SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Rideitout, there are women out there like you wanted. I know because I am one. I feel like Dee and picked the wrong one. I so understand about wanting to have sex rather than watch TV. I have probably thought that a million times. I even cut the cable off to see if that would help. It didn’t. He would then be on his phone, playing with the dogs, basically do anything but sex.

I don’t understand how your wife says she is never horny but then can have multiple orgasms. That boggles my mind. She was obviously horny if she was telling AP she was cutting the meeting short and to meet her. She was thinking about what she wanted, what was going to happen. She got herself worked up and she was horny. Why doesn’t she think about you while she is at work, and think about coming home and tearing your clothes off and blowing your mind? She could easily do that and get herself worked up for you like she did the AP.

I do this every day and I do it a lot. I have done it with every bf I have ever had. My ex bfs and my husband do not have to do much at all to turn me on. I think about what I want and how I want it throughout the day. I get myself worked up for later on. It is no one else’s job to make me horny. I think a lot of women think it is the man’s job to get them in the mood, etc. Being horny and having passion for the person you are with starts in the mind first.

So either some WS don’t understand it starts in the mind or they really don’t care. I really think a lot of them are secure with their lifestyle, they are comfortable, they are plain lazy and don’t want to put in the effort.

I have told my WH that before Dday I never thought about cheating, but since then I have thought about it a million times. I knew he had a lower libido, he is 16 years older than me, has some ED problems. I was ok with all that as long as he was faithful. I totally get why people cheat in passionless marriages. But people who cheat when they have a spouse who is always willing to do whatever they want, whenever, where ever - WTF is wrong with these people?

People who don’t place a high value on sex really do not understand what cheating does to a person who does place a high value on sex. I am not saying anyone hurts more or less from betrayal. I think some people just hurt different. But to be rejected over and over sexually only to find out your spouse has spent countless hours thinking, planning, sneaking, and f’ing another person while you are in a sexual desert - it is evil especially because they know how important sex is to their spouse. Rant over.

People who don’t place a high value on sex really do not understand what cheating does to a person who does place a high value on sex. I am not saying anyone hurts more or less from betrayal. I think some people just hurt different. But to be rejected over and over sexually only to find out your spouse has spent countless hours thinking, planning, sneaking, and f’ing another person while you are in a sexual desert - it is evil especially because they know how important sex is to their spouse. Rant over.

Preach. I doubt that's a part that I will ever get over. Made me feel like a fool. Here I was dressing in lingerie and doing all but begging him to have sex with me and he'd rather save his sexual energy for nasty strangers. The psychological repercussions from that have been awful.

The psychological repercussions from that have been awful.

Same here. Spend so much time trying to convince myself it's my problem, not hers, I was unreasonable, my needs were the problem, not her lack of desire. For a very long time. Come to find out, it was all a lie, my needs weren't the problem (the OM wanted it more often than I ever even suggested, and she happily obliged).

It's a real mind-f**k because this isn't just the period of the A. It's our entire relationship. Our sex life during the A wasn't appreciably different than it was up to that point, begrudgingly "given" but pretty frequent (compared to most). But the guilt I carried around for so long about my "unreasonable sex drive" and the time I spent trying to convince myself I had a problem. That hurts like hell.

But the guilt I carried around for so long about my "unreasonable sex drive" and the time I spent trying to convince myself I had a problem. That hurts like hell.

Yes, so much that. I was thinking that it was unfair of me to expect him to want sex like I did and so I "took care of myself" to give him a break. I felt like I was getting annoying and just flat out harassing him. All that time he was masturbating to porn and then later seeing prostitutes. All that while I sat home feeling like kind of a jerk for wanting sex more than twice a week. Telling myself that him turning me down wasn't about me, but it was because I was asking him for sex when he was tired at night after working all day. Telling myself that I was being unreasonable and needy. Maybe there was something wrong with me and he was normal. I was oh so understanding, but inside I was dying because he wasn't acting like he wanted me. I tried not to initiate so much, but I'd eventually get desperate and initiate anyway.

It really does kill you a little bit each time. I am so sorry you've had this pain too. There's nothing wrong with your sex drive whatsoever or your need for regular and enthusiastic sex with your wife.

DevastatedDee

I hear ya!!!

After fWH EA I asked to spice things up... I figured he was bored and wanted something new. So got lingerie and dress up too. Which was difficult with a tween in the house that would waltz into our bedroom anytime.

So I would wait until she was asleep.

