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Mike, this is what my thinking was. Tell them the most recent truth and leave the rest out. If he brings up the full on affair (I only see this happening if he gets fired which is less likely if she only brings up the flirting), you're right, it doesnt matter (although it may matter to HR) as she's trying to stop unwanted advances. Im not advocating for her to make up false things to wriggle out of this. Just minimizing what she is reporting. I guess it is lying by omission, or straight up lying if she denies the the sexual part of the affair if it's brought up?

Gettingoveritall hit the nail on the head!

A long, long time ago when the poop hit the fan around here, OW got dumped, wasn't happy about it, and when her bag of tricks to lure FWH back in didn't work, she went to HR and filed a bogus complaint. Revenge, I guess, who knows why crazy does what crazy does.

Anyway, my FWH came completely clean to HR about the A, her shenanigans after the A ended. All of it. The company reacted by reassigning both of them. Big whoop.

In our world today, few companies have morality clauses or anti-fraternization policies. Many are just concerned with hostile work environment or harassment suits, because that's what they end up paying for.

And all of this does not matter much at all. The fact is, your WW threw away her standing in her job and moved it down the list of important things in her life when she decided to commence her A. She decided, by her actions, that the A meant more to her than her job. That her A didn't turn out to be glorious for her doesn't undo the fact that she tossed the job as a priority.

So, now she's at the point of being told, it is her M or her job. Neither of you should be helping her try to pick both. She needs to put on her big girl pants and choose, then act accordingly with action, willing, self driven action toward her decision.

Complete honesty with HR is a step toward choosing the M, but really, reassigning her today to a new boss may be a less terrible situation, but IMO it is still terrible. So, she gets a new boss but is still in the same workplace with the OM day to day. Just because that seems like a better situation than today doesn't mean it is going to give you a situation that is conducive to BEGINNING to R.

Success! We figured out a way to tell HR without her being potentially fired. Going to tell them that they were flirty and exchanged flirty texts, it was getting to become something more, she asked him to stop, he didn't, now she is uncomfortable working for him. If he shows the texts it coo-berates her story and if he brings up full fledged affair she can deny. Win-win!

To flip this around, you're planning on helping her minimize the natural consequences of her actions, and allow her to avoid taking responsibility - again.

I think this is a terrible idea.

It is highly unlikely that people at your wife's workplace don't already know about her affair. Your plan to be selective in reporting the parts you want to is way more likely to blow up on you. What you are proposing to do is lie and allow your wife to minimize and avoid responsibility.

I have followed your thread from the beginning but not commented. Your wife's story has never made much sense and I suspect she was much more enthusiastic in her affair then you want to believe. Now she wants to take the easy way out and pretty much avoid responsibility for her choices.

Unlike some othercs I happen to agree that reporting him to HR is basically pointless. She was a full participant in the affair and was not coerced into it. If you are serious about wanting to reconcile she needs to resign and move on to anther job that does not require travel.

DM:

So let me see if I understand you properly. You want to lie for your WW to her company to spare her any potential repercussions?

Never mind the fact that you are lying for her, and in so doing, compromising what should be your principles (although after you posted it, I wonder). Multiple people have indicated that you are carrying her in this reconciliation.

The action of endorsing her lying to her company is you enabling her to avoid consequences. Consequences are what makes an affair so painful to the wayward.

STOP, STOP, STOP!

FFS, dude. Let her f****** own this. She broke it. Tell her how you want it to look, and let her figure out how to put it back together. If she cannot do so, she is a poor candidate for reconciliation. It really is that simple.

Honest question, DM: are you afraid of losing her, or afraid of being alone?

Tell them the most recent truth and leave the rest out. If he brings up the full on affair (I only see this happening if he gets fired which is less likely if she only brings up the flirting), you're right, it doesnt matter (although it may matter to HR) as she's trying to stop unwanted advances. Im not advocating for her to make up false things to wriggle out of this. Just minimizing what she is reporting. I guess it is lying by omission, or straight up lying if she denies the the sexual part of the affair if it's brought up?

