SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I can't answer for 1stWife, but our stories are fairly similar, both reconciled in long marriages after multiple bouts of infidelity and both took a hard stance which the WS found shocking enough to rethink the marriage. Here's the thing though, that urge the WS might experience to save the relationship is a really strong one. They drop the AP like a hot rock and they're all about doing whatever it takes to save the marriage.

That's not what's happening in your situation. What you're hearing is a bunch of weak blame-shifting about how a fully adult woman with agency is somehow being forced to comply with her family's wishes. It's laughable. But let's take it out of the box and look it over... what she's saying in essence is that SHE has no control over her life or her preferences. Other people make her decisions for her. She can't think for herself. So, how on earth would she ever be a safe and trustworthy partner for YOU? Her promises would be meaningless because SHE doesn't have control over whether they'll be kept or not. She's a ventriloquist's dummy and it's all about who's hand is up her backside. Does that sound like a person you'd want to plan your life around?

We all understand the pain of making an investment in someone and finding out they're not who you thought they were. Reconciliation doesn't change the meaning of that experience. It just means we were fortunate enough to have a WS who's willing to work for change. There's no action we can take which will MAKE a WS willing to work for change. There's no secret recipe. The only thing close is making it clear that we're not willing to play games and that when we've given an ultimatum, we mean it.

Strength and healing to you.

And... stay off the sauce. Alcohol will cause anxiety to rebound hard the next day. It's like an anxiety hangover, not worth it.

How are you doing Late Night?

LateNight. I’m sorry you are still struggling through this. I know how hard it is - more than you can imagine.

I rugswept a 4 year EA he refused to admit to.

I lived for months in false reconciliation during his last Affair.

I lived hanging on by a thread during his last Affair as he planned to D me. More than once.

But I finally stood up to him on DDay2 when I was working my butt off and he was still cheating. I basically stood up to him and put my plan B into action. He was the one blindsided.

But he immediately started making amends. He knew he was at fault. He did everything possible to reconcile with me. It took many months for me to consider staying. Good therapist for me and my anger propelled me not to make any snap decisions.

But as the cheater he was the one who had to pursue me and convince me he was capable of changing. He had to prove himself.

I hope this helps you. Reconciliation is always possible if both parties want it and are committed to the reconciliation process.

LN,

It is obvious that you are wavering, and now seem to be questioning yourself. Normal behaviour.

You are not sure what is real and what is not again. Confused like you were when you first found out. This can happen, and it was possibly triggered by the rumour that your WGF was pregnant. Your paternal instincts kicked in.

I guess realistically NC cant be final until she gets all of her stuff.

You are in control of when the NC starts in earnest. You have it in your control. How? By packing her stuff up for her, boxing them up, and placing them at her parent's place.

The longer you delay the true NC, the worse it will be for you, as YOU will be delaying your own healing.

I have read every single post on this thread, and I have to say that it has done wonders for me in my own situation.

So thank you first and foremost to LateNght for sharing his ordeal with us and for hearing all the tough stuff. Also thank you to the many respondents who posted for taking time out of your own lives to share and try to help.

I want to personally thank HoldingTogether and ChamomileTea. The things you have written on other posts have caused me to look for your responses in general. But the things you have each written on this thread are things I have copied and printed out for myself. I tried to send a pm to HoldingTogether because I think he deserves to know how much his words have helped me. Unfortunately I do not see an option to send him a pm so this will have to do. But the wording of your replies and the way you have communicated such profound truths has been worth more to me than my independent therapy. I wish I had your phone number or email or that you were my neighbor so I could have access to you when I need it because I am going through my own devastating storm.

Anyway, thank you all. I personally believe that this forum has the power to save lives. LateNght, I hope you are hanging in there man.

[This message edited by LightningCrashes at 12:13 AM, June 27th (Thursday)]

LateNght, how are you doing?

