SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

When do you know it is done? Or, we are ready to reconcile?

When you see her actions demonstrating she is showing remorse and she is willing to do ANYTHING to repair the marriage. Then and only then should you consider the decision to R and start to process of learning to how to choke down this steamy shit sandwich. Once you see her actions demonstrating she is worth the yeoman's effort it takes to deal with the fall out, then some of us choose to R. It is not a decision to be taken lightly. Even with a W who is willing to be all in, learning to eat the shit sandwich is a long arduous Journey. In my first M,I choose divorce. It took about 6 months to get my bearings on things. You don't need to make that decision now, you need to keep safe, set up boundaries. Show her you don't need the marriage you had. Its dead, Don't mount the dead horse. Start making plans. your questions below are a start.

Finding places, making lists of items and finances to divide?

All things I did. I picked out appts in paper called, left them out for her to see. Divided assets on paper, left it out for her to see. She needs to know your not tethered to her broken sorry ass. Your no longer married!. She threw that marriage out. You need to choose a new marriage down the road. For now act like its time to move on, keep exploring options and watching her behaviors.

LHAP?

I am not sure about the Divorce info but...

I looked on meetup but nothing yet.

I am going out tonight maybe with coworkers but no reply so I may be alone. Should pick up a lady friend!!

When do you know it is done?

Or, we are ready to reconcile?

Should I be preparing for my "exit".

When you are Divorce is when it is done.

Your WW is still checking on the OM, no R yet.

Yes prep for your exit by staying the course of the D.

Way too soon for "Meetup" or lady friends. Sorry Felco. You are still married. You will have to lay low until this D is final.

You don't want to become a wayward!

Go out on the town, look good when you do but none of that other stuff...K?

Your doing great!

I know I am not ready for a fling, not that kind of guy.

Plus, I want to set a good example to my kids and let them know that their Papa did the best he could to be in this family and it was not his fault.

I am wavering on to file for D or not.

What is 2x4 an LHAP?

She came into the room to shower, I picked up my stuff and walked out. She laughingly says" you really don't want to be near me"

I said nothong and walked out.

Felco -

Get your financials in order, go through your personal stuff get rid of old clothes, and get organized if you aren't. Stay physically busy.

DO NOT, and I cannot say this strongly enough DO NOT even think about finding a "lady friend" or "hooking up" with someone. This comes much much later. Dude you are broken, hurt, and sad. You are not in a good frame of mind to start another relationship. I am a FIRM believer that as a BS we tend to loose who we are, we are so focused on the relationship, and our spouses that we loose who we are, and how to be happy just being ourselves. You absolutely HAVE to do this, figure out and make your own happiness. Learn how to be content alone. Once you do that, then you can consider possibly starting a new relationship, and when the D is final.

You need to find hobbies and intrests you enjoy, you need to go hang out with the guys, if you like doing outdoors stuff do it. If you like doing something crafty do it. Call a friend, go to a movie, Skype your family. All these things are focusing on you. IN addition you need to making specific times to spend with the kids, and doing it alone, no mom, no nanny, you and your kids, because that is going to be what your life will be like. Know that you can manage them, and enjoy the time with them.

Your priorities right now should be

You , Your children, and that's it. Protecting, providing, and making happy.

Oh and I would NOT move out, I would make if very uncomfortable for her to stay, so that she chooses to leave, or you mutually agree to sell the maritial home and live elsewhere.

What is 2x4 an LHAP?

A 2x4 is a figurative word for a 2x4 upside the head. A statement made to rattle the cage and is harsh in its honesty. LHAP? is lordhasaplan? my username..

Look if your not ready to file that is cool, while we all think its a reasonable course, it took me 6 months to get there. You need to keep working the 180 watching her and start with small things. the night away to do something enjoyable. The separation of finances on paper. each is a little step toward making a mental and physical break. All the while watch her behavior what is it telling you? right now, its not remorse.

I am wavering on to file for D or not.

Dude...divorce papers are a huge reality check - your wife needs one of those...

If she should decide to remove that fence post from her ass (and you choose R) you can always halt the divorce proceedings....but by filing you will show her that you do not intend to keep a wife that is in "love" with another man...

There needs to be consequences to her behavior....and you will NOT nice guy her back into your marriage....draw a line, Dude.....and back It up....time to go "Alpha male" on her.....she is disrespecting both you and your marriage....you do not deserve this...

A lot of Affairs will go underground at this point....do NOT have your head in the sand....

Keep us posted...

