SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I get that you want your wife back, and I understand it. I hope you get what you want, I truly do, but even more so I hope that when you get what you want, you find it actually IS what you want.

You want the wife that you married back. That woman loved you, maybe even adored you. She loved you and your kids and the life you made with each other. You were happy.

Does that woman exist today? Hard to tell but my guess right now is no. Can she find herself again? Maybe. But right now, she isn't focused on finding that person, she is focused on not getting divorced and you're so relieved that she hasn't chosen the OM you are not really understanding what she has said to you.

She didn't say she loved you. She didn't apologize for losing sight of you and the marriage, of losing sight of what was important, and of losing her dedication to you and the family. She didn't say she was afraid of losing the love of her life, or the love of the man who stood before family and friends and promised to love her forever.

What she did say was she was afraid of losing "everything" and having to raise kids on a shitty income. In other words, she is worried about losing financial security.

Think back to your wedding day. Would the woman who stood there with you have dated a married man? Would you have married her if she had? Because that is what she did here, she dated and slept with someone else's husband. That's the woman you are married to.

You guys are going to give it a try. OK, can't say I blame you for wanting to try. It's good that she is reading. Not just friends by Shirley Glass is an excellent book to gain an understanding of how opposite sex friendships turn seductively to something more. How to help your spouse heal after an affair is another good one for her to read to get a sense of what you will need, especially since I don't think you know yet...but you will. Once the relief over her not choosing the OM wanes, you're going to be in for a whole new world of emotions. His needs her needs and the five love languages also good reads for building a successful new marriage.

Find a marriage counselor experienced in helping couples recover after infidelity. Ask them specific questions about that! There are so many bad counselors out there, don't waste your time with those who don't "get it."

And finally, be prepared to say enough if, some time in the near future, you realize she still is only staying out of economic fear and not because she finally realizes that it is YOU she wants to be with. There are worse things than being divorced, and one of them is being married to someone who is with you for reasons other than love, respect and mutual devotion.

We can all sit here for days and tell you what we see, what we have experienced and what we believe the outcome will be.

The main point is that it is you're life, it is all up to you to decide which path you want to travel down. To even forgive and choose R after your wife went out and had sex with the OM numerous times and would have chosen him over you if he was available says something of your resolve and or codependancy.

I am not going to be judgemental, I will leave that up to you for if by some miracle your marriage survives the next 1, 5,10, 25 or 50 years it will be you and your family that will have to realise the consequences of your actions from this point.

From my perspective I do not believe your wife is still involved with the AP, however I do believe that she is not that into you for anything but home life stability and for me I could and would not live with a wife under those conditions, and for those same reasons it will only be a matter of time before she finds herself another AP.

[This message edited by notanotherchance at 12:22 PM, July 31st (Friday)]

Regardless of what happens with your marriage you need to work on your co dependency.

You must be able to be you without someone else.

Just about every post you have written has co dependent all over it.

There are over 500 post in your thread with advice form people who KNOW what they are talking about. You have not taken anything to heart all I see is, I love her so much, I want my life and family back. She is the mother of my kids. She is shitting all over you while you gravel at her feet.

Man up buddy you must find your inner strength. SHe may decide to divorce you, she is probably still in the affair. We all want the same thing for you, to get you out of infidelity. But you must want that too. If that is your goal you came to the right place. Do something about your situation or it will be more of the same and no amount of posting here will fix it.

Regardless of what happens with your marriage you need to work on your co dependency.

I agree with this and I am taking steps to deal with this.

NMMNG, trying to find my self worth, I just started looking into the co-dependency thing. NMMNG and co-dependency overlap a lot it seems.

I started a week and a half ago by making myself a priority. I'm working out and eating less. I am sleeping again. I feel better about myself.

I used to be a very self-assured person. I lost that years ago. I am trying to find that again. When it comes to work I am there, but home-life and with social-life I need more work to do there.

I've joined a poker league and fantasy football league in the past week.

I am going to reach out to some old friends.

Basically, I am going to start doing things for me a little more and worry less about if it will inconvenience her. I've been doing that for a very long time.

There is work to do there, but I am trying to put in the effort.

