SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Her focus continues to be about her comfort .. when is she going to pull her head out of her ass and realize she just placed a bomb inside your home and already blew everything up?

This is NOT about her .. this is about you and the kids. For someone who is at risk of losing her family, where does she have the time to worry about being embarrassed on FB?

She is STILL not concerned about what she needs to be concerned about. Her family. She is still putting herself first.

Stay strong. Stay firm. When she makes comments like that do not respond.

Dude - -STOP stop engaging her. stop talking to her. stop allowing her to manipulate you.

She made you feel like the bad guy. Fuck her. Seriously.

She doesn't know who you are anymore, because she has had a year long break from reality.

Protect the kids, and yourself first and foremost, and no matter what you do, do NOT cancel the Attorney appt. I don't care if she is rolling on the floor snot running down her face crying. Keep the appt. She doesnt get it yet, and I am afraid she never will. Until you lay down some serious consequences that truly affect her.

Has she made the appt to get the full STD workup?

Actions buddy. IC doesn't count, that just gives her a place to bitch about you.

At this point, I think I've scared the shit out of her.

you haven’t scared her at all… yet. She’s a narcissist who is shocked that her actions have consequences. Narcissists look at consequences like early man viewed fire. You know that look you give something when you really don’t understand it? Kind of turn your head? Dead stare. That’s what she is doing right now

She's seen the lengths that I'll go. She's scared about losing her job and her family. She's scared that I will out her on Facebook, to my family, to the rest of her family.

She says that she doesn't know who I am anymore. Fair. She drove me to this.

Maybe now it has sunk in.

It has not sunk in at all. You just changed her and her lover’s ballgame. She's going to continue the "dialogue" (or as I like to call them, "manipulation sessions"). Talking will do NOTHING right now. 180 Plan it. Map out your next few weeks and stick to the plan because there is nothing she can do or say which will change the necessary steps over the next few weeks.

All you are doind is inviting heartbreak and emotions. After all of this is done she MAY be open for reconciliation, if you decide to offer it. Right now she's just sad she got caught. These next few weeks you're doing things which are necessary for either divorce or reconcilition, so keep on plan.

Yes I am going to go see a lawyer still. Probably won't be until next week since they were pretty booked last time I tried.

No more probablies!

Honestly, last night might have been the best bit of progress we've had.

That’s because you’re showing her that she can’t push you around anymore. It WILL get worse before it gets better. She hasn’t even started to try to push you yet.

I have a feeling that their talk did not go too well. She said that she wants nothing to do with that "mess". He's scared that I have a PI on him and that I am out to get him and his job.

Oh I’m sure that he may have mention a PI in passing to her, but that’s not what they talked about. Your wife and her boyfriend are already trying to build the narrative that you’re a vindictive asshole in white-hot rage. Your job is to convince them of everything but the asshole part.

Did she defend you to him? Did she agree that she broke No Contact? When is her last day on the job and when is she informing their HR department that he continues to harass her despite requesting a no contact other than business matters?

All of those items need “YES and DATE” next to them on HER list.

The only think you’re doing is confirming his fears about a PI. They’ll still be in touch, you just need to find a PI that agrees to be sloppy and get some information on him. But don’t forget that this is about your wife, and not about him. By fucking with him you’re just closing down an option for you wife.

It’ll get real satisfying when he gets exposed at work…. that’s coming too.

Job well done I must say. I'm fairly happy with the outcome. The OBS knows. I wish she would have maintained contact with me, but now that I know it was her, I will respect privacy. She has my information should she want to reach out again.

So before yesterday they might have felt fairly comfortable. Today, not so much.

I am beyond excited that you are seeing progress. We are here to help you build some more progress into your life. YOU are in control. All we can do is tell you what we’ve learned from our similarly awful experience. You reaching out to us was YOU taking action. You collating a game plan was YOU. You let your wife’s boyfriend’s wife know. YOU make the decision to come back here, YOU make the decision to set the next lawyer meeting (don’t tell your wife next time btw, you’re showing your hand).

You are doing tremendous and should be proud of yourself. VERY few people get as far as you do

[This message edited by eric1 at 7:59 AM, July 29th (Wednesday)]

Actually, I didn't want to say anything crazy last night. I had the VAR going. I have checked the recording and I have her admitting to the affair.

Hopefully that will come in handy if needed. I lost the emails but at least I have this.

Honest question, if both parties do actually want to move on from the affair, how do you do it?

