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I am sorry to say she is suspecting wrong. While maybe I dont 100% want to divorce. I know 100% I'm not budging on anything ive said. I have no inclination of taking her back as you say.

Also she didn't choose to move out. I told her to leave.

She just keeps tagging up, in anticipation of stealing the next base. You have to decide if you are going to control the pace or resign to being a spectator?

She said she's going to apply for a job can't guarantee she will quit hers.

I don't know, I keep thinking she is stalling to see how things go with OM and OBS. Just dropping a little nugget here and there to slow down the process and make you consider Reconcile.

The only time she actually "pretends" to care is right after you show some action. She get's the D papers... she writes you a "I want US" letter. You send her a parenting plan... she asks for her resume. Still no ACTION - just words.

Many WW don't want to give up their job because they don't want to be left high and dry if Reconcile doesn't work. That's not the case with your WW. She should be looking for a job that allows her more time with the kids regardless of what happens in the marriage.

Her words (written) vs her actions don't make sense to me unless she is trying to continue to cake eat. She could say she was moving back...that it's her house too... that she is sick of couch surfing. Legally you couldn't do anything about it... and yet she hasn't even asked to move back?!

I think you've got to consider all of her "attempts" as stalling and not honest tries to reconcile.

Her asking you to "check on her?" "ask her who she is with???" Yea, because we all know she doesn't lie. Please don't do this. Please continue with the D and work on a hard 180... Kids, finances, and divorce only.

I sent her a plan last night and asked her about it today. She said she had not responded because it was late. Told her I wanted an email back today.

I see everything she is doing as stalling. Throw a nugget here and a nugget there but whenever I ask a follow up question there is nothing there.

I heard through a mutual friend that OM told OBS he broke it off with WW, where she told me she broke it off.

Doesn't really matter who broke it off, does it? Other than the honesty factor. On that note, in all likelihood, they are still in contact with each other.

Ugh, I just had a nasty thought. Do you think she's found SI? Might you have let it slip or could she have been snooping?

I heard through a mutual friend that OM told OBS he broke it off with WW, where she told me she broke it off.

No surprise there. No sane WS will admit that way. Like many said here all the evidence point to that. So does it make any difference to your line of thinking. Like I said initiate some conversation on this by mentioning OBS told you to stop contacting her (If you want to hear it from WW herself). It is important to know WW is still not in "love" with POS if you want to R.

Did your talking to her boss regarding the affair result in any impact on their jobs. Or the company does not have rules on intimacy? If you are planning on R you can go to HR and complain about the POS (provided company have such policies). Even if WW lose her job as a result it does not matter as you are going to R.

[This message edited by goalong at 4:11 PM, June 10th (Saturday)]

I had a fear that she could have found SI but I don't think so and no it doesn't matter who broke it off.

no it doesn't matter who broke it off.

it matters if you want to go on the R route

If it makes her look better to you she will say she broke it off.

More likely the reality of the OBS finding out, the OM dumping her, and her leaving the family homestead is not quite a rosy a picture as she hoped.

Do you think she hopes her drip drip drip of texting you, checking in, and acting "normal" will get her back home?

Dost,

If you do not go NC except for the kids you are going to really really hurt yourself.

Just don't respond to her.

They could both be right. If she hadn't given the ultimatum they wouldn't have broken up so ... she broke-up. OM chose his wife so he broke-up. If you aren't considering R then it doesn't matter. If you are still having those "what if" moments it would be good to know if she chose the marriage as a plan B.

Your WW wife reminds of a guy named Mblink's WW. Lot's of differences as far as older kids, her work wasn't a priority... but the thing that was the same is that she never truly believed he would divorce her and never put in any effort. Didn't believe it when she was served, while they were going through mediation...She lost EVERYTHING (he was able prove adultery)...Her tears were all about,"but I have nothing now" OM never left his wife and she remained his side action...after the divorce. Anyway, I wish you could read his story because it shows that some never really "get it". http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=582987&AP=1

Have you asked your lawyer about exclusive rights to the home? Can WW have visitation at her friends house? I don't know, I feel like your WW needs to know that this is really happening and she can't ignore it and throw you a reconcile nugget every once in a while.

I know that crickets to her "nuggets" is best but I've be tempted to write "that's fine, I can't guarantee it would be enough to save our marriage anyway. Please respond with your input to our parenting plan." I know crickets are best and just the sentence about the parenting plan should be enough and keep you detached...but...I have a feeling she is going to stall and next week's nugget will be about her interview for a job that she probably won't take because of it's location. Then maybe another email about another interview to show she's trying. In her mind these nuggets mean that you will wait indefinitely for her.

If you read these boards for any length of time even the WW that "get it" and start doing everything immediately have a hard time at R. It's the fact that they had the affair at all that kills it... but you add in the fake reconcile, and the continued affair after she moved out, and the lack of effort (just words) it's going to be very, very difficult to see her as the woman you married and not this woman that is so apathetic about her family.

