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I would like to know if waywards knew what they lost / killed at the time they crossed the line. I found out about my wifes affair 20 years after the fact. I thought that we had a perfect marriage. On DDay my marriage as I knew it was killed. I wonder if my wife knew at some point before or during the affair that she was throwing me and our marriage into the trash? Was there clarity for her that our marriage was forever changed when she was doing it.

She and I had different marriages after she crossed the line. We had the same marriage, we were on the same page before the affair. Do waywards feel that the marriage is changed? There was an innocence, a specialness that a marriage can only have once, and now it is gone for ever. It is not coming back. Do waywards feel the loss of that at a certain line crossing?

One thing is for sure, we are on the same page and in the same shitty marriage now. For me there was a 20 year lie in our marriage. Finding out the truth nearly killed me.

[This message edited by Jimmy1962 at 1:30 PM, April 1st (Monday)]

I'd love to know this too.

I can’t speak for a wayward but I would have to guess it would be a no, bec if they understood the magnitude of what they were doing I don’t think they could go through with it. I often grapple with this too and you are right nothing is ever the same you re evaluate the whole time period. I went through photos emails and texts, it was all there clear as day I remember having fights where I full on called him out and think how stupid I must have been. I find it difficult to live with how much he risked for nothing, and forever it’s tarnished. 😭

For me, there was not a clarity of the negative impacts.

I knew my husband would be upset if he found out.

I didn't intend on him finding out.

I wasn't thinking far enough ahead into the future or about consequences.

It's so very hard to try to put yourself in their shoes. Did they think? No. Did they care? No. This is evident in so many things for me. Their convos, in which OW refused to "date" him while we were seperated because there's too many emotions and things to consider. Really? You didn't think of that when you were sending my husband your naked pics? You thought you two would just go back to a platonic friendship and stil work together? Their thinking is seriously flawed during this time. I truly believe my WH saw our marriage never getting better. It was easier to accept this new form of easy, exciting love instead of working hard to repair what was broken. As soon as he started to really give our marriage a chance, and realized he could rediscover the feelings he had for me and we could work to improve, he no longer gave a shit about her.

Mine saw the magnitude of what he did (I ended up being hospitalized for suicide attempt and suicide ideation) and he STILL chose to continue the A while putting me through False R.

I will never be able to wrap my mind around this and I am a wayward myself... my mindset at the time of my RA was that I was hoping I would ruin my M

This is a common question here. I have read about everywhere, on General, on the Wayward Section, on the thread of BS questions for WS, even on the FAQ on the Library . In almost all of the sections have at least many threads where they talk about what may have going on the minds of a WS during the A.

Essentially, they don't measure consequences. Simply put, they don't think they'll get caught.

And inside those threads you learn the words that, for me, the first time I read about them, changed the way I thought about an A:

Compartmentalization

Fog

Limerance

Do a site search from Google (is the way I've been using these months) for these terms, and start reading threads and threads and threads about them, and you'll understand and see. WS here had been sincere and tell their stories about how they literally blocked from their minds the consequences. I've learned A LOT from reading, and I think it helped me not drowning in the seas of “why, why, why” about the A.

For me, there was not a clarity of the negative impacts.

I knew my husband would be upset if he found out.

I didn't intend on him finding out.

I wasn't thinking far enough ahead into the future or about consequences.

I don't think there is any other WW response that would answer more specifically and clearly and say more than five long paragraphs could say.

It think for the vast majority of WW's, what they thought fits somewhere in these four sentences.

I have a friend who got into an accident while texting and driving. The person in the car that she hit was permanently injured. Her entire life has changed- she had to serve time in jail, she was sued and will financially be paying off her debts for a long time. And she will have to live with the knowledge forever that her selfish, stupid decision really hurt someone. She can't take that back.

At the time she was in the car, did she know that texting and driving is dangerous? Yeah. She was aware that it's not something anyone should do, and that it can cause a car accident.

But she didn't think it would happen to her.

She had a completely false sense of control over the situation.

She wasn't thinking about potential long term consequences at all. She was thinking very much in the moment.

She was aware that texting and driving could cause an accident. How much of an impact it would have on her life was not something she was aware of or prepared for at all.

Having an affair is different in that there is a ton of lying, covering up, manipulating, etc happening.

But I would describe the feeling of knowing that it's a bad choice and doing it anyway as very similar to the analogy.

