SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Happy New Year! Here's to 2015! (Hopefully, the year of no lies!)

WH went to the get-together with his friends, I discussed previously. He decided on his own to come home at 9pm. He drank very little which was also his plan. He created a plan for himself and then followed through. I was amazed! So, far he appears to be doing everything right in regard to R.

I am doing ok, I guess. I've reached out to some old friends: some moms from the homeschool group I used to be a member of. I've fully disclosed to one of the women. She is also a victim of her husband's affairs (9 years ago), so it was awesome to talk to someone face to face about this hell. I'll probably tell the rest of the ladies eventually. I hate feeling like I have a secret.

The news is driving me crazy this morning: law enforcement appreciation day! Yes, thank you Detective OW(#3) for fucking my husband. You exemplify the ideal of an honest,above reproach law enforcement officer! So many triggers.

(I am a LEO also and have many family members (male and female) who are officers. I appreciate and love them, of course, but ,lately, female officers trigger me)

UnwiseOne,

It seems we are on a similar path. I also had a partial hysterectomy due to andenomyosis, but a year before I found out all there was to find out. My d-day was in 2012 and I do understand all you are feeling. The feeling that your whole life was a lie, I get that. I read the article you posted and was in tears, thank you for that posting.

Just wanted to let you know I understand the pain and hear you.

TL xx

Thanks TLxx.

About your WH possibly being a SA (from your signature): I wonder that about mine. His IC didn't seem to be very concerned when WH brought in his score from an online assessment he completed. Otherwise, his IC seems to be pretty good. WH comes his with homework about every time. The counselor seems to think WH has self esteem issues. So far, this seems to be correct.

I need to go back an read that article again too!

Overdue update? Tonight was not good. He still is very reluctant to tell me some detail(s) about his last time with OW3. ( let's call her LK, since that's her initials). My brain is on overdrive. What could be so horrible that he cannot tell me. If I insisted he tell me, he would- but I'm terrified. I'm also drunk and downstairs on the couch. How can I sleep with these thoughts in my head?

He's told me terrible things. What could be worse? I can barely think of i t.

More updates: on the positive side... seriously - my moods have evened out. We talk every day.

Bad: too much alcohol involved maybe. I still wish every day that none of this was true.

We see our marriage counselor every other week.

He sees his individual counselor every other week. I see mine a little more sporadically.

Tonight. I don't know why it's harder. It just is. He fell asleep. I'm still up. :(

[This message edited by UnwiseOne at 9:08 AM, February 28th (Saturday)]

6 months from DD1 & 4 months from DD2

Haircut time again. I feel like doing something different, but I don't know what. Change my haircut/color maybe then I can pretend to be someone else- someone with a healthy marriage who has a best friend to turn to. Or I could be a single person who focuses on my career. I could be safe in my introvert hamster ball- free from emotional complications.

I just don't think I can compete with his memories of the excitement of forbidden sex- new parters. The chase.

He knows me too well. He gets very little excitement from seeing me naked. My kisses are predictable.

I suppose I am not having a good morning. Hopefully, my day will get better after my cut and color. I suppose I will suppose I will go with the same cut and color. I am predictable and boring after all.

Once the HB stops, once the shock wears off, and once the reality of the situation starts to sink in, R can be very very hard. The anger is palpable. IMO the 6-12 month range and 12-18 mo range are harder than the first six months.

Why do you say he does not get excited to see you naked? Your words or his?

To me exciting sex is when it is combined with love and fidelity. Knowing eachothers bodies and the best ways to please eachother. If your husband is not making you feel desired and beautiful, you are not in R. That is just one of the many things he has to do for the rest of your marriage. This is going to be hard. An emotional rollarcoaster. You are going to want to quit and if you choose to, you have beyond enough reasons. I hope we can help you through the next months. Also, stop running yourself down with disparaging remarks. Those accomplish nothing. His fucked up decisions do not define you.

I am trying to R after one affair and it's the hardest thing I have ever done. I totally get it.

It is so hard to love someone who has a past of deceit, we think we know them but truly after this we do not. Yet they cry and they beg and they plead with us after they have been naughty, like children, and we somehow see this as love. We think why would this person be begging me to be with them, to ask me to take care of them, to help them see their faults? They MUST need me. I can help them be a better person, I can help them to stop being a bad person and only love me, if only I can make them see this......