Its a very simple answer - you first need to re-establish trust and that's going to involve HER working towards this. There is nothing that you can do right now other than... be you. That's why the 180 plan is great, it keeps you mentally stable and also avoids anything else bad that you can say or do. You just "are".

Again, there is NOTHING that you can do, this is HER driving this. This is HER offering to go to HR without you hinting, because he is harassing her. This is HER telling her family. This is HER doing the heavy lifting and googling, visiting forums like this, going to IC. This is HER offering to throw MDM on her phone so you can track her always.

You get the jist?

Then it's you understanding that reconciliation is a gift that you are offering her. You can take this gift away at any time for any reason. She fucked someone else. You did not ask for this.

Once you wake up and understand, truly understand and feel, that she would take a bullet to the head before cheating on you again, then this clock starts ticking:

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=566411

This is a lot for most people. That's why more than 50% end in divorce. You are going to have to take a lot of leaps of faiths and be willing to dedicate, and potentially lose, 5-7 years of your life to this. Is it worth it?

Have you tried to recover the deleted gmail account?

https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/67422?hl=en

You

http://www.zdwired.com/how-to-recover-deleted-gmail-account/

Ico

Again you are way ahead of yourself . After what has just happened , the breaking NC , her total anger at you and not herself , the obvious discovery that they were still in contact , why are you so willing to move right to RUGSWEEP. We know why she is. Her OM may not want to risk his job or wife for her. No such commitment from your wife . She is pissed because he may be throwing her under bus .

And as long as she thinks you are one crazy bastard you will do yourself a favor by putting that VAR in her far so you can hear her telling to him and her girlfriend on how to handle you .

So far when you have ignored what we tell you you have been wrong . When you listen you move forward .

As Eric told you you need to stop looking for a quick fix here . So far she has done nothing to reconcile. Quite the contrary .

I agree with the others that you really don't seem to get it. You have too good an opinion of your wife.

The issue is not that she broke NC. The issue is that she is mad that you created a problem for her and her AP. When given the chance to choose him or you, she chose him. That tells you everything you need to know.

Oh and by the way, I would not assume that just because your wife says that he called to tell her you contacted his wife, that it means that you actually did contact his wife. It's totally possible that he intercepted the communication and together, he and your wife came up with the subsequent telephone conversation to provide you with "proof" that it was his wife and not him responding so that you would not attempt to contact her again.

Fun living with a lying, deceitful, remorseless spouse, isn't it? All those days and nights of never really knowing what is truth and what is fiction.

Go see the lawyer, and if she doesn't do a complete 180 and start being remorseful and transparent, file. You think it's bad now, but it can get worse.

I am happy to see that there has been progress - progress earned by you through standing up for yourself. Telling the OBS is critical. Believe me, I know how hard it is to imagine the possibility that your wife will simply get up and leave. It takes courage and you followed through. Congratulations. Now do the rest and continue to show her that you will not be steamrolled.

You are at a critical juncture. For the next 2-3 days they will be in communication. Believe me, they will be. They'll be discussing whether it's simply over and they will say their goodbyes (sob, sob) or they will discuss whether this is the moment they take the leap and leave their families. Often, it is the former - with the resulting "discussions" that you are now experiencing with your wife. You know the one, where she admits to the affair, admits that she was wrong, but still gives you 50 reasons why she did it (many because of you).

This is called regret, not remorse. And you MUST learn to differentiate between the two. From your last post, where you asked about reconciliation, it is clear that you haven't yet gotten that lesson.

You cannot step off the gas at this point. You must get into an attorney ASAP and you must sit down with her with a review of your clear, 100% non-negotiable demands. The attorney will give you clarity as to your rights which will help put your mind at ease. The list will give her a view of what you expect. This is given in a firm, direct manner with the clear intention that if she doesn't like it - she can pack her bag and leave.

One of the most helpful words of wisdom I ever received here was "do not let the wayward spouse dictate the terms of reconciliation." If BOTH of you are all in on the marriage and want to move forward then it is up to her to make things better. You are too full of distrust, anger, hurt, shame, etc. It is her job to convince you that she is trustworthy. It's her job to make you feel loved. YOU are the one who determines what you need - not her. She does not get to decide how reconciliation will look like. You do. Make sure that you fully understand that.

Your marriage issues will get dealt with down the road. And they WILL have to be dealt with. But that is for another day - probably another year or more. Right now it's all about you and your kids.

