SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Hello everyone,

I need help making sense of my situation.

we have been married for 13 years, we are both professional and have very busy lifestyle and raising two kids but we were doing fine.

until I found out that my wife was in a relationship with another man. she always refer to him as "a very good friend". he was her classmate during her masters.

they haven't been in contact for three years as far as I know. we have had a rough 5 months with our marriage mainly because we are not spending enough time with each other, I was trying my best to be a good husband and meet her emotional needs. hoewever, it was very hard. she became irritated easily, mean sometimes.

anyways, she has this vacation she takes every year alone for a yoga retreat.

so I decided to drop her off to the airport and help her with the check in process. after I made sure she passed security I saw this guy who looks like the guy she knew from college. that's when I became very suspicious.

I called my wife to tell her I saw a guy who looks like him and she denied knowing anything.

I started to become a little paranoid. luckily I had his phone number, so I called him from a pay phone just before the take off and during take off and landing of my wife. and his phone was off during my wife's flight and on when she landed.

now i'm going crazy.

I checked my wife's emails and I see that she forwarded the airlines tickets to his email. then I went to the guys house just to check if he is there and his younger sister told me he is travelling to the same place my wife is going.

I was so in shock I couldn't believe what's happening so I called my wife and she was so calm and denied that she is meeting him and that she hadn't been in contact with him for months.

I couldn't sleep that night and suddenly I remembered her phone number is under my name so I pulled her call history online and found out she has been calling him for hours in the past 3 months. 2 hours the day before her trip.

anyways, I confronted her that night and told her everything, she couldn't deny anymore. she flew back the next day. was very remorseful and sorry.

we were both in bad shape and we vowed to be honest from now own. she told me that he is a good friend and he was supporting her during her depressive phase for the last 3 months.

and that although he was in the same resort she was supposed to be alone and that she may meet him for dinner occasionally and maybe snorkel together. but nothing more than that.

we are in good terms now and surviving.

but I get these flash backs of my horrible experience and panic attacks that I can't sleep. and I find it very hard to trust her. although she has been very good so far.

I keep thinking what if I didn't know about this, what would have happened. what kind of relationship she was having with him? was there anything more than what she is telling me? should she continue talking to him?

She sure went to a great deal of trouble to keep an innocent friendship and some snorkeling hidden, didn't she?

Her story doesn't pass the sniff test, and while I truly do understand why you'd want to believe she's telling the truth, it's just too far-fetched.

Consider booking a polygraph test. I think you'll find this is probably a full-blown affair which has been going on for a long time.

I'm sorry.

In the meantime, check out The Healing Library and read through some of the articles you find there. You're going to want to treat yourself with kindness and care while you're getting to the bottom of all this.

I'm sorry you're here. I'm also sorry but you can't be on good terms when your wife is lying to you about the extent of her affair. You really think she did all that lying, right up until you had concrete proof, because she was just snorkeling and having a few dinners while he was just a shoulder to cry on and that was it???

The biggest mistake you can make my friend is rugsweeping/putting your head in the sand. Do you know how many years this has been going on?? Do you even know if he's the only one she's done this with?? Because it sounds like you didn't suspect anything until her boyfriend slipped up at the airport and showed his face.

I'm not sure when your D-Day was but it sounds like it's a bit too early for you to be diving into fixing the marriage. Especially with all the questions that you do have and with your wife still lying to you.

As for your last question, no. Your wife cannot continue to talk to the man she's been meeting behind your back for who knows how long under the guise of a "yoga retreat". That relationship ended the minute you found out the extent of it. There should not be any communication between the two of them again, period. That includes "closure".

Your wife should be in counseling to figure out why she thought this was okay to begin with. She also needs to figure out how to keep from doing this again.

As for yourself I think you need to take a deep breath. You don't need to decide on anything right now, and if all of this has happened recently I'd recommend against it anyway.

Stick around, you'll get good advice and a lot of support. Again sorry you're here.

Hi Recoveringheart

I'm not surprised you sought out this forum, sorry you felt the need to, happy you found this place.

You'll get a lot of advice on this site, much sympathetic and helpful, some quite tough and designed to shake you up. It's likely you need both.