Bufffalo

Please remember, that you can file for divorce, have her served, and until the very moment you go up in front of that judge for the dissolution of marriage, you can stop or pause the entire process. Filing and having her served DOES NOT mean that a divorce is automatic. It will not happen unless you get to the point that you are in front of that judge and it's adjudicated. Me going to my lawyer and having the separation papers drawn up and ready to be served to him the moment he got a job (he had been laid off) was what ripped the last bit of fog from his eyes and convinced him that this was real shit. I was 3/4 of the way out the door. Make no mistake though, had that not happened, I was going all the way out. I had just expedited my exit.

Let me also 3rd/4th the statement that you do not want to be involved, however peripherally, with any other woman at this time. Set aside the fact that you're married. You are carrying too much baggage right now to be able to be a blessing to any decent woman that you would meet. And you do not want to be the type of man that trifles with a good woman's affections.

I don't think anyone ever accidentally got divorced. It's a huge pain to finish a divorce even if both of you agree on everything. And the courts want money for it, or they want proof you can't afford it.

And you may not believe it, but you can get to a place where you're independent, happy, and content being single. Not that you're forced to be single or can't find anyone. Just that you feel at peace with yourself and your life starts to bring you joy again. It's better to get to this place first.

Plus, I want to set a good example to my kids and let them know that their Papa did the best he could to be in this family and it was not his fault.

The BEST example you can set for your kids is to show them to NOT be anyone's doormat. If one of your children were married and their spouse was doing this, what would you tell them? Would you tell them to be kind, loving, and act like all is fine because 'they want to set an example'? No, of course not.

There is an example to set here - it's to have self respect and to accept nothing less but respect from others. No child ever said "Well, my dad didn't date right away - he did the right thing.". That conversation has never happened, ever. What will happen is 'Yeah, my parents got divorced. My dad caught my mom out whorin' it, and he left her. Can't blame him, right?"

I've heard this exact conversation when I was a teenager. I've also heard this one "Yea, my dad cheated, but mom didn't do anything. He still treats her like crap and she just takes it." - mind you , this same girl treated her mother HORRIBLY. The disrespect was so deep and constant.

Yes, there are examples to be set from how you allow yourself to be treated. Don't show that you will accept disrespect. It will say that 1) your kids should accept being disrespected, and 2) you don't demand respect, and you won't get it.

Your wife is the one that is going to struggle when they're older, not you. Unless - you let your wife continue with her me me me bullshit and you just accept it.

'

I am wavering on to file for D or not

Why? You can stop it at any time. I she changes, great. Stop the divorce. If not - you've already got the ball rolling.

She came into the room to shower, I picked up my stuff and walked out. She laughingly says" you really don't want to be near me"

I said nothing and walked out.

Great job!! Why is she walking into rooms you're in anyway? Is this the bathroom off of your bedroom? Doesn't another bathroom in the house have a shower?

Box up all of her toiletries in the master bath. ALL of them - and bring the box into the other bathroom. Don't break anything, or spill, or destroy in any way. Then go to her and let her know

Let her know that since she is no longer using the bedroom, you'd appreciate her using the other bathroom too, and then let he know that you've already moved all of her things out of the master bath.Then walk away again@@

Good Morning everyone.

For myself, I decided to detach myself from the OM and OMW. I will no longer speak with her.

I also will leave the past in the past and not shove my anger and resentment in her face.

I decided that by me telling her that he does not love her and she did this and feels that is the wrong course of action for my healing ang growing. I will refocus the energy from anger and frustration on me.

I will not be a "bitter bitch" and will be pleasant and respectful but keep the conversations to a minimum. I also will be returning to couples counciling so we can navigate this seperation with a mediator.

I am finding ways to acceptance and forgiveness for myself.

I spoke with her on Friday about what I just wrote.

She cried and said that she has remorse but just couldn't show it when we are angry.

She stated that she is in a self discovery mode. She does not know who she was or is.

She stated that she will have to let him and I go in order to find herself.

I agreed that I will be letting her go and moving forward for me.

In the end I want ALL of us to be happy.

I will continue working on my "exit plan".

It is a hard realiztion that this "family" may be broken apart.

I know I will be stronger no matter what.

Patience and forgiveness is what is needed.

I will not be a "bitter bitch"

This is the second time you've made such a comment implying that the members here are bitter. Most of the 'bitter' people here reconciled with their spouse.

Your wife 'couldn't' talk to you when you were angry because she had to admit that she caused your anger. You decided to let her off the hook so now she'll be nice and say idiotic things like 'I have to let you both go to find myself'.

Good luck Felco. Just because the advice of people that have lived this life and come out the other side with their marriages in tact isn't what you were comfortable with doesn't mean that we are bitter.