[This message edited by Freeme at 10:29 AM, June 13th (Tuesday)]

I found this and it's me. I so badly just want to feel I am done. I know I am done mentally but the feelings don't match. You are all right about everything. I told her flat out last night I am done with this. And she lost it....why she asked. Seriously. But I'm the idiot who keeps it going to my own detriment. I want to be stronger.

. Hope. Codependency has been described as the addiction to the POTENTIAL of things. Are you hooked on a cheater’s potential? Wow, she could be a great partner… if only? Or — I want the guy I thought I married back? Do you grasp at the smallest indication that this person gives a shit about you? You’ve got hope sickness.

It’s hard to be down on hope. It’s hard to fault people who have hope. It seems virtuous. But in cases of infidelity, it can keep you STUCK. Listen to me, chumps — hope is not your friend. You need to bludgeon hope with a fencepost and begin to operate with total lucidity.

Because hope is so strong, cheaters know exactly what a powerful manipulation tool this is. The goal of a cheater is cake. Your goal is to get them to come to their senses and be that sparkly person you fell in love with and commit to you. So they will use hope to keep you on the hook. They will feign remorse, cry, say they miss you. They may go to counseling. Admit, hey, they aren’t perfect or Mistakes Were Made. They may crack open a book (usually something like “When Splendid People Cheat.”) And you, desperate to save this mess — take it as a sign.

The only antidote to hope sickness is self knowledge. Know what you will and will not tolerate. What your values are. Where your boundaries are. Be unswerving in your loyalty to yourself, to your well-being and what sort of relationship YOU want. Hold out for that. Cheaters lie and they lie artfully. So it is essential to watch what your cheater DOES and pay zero attention to what they say.

This is very hard to do. Hope is like that siren song in Ulysses. You’re going to have to tie yourself to the mast and stuff cotton in your ears. But stay strong, because crazy hope that this person is going to fix this and stop hurting you — in the face of evidence to the contrary — is the number one reason why people stay stuck with cheaters.

Ah yes, (((dost))),

Hopium

The "crack" of Betrayed Spouses everywhere.

When I originally read about this - it certainly struck a chord with me.

Keep calm.

Acceptance is one of the 'stages of grief' that is often brought up on theses hallowed SI boards.

Accepting that STBXWH was 'what he was'.

It brought me a kind of peace and a great deal of resolution.

I certainly hope that it does for you too.

Stay strong,

MOB

By George...I think he's got it. You are so correct that hope after infidelity is often what really prolongs the pain of the inevitable. The WS will use it to their advantage until the BS finally lose all hope of the marriage being fixed or the WS ever really getting it. That's usually when the WS turn nasty and start to blame shift again. They think we just need to forgive and forget.

The thing is we are hoping for something that will never be. Even if you do R, the marriage is never the same again because you will always wonder if/when the shoe will drop again. Sure their are a few that make it and manage to make their marriages better, but they are few and far between unfortunately. That's why I rarely read the R forum. I see so many BS's that have that hope and then you see the struggles they go through because of it only to find themselves right back where they started. BTDT

By George...I think he's got it.

It is not that easy. He is the one who really feel the breath of 14 year association and WW's so callousl betrayal of it.

He had to look through all the happenings and intentions and face his own emotions before he finally made up his mind.

But still this is just the beginning. He will have misgivings specially now that WW will increase her efforts at her half hearted R.

Now that Dost told her in certain terms how he see the future, he should not make it a point all the time and courteously work towards D or whatever outcome that may be forth coming

[This message edited by goalong at 8:11 AM, June 11th (Sunday)]

dost,

It’s hard to be down on hope. It’s hard to fault people who have hope. It seems virtuous. But in cases of infidelity, it can keep you STUCK. Listen to me, chumps — hope is not your friend. You need to bludgeon hope with a fencepost and begin to operate with total lucidity.

Powerful stuff. I've been following this thread for quite some time. Your story has a lot of parallels with my own. You've simply pulled the trigger and I am dragging my feet, lulled by hope.

But I can see you are gaining a clearer understanding of where this is going, because you are controlling the outcome, not her.

Keep it up.

Sending you strength....and looking for my own.

Stay strong man

Hopium, a new word for my vocabulary. Thanks, MOB. A lot of hopium in my life. Doesn't buy much. If you add 2 bucks to a ton of hopium you can buy a cup of coffee most places. Hopium eventually loses its power.

Stay strong, dost.

WW texted me this morning asking if I'd be ok with the kids staying overnight in a 1 bedroom apt with her. 2 kids, 1 adult in a 1 bedroom apt. I said I'd be ok with that as long as kids were comfortable and it was safe.

I also said. Id like you to respond in regards to the parenting plan and I'd like to get everything back to the attorney to prepare the papers before the kids and I leave to go visit my parents, which is the 26th.

It sounds like you are able to keep WW from seeing your Hopium. If you keep moving forward with what you head knows is right your heart will follow.

Really good sign that she is looking for an apartment... odd that she would be interested in a one bedroom. That might mean she won't fight you on custody too much.

I wounder if she has worn out her welcome with the "friends" or if she is starting to believe the marriage is over.

Anyway, it sounds like your texts back are really good. Non emotional and to the point. Keep it up.