Nobody enters an affair with a pro and con list.

Nobody is carefully evaluating the potential consequences.

Nobody is thinking that they are going to get caught.

Nobody is thinking that the fall out will be as devastating and permanent as it is (there is a thought that "my spouse will be mad if they found out" but not a real realization that the marriage will never be the same).

I did not make myself clear. Did you know when you killed the marriage? When I realized the affair happened, that is when the marriage died for me. Did you cross a line and realize that you forever changed the marriage? Did you know that the "special" was gone?

Compartmentalization

Fog

Limerance

Do a site search from Google (is the way I've been using these months) for these terms, and start reading threads and threads and threads about them, and you'll understand and see. WS here had been sincere and tell their stories about how they literally blocked from their minds the consequences.

The thing is, if that were 100% true, then why'd they hide the A?

Answer: they didn't want to be caught bc there would be consequences

Every prospective WS hits a point where they ask themselves if the juice is going to be with the squeeze. For those that go thru with it, the answer is yes.

[This message edited by GoldenR at 5:44 PM, April 1st (Monday)]

Did you cross a line and realize that you forever changed the marriage?

After the first time I slept with someone else, I remember feeling very much like, "I can't undo this," on the way home.

I didn't think of things in terms of killing the marriage, however.

The second things were physical, it changed the way I saw myself.

Prior to the A, I didn't think of myself as someone who would ever have an A. I had been cheated on in previous relationships. My dad cheated on my mom when I was growing up. I thought I was incapable of doing that.

When driving home, this wave of, "Oh shit, I just did this," feeling crossed my mind. I had this distinct awareness that no matter what, I am a WS.

I wasn't planning for BH to ever find out, but I still knew that I was someone else entirely.

That feeling was quickly compartmentalized, and I definitely did some mental gymnastics to justify it.

I didn't realize while the A was happening that the marriage itself would forever be changed because I didn't intend for him to ever find out.

Nobody enters an affair with a pro and con list.

Nobody is carefully evaluating the potential consequences.

I know, first hand, that list is not "nobody". In fact, I'm not sure I know anyone who's had an A who didn't do a pretty detailed cost/benefit analysis first. Now, were they comparing the costs/benefits with their finger on the scale? Oh hell yeah they were. But this "swept up in it" A that seems so common here, I've never seen it in person. What I see in person is a calculated and well reasoned (if horribly immoral) action that's intended to get them something they want. Nobody runs an "accidental con", (well, almost nobody), and the men I know who have A's are, universally, running a con job. Lie to get what you want, and they are well aware of what they are doing and what they are after. At least when it's "just the guys around", that's the story that they tell.

Nobody is thinking that they are going to get caught.

Nobody is thinking that the fall out will be as devastating and permanent as it is (there is a thought that "my spouse will be mad if they found out" but not a real realization that the marriage will never be the same).

Both of these I agree with. I've seen this rationalization first hand; "what she doesn't know won't hurt her" and "she doesn't sleep with me anyway, what difference would it make to her". Almost universally these appear at some point when a guy is talking to me about his AP.

Jimmy,

I never felt the sense of “special” you’re talking about in my marriage in the first place. So, no, I never felt it disappear because it was never there.

Did you cross a line and realize that you forever changed the marriage? Did you know that the "special" was gone?

I know my H compartmentalisedit so that in his head theaffair was very seperate from our marriage. I know he had no idea he destroyed the 'special' as he was totally horrified when I pointed that out to him soon after DDay. He destroyed so much 'special' :-( Took away so many things I held in my heart as 'ours'.

He 100% did not think of the consequences. His words 'If I thought about that our about you I could never have done whatI did'. He really thought he'd take the secret to his grave and that we would be ok.

Thing is he was so nasty throughout his affair I thought I had 'lost him' so in effect he killed the special but I had just thought it was me.I thought he'd fallen out of love with me and was resenting me for the life he had. All became clear when I found out. It helped him justify the affair to himself.

He still struggles with the fact he broke our wedding vows. Part of him win't accept that They are now broken and don't mean what they did.

If he ever had a second affair? It would be different. He would be doing it knowing exactly what 'special' he was erasing.

@Jimmy1962

I know what you mean about the marriage being “special.”

It is clearly not something that everyone, or many even, experience. But clearly some do, such as you and I.