Best wishes. I hope you continue to post here if it helps you, or if getting things off of your chest is a comfort. Good luck, sincerely.

My comment was certainly not implying that anyone on here is bitter. I was speaking g for myself. I apologize if I offended anyone.

I don't feel like Felco implied that there are bitter bitches on this site at all. Not sure why anyone would think that.

Good Morning everyone.

I have not posted in a few days and things have gone all over the place.

I am sure I am going to get A LOT of criticism for what I am about to write.

I found a place for me that is authentic to me and has given me calmness and feeling less out of control.

In my last post I told you all that I sat down and had a conversation with my WW.

Telling her that really helped. So, on Sunday evening I came home from work and I opened up to her on where I am at emotionally. She responded really well and had a hard cry while holding onto me.

She did say that she is not seeing him but her strong feelings for him are still there. She stated that she feels that she was and is not done with us now or before the affair.

So, I was left with the same options: leave completly, keep it the same and seperate, or suck it up and try to work on the marriage.

I decided to leave again for a couple of days.

She asked me a few times to not leave.

I told her that I am left with not much options and I can't be second.

So, I left for 3 days.

During that time she called me and texted me a in the morning and night.

I came to the conclusion the day I left that I want my family together.

I feel that trying to keep my family together is the best option. So, that means I am willing to accept that she is going through a process and will allow her to find herself while I am here for the kids and family.

She is very confused and is now questioning the OM and if she was duped. She said that she has unaswered questions because it stopped abruptly. She wants him to tell her that he was done.

She said her gut feeling is always right and does not understand how she could be wrong.

She is also questioning our relationship because she had the affair and why she would do that to me.

Her therapist and hair dresser told her that they feel like its over but she doesnt know what to beleive.

She is showing the signs of remorse, according to the post in the healing library.

She has said that she likes these past few conversations and that I have been softer and less dominant.

There is so much more to write but I think I will stop.

This morning she gave me a one arm hug and kissed me on the lips.

What I needs to be done at this point is being separated and giving her time while slowly growing together.

The OM is leaving the building soon.

When I was doing the 180, it created much more tension and confusion.

I felt like I was not being true to me.

Questions:

Is it normal for WW to become very confused and want to be alone?

Is it normal for WW to find spirituality?

Do I contact the OM or OMW again and ask if he will tell her how he feels?

Any suggestions

Thank you all again and I know there will be some criticism but I can take it.

Is it normal for WW to become very confused and want to be alone?

Is it normal for WW to find spirituality?

Do I contact the OM or OMW again and ask if he will tell her how he feels?

WW's are by definition confused. they have wrapped themselves and clouded their minds with lies and coping mechanisms that allowed them to walk this path.

I think any time people are confused and their life seems to crash turning to religion is a response for many.

DO NOT contact him and ask him to speak to your wife. Any contact she can turn into what every she wants. My W talked to him and they decided they cold be friends, ten they decided they couldn't but it was only because... he really couldn't say how he really feels.... etc. No contact means no new hurts. Silence is the best way for your W to detach from that made up relationship.

Oh and this constant changing feelings and battle is normal. You need to continue to demand your 1st. You need to draw a line in the sand at some point and make her decide. This is the only way she may shake her feelings for the OM.

I am sure I am going to get A LOT of criticism for what I am about to write.

If by criticism you mean the occasional 2x4 because we want to point out the problems we see then maybe. Please understand that our only goal is to help you heal.

She wants him to tell her that he was done.

Danger Will Robinson!!! Danger!!! First of all he already told her that. He has. He went NC. He's leaving his job. He has already told her this in word and deed. He just has. She does not want to accept it. Why? Because she thinks if she can talk to him privately then he'll tell her how doesn't really want to end it, that she is his "Twin Flame" () and how he is only doing this because his BW is making or some crap like that. Also, her wanting him to tell her he is done is basically saying "I want to be sure my first choice...the OM...is definitely not an option." That is plan-b'ing you which you don't deserve.

She is also questioning our relationship because she had the affair and why she would do that to me.

I've mentioned on SI before that I came across a forum where a lot of WW posted. ALL OF THEM said the same thing. "I must not have truly loved my BH if I could feel this way about MM" and many of them divorced their BH so they could be with the MM, right? Nope. So they could be the OW to a MM. They mistook lurv for love and thought the two were mutually exclusive. You put all of your thoughts and energy into a fantasy relationship and your tru lurv () then of course your emotional connection to your spouse is going to suffer. It's not rocket science.

Her therapist and hair dresser told her that they feel like its over but she doesnt know what to beleive.