He usually gave me the he’s too tired 💤 Or he doesn’t think he can.. beginning of ED. Or the one that hurts the most.. what’s wrong with you. We had sex last week.

I got tired of trying.

3 years later he has no problem doing all the kinky stuff with that whore of his.

RO...

I don’t think this is a male vs female thing. I’m angry that he did those things with her. But when I brought it up he said I was sick & weird and why would we do such things. As a csa survivor you question yourself... maybe I’m sick and deplorable.

So yeah I’m pissed I went without sex only for him to give it to her.

OMG, Hurtbeyondtime, same. I introduced him to less vanilla stuff and that was cool. He'd never tell me something that he wanted to do, though. I even called the most popular whore and spoke to her for two hours after DDay just to find out what in the name of god it was that he wouldn't ask ME to do. She said nothing, they'd talk for a while about being an addict (alcohol, pot, and eventually crack) and trying to live a normal life and then she'd try to have sex with him and he couldn't stay erect. She was awfully chatty and forthcoming. I actually think she was being honest. It matched a lot of what he'd told me with a few more details. He'd text her for pictures that he could jerk off to mostly. He'd try dirty-talking her.

I really think he's just all kinds of sexually messed-up. But good lord, who better to explore fixing one's fucked up sexuality than with a woman willing to try all manner of things as often as he wanted?!? It enrages me, honestly. He had a monogamous sexually-open woman starving for him at home, but he didn't want to explore his sexuality with me? And he didn't even want anything kinky! Didn't make the first kinky request of her even! None of this will ever make sense to me.

It enrages me, honestly.

Me too Dee. You and HurtBeyond have really given me something to think about; thank you for the education, I really, in my myopic view of the world, thought this was only a male problem (also because I only hear it from men, but, that's a wee-bit of a self-selection bias going on there). It's amazing to hear women in the same situation. And more amazing, because I, and I think many other men reading this thread are thinking to themselves WTF. Followed by !!!WWWWTTTTFFFF!!! Because what your describing is EXACTLY the thing that many of us, men and women (now clear to me) experienced in our marriages before/during the A. And to me being the high drive partner, it's just mind-f**king boggling. You don't want sex, but you cheat and have more sex; and I'm dying for it all the time??

Put bluntly and with no filter at all, I'm the one who's supposed to be cheating! Cheating would have filled that hole for me, because I was only looking for sexual fulfillment, the one that that you actually will get out of an A with a pretty high degree of certainty. It pisses me off so bad that I need to take a break from SI for the evening, not because I'm upset at what you said, but I'm just so mad about my, your and other's in this situation that I need a little cool off time (before the mods give me mandatory cool off time). It's the one thing, the ONLY thing that's unique to marriage people, yes, it's real godd**n important to a lot of us, and we're not sex crazed maniacs for finding our W/H attractive. And should my WW ever make me feel that way again, she's gone, because I can do better.

I hereby decree that all the high libido / undersexed women on his thread here get together with the emasculated BHs here

So let it be written, so let it be done

[This message edited by redhorse at 11:33 PM, April 4th (Wednesday)]

I hereby decree that all the high libido / undersexed women on his thread here get together with the emasculated BHs here

LOL, maybe there's a reason that we wind up in relationships like we do.. Because we'd kill ourselves having sex if both partners were high drive.

It would be a fine way to die, though, LOL!

So let it be written, so let it be done

I got a pretty good chuckle out of that... Either you recently watched 'The Ten Commandments'or listened to 'Creeping Death'. At any rate I would never consider getting shots or meds to give my 'tool' the Creeping Death Hell... the wife has been doing that for years without me paying a doctor.

Commandment 11- Thou shalt be enthusiastic with your mate.

Put bluntly and with no filter at all, I'm the one who's supposed to be cheating! Cheating would have filled that hole for me, because I was only looking for sexual fulfillment, the one that that you actually will get out of an A with a pretty high degree of certainty. It pisses me off so bad that I need to take a break from SI for the evening, not because I'm upset at what you said, but I'm just so mad about my, your and other's in this situation that I need a little cool off time (before the mods give me mandatory cool off time). It's the one thing, the ONLY thing that's unique to marriage people, yes, it's real godd**n important to a lot of us, and we're not sex crazed maniacs for finding our W/H attractive. And should my WW ever make me feel that way again, she's gone, because I can do better.

