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Why do you assume the sympathy for your wife is fake? From what I've seen on here, betrayed spouses sympathize and empathize quite a bit for fellow betrayed spouses.

If you look around, there's more than one current thread talking about a ws who chooses to continue to lie and keep the affair from their spouse. It would seem the vast majority agree the BS deserves to know.

And that makes you angry, because it's something you refuse to do.

Do you like and respect your wife? Do you think she's a bad mother? I ask, because after being told you should confess for several months, you then told people it was because your child is fragile. Do you think your wife doesn't know that? Do you think your wife won't do everything possible to protect her child?

It would appear you don't. You don't trust her with the truth,or that she won't protect the child. Yet, the other woman knows. You're trusting the other woman to not tell your wife. Her guilt may get the best of her eventually. You're trusting her that it won't.

You're attempting to rebuild on a bed of lies. You say you're ok with that. Why?

As to the question you asked I've reconciled because I love my spouse,my family,and my life. I wasn't going to give all that up because he had a ONS, and didn't keep his dick in his pants.

Nothing I said was meant to upset you. I do think you don't want to be a man who cheats on his wife. You seem to want to be a better man. The good people here are just trying to get you to understand a good man doesn't lie.

And,yes, your wife had my utmost sympathy and empathy.

I read this post and the first thing I thought was, maybe you need good insight why BS stay with their WS because maybe one day you would what to tell your W the truth and need to know why they stay. To have hope your W would feel the same way if you ever do tell her.

Just because his on here today, still not wanting to tell his W the truth don't mean down the road he would want to do that later. Instead of bashing him over and over on why his this horrible, awful person for not telling, maybe for once everyone give him good insight why telling his W the truth is a good thing, or if you can't don't reply to the thread anymore.

Everyone wants to argue the fact his not in true R, which I don't think is true R myself but his on here trying to get insight about why BS want to R with their WS, hoping she would feel the same way, overall it's not his choice if he did tell her but maybe encourage him a little why this is still a good thing. Yes a lot of you have, but his still scared to do.

It takes a lot of guts to tell your BS the truth on something like this, trust me I know, I did it myself. I don't know how many WS on here who actually told their BS the truth, I don't think a lot of them have so why judge someone for something that you didn't have the guts to do yourself? I know a lot of BS on here probably would of want their WS to tell them the truth themselves, but didn't. Maybe that's why you keep hounding him to tell his wife the truth.

His here today, trying to get good insight, maybe give him hope and the reasons why telling is good and the encouragement he needs fearing maybe if he did tell his wife would leave him. No it's not his choice overall to R if his wife don't want too, but we all need good reason on why telling the truth is still good.

One thing we all should learn by now is too never say never right? Oh he will never tell is wife the truth...we don't know that, heck he probably don't know that for himself.

FF4152, I think it good to keep posting and try to grow and maybe one day you can tell your wife the truth. No one on here is walking in your shoes so its just so easy for them to give there opinion on something we don't know what's going on behind close doors. Your wife could be in already in depression bc of the issues you guys been having with your kid. And at this moment you could feel like it would be adding fuel to the fire to your wife's life.

HellFire

Why do you assume the sympathy for your wife is fake? From what I've seen on here, betrayed spouses sympathize and empathize quite a bit for fellow betrayed spouses.

That was possibly an unfair statement to steadychevy; I do question the motives of someone who attacks me so I will stand by my statements to him.

I can certainly agree that BS can and do sympathize with other BS and that it is not fake.

I ask, because after being told you should confess for several months, you then told people it was because your child is fragile.

I think I've been pretty consistent in my reasons for not disclosing. It is true that I didn't bring my child into the equation on SI because I really didn't think it was anyone's business that my child attempted suicide. But it has been a big reason for my taking the path that I'm on now.

Do you like and respect your wife? Do you think she's a bad mother? Do you think your wife doesn't know that? Do you think your wife won't do everything possible to protect her child?

I actually think she is a great mother. But it's clear that no parent can protect their child from something like this no matter how vigilant they are. Aside from my wife almost losing her child, she also lost a very close family member recently. That is the reason for my silence.

Yet, the other woman knows. You're trusting the other woman to not tell your wife. Her guilt may get the best of her eventually. You're trusting her that it won't.

I'm not concerned about my AP having ANY GUILT over this. So I highly doubt she would do it for any kind of altruistic reason. That being said, I do struggle with the reality that she could blow up my families life with a simple text/phone call.