I'm sorry to say that while your wife's explanation is not impossible, it is highly improbable to say the least. Her account is full of holes and the words do not match her actions.

My story had quite a few parallels and a similar context (wife, kids, rocky patch), although I found out 18 months after a one year EA/PA had fizzled out.

The long and short of it is that she arranged to travel with another man to a new location to be together for several days without telling you and when initially confronted she gaslighted. When discovered she has admitted to the 'least worst' version of events she can get away with.

Not one word of it rings true.

You guys may well have been going through a rough patch but she's used that to justify her relationship with this new guy, which is why she's been so ratty with you - it reinforces the "he doesn't care, I deserve more" etc narrative she's been telling herself.

This is all straight out of the cheater's handbook.

Unfortunately, as the BS what we find out first and what is admitted to are very rarely the real story. You need to get digging through calls, social media, emails etc and look for any other evidence or weekends away or whatever. Find out what you can and then push her for a proper explanation.

Put simply, you need to find out what you are dealing with, then you can decide how best to deal with it.

Does he have a wife/partner? If so, you need to tell them. And have you insisted she go No Contact with him and delete all social media etc connections with him?

The latter is essential and if she protests it is a clear indication of deeper links.

Sorry to be the bearer of pessimistic news, unfortunately it is the result of the experience gained personally and through these forums.

And of course, good luck and keep well and safe.

I pulled her call history online and found out she has been calling him for hours in the past 3 months. 2 hours the day before her trip.

RH,

Based on the duration/frequency of their calls and their opportunity for contact, there's no way you should reasonably accept her story about it not being physical. It's possible that is was only an EA, but not likely.

Ask her if she's willing to take a polygraph and gauge her reaction. If she's agrees, proceed. If she doesn't agree; well then you've got your answer.

I just know that if I were in your shoes, I'd have to know what I was trying to forgive.

Sorry you're here.

You’ve already been betrayed by her secretly going on a trip with another man, now the only question was how deeply you were betrayed. Her story is so fishy that you need to get tested for STDs. I’m sorry, you didn’t deserve this.

Recoveringheart,

You did the classic rugsweep with your wife breathing easy now that you have taken her back and now that she can push the affair underground but keep it going.

You have just barely scratched the surface of what is going on here.

Please re-read your story and consider if I or someone else gave you the snorkel and dinner line that you got, what would you tell us ?

Polygraph is a must IMO and an immediate consequence. She knows that she is under the gun.It sounds like you make $$. PI time as well.

While I know you say things are better, I would consider some form of a 180 which will put you in control of yourself and not reliant on her and can lessen the blow when you find out she is still cheating. Because without consequence, there is no motivation for her to stop.

Why would she think it's ok to be taking trips with this other asshat while you stay home and play Dad ? She betrayed your kids too in this.

If she has any upcoming trips alone, she needs to cancel those

One big poly question is if this guy has been with her on the previous trips or not

I am sorry for the pain and trauma your spouses's actions have caused. I wish to welcome you to Surviving Infidelity (SI). We will be with you as you navigate through the mire of infidelity. This will be a long post.

First, make a copy of all evidence and secure it where your wife cannot get to it.

Managing your SI experience:

Please utilize and read in The Healing Library, yellow box upper left. We often use abbreviations. They are found here. There are the betrayed spouse (BS) FAQ, the wayward spouse (WS) one who commits adultery or cheats FAQ, Abbreviations, Articles (mostly on-line), Books (mostly available on Amazon or your favorite bookseller).

Start with Articles with titles that seem to best apply to your situation and then go back and at least skim most of the other articles.

Also read the Guidelines. They are designed to keep this a place for healing as we navigate out of infidelity.

I suggest you stay out of the wayward forum for awhile. It can be difficult or cause triggers for a newly BS to read as they try to heal.

You are going to get a variety of replies here that fit your situation and some that may not. SI motto - "take what you need and leave the rest."

Note: what you need...may not be what you want.

What You're Experiencing:

Likely you are in some amount of shock and disbelief. You are likely to be riding The Emotional Rollercoaser, where you go from anger to despair to love to confusion to crying to ... all in the space of minutes. You might think that you are crazy, or getting there. This is all normal.