I've thought this so often and it still pisses me off too. Looking at it on paper, it would have made more sense for me to cheat. Granted I did on DDay, but that was a psychological shit-storm in and of itself.

I doubt that's a part that I will ever get over. Made me feel like a fool. Here I was dressing in lingerie and doing all but begging him to have sex with me and he'd rather save his sexual energy for nasty strangers. The psychological repercussions from that have been awful.

Same thing, except the wearing lingerie thing, being a guy. Hell, I'd try that if it would have done something for her. If nice guys finish last, then I'm fucking adorable.

Something occurs to me, and I apologize for not thinking of this earlier.

BHs: if your WWs are remorseful, would they consider not only IC, but also reading a book about increasing sex within M? Remorseful waywards read books like How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair - since sex is a huge part of your M and very much a priority for you, she should be willing to explore that too and address it. Maybe even a book for you two to read together, if you think it would help you both reconnect?

I don't know any good books to recommend. The ones I've read have been for high-drive wives, others have been about healing from sexual assault and abuse, and I haven't found any about how a couple can recover sexually after infidelity. Does anyone else know or have any book recommendations to help the BHs here?

BHs: if your WWs are remorseful, would they consider not only IC, but also reading a book about increasing sex within M? Remorseful waywards read books like How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair - since sex is a huge part of your M and very much a priority for you, she should be willing to explore that too and address it. Maybe even a book for you two to read together, if you think it would help you both reconnect?

Going through some of my old posts, and realized I never answered this.

Here's the thing. "Read a book" would be the right advice for a non-A couple facing this situation. And it might be helpful for basic understanding. But, in some ways, I feel like this is a cop out for a WW (or low sex WH). The answer is real simple. Get with the program. Sure, if you've never had a drive, and it's always been a problem, I get it, books and psychs might be the answer. But after a f**k fueled affair? You seemed to figure it out just fine there when you were having sex half a dozen times in 6 hours. Why the heck do you need to read a book to figure it out with me? It really is that simple. Take the reverse example, guy has an AP and goes down on her all the time, middle of the day, multiple times during sex. Never does that for the wife, ever. Now he's "willing" to start doing it for the wife, but the lights have to be off, she needs to take a shower first, he needs to be "in the right frame of mind" and another endless stream of conditions and qualifiers. And the BW here knows that he was happy to do it for the AP in the back of the car, middle of the day, after she hadn't taken a shower in a week (kidding, adding for emphasis). I kind of feel like "read a book" is the same thing. No, don't read a book, do it, just like you did it with the AP without the need for a shower/10 beers/lights off or, in this case, reading a book on it. You want to do something new, or something even more intimate that you've never done? OK, reading might be a good answer. But if my WW told me she had anal sex with the AP, but now needs to "read a book" before doing it with me, I can tell you, her ass, and the book are both going to be flying out the door real quickly after that statement crosses her lips.

It's not that hard, it really isn't. We all complicate the hell out of these things, and say stuff like "more IC", "more books" or even "more SI" when the BS is sitting around in agony waiting for their WS to "get it". Well, in a lot of cases, they "got it" without any of those things for their AP (sexual or non), why the heck do they need 25 different things to do to "get it" for their BS?

** as a member **

Here's the thing. "Read a book" would be the right advice for a non-A couple facing this situation. And it might be helpful for basic understanding. But, in some ways, I feel like this is a cop out for a WW (or low sex WH). The answer is real simple. Get with the program.

Rather than 'get with the program', I think 'get authentic' is the right thing to do. High, low, medium, no libido - what's right for both WS and BS is to be real. If there's a match between BS & WS, maybe R is possible. If there's too much of a mismatch, probably not.

I'm also very concerned about your comparing the BS with the ap.

A BS who allows himself to get hung up on what the WS did with the ap is slowing down his own healing. A BS who chooses to want what the ap got is keeping the ap in the M, and it just doesn't make sense.

I know it's impossible not to ask/talk/think about it, but it's only a stage in recovery. If a BS wants his recovery to proceed and succeed, the BS needs to move past what the WS did with the ap.

To R, the BS needs to comprehend what the BS wants to do with the WS, and the quicker, the better.

A true Marriage is a partnership It's is built on 2 people giving to and taking from each other what they want, not what someone else wants.

If you want kink, great! Negotiate kink.

But I can't figure out how anyone can say, 'You gave it to him' without whining, and I don't see whining as a winning negotiating tactic.

A BS who allows himself to get hung up on what the WS did with the ap is slowing down his own healing. A BS who chooses to want what the ap got is keeping the ap in the M, and it just doesn't make sense.

