SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

DM:

The reason you are losing your mind in this (beyond the obvious mind f*** and her still working with OM) is because you are still pushing/carrying her through reconciliation. Why does she have to put any effort into this? You are doing all of the effort for her, through research, helping her to establish boundaries, etc.

She has no ownership of this reconciliation; she is simply along for the ride. Now in fairness, this may have less to do with whether or not she is worthy of reconciliation, and more to do with the fact that you are showing you are unable to lay out what you need from her in reconciliation and then letting her figure out how to do it. In other words, take off the damn training wheels.

Why are you still in this position? Because you still fear losing her, so you are still trying to control her. Instead, you need to truly reach peace with divorce, lay out what you expect from her, then let her figure out how to earn you back. If she is unable, then she loses you. If that is not enough motivation, then you are better off without her.

When you accept that she is gone, and it is up to her as to whether or not she wants to return despite your trying to strong arm this thing, you will reach a better level of peace.

Take care, brother.

Desert-

I haven't reread everything on here, but only this last page.

I'M confused about who wants her to stay at her current job. Her? You? The Scumboss? There are mixed signals- In one post you say you want her to keep the job. In another you seem to want to leave because she is still there.

As far as Scumboss getting off scott free, ask yourself what winning looks like? What does it mean to "win?" Who wins what? Who loses what? .

but it's probably me who should be looking for something new... A new wife...

Sam, youre right. I want my wife

You're in such a tough position. One of the things that usually gets a lot of airtime on this forum is 180. 180. 180. I think it might be helpful for you to not necessarily 180, but look at your own shit. Deal with getting healing on your soul. Stop worrying about her, but deal with YOU. You don't have to make any decisions about R or D. In fact, you shouldn't. But I and probably all of us, understand how hard it is to be in that ambiguous "what the hell am I going to do? stage." - But maybe for now, the direction to give you course is to stay for now. And decide to decide after a few months. Give her time to figure out what she wants, too. You can't control her. See what she is willing to do. She probably is afraid to deal with her shit. There is a lot of shame involved. And while it is unfair that BS's tend to have to do all the heavy lifting, you might have to do the hard thing of laying off her for awhile. You are HURT. We know. God, do we know! Deal with yourself and your hurt. Let her deal with her stuff. Let her actions show you.

Forward.

[This message edited by Minnesota at 3:31 PM, November 2nd (Wednesday)]

Minnesota- She wants to stay in her job, and because of that, I want her to as well. I want her to be happy ultimately. I think that for me to be okay with her staying, she has to get away from her boss ASAP. If she can't do that, then she needs to find a new job imo.

Farsidejunky- Yeah, you're right. I need to figure out what I want from her and just lay it out. I think she is truly sorry and will do whatever to attempt to right this. I haven't been clear from my perspective. At first I was okay with her working for her boss but after he hit on her again, I'm really not at all. What is a reasonable time frame to let her get her shit together?

A year or two fully, assuming she is with a good therapist. However, 3-6 months is fair for her to demonstrate behavior that she is trying to earn your trust.

You wont know how well she can pedal until you remove the training wheels, DM.

[This message edited by farsidejunky at 3:56 PM, November 2nd (Wednesday)]

Farside- Ok, thanks. So we are just over a month and a half in. I'll give her some space (in terms of not pushing her to do things), set some things I want done, and see what she does.

I got dizzy reading this thread and though I don't post often on a thread other than my own, I feel inclined to do so here.

You have made her desire to keep her job more important than fixing your relationship, if it's fixable at all. It's JUST A JOB! Who gives a shit if it's a good one, if she's a good employee she'll find another one.

Also, there is nothing that suggests that if she tells HR about this that she will get fired. Both of you are only guessing that could be a consequence because two attorneys told you. You are making HUGE decisions based on "could happen" conversations. She needs to get off the fence and take some action. A lot more shit can go wrong and she can get fired for other reasons - namely doing a poor job at work because she is so wrapped up in this stressful situation. She needs to get out of that situation NOW.

Listen, I'm sorry you find yourself here. Hell, I'm sorry I find myself here, but we both are. The big difference between us is I made a decision and took decisive action. You made a decision but are letting her be willy nilly about taking action and you are even supporting her. You can't have it both ways.

We all know and have heard the saying. "Shit or get off the pot."

If you really want to see if you can salvage this relationship, she CAN'T be anywhere near OM, even in the same building. Until then, you're just chasing your tail. She's not showing you she is willing to do whatever it takes to make this up to you. But she is showing you what's most important to her. It's her job.

Turnothercheek- You're right, it is just a guess, but it is a possible outcome from all this. Her thing, and I agree (from a strictly financial point of view) that it is better for her to quit than be fired. I really have no idea how someone that is fired for something they did goes about getting another job. How do they handle the question of why they left and why they don't have any recommendations from their job?

I really have no idea how someone that is fired for something they did goes about getting another job. How do they handle the question of why they left and why they don't have any recommendations from their job?

The answer is that they are looking for a better job, better pay, better opportunities, and NO travel requirements.

You really worry about too much.

Has she even looked for another job, there are tons of jobs on CraigsList and through job searching websites.

I really have no idea how someone that is fired for something they did goes about getting another job. How do they handle the question of why they left and why they don't have any recommendations from their job?

First, I don't think she'll be fired but even if she is, there is enough gray area that she can threaten filing a complaint and a possible lawsuit as retribution. In order to prevent her from doing that, the company can give her a letter of recommendation and severance! I think it is highly likely they would do that just to make the problem go away because it is a lot cheaper than fighting a lawsuit.

That's a bet I'd be willing to take in the same situation.

Have followed this thread since the start. To be honest it sounds like you're carrying the bulk of the reconciliation. Your wife sounds regretful but not remorseful.

