SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

She was going to wait until January, but I told her last night that I wouldn't be her plan B and that if she was waiting to move out to spare my feelings to not worry about that

You took control of the situation right there. A great move for getting yourself in the correct head space. The last thing you need is to have her coming and going from your place and having to deal with her daily drama (and she will have drama) .
Now see a few lawyers. Know your rights and know your financials.

If she jumps right in with this guy, she's setting herself up to be dumped and you don't need her coming back with some sob story.

..if I may ask?... How old are you both and at what age did you get married? What brought you two together? Now, after 18 years married, do you share interests and activities that bring excitement and passion to your marriage? Is it time to reassess your sex life with her? Either of you wouldn't be the first spouse who let their sex life get stale or boring... or non-existent??

Sorry you're here... aren't we all..?

smy

The guy is married, but they are currently separated…

That’s the infidelity version of "my dog ate my homework" .

Let her know. If nothing else it might give her the shove she needs to finally realize her marriage is over. What happens in probably 9 out of 10 cases though is the OM comes running home to save his marriage. Either way it’s the right thing to do.

Frankly you don’t need to know if or how physical this is right now. It’s an affair. At the very least it’s an emotional affair, and it’s reached a stage where it’s wrecking your marriage. I believe in guarding one’s words. I would suggest you don’t talk about your marriage being at risk because of your wife’s affair. Instead use the term inappropriate relationship. If asked you can truthfully state that you don’t know if it’s an affair according to the classic definition of that term, but that your wife starts and ends the day texting and communicating with him, keeps it hidden from others (why if it’s only a friendship?), spends time alone with him and that YOU see it as an affair but she denies it’s physical or infidelity.

I also encourage you to be vocal about it. When you talk to your pastor use the wording I suggested. When you tell friends you are divorcing don’t hide the reasons. When asked use the terms "inappropriate relationship with OM". Name him. Make sure they don’t have a place to hide. That her friends ask her why the f@ck she’s sacrificing you for an unstable married man.

At the same time I encourage you to stand firm on the stance that you don’t endorse her infidelity. Like the let’s not wait to January stance. You don’t need to hate her, in fact it’s to be expected that you still love her. Try a statement along these lines:
"Wife. I love you, but I don’t share my wife. You are free to go be with OM even if that inevitably means we divorce. I’m fine with divorce because it beats the feeling I have knowing that my wife is with another man. That feeling can only end with one of two actions: you recommitting to the marriage or you no longer being my wife".

I myself do not subscribe to Affair Bubble dissolution tactics. I believe if a WS is stuck in an Affair Bubble, leave them there and move for a quick and as amicable a divorce as possible. Use "The Fog" to your benefit. She's at a disadvantage while she's in "The Fog".

I myself could never truly reconcile with someone who's using the "Affair Bubble", aka temporary insanity, plea. It's just too lame, pathetic and convenient a foundation to base a lifelong marital true loving devoted relationship upon unless, UNLESS...

They spontaneously break themselves out of the fog when they realize, on their own, that you're about to seriously leave forever.

I don't believe in using manipulative tactics to break them out of "The Fog". Tactics such as informing the world, smear campaigns, tag teaming with OBS, informing employers and clergy or anything else divisive that is meant to alter the natural course of things.

If her love for you has ended, let it die and move on. If she does still have adequate love for you to survive the rigors of true reconciliation and sustain a lifelong devoted true loving marital relationship, she will spontaneously come out of "The Fog" when the D-Papers are served. If it takes more than that...then you will always question the strength of her devotion.

So, I would do the 180, serve her with D-Papers then, after the divorce terms are fully negotiated, tell who you NEED to tell. Nothing creates more acid acrimony than poorly handled publicity. Tell only when the telling will serve you well. Don't tell for justice or retaliation. Don't tell to manipulate.