Lying by omission is just as bad as lying. And once found out, the company will just be done with your wife.

What is so damn wrong with telling HR the truth, just the facts truth. We had an affair, ended it, told boss I don't want to continue this and want to heal my marriage. But now boss is continuing to come on to me at work during our so-called meetings.

Truth, simple and short.

The bottom line is that at this current time, the boss is sexually harassing your wife.

Any type of lying is going to always make your wife look less believable and I would not do that at all.

Honest question, DM: are you afraid of losing her, or afraid of being alone?

Yes

Yes to what questions, alone or losing her.

Why would you lose her? I think you will always wonder when her next affair will happen, it will always be in the back of your mind.

About work, does work have a company policy book and if so, does it mention relationships with coworkers.

Yes to both of them.

They have a handbook that states "the company frowns upon" having relations with coworkers and it must be reported immediately. They say they handle it on a case by case basis but it could result in termination.

They have a handbook that states "the company frowns upon" having relations with coworkers and it must be reported immediately. They say they handle it on a case by case basis but it could result in termination.

It is time for your wife to be seriously looking for another job.

Reported immediately is sort of odd, who is going to report it. If two unmarried people are having a relationship, nothing wrong there. And in an affair, who would report it really.

Sexual harassment is a big deal though at this point.

Hard to say, your wife had an affair with the boss, and according to this book, they both could be fired. Certainly the boss will be.

She needs to he very active finding another job now.....or you learn to live with the fact she is with the OM every day, and might once again have to travel.

Sometimes there are only a couple of choices, and those are your only two choices in this matter.

ETA: Actually you have three choices to choose from:

1. Your wife just quits and finds another job.

2. Your wife tells HR the truthful facts and sees what happens and go from there.

3. You learn to live with the fact she is with the OM every day and might have to travel with him. If he continues to bother her...you could call him.

Actually, have you ever confronted him about this?

[This message edited by craig2001 at 10:16 AM, November 4th (Friday)]

Reported immediately for everyone. The company doesn't care that she's married, all they care about is not getting sued by her or others within the organization. If they were both single, it should be reported immediately so she doesn't report to him and receive potential preferential treatment.

I really think that this very well could have happened with someone else. I think it has a whole lot less to do about OM and more to do about her. She needs to fix her. He is a "charmer" who knows what he's doing but it could have been someone else. I've met him, he's friendly and stuff but he's 20 years older than us. I don't get her attraction.

I have not contacted him. I don't trust myself to not threaten him in some way (job, safety, etc). I also don't see what good it would do to contact him. He clearly doesn't give a fuck about much.

[This message edited by desertmirage at 10:19 AM, November 4th (Friday)]

Yes.

DM:

Until you get over your fear of losing her, she will never have to stand on her own two feet because you will continue to carry her, no matter how heavy (proverbially) she becomes. When that happens, she does not have to do any of the work and you will continue to build resentment. Sound familiar?

Please remind me; are you in individual therapy?

[This message edited by farsidejunky at 10:22 AM, November 4th (Friday)]

Your WW needs to start looking for a new job, like yesterday.

The best time to look for another job is while you currently have one. Your WW needs to be proactively searching for employment elsewhere. Right now she has the ability to control information presented to a future employer (needs different hours, looking for advancement, better pay, no travel). The employment ball is in her court. If she loses her current job over this affair, any future employer will learn of her being let go when they check up on her past history. At that point, she has no control over what a future employer will learn.

It is important to note that IN NO WAY am I advocating lying to anyone. If she starts looking for another job now, she is not under any obligation to disclose the affair. That may not be the case later on.

Aiding and abetting her deceit will just encourage those same behaviors in the future and will likely come back to bite you in the ass.

Please remind me; are you in individual therapy?