My post was not tactful, somewhat intentionally, somewhat because I was tired. Here's the difficult part of what you said, while I agree with you, doing things for the "sake of it" or because the AP got it, I'm on board, that doesn't make a lot of sense. But getting down to the details, I feel like that doesn't exactly hold up. Because when this situation pops up here (and it hasn't in awhile I'm kind of surprised actually), it's not a BH coming on and saying "AP got X, now I want it" it's almost always (actually it is always, I've never seen an exception, although I'm sure one exists), "I wanted to do X with my WW, and she told me no, then did it every time she met the AP". Is it about "reclaiming" sex for the BS? Yes, in some ways it is, but it's also that this was a desire that was shot down by the WS.

So, let's make an example, somewhat funny, but also not all that ridiculous. WW gave anal sex to the AP. Husband had always wanted to do it, made that desire known, and was rebuffed. This is the most common situation that I see, sometimes it's BJ's, and sometimes it's oral sex (with a female BS), but those 3 things probably encompass the majority of these discussions. Thing is, a woman wanting her H to go down on her, if expressed before the A (or even not expressed, but wanted) has nothing to do with the AP. Or what the H did, other than to make the A hurt worse. It's not a desire because he did it with the AP, it's a desire that was always there, and has been made very raw by the fact that it was denied to the W, but given happily to the AP.

Now, the other situation. Same WH, has scat play with his AP (look it up, but don't do it from work). BW has no interest in it, even after discovery, it's just not something she wants to do. Should she do it to "reclaim it"? No, IMHO, she shouldn't, it's not her thing and she doesn't WANT TO reclaim it. And I put that in caps, because that's really the dividing line, do you, the BS, want to do these things with your WS because you want to do them, or because the AP did them? If its the first, then what I said, I stand by. If it's the second, then.. I think what you said is more reasonable, don't do things because others did them, do them for you.

Thing is, it's almost never that. The things my W did with the AP that I have no interest in I've long forgotten. The things she did with him that I'd always wanted to do? Those are with me to this very minute. I'd never want to do the things they did because they did them, I want to do them because I've always wanted to do them, my WW just wasn't willing.

But I can't figure out how anyone can say, 'You gave it to him' without whining, and I don't see whining as a winning negotiating tactic.

Neither can I. Which is why I think these threads are valuable. Hopefully WS's read this and realize "I need to get with the program" and realize what their refusals did to their BS, and how to fix it moving forward. And it's not to pretend it didn't happen. And it's not to explain away why it happened. It's to have an honest conversation, and be open and engaging with your BS. And I just don't think that message gets delivered clearly.

And I just don't think that message gets delivered clearly.

I have to disagree. I think the message is delivered clearly far more times than not. I think in most cases, it is not that a WS doesn't get what the BS is saying. They simply don't care enough or feel genuine empathy or have the motivation and determination to act on what I think they clearly have heard.

In your case, as was similar in mine, I think your your WW could repeat what you have said pretty clearly, if she wanted to. I think they get the message. A WW not acting on what the BH asks does not mean they have not gotten the message.

But, what if she can't feel that passion she felt for a fantasy? (OM was a fantasy guy, not a real guy.)

Tough shit, learn.

Is it a deal breaker?

Yes.

Would you divorce her?

Yes.

I have to disagree. I think the message is delivered clearly far more times than not. I think in most cases, it is not that a WS doesn't get what the BS is saying. They simply don't care enough or feel genuine empathy or have the motivation and determination to act on what I think they clearly have heard.

I think we'll respectfully have to disagree on this one. If you look at the threads that have gone in depth in this issue, there's a clear divide between how men and women view this. Women, in general, seem to be of the mindset that "You shouldn't do anything sexual for the BH that you don't want to" and men are of the mindset "You need to get with the program". So, I don't believe the message is clear at all, a new WW could come here and read 100's of threads from posters telling her it's fine that she had anal sex with the AP 10 times a day but won't with her H. They will, of course, tell her the A was wrong, but will tell her it's "her body, her choice" and that the man needs to get over it. He won't, not if he anything like me, and I think that's where I take issue. We give a bunch of great advice here on how to fix a marriage broken by infidelity, but on this point, I think we just can't see eye to eye. And a WW coming here could easily get a message that will lead to a D, it would have in my case, and I believe it would for most BH's, because there's just no getting over that rejection for most of us.