Does this sound familiar to you? After all you have found out do you still feel you can save him? We BS's say we are "saving the marriage". We confuse this with love....and please know I do not want to slam you with a 2x4, I am just saying I get it.... with children, years, houses, bills, IRA's, family members, friends, relationships....so much involved, so much left adrift in a sea of lies and betrayal. He ruined this, not you.

But until you get to the point where you finally see you can't save him and he is the one who ruined the marriage, not you, and you can't save the marriage and you cannot unring this bell....you will continue to flounder in this abyss of trying to figure out how to make it better.....I hear this throughout your whole post. 6 pages.

Add in the fact that this was with what you thought was your friend, your former "best friend" who is not harmless in all of this, yet adds a whole other layer. Many people here have bashed your friend, I will say I agree and think she is no longer a friend, but after you have learned of so many betrayals by your H thru the years don't you think your husband is the serial cheater? He is not innocent, he has done this multiple times, he knows what he is doing.

We care, and on this board we truly do know how you feel. Yet I hear you in your posts and you are not there yet, you flounder and work on ways to think you need to cut your hair or be better looking or blaming it on the OW's. Your H has never come clean with you until pushed, he has tortured you and trickled truthed you to the point of madness, yet acts like the innocent and allows you to continue to dig and plead and beg and dance around him to get to some kind of truth.

Thus hysterical bonding. You cling to the person who you thought you knew for years, you are so sure you know them that somehow during the most intimate act you will FEEL, or you will KNOW them. They cannot lie to you during this moment, can they? How could they?

You will ignore this message because you are not there yet, you will continue to think you can save him....I would just tell you to go back to IC for yourself, go once a week if not twice a week....find your own happiness and find your center again. It is there, you are a strong woman, but I hope you finally stop swirling around him and his needs and his wants and his dysfunctions and start only helping yourself.

Just know we understand. We get it. How horrible an act this is. Add in that the last OW was your best friend, add in that you now know it was with multiple people. For years.

I can't say it any better than realitybites.

My true happiness and peace is before me. I see a glimmer of it and it has absolutely nothing to do with my WH but everything to do with learning to love myself. He cheated because he is broken. If he cheats again it is because of his own demons. He makes his choices and I make mine. There is something very empowering in coming to that place. I will be happy and healthy no matter what he chooses.

UnwiseOne,

I have the words, I try to put them into actions, too often easier said than done, but. . .It is hard to move forward, so hard. But, I do think there are some steps that can help. Some you have to take. Some he can take.

1. You have to forgive yourself for not seeing it. Let go of the "should've, would've, could've, if onlys." What your husband did is completely on him and NOTHING to do with you. I know, easier said than done. But, truth none-the-less. Blind trust is something we gave and it is gone. And, that is ok. With that now gone, we can start learning to TRUST our intuition. While we are building that trust in ourselves, there are things our partner can do to help us feel safe(r).

2. Words, love, support, day-to-day actions to show his love, remorse and change of habits and patterns are so necessary and important. Still, you need a foundation of safety. You need to know that there are no more secrets out there waiting to hit you out-of-the-blue. We cannot live with that out there possibly waiting to pounce on us at some date in the future. You need to know you are truly starting at ground-zero to move forward. Has your husband taken a polygraph yet?

3. You need to know that your husband is bearing some of the risk of R too. Has your husband given you the post-nuptial agreement with infidelity clause (or if not legal in your state, a separation agreement that could be immediately implemented should the need arise).

Counseling is, of course, a good thing. Wishing you the best. TL xx

[This message edited by TigerLilyxx at 3:43 PM, February 28th (Saturday)]

Thank you for everyone who has responded Many times I feel isolated still because I don't have any close friends to share with. I have WH, my counselor, and a few ladies I go to lunch with once a month (I have shared about WH's affairs with one of them, but we don't talk regulary).

Chce-

IMO the 6-12 month range and 12-18 mo range are harder than the first six months.

Why do you say he does not get excited to see you naked? Your words or his?