LateNight...Buddy, it is time to Cowboy Up, grow a pair and realize you may never know the truth, her reasoning or her motives. At this point, what do you want? We are in similar boats and I have had to do the same. I made the decision to stay and try to R which I believed we had for 25 years until I found proof that she was trying to reconnect with him on his 70th birthday. It was devastating but has led to me knowing more about the two of them than I ever imagined before as we go through therapy one more time. This time my making it clear that HE (AP) is a deal breaker and there is not room for both of us in this life. She has allot to lose and has confessed to much I suspected but we are far from the whole story yet. No more rug sweeping.

[This message edited by Niceguy25 at 2:56 PM, June 29th (Saturday)]

Just wanted to reply to you guys.

I'm stronger now but not "over it".

A lot has happened. I guess that's normal given the circumstances. Today has been one of those days where my mind has just been in a fog of replays. I hate feeling spaced out like this.

I'll try to post the important points.

1. I have not done NC.

2. I've accepted what has happened.

3. I feel that BS can sometimes be to blame.

4. At one point exgf made a comment about me not deserving her B.s. and that I should meet someone better and go out and forget about her and move on. That really pissed me off considering how much I was willing to forgive her. It was just a slap in the face if you ask me. So I went and did exactly that. I've gone on a half dozen dates with 3 new women and all have been extremely fun! The 1 one problem is that ultimately the dates/girls end up reminding me of exgf and how me and her met and started dating and how our love grew from there. So its been a double edged sword.

5. I have not slept with any of the dates despite sex clearly being on the table.

6. Exgf is still very back and forth in her words and actions.... however after me meeting new women and going out more she is less standoffish and seems to be making an effort to show me that shes sorry. It is not what you would call an "all in at full speed ahead effort". Which I know is what most BS consider mandatory. And I considered it mandatory as well but at this point I really dont know if shes capable of such effort. Not that she wouldnt want to. Just that she seems so consumed by fear. Fear of everything. And of course I still love her. And bc I love her I cant/dont want to demonize her for being fearful.

7. I've been thinking alot lately about codependency and what it means and is it really evil?

8. I've been thinking even more about the elderly that make it to 50 year and 60 year anniversaries and how much shit they must go thru in their relationships to make it there. What is the actually percentage of relationships that even make it there to begin with? And then the ones that do, what are the percentages of those that have been completely faithful? And of the one that were not faithful did they work it out and make it to such a milestone anniversary bc the BS found out and they worked it out? Or did the BS find out and just not care? Or did the WS never get caught?

Some people believe in god. Some believe the earth is flat. Neither group would change their belief. I believed I was going to spend the rest of my life with this woman no matter what bullshit we went thru. I dont know why but I still believe that.

I still see the good in her. I hate what she did. But I think if I were a better man, she wouldn't have emotionally detached enough to do those things.

It's not like I was dating a whore for 7 years. At some point in the past year something about her emotions changed, I wasnt doing the necessary things to keep her from becoming emotionally detached.

These are not her words. They're mine, from analyzing everything that's happened.

I'm not saying all BS have anything to do with what happens to them. But I think SOMETIMES they do. I think I did.

I also think anything is fixable. It's all just psychology anyway right? Person A has to feel a certain way about person B. Perception has to change. If X happens then Y behavior follows?

Maybe I'm just self soothing by thinking that I could have anything to do with the outcome. But I really feel like I do.

She’s you EXGF... and she’s been lying and hoing around on you.. How much more are you going to take ! Stop Stop it just Stop.

Don’t you see that She is NOT worthy of YOU!

Just kick her out and don’t look back.

You aren’t married you don’t have children. You have everything in front of you !

Do you know how many of us wish we could be in this situation.

Do many of us wishes we could walk away.. no divorce No assets to divide no children to suffer the divided houses and all the alimony and child support etc.

