be very graphic.

Yeah I do - I think. He was very specific from day 1 and the story of the facts has never changed only the fact he did want it when he told me he didn't but felt trapped.

He has described to me exactly how he masturbated her and how they had sex. He told me how she felt and that it was difficult to get in. He didn't want to do it cos masturbating her had turned him off.he says he never got turned on but I don't believe that! I expect he was turned on at the thought but he is so graphic in explaining why it was 'nasty' I have to believe him. he says realisation had kicked in when he touched her so he didn't want to get in the back but thought he had to or she would tell me.

apparently he took his time walking round to back seat as he had to give himself an erection. I told him that was pure evil cos it shows he really tried. He said he struggled and only just got hard enough. Put it in and out 3 times and stopped. He says that's the moment he came out of the fog and he realised what he was doing.

He was squatting in the back foot well of her car (she keeps front seat way forward) and she was reclining like lady muck so he found it painful (bad knees lol) and because of the angle he could hardly get in. She didn't lie down or get on top just reclined. I expect that had something to do with him not enjoying it. Stupid man. I have always wanted sex in a car and I would have been a damn site better! He will never get that now.

For a long time I didn't believe that position would be possible but he was so adamant I can only see it as a farce. It still hurts like hell but imagining them like that seems ridiculous too.

Surely he can't have made all that up? Or am I being a bit dim again?

[This message edited by olwen at 1:52 PM, November 3rd (Sunday)]

I'm not a bloke, but i'd find it hard to believe he managed to think himself into an erection if he really found her such a turn off.

He says he didn't. He took a minute to rub himself. It only half worked apparently.

I don't know if it's possible to do that if you don't want to be doing what you're doing but a male friend told me it was and that he had done it too with girls he had picked up that he didn't really want but that wanted him. The male friend was single at the time.

[This message edited by olwen at 2:17 PM, November 3rd (Sunday)]

I don't know what to believe his story changes all the time and I have had enough. I don't feel I can trust him to tell me the truth.