My observation. I've also asked him that. He acknowledged it is something he's working on. I think he broke his brain with porn at one time. I am not fat. That I know. But, I have had 3 children and I am 5'2. I will never have long legs. I will never be big breasted (unless I get surgery- and I will never do that at this point, because I won't play into his big-breasted (former?) fantasies). I know I have body image issues. His As have messed with my mind.

If your husband is not making you feel desired and beautiful, you are not in R. Also, stop running yourself down with disparaging remarks. Those accomplish nothing.

I am trying to R after one affair and it's the hardest thing I have ever done. I totally get it.

I am glad to hear I am not "crazy" for feeling like this: 6-12 months out- I think maybe a lot of the shock is wearing off. I'd like to think I'm thinking more rationally these days (I think I am most days), but when I posted on Saturday, I was having a bad day. I should pop in here one day, when I am having a really good day, so everyone can see that!

I have felt like he doesn't find me attractive for a long time...before DD1 and DD2. I think we were both taking each other for granted (him- definately ). I was in a rut. I got in a routine of turning him down sexually, especially if it was after 9pm. I was practically married to my schedule. I "needed" my eight hours of sleep more than I was willing to be sexual with my husband. I regret that. I regret we didn't talk about it and figure it out. But, I know, in spite of that, he still should have never, never committed adultery. I do feel I shoved him in that direction (at least a little).

**

realitybites-

But until you get to the point where you finally see you can't save him and he is the one who ruined the marriage, not you, and you can't save the marriage and you cannot unring this bell....you will continue to flounder in this abyss of trying to figure out how to make it better.....I hear this throughout your whole post. 6 pages.

Add in the fact that this was with what you thought was your friend, your former "best friend" who is not harmless in all of this, yet adds a whole other layer. Many people here have bashed your friend, I will say I agree and think she is no longer a friend, but after you have learned of so many betrayals by your H thru the years don't you think your husband is the serial cheater? He is not innocent, he has done this multiple times, he knows what he is doing.Just know we understand. We get it. How horrible an act this is. Add in that the last OW was your best friend, add in that you now know it was with multiple people. For years.

Yes, he is a serial cheater. And yes, I desperately wish this bell could be unrung. I think I am beginning to get angry. I really don't think I've gotten angry too much yet. For the first few days after DD1, I was. After DD2, I was stunned (but not really surprised). But I have not really had an anger stage yet. I think most of my feelings have been utter sadness. I really think I don't "do" emotions well. I've been a emotions-stuffer most of my life because I like to keep the peace. I like stability and predictability. Perhaps I am stuffing my anger? Redirecting it at the OW that lives down the street? I will have to ponder this.

**

TigerLilyxx-

I have the words, I try to put them into actions, too often easier said than done, but. . .It is hard to move forward, so hard. But, I do think there are some steps that can help. Some you have to take. Some he can take.

1. You have to forgive yourself for not seeing it. Let go of the "should've, would've, could've, if onlys." What your husband did is completely on him and NOTHING to do with you. I know, easier said than done. But, truth none-the-less. Blind trust is something we gave and it is gone. And, that is ok. With that now gone, we can start learning to TRUST our intuition. While we are building that trust in ourselves, there are things our partner can do to help us feel safe(r).

Some days, I do really well and know confidently 100% I had nothing to do with his decisions. Other days, I am 80%, and for short bursts I am at 0%. Most of the time when I post here, it's when I am doing badly. Thank God the 0% times are getting more and more infrequent.

2. Words, love, support, day-to-day actions to show his love, remorse and change of habits and patterns are so necessary and important. Still, you need a foundation of safety. You need to know that there are no more secrets out there waiting to hit you out-of-the-blue. We cannot live with that out there possibly waiting to pounce on us at some date in the future. You need to know you are truly starting at ground-zero to move forward. Has your husband taken a polygraph yet?

No. He has not taken a polygraph. He has said he will. I have not asked him to yet. I am fearful there is more to know. I remember what DD1 and DD2 felt like. Can I take more? I know, but can I live wondering if there are more lies? Somedays, I feel like I'd be perfectly willing to accept everything as it is and not dig more. I know a polygraph would settle my brain. I know.

3. You need to know that your husband is bearing some of the risk of R too. Has your husband given you the post-nuptial agreement with infidelity clause (or if not legal in your state, a separation agreement that could be immediately implemented should the need arise).