The work will take time

You still planning on standing for her to go spend a week with him? That's what everyone is going crazy about . You can work on yourself, great idea . But that does not mean you do not make any demands on her

Forget about transparency . You don't and won't have it while they are both n that job . But there is a lot you can do right now that can at least keep them physically apart . Isn't that a reasonable demand even if it causes a little embarrassment for her ????

Thanks for the reply. I'm glad you're planning and have already started to work on yourself! I think it's great!

Do you have any plans for starting IC? I think it might help you tremendously.

Have you told her that it is non-negotiable that she does not go to England and that in the near future she switches jobs? How did she respond?

We're here to support you, even if we come off a bit rough and tough love at times.

Best wishes!

I think I would be careful about the individual pursuits until you've seen the attorney. Don't engage in anything that she could use against you in court. Ex: poker night = gambling addiction. Bullshit? Yes. But it sounds like this bitch could spin a story like Olivia Pope.

I told her that the management meeting was too soon and probably even October or November would be too soon for me.

At some point, she'll have to go there. I am going to try and have her put that off as long as possible.

She's been good about that part and agreed.

When it happens, she's agreed to a lot of conditions, such as constant contact. She's been able to live under this veil of secrecy for too long. I've allowed her to live a double-life by not checking up on her and just assuming. I don't plan on doing that again.

I may make her run skype while she's sleeping or something. I don't know yet.

I will probably hire a PI at some point on one of these trips, or may ask her to do a polygraph. Trust but verify.

I want to trust, but I have to protect myself at the same time. The work part sucks, there are many easy forms of communication between them. Other than sitting at her desk with her, I don't see how I can ever be 100% sure. She'll have to prove some of this to me.

I am definitely wanting suggestions on how to check up on her. I thought maybe have her only use a non-work phone so I can jailbreak it. She still has to have a work phone, but she's been very good at not checking it lately. She checks very seldom and tells me what she is doing.

She uses an app called viber on her phone. It's not to talk to him, but she is going to remove it. I don't trust this app. It doesn't leave any trail and just seems like a cheaters' heaven, which is why her cheater friend uses it.

She asked me what else she needed to do to help gain my trust. Besides leaving the job, I really wasn't sure. She's already been more transparent with my about when she's leaving work or just what she's doing in general.

I can't say she's doing nothing. I just didn't feel a commitment from her. She knows that I need to see that from her going forward. I hope she does it.

Do you have any plans for starting IC? I think it might help you tremendously.

I'm already in IC. She's in IC. We are both in MC.

She's had a couple of meetings with this IC that seems like she knows what she is doing instead of the "how does that make you feel" after each response. Literally, that's what her first IC did, repeat what she said and asked how that made her feel.

I'm on session 4 next week. I get 5 free through my works' EDP or whatever and my insurance will cover more.

Please do not take this as a criticism of your desire to R and the path that you're on.

I honestly believe that you're being very weak and indecisive in the face of her continued cake eating. Nowhere in your post did you mention that she was sorry that she hurt you or that she wants to stay and work for you, for "us".

Don't let her use your kids as a bargaining chip. Its especially hard giving advice to someone who agrees on all the points being stated and does the exact opposite. Trust us when we tell you that we can see right through her crap. A lot of us wish we'd done a lot of things differently - this permeates into the advice being given here, for your benefit.

You might even make it out as a reconciled couple, as you desperately seem to hope for right now. The cost of this might not be evident right now but I sincerely hope you don't end up in 2 or 3 years wishing that you hadn't given away so much control and sacrificed your dignity.

ICO, I'm one of the less intense guys here. A "root for R" BS. That's me.

Here's my 2x4:

And here's my face palm:

Look ... I understand wanting stuff to work. I do.

At some point, she'll have to go there. I am going to try and have her put that off as long as possible.

No. At some point this week, (and tomorrow is Friday) she needs to leave that job.

I want to trust, but I have to protect myself at the same time. The work part sucks, there are many easy forms of communication between them. Other than sitting at her desk with her, I don't see how I can ever be 100% sure. She'll have to prove some of this to me.

Okay... HOW?! HOW!? How does she prove this to you?

I'm worried about you ICO. You may need to rename yourself to "I wanted to overcome, but set myself up for failure".

