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Last night we were getting ready for bed and I was "in the mood". Prior to that, my WW had complained about being tired, feeling overweight, etc. After I proposed sex to her, she responded with a "no". Frankly, I was annoyed and I told her I felt rejected. I explained that sex helps me feel connected with her. Since d-day, we've had an active sex life with some HB initially which has since settled down.

So then I said that I'm sure she never turned her AP down when he wanted sex. She responded by saying it was only once. I reminded her that while she may have only slept with him once (still wondering if that's true), they also had oral sex on several other occasions.

The whole conversation left me irritated. Honestly, it makes me not want to initiate sex anymore. Thoughts?

[This message edited by phoenix54 at 3:02 PM, October 11th (Thursday)]

Chances are you'll hear no sometimes. At least she's home and wants R.

Really tough to hear "no" after her trolling for other dick, IMHO. 5 yrs out it still sends me into a rage.

I wasn’t aware of the A at the time when mine was telling me no. It sucks I know that feeling too well. I never forced the issue because I have always believed, even in M, hounding or forcing myself in any way is rape and I will not go there. After being told no so many times I just started sleeping on the couch when I was in the mood, I just stopped asking.

wth . . . doubled posted

[This message edited by time2grow at 3:38 PM, October 11th (Thursday)]

Im lookin g at this as a woman,cheating aside for a minute. You said prior to you asking for sex,she was telling you she felt tired and fat. So,she wasn't feeling sexy. Not that it's your job to make her feel sexy,that's not what Im saying. But sometimes women just aren't in the mood. I know that infidelity clouds everything. But perhaps she is about to start her period,or she was just having an "off" day where she felt bad about herself and her appearance. I know when I feel fat I don't want to have sex. But,I could wake up the next morning and feel better about myself,and want to have sex.

The conversation you and your WW had,however,irritates me too. She doesn't sound very remorseful. And she is minimizing what she did by saying "only." She "only" had sex with hinm once..him being the OM..so "only" is a shitty thing to say. it's like saying,"I only killed your puppy once."

The "only" shit doesn't cut it with me.

Even in a healthy M, without infidelity, we all hear "no" at times... Unless the no is a punishment or every.single.time. then I dont think its abnormal.

I think that if her issues with not wanting sex are truly her own (tired/insecure), it's not an unfair concession for her to see that part of your healing is going to be not getting rejected sexually. I am by no means saying that she should have sex when she doesn't want to, I just think there's a grey area where the compassionate WS might be able to shelve a couple of their own issues to comfort their BS. On the other hand, the reality of any relationship is that you're not always going to be on the same page with sex, and it takes a lot of communicating to strike a healthy balance.

If you feel it's something deeper or more complicated than this, then it might warrant some counseling.

Even if she were just apologetic about not being in the mood, that would be easier to take than what sounds like her defensive and closed response to you.

I miss HB some days, and know that it can't always be like that. Search your feelings for whether this is a recurring and hurtful thing, or whether ANY rejection is going to trigger you, and how you can communicate that to her.

(((phoenix54)))

I am a woman and sometimes my WH says no. He says he is tired, etc. Like you, I felt rejected when he would say no and would think and tell him what you told your WW "I bet you didn't say no to OW".

After awhile I just stopped initiating. I was always amazed - I never thought a guy would turn down sex so I was crushed. It is better now, but honestly I still don't initiate - well I guess I do b/c all it takes him is a back scratch and he thinks that means I am in the mood

I was annoyed and I told her I felt rejected.

At that point your WW should have said "honey I love you, but I just feel disgusted with myself at this moment". That way she is at least acknowledging your feelings of rejection.

On the slim chance that I say no to my WH (which does happen - usually at 3am b/c I am in a dead sleep) I will explain to him when I wake up why I said no.

Did she ever say no before the A? Most likely she did, but the A has now just made the need to feel intimate with each other more important. IMHO. She needs to understand that.

The "only once" comment also pissed me off. And I did let her know that. While she's making progress, my WW is still sometimes in the mode of protecting her own feelings. Yes, I know it's crap.

NO?!?!

If I was you I would be extremely pissed off.

WSO never turned down OM, and rejected me for years. Any rejecting now would be a deal breaker for me. Of course if she were to be incredibly ill or something I would be understanding. Just being tired or not in the mood is not good enough for me. Even if she doesn't feel like intercourse, there's always BJs or HJs.

Really tough to hear "no" after her trolling for other dick, IMHO. 5 yrs out it still sends me into a rage.

This.

I agree with the other men here. She made the effort for her OM, she was horny for her OM. You deserve no less. And if she was giving blow jobs to the OM that she denied you, well....thats infuriating .

And I think you're being trickle truthed about the number of times they did it. Remember the rule of 3.

[This message edited by lm2024 at 12:14 AM, October 12th (Friday)]

I totally understand feeling rejected as a BS if the WS rejects you sexually. They certainly weren't telling the OW/OM "no".

But they also weren't living in reality when they were having an affair.

So, I don't think it's realistic, or healthy, to expect to never be told "no" by your WS unless said WS is comatose, has the plague, just had major surgery, gave birth 12 hours ago, their best friend just got run over by a bus, etc.

Healthy relationships happen in the real world, not happyflowerkittyland. And sometimes, in the real world, people are honestly tired, grumpy, feel gross or fat or bloated or just don't want to think about sex at all at the moment.