Consider yourself Lucky 🍀🍀🍀

Walk away with your head high knowing you are the better person

Look LateNight:

You are a good guy. You loved your wgf the best you could. She is not remorseful but you have decided to subject yourself to continuing pain and rejection. That’s okay. For some, even being rejected and being treated as less than, is okay, because they are still in the wgf’s life.

The fact is that nothing you did or didn’t do in your relationship caused her to cheat. The decision to take off her clothes and have sex with her boss over, and over again was hers alone. She did it because she wanted to do it. Period. If you wish to engage in the fantasy that your behavior caused her to cheat that is certainly okay. A lot of people like to live in a fantasy world. But for those BS newbies reading this, no, no matter how many times your WS tries to blameshifting, you had nothing to do with your WS decision to cheat.

LateNight, I wish you well. I hope you do begin to see reality and start to heal. Wishing you the best.

Dear Fellow,

I read the story you deleted. With horror. I do not care what your or her sexual proclivities are but purposively demeaning you in that way is not a way to live.

Get IC for yourself so you can come home to someone who loves you and does not say those horrible things to you.

There is a place for role/playing in sex. But she went way beyond and emasculated you for her fun. Just say “No.”

LateNight, I hope you find the strength to move forward with your life. Work on yourself, and you will find the woman that is worthy of you. Find your strength.

You went through significant emotional abuse. The abuse was so damaging to you, you're even contemplating your contribution to it, even though it was your wife's own doing. The residual effects of abuse is self-doubt among many other things, and your post reveals as such. You understand the emotional damage her infidelity has caused you, but may underestimate the residual damage the abuse has entrenched in you.

Case in point. Both emotional and physical abuse are destructive to the person being abused. If you physically abused your wife, few would think she contributed to being abused. An abused woman is NEVER party to her own abuse. She may have communicated in such a way that caused her husband to become angry, or her actions which could include cheating, could have caused the husband to become furious.

Either way, the moment the husband strikes his wife or significant other, it becomes a different matter altogether. The husband can point to his wife's provocations all he wants, but many people reach a high emotional level and don't come close to physically abusing them. Just like many become disenchanted with there spouses and don't commit infidelity. There's not one scenario of which striking a woman or child is acceptable or understandable. Not one.

The husband or male in this instance has other issues that need addressed, and his wife isn't one of them, when it comes to imposing physical abuse. Back to your situation. Same thing here in reverse. Whatever you consider as your contribution that led to her infidelity are off the nark. Don't succumb to being defined by her actions. She's the sole owner, just as a physically abusing husband is sole owner to striking his wife. The wife may have contributed to emotional escalation, but it stops right there. Men have options, to either walk away or strike. Those that strike have anger management issues, not wife issues which led to the strike.

A cheating wife has options to engage or enforce boundaries. Those that engage have issues that you have nothing to do with. If it was someone else with her, chances are the results would be the same.

Blunt talk not directed at LateNight

For new folks,

That line about the BS is sometimes to blame for the A is pure crap.

If you're a lousy partner, your WS can ask you to change or end the relationship with you, and those are honorable ways to handle a lousy partner.

Cheating betrays the cheater, the ap, the BS, and the WS's family - and the cheater decided to do that on his/her own.

****

Back to LateNight:

7. I've been thinking alot lately about codependency and what it means and is it really evil?

It's a crooked way to live, and it's virtually guaranteed to keep you from achieving your goals.

It's based on manipulating other people. It requires the practitioner to be unreal, to betray his own wants and needs. It requires wasting energy in indirect action rather than going straight fro what you want.

And, gently, it annoys the hell out of people who are living real lives.

I urge you to live a real life - connect with others in straight ways, human being to human being, not behind a mask that makes you less than you are.

8. I've been thinking even more about the elderly that make it to 50 year and 60 year anniversaries and how much shit they must go thru in their relationships to make it there.

Married in 1967, so I'm there.