You're attempting to rebuild on a bed of lies. You say you're ok with that. Why?

I'm actually not ok with it but it's the only path I see available to me.

Nothing I said was meant to upset you.

It didn't. I do not view people disagreeing with me as an attack. On a public forum, you are going to always find differences of opinion. There wouldn't be much value in SI if people didn't hold my feet to the fire. As long as do it in a respectful manner (as you did), I'm ok with it.

You should maybe focus on why you wouldn't give that type of grace if your wife cheated on you. Then find your answer and work on that level of empathy. The empathy depends upon what you lack. Is it pain? Is it a control issue? Is it entitlement? My mother holds grudges for any slight. There is no forgiveness. She has two friends. I tolerate her. My sister is estranged. She would rather hold onto her pride than give anyone any grace.

I appreciate your response.

To repeat your own words..'No parent can protect their child from this,no matter how vigilant."

That includes you. Right?

Is this a case of, "I will never confess to my wife" or, " I will eventually confess,but right now is not the time"?

T/J @sewardak, respectfully, I feel wishIcouldfly fully understands trauma. It seems to me that she may have been traumatized and it gives her a unique understanding. I am reading between the lines here, but from her posts, this is what I have gathered. I mean that with all respect to wishicouldfly because I feel she is amazing and has an awesome perspective and conveys her thoughts and insights in an easy to understand way. It seems we may have lost her and that is a shame for SI because I feel she had a lot of hard won wisdom to share. end T/J

I do not view people disagreeing with me as an attack.

^^^This. A thousand times THIS.^^^

ff4152, my FWH is of the same mindset as you. He doesn't feel he would be able to have the same grace for me as I have for him. He doesn't feel he would be able to reconcile. I don't have a problem with that because I feel the natural reaction to infidelity is divorce. He thought if I found out I would divorce him. He fully expected that. He was still willing to take the chance, though, which in retrospect, of course, was not worth it at all. Although he smugly thought I would never find out. Which I wouldn't have but the Zombie/OW had other ideas. Six years after FWH ended the affair, six years after stalking and fishing for both FWH and me, OW decided to blow our marriage up. That is what sociopaths do. Their idea of "winning" is not what most consider winning.

For me, I had to weigh the pros and cons of reconciliation. You know, cost analysis and payoffs. I had to weigh if I would be able to do that without turning my FWH into a whipping boy. And, it couldn't be rugswept. The infidelity had to be dissected. Taken apart and each part had to be looked at under the microscope. Would we be up to the task? Would it be worth it? In my particular case, my FWH seemed like he was up to the task and willing. For me, the pros of keeping our marriage intact outweighed the cons of divorcing.

ETA: BTW, ff1452, my FWH never thought his AP was a sociopath. AP was a good, nice person. Until FWH ended it. Well, actually the mask was getting harder and harder for AP to keep in place. It was slipping and that is actually why he ended it. Too late! Juniour Fatal Attraction"I mean, I'm not gonna be ignored, Dan!" emerged full force. Standing on random street corners that AP knew FWH would pass, sending messages through the radio station AP knew he listened to, practically running him off the road to give him a "hug" alongside the highway, driving drunk through our neighborhood and calling FWH, having random men call me, OW calling me and trying to befriend me (I didn't know this woman was my WH's XAP), inviting me to coffee, trying to set up double dates with my FWH and me with AP and AP's SO. AP was relentless for six years until AP finally told me posing as OW's dead XBH/MM. Anyhoo, really hope that shit don't start for you, MisterSister never thought AP would do this. His was a LTA. He thought he knew AP. He thought they would keep each other's dirty secrets to the day they died. AP...not so much.

[This message edited by SisterMilkshake at 8:08 PM, July 9th (Sunday)]

I do have to add myself I thought my H would of want to continue the D with me . We were already separated, had our own places and had temporary agreement with the children already when I told him. We were taking about getting back together and I wanted to make sure us rebuilding the marriage was not base on a lie with my A.

He could of said no and continue to go his own way but he didn't. It would be so easy for him to do that since we were on the path of D already. I thought he would of not trying to push him away even more but telling the truth at that point was the right thing to do.

I think it's so easy for someone to say that they would do x y z in a situation that they never experienced before. I could probably say I would try to R with my H if the shoe was on the other foot but I couldn't say if it would work out or not bc I wouldn't know myself if it would be too much for me to overcome since I have no idea how's is like to be in my H's shoes.