I would go so far as to say if a BS expects to never be told "no" to sex outside of very, very extreme circumstances because their WS had an affair, I'd consider the affair to be a deal breaker because that's just not a realistic, fair, or healthy expectation to have.

Affair sex is far more emasculating for a betrayed husband than a betrayed wife. This is why sex is part of the heavy lifting that a WW must involve herself in to help her BH feel safe and reassure him sexually by re-establashing that intimate physical bond. It also helps calm the mind movies that BHs have of their WW doing the nasty pornstar sex with her OM.

[This message edited by lm2024 at 2:00 AM, October 12th (Friday)]

It sounds like before you even tried to initiate she let you know she wasn't in the mood. Why was that not worth respecting? One major issue (for me) in my M was that my husband would initiate sex at times that he clearly knew I was not feeling well (a couple of days after kidney stones?!) but that never mattered to him and it infuriated me. It showed me sex was just an act for him and what he wanted mattered more then my feeling sick or XYZ. There was never enough sex for him. You stated that your sex life has been active since dday, so I'm not sure I understand why hearing "no", when you already knew how she was feeling, was such a big deal.

I also understand the "we only had sex once" in response to you saying you figured she old never turn down the AP for sex. Clearly sex with an OM is unacceptable in any amount, but how could sex with him one time show that she never turned him down, unless he was just never asking.

Anyway, I think we are all human, we are not sex objects to be used at others whims, and I think some understanding if we are not in the mood sometimes is expected. (btw, I am speaking from a pov of having had sexual abuse in my life. I have many strong feelings about the expectation of sex just because a partner is in the mood. Sex should be more then an act and for me, when my husband wanted it regardless of whether I did and I gave in, I just felt dirty, used and resentful afterwards. Not sure if those responses are normal or more linked o my history).

[This message edited by thenon-goddess at 6:45 AM, October 12th (Friday)]

Affair sex is far more emasculating for a betrayed husband than a betrayed wife. This is why sex is part of the heavy lifting that a WW must involve herself in to help her BH feel safe and reassure him sexually by re-establashing that intimate physical bond. It also helps calm the mind movies that BHs have of their WW doing the nasty pornstar sex with her OM.

For real? As a male, how would you have any idea how a woman feels about sex after her partner cheats? I guess since we're not masculine it would be true that it is "more emasculationg" but A damage women in ways that rip them of their confidence sexually as well. That aside, no person should be "expected" to have sex just because another person wants it. There certainly are more compassionate ways to say "no" then the way this op's ww did, but some expectation that she should always put out now when he wants it lacks compassion as well.

[This message edited by thenon-goddess at 9:49 AM, October 12th (Friday)]

I think if your WW had already communicated to you that she felt tired and overweight, it was probably not that much of a surprise that she wasn't feeling sexy and horny. You said that post-dday you guys have had an active sex life, so it doesn't sound like a chronic issue but just an off period. And IMO those are normal in a marriage for women and men alike. Especially when you have 4 kids.

My FWH doesn't get horny when he's stressed, and so when he's working on a deadline and his hair is standing straight up, I can reasonably expect that if I told him I was horny he'd say sorry but he wasn't in the mood. It's not as if I didn't have fair warning.

Also while I completely agree that "just once" is a teeth grindingly unacceptable way to describe or defend an affair, when WS use it in that context - I get why she might have phrased it that way when you directly compare her not being in the mood one particular night in your marriage to "never" saying no to the single incident of sex with OM.

You feel how you feel when your spouse turns down sex, so I don't know how you "should" feel, but in the case you're describing here it sounds like something pretty normal. I get why you're annoyed and I also think it's something that you can work on as a couple. Finding ways to make each other feel desirable. You helping her feel more sexy and desirable, her making you feel wanted. Two way street.

It sounds like you are in R and that is great. One "no" when having an active sex life after D-day is not a huge deal. If it turns into a pattern, you might be concerned. Some of us are not so lucky to be in R.

I always used to respect my wife turning me down, and I never took it personally. It certainly never made me angry or sad.. maybe disappointed at the most.

Post D-day, you can count me as another man that can not handle rejection very well.

At first I said the typical, "I guess you just like sex with people like OM" or "you were never too tired for OM" and I would just wind up feeling guilty, because I some level I know she was just tired.

I'm ashamed of having said those things to her, and I generally respond nicely now, but to be real honest, it still hurts like hell now when she turns me down. I still think those things in my head, but I don't say them. I just lay there with a huge gaping hole in my chest feeling rejected and pissed. I try to just stare at the wall, try to calm down, and go to sleep eventually.

Sorry I have no advice, and I have no idea if how you should feel.. I just know I think I am right there with you on this, so maybe it's normal (not saying healthy) for betrayed men??

so maybe it's normal (not saying healthy) for betrayed men??

I think it is a normal response for a betrayedperson

period, not just men. However, I don't think that this gives the BS the right to infringe upon the rights of the WS. Being someone who wears both hats on this issue I understand that there are times where as a BH my H may feel rejected when I say no simply because I don't feel like it. I can make sure he understands that it has nothing to do with him. In the long run, I am not obligated to have sex with him simply because I am a WS. Just as he is not obligated to have sex with me because he is a WS.