You need to get some control back in your life, and you need to be at least minimally healthy to do so. Here's how to start:

Drink - water or juice. I suggest no alcohol for a while because that is a depressant and you do not need any more of that right now. Also, alcohol lowers inhibitions. You might start throwing things, screaming and cursing, or become violent. Later you may regret the action you would not do if sober.

Sleep - what is that? Catnaps are helpful. A full night's sleep might be out of the question for you right now, but any sleep helps. Over-the-counter supplements may help you to be tired without completely knocking you out. See a medical provider if problems develop.

Eat - regular meals if you can. If you can't, then snack on veggies and fruits throughout the day. Smoothies are good. Supplements, shakes, and similar products can help. Many of us went on "The Infidelity Diet." You may lose weight from not eating and stress.

Exercise - I know, right? But - some form of exercise (the harder the better) can help release the stress and it gets those exercising hormones and brain chemicals released that help you to feel better.

Doctors can help with any and all of the above. Don't be afraid to tell them exactly what's going on because they've seen it all before.

There is the risk of STDs from your W(ayward) W(ife)'s infidelity. We do not know where she or the other man has been. You both need to be tested. At this point nobody knows what she has been up to.

Resposibility for infidelity:

Your wayward wife made many decisions and executed a host of acts to arrange the meeting to be with the other man. Her decision to have an A(ffair) or cheat is 100% on her. It doesn't matter what the state of the M(arriage) was, you were not consulted. Accept no blame or rationale for her actions. She did it. She owns it. You had no say. She had choices, as did (and do) you.

You didn't choose to have an A and you were in the same M as she was.

If she tries to tell you differently, that's "blameshifting" and blameshifting is asinine.

Which leads us to this:

Watch out for....

blameshifting - "I had an A because you forced me into it!" You didn't trip her so that she fell onto a penis. You did not force her to contact him and arrange to meet on the trip. Suggesting that you "forced" her to do this is ludicrous.

gaslighting - from the play, "Gaslight". This is where she tries to convince you that what you have seen, heard, or experienced did not in fact happen. It is a deflection and it is done with the intent of leaving you questioning whether or not you can trust yourself. She stating she cheated to with him to help her depression or mood is an example of this. It is also a form of blameshifting. There is nothing noble about her actions and infidelity never improves a relationship. This is utter nonsense.

rugsweeping - don't sweep this under the rug. Things swept under the rug build in pressure until one day they erupt violently out from under the rug blowing everything to hell. Resentment from rug sweeping is often fatal to marriages. Without doing the work her desire and ability to cheat has not been remedied.

trickle truth (TT) - where her story is "it was we were only going to meet for dinner, I swear on the grave of my dear mother" on Monday and two weeks later you dig more and get, "well, I have screwed him every year for the past 5 years at least 2 to 4 times per year. During the yoga trip we would have had sex once or twice a day if you had not caught us. But that's all, I swear!"

Minimization - this behavior is not that bad. It was just about me needing help. We did not have sex. You know everything are classic examples.

Cognitive Dissonance and Failure to acknowledge the truth-

Your spouse is engaging in a host of actions to shield herself from the guilt and shame her betrayal should have brought forth. She will lie and then lie some more. This is what cheaters do.

Sugestions:

Believe only 50% of what you see and 0% of what she says. She has already blown her credibility and most cheaters lie to cover themselves.

You must seize the narrative and establish control in your life. For one thing, when your WS had control she really screwed that up. You need to slow down and think logically if possible.

Give yourself time.

Infidelity is often fatal to marriages. But it does not have to be. Some of us have reconciled after adultery and others have divorced. Which path you choose is up to you. Much depends upon what you want and whether or not your wife can do the work to become a safe spouse and is worthy of reconciliation.

Please see an attorney to determine your options.

We will be with you as you journey out of infidelity.

I'm sorry to meet you, glad that you found us.

Does the OM have a wife or SO. You need to contact her immediately without alerting your wife.

Your wife is lying to you. She had an affair, she had sex with him. A lot. And was planning on more.

If she stays in contact with him the affair will continue. Maybe it will cool off for a while until your guard is down, then it will resume with better hiding.

She does not need a male friend. She needs a therapist. The relationship with this guy needs to end 100% immediately, forever.