No, the counselor I contacted said he doesn't like to see couples individually for too long as he has found it can be detrimental to the health of the marriage over time (the two getting IC get to get a lot off their chests at IC and feel better upon leaving. They return to their spouse who is upset and whatnot and maybe aren't as open with them, etc). I can see his point.

Applegirl- Yeah, I agree. If the whole thing needs to disclosed, she just needs to get a new job. I don't see how getting fired for this won't become an issue when seeking future employment.

[This message edited by desertmirage at 10:29 AM, November 4th (Friday)]

I really think that this very well could have happened with someone else. I think it has a whole lot less to do about OM and more to do about her. She needs to fix her. He is a "charmer" who knows what he's doing but it could have been someone else. I've met him, he's friendly and stuff but he's 20 years older than us. I don't get her attraction.

20 years than her is a red flag as to possible childhood issues. That is rather unusual.

She needs to figure this out and right now, as to the why.

Didn't you say this boss has a previous complaint against him. I think so, it should not go good for him with HR. This guy is a real problem at work.

When he stops bothering your wife, that just means he found someone else to have an affair with.

This is up to you now, only you. Make a decision and stick with it.

I don't know where you live, but where I live, there are plenty of good jobs in many fields.

My wife is a product manager at a software company. This company is owned by a big prestigious company. We unfortunately live in rural CT so there is nothing similar to this anywhere near us. We would need to move somewhere new. I work for my family's small kitchen design company so moving is very stressful for me (quitting my job and kinda screwing my father over).

This whole thing is just a HUGE mess.

My wife is a product manager at a software company. This company is owned by a big prestigious company. We unfortunately live in rural CT so there is nothing similar to this anywhere near us. We would need to move somewhere new. I work for my family's small kitchen design company so moving is very stressful for me (quitting my job and kinda screwing my father over).

This whole thing is just a HUGE mess.

Yes, a mess that only your wife created. When is she going to explain the how and why she ever did this.

As for work, you are between a rock and a hard place. Not much you can do.

Risk it all telling HR...but it was supposed to be reported immediately, yet who would do that, but a lot of time as passed. I do not see ANY WAY you can tell HR at this time, just too much time has passed.

IF the boss continues to act this way, then report it.

Your wife is the one that needs to get a different job in the same company, with a different boss and no travel.

You could confront the OM without any threats. All you have to do is call him and tell him you are fed up with the advances at this time with your wife. You dont have to mention HR or anything.

Otherwise, I don't see a way out of it. Your wife makes good money I imagine, and she really screwed things up.

Too bad other WSs do not think about the unintended consequences of an affair before they do it.

You've mentioned earlier in this thread that OM had a previous incident at this company. I'm assuming that you know this because WW told you.

With that being said, I'm struggling to understand her hesitance to come forward. Have you considered the possibility that the previous incident may have involved WW, and may not have involved this OM at all?

If what you have been told is the truth, regardless of whatever history there was previously between WW and OM, her asking him to back off, and then he coming on to her, that's without question sexual harassment. That's as clear cut as it can be.

By going to HR, she is self reporting the relationship, and she is also on record reporting the harassment by the OM. If they let her go as a result, the company is walking some very thin ice as it pertains to actions against the whistle blower.

Yeah, she does make good money and since I work for my family she provides all the benefits too. I know it's just money, but it would definitely put a drain on us. I agree, if she thought about potential consequences for like 15 seconds, it becomes pretty obvious how stupid having sex with some fuck head is.

Idk when she is going to explain the why to me. We spoke about that piece in MC last night and it's the same answer "IDK".

About confronting him, I again don't see a point. He doesn't care what I want or think.

As far as the time piece is concerned, I actually disagree. One of the lawyers advised to wait to see if he did anything that would be constituted as sexual harassment and advised to wait a month and see. We are around halfway through that month. He seemed to think that 2 months after the affair ended could be considered good faith.