If, IF she comes running out of "The Fog" after the 180, the shock of served D-Papers and imminent divorce then, THEN you can slow or pause the D-Process and objectively reassess the situation and proceed carefully, methodically at your pace and at your terms.

Then, as part of your terms for R, SHE will notify family, SHE will notify the OBS and SHE will notify anyone else, to your satisfaction, necessary to aid in your healing and earn your trust.

Now, with that said, I will admit that there are rare examples where heavy Affair Bubble breaking tactics were used to facilitate a successful reconciliation. That's because people are infinitely diverse, unique and unpredictable.

I gave my H all the opportunities in the world when "he wasn’t sure he wanted to be married anymore" and he told me ILYBNILWY (I love you but not in love with you).

Six months of letting him live in the Affair fog.

At dday2 when I discovered the affair had continued after he told me he ended it — I didn’t give him 20 seconds. I told him we were finished and I was D him.

I had enough. I had a plan B in place just in case. And dday2 was just in case.

How we reconciled I don’t know but it is nothing short of a miracle.

It is possible your W may snap out if the delusional state of mind and realize the mistake she is making. Bit living as "plan B" is a hell I would not wish on anyone.

I feel this need to know if it was just an EA or if it was a PA…Does it really matter though? Do I push it where she doesn't want to work on our marriage or just let her go and move on with my life?

You want it to not matter because if it matters, and you can only get the information from her, then you’ve given her leverage. What do you think she’ll do with that leverage? I guarantee it won’t be in your interest.

The gator next to the boat is not her affair, it’s her clear desire to leave the marriage. Ignore the affair, focus on the divorce. Frankly, you should be glad she so unequivocally wants a split. Better to rip the bandaid off fast.

Sending strength!

[This message edited by HouseOfPlane at 8:11 PM, Thursday, November 25th]

They spontaneously break themselves out of the fog when they realize, on their own, that you're about to seriously leave forever.

If her love for you has ended, let it die and move on. If she does still have adequate love for you to survive the rigors of true reconciliation and sustain a lifelong devoted true loving marital relationship, she will spontaneously come out of "The Fog" when the D-Papers are served. If it takes more than that...then you will always question the strength of her devotion.

After almost 6 years of my own mess, I am now squarely in this camp. And if she does come around, I'd tell her she can "earn" you back after the divorce.

No amount of heartfelt talk resonates with these people. Their eyes glaze over at about the 10 second mark. That's the point when they've begun fashioning a rebuttal in their mind for when its their turn to talk.

When my H decided he really wanted to Reconcile (after months of me reconciling and he’s still cheating) I certainly did not make it easy.

And for one year I was convinced I was still going to D him.

It’s 8 years post affair and he’s definitely changed. And I don’t think about D him. But I have never given up my plan B — just in case.

My experience is that the cheater has to willingly want to stop the Affair and commit to the marriage. Anything else is a waste of time.

Some posters will advise you to stop talking to your WW. This is not out of spite. You need to minimize contact so that you slowly detach. This is your "less bad" option.

The reality is that your WW gave you happiness for 18 years. She also gave up this happy marriage for some guy that gave her attention.

Tell yourself that you lost a woman you love, but a woman with loose boundaries. So it’s a case of "I love you, and I had many happy years with you, but I don’t want to stay with an unsafe partner".

Like the other posters have said, consult with a lawyer, a doctor, and seek support with friends and family.

Slowly start to detach. It takes time, but you will get better.

File for D and EXPOSE them with everyone, OBS, relatives and close mutual friends WITHOUT WARNING (very important), also file a complaint and report POSOM with Virginia's Department of Insurance for unethical conduct. Contact a D attorney ASAP and have her served (you can always stop the process if she comes around), if D papers and full exposure don't shock her back to reality, then nothing will, and if so just let D run its course and get out of infidelity.