I was for sure myself that my H would not want to R since he always told me this would be a dealbreaker for him. To this day I am still a little shock his still with me and made that choice to R.

"I read this post and the first thing I thought was, maybe you need good insight why BS stay with their WS"

I wondered the exact same thing. I still do. I'm cautiously optimistic after reading a few responses that appeared really healing.

I have received help from some older members (in length of time here) that has been so supportive. Understanding goes far in helping. Miles.

You, my friend, have no business talking about R. Here's a news flash, the only person your are in R is with yourself. You are a coward and will never know what the "gift" of R feels like.

To answer your original question, mercy. I am not an advocate that R can only happen with forgiveness, or, that you need forgiveness to heal. The only thing I can offer my H right now is time and mercy that may or may not evolve into forgiveness. The compassion needed to offer mercy is not easy, especially during the emotion filled early days. If lies are told after the initial discovery or dday, the task becomes harder and there is another layer of betrayal to work through that could have been avoided.

As someone said, you look at the entire life of the marriage to get an accounting of pluses and minuses. If the A does not wipe out the account you might get a chance at recovery. However, the ability to look at things in a rational way comes much later in the post dday timeline. I could not function early on because the thoughts of the A were with me every minute of everyday for weeks, maybe months. It was a painful, disgusting time that I thought would kill me and I fought for my sanity daily.

I would ask someone in your shoes a similar question. Why stay? Why is it important to you? You love her? The kids?

I don't follow on Wayward side too much yet; but if I understand what I am reading it sounds like you have not told your wife that you had an A? If this is correct, my answer to your question may be complicated. Your wife cannot consider R b/c she doesn't know what you have done. The longer you withhold this information the worse it will be for her.

If I read correctly, you face challenges in your home life with your wife being of a delicate nature and your child possibly suicidal? Sorry if I have the details wrong...No matter how complicated your home life is, you have to figure out a way to confess and confess now.

Most of us BS at some point in our lives (prior to A) said no way would we stay with a cheater. Well that statement goes right out the window once it happens for real. Most of us stay and try to R. The reasons why we choose to stay vary.

I chose R b/c my fWH showed me true remorse from the moment I discovered his A. He was honest from the start. I chose R b/c we have invested 24 years of our lives together. I chose R b/c we have a DS who needs BOTH of his parents full-time. I chose R b/c I love my H and couldn't imagine my life without him in it.

I won't pretend to know you, your wife, or your life. But please, please, please tell your wife about your A. She has to know what you have done. By not telling her, you continue to betray her. Ask any BS and you will find that it isn't the actual sex/relationship that hurts the most, it is the betrayal that hurts the most. If you truly love your wife, then that means your fear of what will happen to YOU, should be irrelevant.

You never know how you will face a situation until you are in that situation.

I have a temper and I am proud of my strength and independence. I always thought I'd be a plate smasher. I was serene as a lake on a windless day when I found out. Shock is a funny thing. The grief and anger and xyz came but in that moment I was the most rational I have ever been.

Now to answer your question OP, I gave my husband the chance to win me back - that's it. A second chance. There is no guarantee it will work but as we had 14 great years together before this shit storm, I thought it was worth a shot to wait and see. Thus far I see him working his ass off, owning his shit, etc. It's really no different than any other marriage in a no-fault state. If I wake up tomorrow and want to I can file for divorce. For me it is worth the risk of losing it all by there being another betrayal to keep our family together.

But that is my story.

But it's clear that no parent can protect their child from something like this no matter how vigilant they are.

There are actually a LOT of people who didn't know their parent had an affair until decades after the fact. There are probably more who never do find out. So it's not as clear as you may suspect.

Hello ff...

I don't need to spend any IC time on this and frankly, this would not be worth my IC time.

The trigger(s) are easy and obvious - someone "in my face" lying to me (and not just me - but all of us) so I call you on it; and the second part (which is worse) watching your lying further victimize vulnerable BSs. Your lies of omission in this setting are dangerous.

If you're so ok w your "FWH" and your situation overall - then have the guts to add the description to your sig line so people know what they're dealing with in your perspective on your posts: "FWH - but I haven't told my BW"

I don't care to read your details but you're something like 8 months out from your decision, right? I am almost three times further out from living a real d-day than you and I don't yet dare call myself Former anything. It's lacks a genuine-ness worthy of so many on here doing the tough work this requires.