Does she have it in her to do what it takes? When you sit her down, ask her that very question. "Do you have it in you?" Because if she doesn't (and it takes a very, very, VERY strong person to reconcile from this) then you both may want to reconsider.

Keep your foot on the gas. Be strong.

I don't know. She's a tough nut to crack. She's had to get pretty tough for work prior to the affair. She got beat down on a daily basis.

I can't say that she isn't doing anything. She has it in her head that I am punishing her. I haven't figured out what the hell she thinks I am doing as punishment. I couldn't get that from her last night.

This stuff with a cheating spouse sucks. I don't know if I can believe a single word. Even if I were to file for a divorce, it would seem like I couldn't trust her. So where does it start? Where does it end?

She knows I'll end it if something happens again. I've been very explicit on that.

She said that since she wasn't allowed to contact him, she couldn't tell him not to call her. So, if I can believe her, she told him not to contact her again.

She told me last night that I should have told her. We agreed to disagree on this topic.

I realize that you do not want to bring further pain unto yourself. But not knowing the specific details and timeline of her one year long affair is what is helping you not fully grasp what she has done, what she is capable of and who you are truly dealing with.

There is a huge difference between saying to yourself, "my wife had an affair" and knowing exactly what she was doing behind your back.

It takes a great deal of disconnect, dishonesty and selfishness to carry on a one year affair and remain in a marriage and parenting children.

You can not move forward with R until you are completely clear about who you are dealing with, be able to look at her with clear detached eyes and then make an informed decision about whether this is an individual you want to reconcile with.

She is still spinning it to be about her.

Honestly, I don't know how anyone reconciles. It seems like so much gets broken on both sides by the end.

Couples reconcile when BOTH partners want to reconcile. Right now, it's just you. She doesn't yet know what she wants, she has made that clear to you. You just don't want to accept the uncertainty that comes with acknowledging that your wife, right now, doesn't know what she wants or even worse, wants the other man.

That's OK. This stuff is hard, and no one expects you to be an expert on it yet. Just remember this....her actions/thoughts/feelings are not unique. If you learn nothing else from reading the posts on this site, you will learn that.

She distanced herself from you, exercised poor boundaries, found someone she wanted to pursue a relationship with, and did it. Not unique.

She was caught, denied it until you showed her proof, and then had no choice but to admit to it but said she loves the other man. Not unique.

You have let her set the terms for whether you get to read the emails (you don't) and how (or if) she ends things with him (she hasn't.) You haven't made her choose between you and him, so she hasn't. Not unique.

She got mad at you when you created problems for her and her boyfriend by (maybe) telling his wife. Not unique.

She broke NC, but somehow it's still your fault and she's mad at you. Not unique.

You don't want to lose her. You want her to choose you, to come back to you, to tell you it was all just a big mistake and that she must have been crazy to ever jeopardize your relationship. And your fear that she will not choose you if you force her to make a choice, is causing you to allow her to set the terms of your marriage. Not unique.

But that last one is deadly to your relationship. Look around this site. Look at the people who successfully reconciled, versus the ones who didn't. You'll see the successful ones set the terms for reconciliation and went nuclear when the terms weren't met.

Yes, some of those who set the terms lost their marriages when the WS chose freedom over the marriage, but they had the bonus of not having to endure the agony of living with an uncommitted spouse. If she is going to choose freedom, I say it is better to have her choose now. If she is going to choose marriage, there is no time like right this second to make that choice.

She's told me repeatedly that she doesn't want him. She said last night in reference to the OM, "that's a mess. I don't want that."

I don't know what to believe. I want to believe her.

I've been pretty clear on most things. I've held fairly firm.

She's not sure how she feels about me. That's a fact. To be fair, I don't know how I feel about her now either. I don't know if I can really get over this. Though I do feel like I have one foot out the door, just waiting for an excuse to leave.

I feel like we both maybe need to commit or just separate. Wrong, right?

Honestly, I don't know how anyone reconciles.

No one reconciles from where you are at right now. You would do yourself a HUGE favor is you would remove that term from your vocabulary right now. You need to have someone to reconcile with and right now you have

(1) a cheater who lived an affair life and regarded you as a roommoate for a year

(2) a liar who has not told you one iota of fucking truth since you caught her

(3) a woman who less than 72 hours ago told you she was not sexually attracted to you anywhere near like OOM

(4) a woman who was and still is more loyal to her boyfriend than you and would undoubtedly be walking out the door if he was local and she could

(5) a woman who has met not one of any of the conditions you asked for

(6) a woman who really would rather have hung out with her friends Saturday night than you

Should i keep going????? AND YOU WANT TO RECONCILE WITH THAT AS IS RIGHT NOW??????