"Depressed" whatever. Yeah, sure. What was happening is that she was cheating on you and feeling guilty. Maybe she's in love with this guy, and also wants to keep her marriage, and feeling torn. Oh, poor thing. It's of her own making. She should talk to a therapist about her behavior and how it contributed to her depression.

"Rough 5 months" is going to correspond with her spending time with him and not you. Her irritation at you was coming from her behavior outside the marriage, not your behavior inside the marriage.

Ripped posted his usual great advice. Heed his words.

Schedule your STD test asap. Don't have sex with her right now. She will use it to try to win you back. You need to take 10 huge steps back from her and sort out what you know, what you suspect, and figure out what reality is.

Also try to figure out if this is a deal killer for you. You may never be able to get over this, so thinking about that long and hard right now may help guide you on whether you want to choose divorce right away. Trying to forgive and understand your wife may be your go-to mode right now. But that's because you are used to being in a trusting supportive relationship (or so you thought). You need to come to grips with the fact that your wife is not who she presented herself to be. Your new understanding of her may mean that you'll never be able to truly get over this. You also do not HAVE to get over this. There's no rule you have to repair your marriage after infidelity. If you try, it's really really really hard.

Keep posting here and let us know how things are going.

You got and will get many replies revolving around one thing - she is lying about the extent of her affair. That's because many of us lived through the same shit your WW (wayward wife) just served you, and seen the same story repeated again and again. There's even a few threads in General section now concerning mythical Cheater's Handbook - the actions of a cheating spouse appear to follow the same script as if they were following some written rules.

And the story always begins with "He/she's just a friend".

The secrecy, the amount of communication, effort, put into creating time alone - everything points to it being physical affair. I kind of believe that some women might go to such lengths to keep only EA, but I'm absolutely sure that no man will put so much effort (going on the same trip) just "to talk". He went there to fuck your wife and was 100% guaranteed that he will get a lot of it.

There's probably a 1 in 100000 chance that your WW is telling the truth. But you shouldn't rely on it. I know that you probably came here hoping to hear that yes, you are doing great, you can now trust your wife, but I don't know a single poster here who might tell you that. Because we have seen a lot of shit in both our own life and stories here and there are zero indications that your story is different.

So, there are some steps that you need to take.

First - you have to dig for more information. Does your WW has location services turned on on her phone? If yes (and it is Android), check her location history (iPhone users can advice if your WW has iPhone) for suspicious trips (visits to OM's house, hotels (if OM is married), lunch hours in parking lots or secluded areas.

Is she guarding her phone and won't let you see it("protecting her privacy")? Major red flag. Demand she hands it to you right this second. Tell her that refusal to do so automatically means that you would assume she fucked OM for who knows how long. If she hands you her phone, I would suggest running recovery software on it, to uncover deleted texts.

Many members found polygraphs quite useful.

Second - go and get STD tests done. Your WW needs to do the same. Do not have sex until you personally see her (clean) results. This will also help drive home seriousness of situation for her.

Third - it probably sounds scary, but it would be good if you consulted a divorce lawyer, if only to get information where you would stand in case you divorce (D).

Fourth - DO NOT REVEAL YOUR EVIDENCE and methods of discovery. It is actually very difficult to do - it is mind boggling how cheaters deny everything - you know, they know that you know and they still deny everything, hoping that somehow they will be able to gaslight you and get away clean (and many times they actually succeed).

And sad welcome to the club nobody wanted to join :(

Your wife is minimising. She only told you a little because she was busted. You did well to find up she was up to no good.

If you want to reconcile then she will habe to be open and honest about everything. You should explain to her that you are willing to reconcile but that you don’t believe her story. If she is confident that her story is true then ask her to sit a polygraph test to put your mind at ease. Explain to her that you require a polygraph because of all of the lies she has been telling and how convincing she has been.

I'm very sorry that you find yourself here. It sucks. We all know how much it sucks.

I'm going to be blunt...you know that she is lieing to you. Adults don't take trips away together to exotic locations to just hang out and be buddies. They're not 12 year olds traveling with parents. Once you confront her more firmly, she'll likely try to get you to believe that:

- they only held hands

Then when pressed, it'll become:

- they only kissed once

Then when pressed more, it'll become:

- they had some heavy petting, but nothing more

Then when pressed even more, it'll become:

- they had sex once but (pick one)

A) he had ED and couldn't perform

B) she stopped it after two minutes, neither of them finished.