Yeah - you're doing your own work I get it and it's hard for everyone so kudos to you. I don't disagree but it is different and you have to be willing to admit that. You should be more forthright about that slight wording variation - cause it's different. Your "former" and my former differ in many very important regards. Labels mean something on SI - in fact they mean a lot.

I do think the spouse that you've betrayed should have a say-so in the matter of former, current or still lying spouse, FWIW. Former comes when you've put in the work - rubber meets the road, eg when have you lost the 20 lbs vs. when you "decided" to diet and exercise or when the scale says you're down 20 lbs?!?

We WWs (also waywards not just wayward wives) are told we are in a fog from the As we have chosen - so yeah, I'm gonna listen to someone seeing/ thinking/hearing more clearly than me - even other SI posters. They're called blind spots for a reason.

This post of yours wreaks of creating havoc and pain to me. It has no real spirit of humility or learning about it. Hear me out - you're coming on here being the BSs worst fear (that they are still being lied to) and acting with your comments and your posts like you're not living the worst lie of all and then you state another of the worst pain for many BSs that YOU WOULD NOT RECONCILE?!?

Ouch - that hurt me.

I'm stopping now and it is for your kid and that situation that sounds quite fragile. I hate that for a kid but since you're at the head of the family making poor decisions now and historically, one can only surmise what else might be going on. You know it's just not a surprise everyone is in crisis. If you start stabilizing the foundation - maybe you'd begin to create a more healthy system for all. That's what reconciliation is.

I have my own issues about this, being triggered, talking directly to one person, etc. so be it. And yes, I could probably chose to ignore you and I may just do that. For now, I'll handle as I see fit or until mods tell me otherwise.

LostHope8008, you have a PM

This is probably going to sound weird, but the main reason I gave my fWH the chance to even talk to me after DDay was that the APs involved were utterly grotesque. If even one of them had been marginally attractive, I'd have seen an attorney immediately and filed for divorce.

Of course, that's not the whole reason. But it put a spoke in the wheel of my flight response. These people were nasty, and I'm not saying that just because they fucked my husband. I'm saying it because these OWs were grossly fat, old, and ugly... and in that order too. Although, I do think that last one was hitting from a little of Column A too.

Upon discovery and in response to my horror, my fWH pointed out that these were "nice people". But even he wasn't buying that, not really. Nice people don't do the kind of things these people did. Nice people don't do the kind of things my fWH did. Broken people do those things.

What I saw, almost immediately, was that he was in trouble. That these disgusting individuals were an outward reflection of his internal self-loathing. Only a person who hated himself would let such nasty creatures defile his person. Affairs are mirrors. What was in his mirror was shocking.

If I had hated him, I'd have left him to it. If I had wanted to punish him, there would have been no better way than to just walk away and allow him to destroy himself. And you know what, for awhile, he'd have been happy with that. Sure, he'd have lost half his net worth and ALL the respect of his family and friends. But for awhile, he'd have been free to revel in his own dirt and rationalizations, happy like a pig in mud. That last OW would have continued to flatter his ego until the hook was set, and then... she'd have treated him like she treated her own BH. There could have been no more fitting punishment.

But meanwhile back at the ranch... I could still SEE that sweet boy I met more than 3 decades ago, underlying the image of this angry, disrespectful, selfish man. And I wasn't willing to allow ANYONE to hurt him, no matter what he had done.

That was the spoke in the wheel, the thing that slowed me down. There's more, of course. Some of it more self-serving.. like my fear that if I didn't work through it and explore my feelings of compassion, I'd become a bitter person. I've seen people do that. It's not a pretty thing. And of course, my fWH had to get his head on right. But overall, that was the first thing I noticed... that he was in trouble, and even though he was lashing out at me, the person he was hurting most was himself.

CTea... that post is beautiful. What a great understanding you have.

To your original question: Because we were BOTH broken people. And now we're both working on ourselves. I've spent my whole life getting into disfunctional relationships, so why not try one where we both recognize the patterns and make an effort to be better. I still don't know if it will work out in the end, but you never know the future. I think it's worth a shot. I wouldn't stay if I didn't see the effort on his part.

Just a question ff4152-

Do you view your wife as a partner or a patient?

FF, the way you framed the question, you imply that R is one sided and entirely up to the BS.

R takes both the BS and the WS.

You're going to get various answers either way.

Perhaps you might considering asking "as a WS, why did you choose to R with your BS?"

Because, sadly, as we all know, not all WS do.

As a WS, would you, FF, choose to R with your BS? Why?

Your answers to that might provide insight into some of the reasons why a BS might do the same too.