I am assuming they are referring to her "relationship" with OM? If so then you should take of a couple of things here. She is still persisting in holding onto her fantasy about OM. She wants to prove everyone wrong. It's almost like the more people who try to introduce reality into the equation the more she wants to believe the A was "real". Also, I would be concerned about taking advice from her hairdresser. I know it's not uncommon. The hairdresser is sort of a friend but removed enough for her to feel objective in a strange way. What concerns is whether the hairdresser knew about the A to begin with. If she did then she is not a friend of the marriage. Also, a hairdresser's expertise is not in relationship counseling. She does not know you or your life beyond what WW tells her during her visits which are no more frequent (I hope) than her visits to her trained and educated IC. That is just a red flag to me.

Do I contact the OM or OMW again and ask if he will tell her how he feels?

NOOOOOOOO!!!

This will come across to them as "Please help me win back my wife."

If they are in true R then the BW won't want her WH to speak to your WW at all. If I were the BW I would be fearful that I was giving the OW (your WW) another chance to try to woo my WH away again. In fact it would be giving that chance with her blessing. That is the best case scenario. Worst case is where OM still has his head up his arse enough that being asked to tell your WW how he feels ("Please let her know it's over so she can move." is feeding a gargantuan dose of ego kibbles to him and that is the last thing a WS who may still be struggling with the wayward mindset needs.

Felco...you are still trying to fix this. You cannot fix this. Your WW broke the family because she is the one who is broken. She has to fix herself.

I respect that you want to keep your family together. I understand that you love her and are willing to endure this pain to see this through to achieve R. You have to absolutely accept that this isn't solely your choice. Your WW made a lot of choices and did a lot of damage. You can't make her responsible for them. She is responsible for them. You have to hold her accountable for it. That is truly how you can see this to a healthy M if that is even possible.

The 180 is for you. To help you detach so you can make healthier choices and focus on yourself.

It's perfectly normal for all parties involved in a traumatic event to be all over the place, emotionally. The roller-coaster isn't just for us BSes.

So a few thoughts:

She did say that she is not seeing him but her strong feelings for him are still there.

Of course they are. This is something I've discussed with my fWW, when she's had a spike of "affection" or "I miss [AP]." As much as I subjectively hate saying it, my wife and her AP had fun together. He made her feel special and loved at a time in her life when she wasn't feeling that at home, and in return she did that for him at a time when he was feeling unlovable due to some post-deployment issues. I'm not saying that these feelings were a good thing, nor that they were a healthy or constructive thing, but they were and to try and pretend otherwise would be lying to ourselves.

So, sure, your wife is still dealing with the aftermath of her emotions. They're still strong right now, but if she makes the choice to commit herself to her relationship with you, then they should fade. I think we'll all admit to having had strong feelings for pre-marriage boy/girlfriends, but those feelings faded over time for one reason or another.

I'd still be cautious. In your situation I'd still make sure I knew my legal and financial options, and would make sure they're up to date. But that doesn't mean that you can't try to move towards the future you want.

I'd set up a timeline of what I'd accept, though. You don't have to share it with your wife, it's not about pressuring her it's just about helping you keep your life on track and moving towards a healthy future.

In the end, that's really all the 180 is about anyway: helping you take control of your future. If you're finding another way, or even if you want to try and invent another way for yourself, to do that then that's your choice. Just make sure you keep moving forward.

Well, to me, if the pain that an A caused to all around the two involved are not enough to immediately see it for the disgusting act of selfishness that it was, and thoughts of it bring anything but shame to the WS, I'd bail immediately. It's bad enough that they did something so cheap and treated us like we didn't matter at all, but to watch them miss the person and actions that caused all of my pain and the destruction in my life?

Not a chance. Not for a single second. If a person can see the destruction acts bring, and think fondly of those acts, they are still very much the selfish nothing that had the A in the first place.

Good Luck Felco. Seriously, if this is what you want, good luck.

Is it normal for WW to find spirituality?

Oh, they're usually so lost and broken that they're willing to try to grab onto anything they can think of. My WH is an atheist. That's what he has always said. We don't go to church, I've never known him to be interested at all. As soon as our marriage blew up, he told me one week he was going to church on Sunday and I was welcome to come along. I think I had to work, and he never went. I think he said he tried to go one time but the service had started earlier than he expected. He talked about it for a few weeks, said he didn't know where/when to go, I mentioned a couple of churches he could try, but nothing ever came of it. I remember asking why he wanted to go, and he right out said that he was so lost that he wondered if that's what he needed. I dunno, at least at that point he recognized that he was lost and had to do *something*.