Let me translate what she meant when she told you the conversation with OM did not go well. YOUR WIFE WANTED TO KEEP THE AFFAIR GOING AND YOU CALLING HIS WIFE SCARED HIM ENOUGH TO HESITATE AT LEAST. THAT IS WHY SHE IS SO PISSED AND IS ACTING LIKE YOU ARE A MADMAN.

JUST A STATISTIC just sent you this

Couples reconcile when BOTH partners want to reconcile. Right now, it's just you. She doesn't yet know what she wants, she has made that clear to you. You just don't want to accept the uncertainty that comes with acknowledging that your wife, right now, doesn't know what she wants or even worse, wants the other man.

That's OK. This stuff is hard, and no one expects you to be an expert on it yet. Just remember this....her actions/thoughts/feelings are not unique. If you learn nothing else from reading the posts on this site, you will learn that.

She distanced herself from you, exercised poor boundaries, found someone she wanted to pursue a relationship with, and did it. Not unique.

She was caught, denied it until you showed her proof, and then had no choice but to admit to it but said she loves the other man. Not unique.

You have let her set the terms for whether you get to read the emails (you don't) and how (or if) she ends things with him (she hasn't.) You haven't made her choose between you and him, so she hasn't. Not unique.

She got mad at you when you created problems for her and her boyfriend by (maybe) telling his wife. Not unique.

She broke NC, but somehow it's still your fault and she's mad at you. Not unique.

You don't want to lose her. You want her to choose you, to come back to you, to tell you it was all just a big mistake and that she must have been crazy to ever jeopardize your relationship. And your fear that she will not choose you if you force her to make a choice, is causing you to allow her to set the terms of your marriage. Not unique.

But that last one is deadly to your relationship. Look around this site. Look at the people who successfully reconciled, versus the ones who didn't. You'll see the successful ones set the terms for reconciliation and went nuclear when the terms weren't met.

Yes, some of those who set the terms lost their marriages when the WS chose freedom over the marriage, but they had the bonus of not having to endure the agony of living with an uncommitted spouse. If she is going to choose freedom, I say it is better to have her choose now. If she is going to choose marriage, there is no time like right this second to make that choice.

READ THAT AGAIN

Even now, if she is so scared, are you getting her begging you or pleading for another chance. Not at all. You are getting resentment that you fucking dared to interfere with her fun and did not patiently wait for HER to decide if she wanted any part of you any more.

AGAIN, DO YOU REALLY WANT TO RECONCILE WITH THAT IS SUCH A HURRY. ????

As predicted, today she is being asked for dates when she can do face-to-face management team meetings for a week. These usually happen in the OM's backyard. (not literally, but at his office in England)

This makes me sick to my stomach.

Her boss' admin was asking about dates in Aug/Sep. To say the least, this is too soon. She thinks it won't be until Oct before this happens but even then, all I am reminded of is that's when the physical part of the affair first happened.

This hit me harder than I thought it would.

How convenient.

You blow up her affair and she gets to go to UK in a few weeks for a week.

And it hits you hard.

ARE YOU GOING TO TAKE IT??????

Again, if you have a VAR in the car you will find out what is going on.

And how about telling if she goes to UK she is taking a polygraph when she gets back???

or do you just whimper away and accept what she told you.

ICO, something is wrong here. You have all the right ideas and just cannot seem to stand up to her on ANYTHING.

And if that does not change you are going to get whacked again as sure as you are breathing.

[This message edited by nononsense at 11:03 AM, July 29th (Wednesday)]

She has it in her head that I am punishing her. I haven't figured out what the hell she thinks I am doing as punishment.

Disregarding the England meeting, ^^THIS^^ is disconcerting from where I sit.

That is not a remorseful spouse's thinking.

I told you this would happen. Now I didn't realize that it would be 24 hours after the first no contact break. (well, no contact that never occurred to be fair).

Due to her affair she will be unable to perform her duties as an employee of the company. We can help you write the letter that you will ask her to deliver to HR if you'd like. There are probably 100 examples kicking around here.

Your wife is like a paint-by-numbers cheating wife. No surprises this one...

if you do not hand her divorce papers you are going to get run around like a money for months.

You can call it off if we all are wrong.

She is going to UK to fuck him again if she can. if you do not believe that, you are the only one who has read any of this that thinks that way.