Deep down,you know what happened on this trip. And given the gaslighting you've been given, and your acceptance of it, it's likely still going on.

Get a VAR and put it in her car. You'll know everything reeeeeeally quick like.

[This message edited by GoldenR at 1:51 PM, August 28th (Tuesday)]

excellent post by GoldenR. Spot on and that's the pattern.

That is why your current 'rugsweeping' won't work, Recovering

Your wife admitted to only what you had already proven. I'm sorry, but the chances are great that there is much more.

Those 5 months of trouble are most likely the start of the affair. The WS detaching and blame shifting onto bs is normal - after all if you are a bad guy that makes her the good guy and thus what she is doing isn't bad. Honestly, that's the average cheaters chain of thought.

How far away does he live? How possible is that they could see each other? Generally people in an affair have sex - unless they can't (locations far apart for instance and even then you'd be shocked at the lengths they will go to).

Is he married? If so expose to his wife. Sunlight kills affairs.

As to should they remain in contact? Only if you want the affair to continue and the damage to you and your m to get worse. No contact is a must. The common saying is that as long as they are in contact the affair continues.

[This message edited by william at 2:01 PM, August 28th (Tuesday)]

I am so sorry you're going through this. There is not much to add to what was said. Sadly, we have gone through this ourselves. You need to understand that this is not your fault. She cheated. And yes, I do believe she was having an affair.

I bet all corespondence has been deleted. She will leave no proof. My wife went to Miami with her OM. Girls trip I was told. Guard yourself.

[This message edited by WilliamM at 2:04 PM, August 28th (Tuesday)]

"She has this vacation she takes alone every year".

Sorry you're here but this (affair) has been going on a long time.

Your WW is lying to you big time, of course she's been having an A, based on your story seems it has been going on for quite some time, rule of thumb is if they have time alone it's most likely a PA (sex, kissing, groping, bj's etc.) and yes they've been having lots of sex, it's at least an EA (emotional affair) and if it wasn't yet a PA it became one that night at the hotel. You need to inform of the A to OBS (if any) without warning, also Expose her to close family and friends and tell them your wife has been seeing OM behind your back and went on a secret vacation with him.

Your WW is NOT remorseful, she just regret being caught, she deliberately planned this sex vacation. If there's any chance at reconciliation, she needs to give you FULL access to her phone, passwords and all email accounts, there's no such a thing as privacy in a marriage other than the toilet, and if there ever was any, she lost any right to it the second she began talking and dating another man behind your back, she's a proven liar and a cheater, you need to DEMAMD NC FOREVER, she also needs to email a NC letter to OM (approve by you) you need to read it and see her hit send, after this NC FOREVER no questions asked, if she refuses to stop contact with OM you know the A will continue, file for D without warning (you can stop it at any time if she shows true remorse and agrees to NC FOREVER).

Contact a divorce attorney to see what D would look like, if you decide to R, DEMAND she signs a Postnup with an infidelity clause in your favor, if she cheats again in the future, you take her to the cleaners, you would get most assets and gain full custody of the children.

If you need to retrive deleted texts and social media posts and emails between them download an app called Dr Fone, also get a VAR and a GPS and place it under her car seat, after you do this demand she takes a polygraph, if you have the resources, hire a PI ahd haver her followed, Keep posting.

[This message edited by Buster123 at 3:02 PM, August 28th (Tuesday)]

What you attribute to 'tough' times was probably instigated by the presence of the OM in her life.

Every marriage has tough times and it's never appropriate to go outside a marriage to fix a marriage. You are not in any way responsible for her decision to cheat.

Her ongoing relationship with the OM, vacation plans, lies and deceptions have cumulatively placed the burden of proof entirely on her. She has placed herself in a position where she has to prove that she didn't fuck him. Her empty words (tears,begging, promising) and disclaimers don't out weight the evidence against her.

Based on the experience of those that walked this path before you, your best strategy is to go 180. Take a few months to decide on R or D. Insist on a time line of full disclosure backed up by a polygraph test.

Unfortunately, based on what you know now, you'll need to determine if she kissed him back in grad school.