I think Virginia is still one of the few states that consider adultery (check with your attorney) but you would have to prove it, depending on your assets, hiring a PI may be worth it to catch them and get undeniable proof, a PI could get the info you need in a short amount of time, you could use the info as leverage and negotiate better D terms, it could save you a lot of money (retirement, investments, alimony/spousal support, etc.).

[This message edited by Buster123 at 4:11 PM, Friday, November 26th]

Yesterday being Thanksgiving was especially difficult and I really appreciate all of the helpful comments — especially for the language to use that is a HUGE help — I have been thinking about what everyone is saying.

Even though she is having that inappropriate relationship with the OM, I still want to part ways amicably, an uncontested, no-fault divorce through mediation, which means we have to be separated for 6 months. Yes, I could file for divorce based on adultery in VA, but then I also have to definitively prove adultery. Hiring a PI and going through the court system is not appealing only to have a judge decide who gets what. From what I understand, adultery doesn't carry a lot of weight with the judges in this county, but even with a no-fault divorce, I can keep the adultery in my back pocket as leverage if I absolutely need to.

I'm not looking to reconcile — I honestly don't know if I could — but I also don't want to drag her through the mud.

I like what was said about telling only who I NEED to tell. For me, that would be my pastor — because I feel like I'll need the support or help finding new church because of them both being there — my family, friends, and the OMS.

I could probably work on getting him fired, but again, I don't want this to become a heated divorce where we just try to screw each other over through lawyers.

I'm trying to just stop talking to her and detach, ignore their relationship and focus on the divorce, it's just hard.

Someone asked about my age and a bunch of other questions — I'm 41 and she is 39, we got married fairly young in college. Up until October, we would go hiking and birdwatching together almost every Saturday, or go out kayaking, we love the outdoors. We took a trip to Niagara Falls and a train ride through the Great Smoky Mountains in September, two separate vacations. This really felt out of the blue for me, I have no idea how long she has actually been unhappy, according to her "a very long time." But as was mentioned, that could be the fog she is in rewriting our marriage history.

In all honesty, I think I have moved past my need to know — thank you again for helping me see that doesn't matter — and focus on myself.

Up until October, we would go hiking and birdwatching together almost every Saturday, or go out kayaking, we love the outdoors. We took a trip to Niagara Falls and a train ride through the Great Smoky Mountains in September, two separate vacations. This really felt out of the blue for me, I have no idea how long she has actually been unhappy, according to her "a very long time." But as was mentioned, that could be the fog she is in rewriting our marriage history.

Almost identical situation here. Spent every spare moment together doing things we enjoyed together and as a family. The only time we wasn’t was when she was at work. This time was sadly enough….

When discovered I got the exact same line, hadn’t been happy for 16 years !!!!!

Step forward 2 years and she wants 2D more than any other and is even more unhappy without him.

Eventually you’ll come to the realisation that nothing you did or didn’t do had anything to do with why she cheated. She did because she could and then you caught her. This tactic is to shift blame to you and remove accountability from where it truly lies. Her own poor boundaries and her need for external validation. Her world will come crashing down when she realises what’s she’s done.

For what it’s worth I have managed a very amicable separation (wasn’t married) so it is possible but from what I’ve read in SI isn’t normally so. So prepare yourself in case it doesn’t go as smoothly as you would hope.

Strength brother.

For what it’s worth. You have handled yourself way better than I did at this stage of the process !!

I've been a lurking for months and seldom post. The people who are are level headed and genuinely want to help. Weigh their responses according to your situation. You can heal

You are giving up an advantage by being "amicable". There is nothing amicable about a divorce, it is simply a business transaction. You said yourself that you need a new church, etc.

It's the right thing to do to expose. It changes the narrative. She is already cheating on you and is already not amicable. Gently, a lawyer is going to be the one doing 99% of this.

By exposing you are taking yourself out of the situation morally and publically. If you agree to keep her secret she'll rewrite history to whatever best serves her at that time. It'll make your recovery 100% worse when you walk into a supermarket and people look at you because of whatever lies she tells to make herself the good person in this.