Personally, I can't believe she's still at that job with her boss working there or that you're okay with it. She needs to find another one. I don't care how much she likes it there. She shouldn't have shit where she eats, that's her own fault. Telling her you're okay with her working there is really sending her the wrong message on your part.

I also agree that you're focusing way too much on the actions of her boss when a lot of the anger and spite you have for him, your wife deserves.

There are always going to be men out there who will try to get into a woman's undies whether they're single, taken, or married. It's up to her to put up boundaries to stop it from going further. Her boss could have been one of a dozen scumbags she would have slept with if they said the right words. You're wasting a lot of time and emotional energy on this guy. As long as your wife is still working with him, it's not going to get any better.

And while it's good your wife confessed what she did, went to a therapist, and did a bit of reading based on your posts, even back to the beginning I have a feeling you don't know of other transgressions she's committed. From what I can tell she hasn't faced any consequences for her actions, from you or otherwise (hell she actually made a list of things YOU need to do better for HER after she told you she cheated on you), she's still working with her affair partner, she doesn't want to quit her job so you're not going to ask her to, etc.

I'm not really seeing any incentives for her to change or reflect on why she did this. While you say you're on the fence on whether to D or R, your actions and what you communicate to her say you're definitely leaning towards reconciliation if not fully there. Which is certainly fine. But if your wife faces no consequences and doesn't believe that there are any real concrete consequences to her actions, there's nothing to stop her from doing this again, let alone try to figure out why she did this to begin with.

It's fine to love your wife, and I'm not saying you have to wake up in the morning and drop a deuce on her head everyday. But you need to start playing hardball for your marriage, forget the OM because he's not going to make or break your marriage, and draw some lines in the sand for what your wife needs to do or you need to start planning an exit strategy.

I think your wife wants to reconcile but just wanting to is not enough. She has to do, and be willing to do, heavy lifting to repair the damage she's caused to the marriage by cheating. From what I can tell it really doesn't sound like she is.

Farside- Ok, thanks. So we are just over a month and a half in. I'll give her some space (in terms of not pushing her to do things), set some things I want done, and see what she does.

No, you're not a month and a half in. The clock hasn't started yet and won't start until you stop carrying her towards R. Note I said towards R, you can approach it but never achieve it until she goes full remorse for what she's done and starts carrying her own weight.

she seems to care more about keeping her job than you or your marriage. :(

Success! We figured out a way to tell HR without her being potentially fired. Going to tell them that they were flirty and exchanged flirty texts, it was getting to become something more, she asked him to stop, he didn't, now she is uncomfortable working for him. If he shows the texts it coo-berates her story and if he brings up full fledged affair she can deny. Win-win!

Oh, I meant a month and a half since D-Day btw.

[This message edited by desertmirage at 8:24 PM, November 3rd (Thursday)]

Success! We figured out a way to tell HR without her being potentially fired. Going to tell them that they were flirty and exchanged flirty texts, it was getting to become something more, she asked him to stop, he didn't, now she is uncomfortable working for him. If he shows the texts it coo-berates her story and if he brings up full fledged affair she can deny. Win-win!

I've been following your thread, and I understand your pain, but this statement brought me up short. What are you thinking here, brother?

You are dropping down to her level of lies and deceit, in order to allow her to avoid consequences for her decisions. What is she going to learn from this? What are your kids going to learn from this? Lies, lies, lies.

Decisions have consequences. You may indeed get away with deceiving her employer, but if you take this route, you are sacrificing your integrity. You are allowing her to continue in her lying, deceitful ways. You are helping her avoid the consequences of her own bad decisions, and in doing so, you are telling her that lying is ok if it is done to protect yourself. I would not be ok with that.

I may be the only one here who thinks this is a horrible, ill-conceived idea, but I hope not. Your wife needs to own her shit in order to become a better person, and this course of action will not help her do that. You are abetting her in her problem of avoidance.

I understand your desire to punish the OM, but if you do what you are suggesting, you are playing with fire. What will you do when he fights back in order to save himself? When he presents some sort of evidence that they indeed had an affair, and she was complicit? What do you think her employer is going to do then?

Honesty is always the best route. When you practice honesty, you build character. When you face up to your own misdeeds honestly, and face the consequences, you learn what it means to be honorable.

What you are proposing is the exact opposite of honor and honesty. Your wife needs to learn to be honest and honorable. Don't support her in lying. It will come back and bite you in the ass at some point, and it is just wrong.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

THIS. ALL OF THIS!!!

^^^^^^^^ SECONDED!

agree

My thought process was that she gets to admit some of what they were doing but it allows her to leave out the sex part (they were being flirty abd sending each other flirty texts). It's less about getting him punished and more about getting her to stop working for him.

If he's got info to prove there was more then she will probably get fired for not disclosing. I thought it was a decent way to get around the damned if you do damned if you don't. Guess not.

[This message edited by desertmirage at 5:59 AM, November 4th (Friday)]

Horrible idea. When I heard your solution, I almost puked. So your setting the same example she did by lying? Honesty! Please rethink this and YOU go to HR!

i don't think it's necessarily a bad idea. I don't encourage lying. But she can certainly go and tell HR that he's bothering her and she's asked him to stop. That's true. She doesn't have to tell HR every position and sex act they did. I don't recommend lying. But I think she can be succinct without going into the details. She has a right to tell some guy to stop bothering her. Heck, even if he was an ex-husband she has the right to tell him to stop bothering her.

If you need the money, I can see why you want to minimize the risk of her losing her job.

Personally, I think it's fine. Whatever you do, don't lie. However, if he claims that they had consensual sex, so what? So? She's married and she doesn't want him bothering her anymore and he won't stop.

as far as consequences, you can provide consequences in other ways.

[This message edited by mike7 at 7:29 AM, November 4th (Friday)]