Sorry to be so harsh. I'm really worried about you man.

What does 100% her-being-in look like to you?

Please. Let's just start there. Answer the question. Please? What does "100% in" look like, from her side of the fence?

We care.

[This message edited by CanoeVA at 11:09 AM, July 30th (Thursday)]

ICO, I've been following your thread and wanted to suggest this thought. When you speak with your attorney, ask him or her what you can do to protect yourself. Those suggestions along with your own thoughts could be shared with your WW to judge her commitment. What would she be willing to give up to save the marriage?

It's your life and marriage and you need to do what you think it best.

At some point, she'll have to go there. I am going to try and have her put that off as long as possible.

When this time comes I would be in contact with OMW let her know that your wife is going to be there for business so she can keep an eye on things from that end. Don't tell wife you are going to do this.

She asked me what else she needed to do to help gain my trust.

Polygraph

Postnup

Collateral

I may make her run skype while she's sleeping or something. I don't know yet.

That is a good idea, You will know if she takes a piss and she will not know when you are sleeping or listening.

You can also call her room , not her cell phone, and make sure she has not left the phone in room and gone somewhere. if you wake her up tough shit. And she does not get to go out socially even in group if OM is there. She gets diahhrea, female issues, or whatever not to go.

I will probably hire a PI at some point on one of these trips, or may ask her to do a polygraph. Trust but verify.

These two are the BEST ideas. it will be worth the money for your sanity.

She uses an app called viber on her phone. It's not to talk to him,

This is why we are all worried about you. it's not to talk to him??? Who else is she using a cheater app to talk to, SANTA CLAUS??? And as of this morning it still was not removed by her voluntarily??? Give me a break. you believe her???

t doesn't leave any trail and just seems like a cheaters' heaven, which is why her cheater friend uses it.

So on top of not leaving job, she still gets to hang out with a cheating girlfriend who probably brainstormed with her to cheat on you and how to keep you clueless. She won't give that up either??? they'll figure out another app to fool you. YOUR SMART MOVE WOULD BE TO TELL HER FRIENDS HUSBAND HIS WIFE IS CHEATING 11

This "friend" was instrumental in harming your marriage. why don't you return the favor???

And lastly, the Om came to US and banged your wife nightly probably every night he was here. How do you account for his whereabouts,??? Rely on your wife telling you??????

Put the damm VAR in the car and in less than a week you will know what she is talking about with her girlfriends and if she is talking to OM in car. Stop this ridiculous worry about her suing you. there are $40,000 members here and no one has posted they remember a lawsuit that was successful being filed and carried through to closure.

Your neighbor can sue you because he does not like your tie. ain't likel;y to happen.

so the trust and verify means NOTHING if you do not still take some actions she is not going to like.

AND OF COURSE THERE IS STILL THE LITTLE BIT ABOUT HER LOVING HIM MORE THAN YOU AND NOT DOING ANYTHING ON HER OWN TO FIX THIS THAT YOU ARE NOT DEMANDING.

You kind of missed the point of my post.

Joining a club or hanging out with friends is not going to fix you co dependency. Or your problem with being indecisive about your situation.

Man up now stand your ground. You can not control your WW nor should you try. What you can do is show her consequences. Go see a lawyer get divorce papers drawn up move half your money. If she says fine divorce it is then so be it. You are clinging to her to your detriment. You are allowing this torture to continue. Stop being a doormat. For God's sake DO something.

The folks here have repeatedly told you what to do and what will happen if you don't take action over and over again.

Eventually they will stop responding what else is there to say after the 10th time of repeating the same thing.

You keep saying yes, yes I hear you thanks for the advice. And come back with the same BS.

ICO, very respectfully, she is going to have to face some consequences other than you playing cat and mouse trying to find when and how she is communicating with her boyfriend.

She is still talking to her boyfriend daily and there is not a damn thing that you can do about it.

I guess if you're really committed to punting on this then she can commit to a polygraph to attest that she has not had a single personal word with him since no contact broke, outside of his phone call from her.

She is conducting her affair on company property. You cannot MDM, keylog, monitor or view those resources.