At this point, your XGF blames you for her A and still doesn't know what she wants. You describe a life of pleasing her, and she seems pretty fickle. It's safe to predict that you will not be able to keep her pleased, except by stifling yourself. And that's what you seem to want....

If that's the life you want, so be it - but I don't have a clue about how to support you. I simply don't know how to support a person who hides himself from others and from himself, except to say: stop hiding.

Living together requires compromise. I never cheated, but I have never been easy to live with. And yet my W hung in with me. On the whole, I can't explain it, but I can say that I want to be with her, despite the A.

But she stopped her A on d-day, took responsibility, and started changing very quickly. Had she blamed me and/or hadn't started changing, I doubt we'd be together.

You get to make your own choices, though, and I hope they work well for you.

This woman that you proclaim to "love" you just called her a "whore" (and rightfully so).

"She's so consumed by fear"? As are YOU!!!

LateNight I have said all along that you would get back together with this vile woman. That's why you didn't stick to NC.

As for Love, and what it is (and isn't) unfortunately some people just have to learn the hard way. Your comments/actions show you have NO idea what love is.

Some people are indeed codependent, but others just need drama in their lives and others think SO little of themselves that they will take all the shit someone will throw their way because that crumb in some SICK way is viewed as validation.

I've also said this isn't about your "whore" (your word not mine) and hasn't been for quite some time. This is about YOU and why you think SO little about who you are.

Why are you even here on SI LateNight as you have not taken ONE piece of wisdom that has been bestowed to you?

In my opinion this is like rubber necking and watching a man who was just in a MAJOR wreck stumbling away from the scene covered in blood and is now walking down a Major highway during rush hour traffic going the wrong way.

I would say "I wish you luck" but given the info you've shared I would say I sure hope you don't have any fire arms in your home and to make sure that you keep your health insurance up to date.

FAREAST - you are so right ...

You’re doing the pick me dance it and it never works. You can’t win her back. You can’t nice her back. By trying to do it you look pathetic to her. Garner your self respect. Northeastern area is absolutely right. Read in the healing library and implement a hard 180. Tell him he can have her and move on with your life. If she wants the relationship she has to win you back. You are the prize. Value yourself! Good luck.

Seriously, you can't make her want you ... and if she has to wonder if she should stay, then YOU shouldn't wonder if YOU should - there answer is clearly NO, you shouldn't. If she does not have a definitive YES that she wants you, then she just plain doesn't. You are worth more than a "eh, maybe" - you deserving a resounding YES. Find a woman who KNOWS she wants you and only you!

LN,

I just caught up on your journey. I’m so sorry that you’re going through this.

I just want to tell you a quick fact about my own journey through infidelity. Dday was in 2010, and after a couple of months, I accepted her part and my part of her infidelity.

I registered on this forum 5 years later once it finally sunk in that it was 100% on the cheating partner. I had felt reconciled with my partner (and with my own self), accepting part of the “blame”. It still never felt quite “settled” deep within me.

I just hope that that doesn’t happen to you too.

Sending good energy your way, and wishing genuine “peace of mind” to you.

LateNight.

Good update.

I have a few questions for you:

1. What can we do for you except listen? You do not use any advice that is given.

2. Is this because you believe this is a unique situation and therefore the knowledge given does not apply?

3. What are you doing to force her hand?

4. When you date other women, she seems to loosen up? Why not do this more and even make it appear that you are enjoying their company? Don't you think that might be the best thing you can do?

5. Why do you believe the pick-me dance will actually work when it never has in the history of this site? Do you not understand how it makes you look weak in her eyes? Do you think that what attracted her to the OM was his apparent strength?

6. If you loved her so much, why didn't you want to get married in the first place?

7. What have you learned from this experience?

oops, double post

[This message edited by skerzoid at 11:42 AM, July 10th (Wednesday)]

You should download and read "No More Mr Nice Guy" it's free and short.

You are letting your heart and emotions control you.

I hope you wake up to reality. You need to.