I have not looked into this. Actually, what am I thinking? He needs to do the research on this...not me. And if he says our state doesn't do this- I will double check myself. What do you mean a "separation agreement?" An agreement we could up with ourselves?

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you again. I need to hear these things. I need to keep my brain turning and not settle for not knowing things for sure. He needs to do the polygraph. He needs to tell me that thing he doesn't want to tell me about his last encounter with OW3. I need to schedule an individual counseling session (last one was about 2.5 weeks ago).

[This message edited by UnwiseOne at 8:46 AM, March 3rd (Tuesday)]

((((Onwise One))))),

It is a hard road, no way around that!

Do that polygraph. Make sure you find someone who has years of experience with law enforcement, perhaps get a recommendation if you can. They should not allow for any questions based on emotions, you should not be present for the actual test. They will have you present pretest to go over your questions, word them appropriately, etc. Mindless wrote a timeline of everything, then he was asked essentially if there was anything he was withholding, omitting, or lying about relating to his sexual actions with others. I don't remember the words, but that is the idea. There were several questions around that theme. It is very specific, targeted, yes and no questions only.

On the post-nuptial, we had two lawyers. He had his lawyer draw up the post-nuptial and my lawyer review it, make amendments, edits, deletions, etc. . .It wasn't cheap, but it was worth it. If it must be a separation agreement, again use the attorneys. He took the initiative on this for many reasons: 1) to show me how committed he was to making me safe, 2) to show that he did this of his own free will, his decision, no coercion, 3) to ensure that provisions were as giving as possible to me without being unconscionable (lawyers know that level better than we do), and 4) in business law any ambiguities present are ruled in favor of the person who did not write the contract.

I don't know what you guys will think about this suggestion, but I am going to throw it out there anyway. At night, in bed, just lie naked together, spoon, hold each other, lots of skin contact, without an expectation of sex. Something about doing this has really increased our sense of intimacy. Try it for a few nights and see. Just a thought. . . .

TL xx

[This message edited by TigerLilyxx at 11:14 AM, March 3rd (Tuesday)]

Things seems to be going well. I've found a new counselor who seems really promising. I'll be seeing her next Tuesday. I feel stuck in many ways. I need a counselor who will give me homework. My last one just gave me an audience. Not helpful at all.

Husband surprised me yesterday when he gave me a summary of his counseling session. It ended with them not scheduling another session. His counselor said he wasn't going to discharge him yet, but thought they should leave the next date to when WH feels like he needs a session. This scares me. I don't think he's ready for that. :( I feel like they didn't even touch on his addictive tendencies. I see so many changes in him however. I really think he's changed tremendously.

We booked a Disneyland vacation for the end of June. We will be celebrating our 22nd anniversary. I am really looking forward to some vacation time. I'm even looking forward to spending it with him. Two years ago, but we went to Disney World for our 20th anniversary, I was nervous about spending so much time with him. We didn't have much of a relationship. We were mostly TV watching-buddies. (It was also before DD1 and DD2).

[This message edited by UnwiseOne at 5:05 PM, May 7th (Thursday)]

I am so sorry you are going through this! Good luck, and stay strong!

His counselor said he wasn't going to discharge him yet, but thought they should leave the next date to when WH feels like he needs a session. This scares me. I don't think he's ready for that. :( I feel like they didn't even touch on his addictive tendencies.

WOW!

7 months out from full disclosure, after over 20 years of Sexual Addictive behavior, his IC says he is ready for self- accountability? Is he with a counselor who has familiarity with sexual addiction?

I personally believe that people can change. But that change comes as part long process. Not a choice. I don't believe that the 180 behavior began on DDay2 is sustainable without help, support and most importantly accountability. And for the first couple of years... 3rd party accountability. You H may be able to white knuckle his 180 change for some time. But without oversight, I can't help but to believe that those behaviors ingrained over time will come back.

The fact is that he hasn't earned the right yet to self-determine when he will go for treatment. And any counselor that would promote that has me questioning his understanding of your situation.

How does your MC address accountability with you both? I just wonder if there is a plan in place and that he is following it? And from what you describe, you have every reason to be suspect.