You cannot view her while she is travelling because she will just go to another hotel room to fuck her boyfriend while your skype camera is running in her room. While she's at work are you really going to monitor her every 15 minutes via some remote camera or something. You can't and she damn well knows it.

My point is that she's going to unfortunately have to do something real beyond just saying shit to earn your trust back. That's how life works.

At this point I don't think we can 2x4 you more than what a horrible idea this is (you'll come back and agree someday) but if you're committed to this course of action, then she needs to atleast expose herself to her boss. She likely will not get fired if she dials down the details, but the boss needs to know 1. she had an affair and cannot travel and 2. any additional contact from her boyfriend will be considered sexual harassment and as it's on company property, they will named a co-defendent.

There will also be post-nuptual contract in your future. She's going to use the same excuse as she did with the job "I don't even know there will be a marriage I'm not signing that!", you'll probably buy her lame excuse again, but I suppose you can try ;)

[This message edited by eric1 at 11:57 AM, July 30th (Thursday)]

So she's not leaving her job because she's afraid she might end up without a marriage and without a job... And, of course, you see her reasoning behind it... Well ok, so, explain it. You have been very clear that you absolutely want to R and keep the marriage, if only she showed you that she has given up the A and wants to stay. You've been jumping like a puppy every time she made even a little half step toward you... We've seen it and she has seen it too. She knows you won't divorce her unless you have no choice.

So the real reason she's not giving up her job is because she's not going to stop cake eating, and she's afraid that sooner or later even you will get to understand that.

So:

- NC, but not too tight or too much of it because it might inconvenience her

- Transparency, but not too much of it, she still has a cheater app on her phone (not to talk to him, of course), but let's not put too much pressure.

- She gets to keep her job, and doesn't even have to come clean so she can ask not to be sent abroad, it might hurt her career

- Timeline, but not a written one, that would be too much of an effort and too inconvenient,

- VAR on yourself, but not in the car where she might talk on the phone to OM or to her toxic friend so you might find out some of the truths you would need to know, that would be too hard on her.

- Of course, no exposure, she would suffer too much shame.

You say you don't want to be half in, half out, but it looks like you are the veritable KING of "half in, half out".

The only thing you've done right so far is exposure to OMW.

I hope you will, at least, keep the appointment with the attorney.

We reap what we sow, ICO, but I'm afraid you're sowing terrible seeds.

You aren't alone here man. Sure it sounds like we're all pushing you.

That's because we know that not making a decision to reconcile or divorce is still making a decision.

And you don't have to decide that right away man. It isn't an easy decision to make. And you don't want to make it lightly without all the facts. Not a decision like this that effects your kids.

I know. I've been there.

So if you aren't deciding. If you aren't being strong and demanding with your wife, that's okay. Just understand what that means. It doesn't mean weakness. It doesn't mean insecurity. It means you love your kids. We know.

Hell. I've was there in that place for at least 5 months. It sucked the life out of me.

That's why I recommend the journal. And the battleplan. Because you're weighing everything. You're not wanting to fuck this up. You're wanting to make the right choice when you're stuck between a rock and a hard place.

So, when these guys push you? Listen. You'll pick and choose what you want to use. I'm hoping you pick and choose the journal and the battleplan. Because those two things will lead you down your road to where you want to go. In the manner you want to travel.

If one of us is pushing you to go to hard and too fast, and you aren't ready? That's fine. But you also got to say what you're ready for. And to do that, you need a plan. You need to KNOW what you're ready for.

And all of this is harder than it looks. It sucks. It really, really sucks. But it's not like you're wife is giving you many choices here, either, right? Filing for divorce IS a consequence of cheating, isn't it? You wouldn't be at this website, in an emotional wreck, scheduling appts with your attorney, or any of it if she hadn't been cheating, right?

Thanks for the update.

Without coming off as insensitive, why don't you demand she finds another job or another position within the company, so she never goes to England again?

I agree with others. No way in heck should you allow her to ever again go to England unless it's with you (and imho it would be too triggery for you to enjoy it there).

Please, don't get scared or upset, I genuinely want to understand the thought process behind you not demanding she finds another job or a way to never again be in contact with him for work nor to not have to go England.

Thanks!

Keep talking to us, we're here for you!