My WW certainly does not comprehend the magnitude of what she destroyed by committing adultery and killing our marriage.

Not only did I, and she, see that we had something special. Many many others did as well. However, there were some who noticed serious flaws in my WW.

In any case, I think that whatever drives the WS to cheat, also causes them to disassociate from anything good or special in the marriage. Otherwise, if the felt happy within themselves, and valued the M, they would have never thrown it away or even risk losing it.

Some WS’s might someday realize what they threw away. They threw away the world for a pretty little thing. I wouldn’t count on them ever realizing it.

After the first time I slept with someone else, I remember feeling very much like, "I can't undo this," on the way home.

HeartBreaker11, sorry if this is out of line but you stated how you were feeling and what you were thinking just after the first time you slept with someone else.

Do you remember if you felt or thought anything about your marriage, or your husband, or yourself in the time just before the first time you slept with someone else?

As a BS, what a WS is thinking in, say, the hour or so just before the first time they sleep with someone else is IMHO very interesting and could really help BS's understanding of what happened.

Nobody enters an affair with a pro and con list.

Nobody is carefully evaluating the potential consequences.

I know, first hand, that list is not "nobody". In fact, I'm not sure I know anyone who's had an A who didn't do a pretty detailed cost/benefit analysis first.

I guess I shouldn't speak for everybody.

For me, I was not carefully analyzing costs at all.

It was a skewed mental "list" in which the benefits were me getting what I wanted at the time, and the cost of my husband being upset was seen as a hypothetical because I didn't think he would find out.

But this "swept up in it" A that seems so common here, I've never seen it in person. What I see in person is a calculated and well reasoned (if horribly immoral) action that's intended to get them something they want.

I wouldn't personally describe my A as something I was "swept up" into.

It was a series of conscious choices I made, and continued to make by justifying, compartmentalizing, blame shifting, and being selfish.

I think when people say that, they intend to mean that they didn't wake up randomly one morning and say, "Hey, I think I'm going to start an affair today! Great idea." It's usually more subtle than that, and the WS is doing a great deal of lying to and manipulating themselves as well as their spouse.

Do you remember if you felt or thought anything about your marriage, or your husband, or yourself in the time just before the first time you slept with someone else?

That's a fair question.

TBH, I wasn't thinking about my husband or my marriage at all in the hour just before sleeping with the OM.

I did have a flash feeling of "What if I get to the bar we are meeting at and someone there knows me?" prior to the first time I met up with an OM (it was an ONS with someone I met on tinder).

I compartmentalized during the date and completely didn't think about my husband.

I liked the way OM looked at me. I could tell that he was attracted to me. It had been a really long time since I felt like someone was looking at me that way.

I hadn't been on a date in years. It felt exciting. I have always liked dating. I missed it while I was married.

I enjoyed being out of the house. My husband and I were very much homebodies. When I asked for date nights, my husband didn't want to leave the house.

I was turned on. I felt wanted. I felt sexy.

I explained it to my WS like this: I used to be in drama class in HS and was in one of the school plays.

I could be having a totally shit day, but when I was on stage and rehearsing, it was like a break from my life. Whatever I was feeling prior to rehearsal went out the window, and I got wrapped up in being my character.

Then, when rehearsal was over, it was back to my real life.

When I was with the OM and cheating, I very much compartmentalized in a similar way. I put my phone in my purse, I put on an act, and got wrapped up in this other life entirely. And then I would get dressed, and it was stage lights off and back to my marriage and the ins and outs of my day to day life.

I'm sorry if this isn't helpful at all.

Some WS’s might someday realize what they threw away. They threw away the world for a pretty little thing. I wouldn’t count on them ever realizing it.

A pretty little thing that many WS's will claim they didn't even want (sex). Or a pretty little thing that they never even got (love). It's amazing really, because as others have said, the price is SO HIGH, you better REALLY like what you're getting. But, then, after the A, most will say "I didn't really like it". It's either the most common/biggest lie in the book and/or a lot of WS's are really mentally unstable at the time of the A.

Trust me, I know people who get what they want from an A. It's still not worth the price, they still bemoan it and say "I was so stupid", but they did get what they wanted (or claim to have wanted). It's the one's who don't even want the thing that you're most likely to get from the A that really boggle the mind. You gave up all the good things between us for something that you didn't even want?? What kind of sick is that, and how do I avoid getting it!