You can't force him to do anything. I am always suspect in overconfidence in an addict. For good reason.

Did you bring up your concerns with your WH? and how were they met with?

PS- when I refer to the 180 change in WH behavior pre dday2 and after dday 2. Not the 180 we often discuss around here.

[This message edited by redrock at 7:29 AM, May 11th (Monday)]

WH did not deny his addictive tendencies or childhood sexual abuse were never addressed with his counselor. We talked about that with our marriage counselor last Saturday. She thought it was odd too. WH has agreed to contact his counselor to address these issues. Otherwise, we bought a book about sex addiction and we are reading it together.

Here's a post I out on the Double Betrayal forum tonight:

I was really missing my XBFF too, but she did me a favor. A month or so ago, she contacted my husband. She called him (from a pay phone I found out later, as she knew her phone number was blocked fromWH's phone). WH did the right thing!! He texted me right after the phone call. She said stupid shit like she wanted to make sure WH and I were going to be ok.

I unblocked her number on my phone and texted her:

Why did you call WH? That is not remotely ok. I don't care that you never got to say goodbye. You forfeited the right to have any contact with him.

Really. You can call and talk to WH, but you can't call and talk to me?

What would your husband say if he knew? I'm trying to decide if I'm going to call him.

The rest of the text conversation was filled with lame excuses and things such as:

In my dreams your eyes were sparkling with or without your husband. It was you, who was at peace and the world was your adventure.

Is it ok with you if I heal and succeed at something? I don't know if there's anything I will succeed at but I know I won't even try if you need me to fail.

Anyway, her texts were bizarre. She is not the same person I remember.

She did me a favor. I will no longer miss her. She betrayed me a second time by contacting WH. Bye XBFF.

[This message edited by UnwiseOne at 12:34 AM, June 7th (Sunday)]

People need to file formal complaints against these law officers. Maybe even try to get a restraining order filed against them. Go for their job! People like that have no business being public servants!

I know 2 Tx troopers who were reassigned to other areas of the State due to adultry with another's wife.

I bet they did not want to tell their wives they had to move 200 miles away due to screwing around on them.

If he is still refusing to tell you what you ask....he is still hiding stuff. Get the poly and I would go after the COW with formal complaint just for her employment record.

Today is WH's birthday. I've wondered if any of the APs will try to contact him. They've been blocked from his phone, but I'm sure they could wish him a happy birthday if they wanted to. We talked about it briefly this morning before he went to work. He will call me if anything happens. I actually believe him!

This month sucks because: his birthday, Father's Day, and our anniversary.

Each of these days is going to be very bittersweet.

I told him I was very conflicted about buying him a birthday gift. Afterall, I didn't get him anything for Christmas. I did end up getting something on Monday, but it won't be delivered until after his birthday. Oh well.

We are going to Disneyland for our 22nd anniversary at the end of the month. I am actually looking forward to it. I find I am actually enjoying getting to know the real him. We are really newlyweds at this point with a really shitty and long "dating history."

He has a individual counseling session set up for today. I am glad.

I'm going back to see my new one again on Friday. I am liking her a lot so far.

DivinelyFavored,

I am still considering complaining to her PD. Even if she isn't formally reprimanded, at least it might bring some embarrassment and uncomfortable-ness to her life.

10 months from DD1 & 8 months from DD2

I have written a formal complaint against OW3 that I plan to submit to her department today. It's a one page document barely skimming the surface of describing her lack of integrity.

The PD says:

All complaints are fully investigated and documented to an appropriate conclusion in order to maintain the public’s trust and to protect employees from false complaints.

The objective of an investigation is to determine the truth.

I really have low expectations of anything happening to her at work. I've seen many corrupt-cop sex-scandal-type news stories with unsatisfactory conclusions. However, I do recall seeing a local story about a cop getting fired for a DUI. I don't know. I figure I will keep my expectations low. I will gather all my evidence so I will be ready.

This is not just about an affair. This is about her allowing my husband to do IT work on her computer to configure PD software. This is about public sex acts. This is about her sharing confidential PD business with WH via text.

[This message edited by UnwiseOne at 10:05 AM, July 8th (Wednesday)]

I did it.

I turned in my complaint.

Now to wait.