Here's the blunt truth. She is cheating on you and you need to not look at that like a poisonous snake. If you are choosing to leave your church then you tell the pastor that you are leaving because she is cheating on you. What has he done to you to deserve for you to lie to him, or to leave without explanation? You need to tell the OBS because it is the moral and right thing to do. Moral and right are not always easy, and you only need to read a few pages of the Bible to affirm that.

99 times out of 100 "amicable" divorces are not amicable.

If you do decide to tell some folks( and you should, at least some, for support), remember to be calm, rational and in control.
One of my friends was so upset he appeared unbalanced when he would disclose. Those who have not been on the receiving end of infidelity got the wrong impression of him, such that his anger etc played right into giving credibility to the narrative his wife was spinning to justify her cheating.

Essentially, you need to watch out for what is known as " fundamental attribution error". In a nutshell, this is when outsiders see only your behavior not realizing it is atypical and a response to the severe trauma and abuse you are going through. Folks not familiar with infidelity, like those who buy the casual way its aftermath is portrayed in movies, books etc, are likely to see any anger or erratic behavior as proof that your cheating wife's portrayal of you as an angry, controlling or abusive man is accurate.
The abusive/controlling/angry or neglectful portrayal seems to the th " go to card" played by a lot of cheating women.

One phrase you could use is:

We are divorcing because she chose to not honor her wedding vows. She'll provide you with any details you may need.

Yes, I agree telling others has an important purpose, especially when countering marital history rewritess and blame shifting, but the timing is strategically important depending on the desired outcome.

If you want an amicable, best terms divorce in a no-fault state, I would hold off on anything antagonizing until terms have been negotiated. If you're going to foster a nurturing post D co-parenting relationship, I would carefully consider your public relations campaign.

If you're divorcing it's not necessary to go out of your way to punish and humiliate your Ex as you're walking out the door. You will get a mix of reactions from your circle as you appear petty, bitter, vindictive, even unbalanced and sadistic. This could sour the court of public opinion against you and reinforce a WS's false narrative.

I believe it's best to keep it classy, effectively tell your side of the story, but with grace and dignity. People will respect and admire that. Your WS may appreciate that and learn something about integrity from it-perhaps not.

Some posters here are still bitter and angry and live vicariously through new posters. Watch out for this. Take level headed approach, follow your attorney's guidance.

An attorney would never advise a hot headed careless EXPOSE-EXPOSE-EXPOSE! Campaign.

You tell, who you NEED to tell to get desired outcomes and control narratives. Nothing more, nothing less. Revenge and punishment are not your priorities or concern right now.

I have no idea how long she has actually been unhappy, according to her "a very long time."

She started to be unhappy when she started to have feelings for the OM. It’s a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I tried to divorce amicably but at the end, my XWW lawyer up to "get what she deserves". Be careful.

An amicable divorce is a relative term with a broad spectrum of degrees of amicability. Let's not unnecessarily stir the hornets nest and put yourself on the extreme and of the spectrum. That's just common sense tactics of engagement.

My ExWW waved off alimony against her attorney's advice. If I was an asshole through the divorce, I'm certain that would have went the other way, and we would have had a very acrimonious protracted divorce proceeding.

Well, it is a bit complicated, the decision to disclose prior to divorce. on the one hand, as posters have said, you run the risk of setting up a more adversarial divorce. But, in my case, disclosing to my XWW's family brought pressure to bear that she better treat me fairly.

I was very close to my in-laws, such that they had witnessed my being a good father and husband. They also knew my XWW's history and had witnessed the manifestation of her personality disorder both before I was on the scene and during our marriage. They sided with me on every issue and made it clear to her she better play fair.

YMMV, depending. But, it is not all that straightforward that disclosing causes problems in the divorce.

That said, a big time PR campaign to outsiders may hurt you. If you tell folks, you need to be image conscious.