SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

And the big one. While away on a work trip. I was asked to go home with a woman at a bar. I agreed, she then remembered I said I was married. She said it wouldn't be a good idea. I agreed and I went back to my hotel alone. Had she said yes, I don't know what would have happened. I can only assume the logical outcome. That I would have slept with her.

Or she could have been an alien and eaten your intestines clear out of your body.

Pontification will get you nowhere, and there is an imbalance in her vs. your transgressions. They are both wrong, but hers took wrong to a whole new level compared to yours. You do not have the high road by any means, but she's in the subway. Deal with the facts, not the what-ifs.

Now go get a bucket of chicken and stop beating yourself up, just makes sure it's good chicken.

[This message edited by RubixCubed at 8:22 PM, January 13th (Monday)]

Could have/would have.

Certainly intent matters, a lot. The heart knows what it knows. N, you have gone through a giant arc of self-truth and self-discovery here on SI. I think what your heart is telling you is that, regardless of the literal data points describing your acts during that period (e.g. -- in the end, you didn't go home with that woman at the bar nor have sex with her), your heart was rotten with respect to your role as a husband, and it's likely that LD, with her woman's intuition, knew this at some level and felt injured by it, albeit perhaps subconsciously.

So, learn from this. You need to figure out your whys, like any Wayward should. What was broken in your moral compass and your commitment to your marriage and family that would lead you to that dark place? You'll not be a safe partner for LD, or anybody else, until you figure it out.

My observation is that LD has also been going through a giant arc of self discovery. The interesting thing about your story is that the catharsis of your DDay has launched both arcs. It really is a sort of crucible that both of you are going through, together.

I wish you luck my friend. You have been so human and real to us.

We're here to support you as long as you need us.

Forgiveness is such a strange thing. I'm likely to forgive my wife way before I ever forgive myself. How could I forgive myself knowing it was still a secret?

Well, now that your secrets are out, will you start the process of forgiving yourself, which will hopefully lead to learning to love yourself?

Your self-respect is in tatters, and understandably so, but what you need to do now is to learn from what you have done, correct the behaviours that led to that, and grow to be a better person.

IMHO, whether you decide to date your WW or another person, is secondary.

What you need, is to get yourself out of this funk, and be a great dad to your daughter.

Neanderthal, I'm glad you are no longer weighed down by the shame of your secrets.

Do you now have a better idea of what you want? It's pretty clear to me that she wants to know you and love you and get better with you. Recovery supported by my husband's love, and his recovery supported by mine, is one of the parts of our relationship I cherish most. Rereconcovciliationery. :) It's messy and sometimes painful but also wonderful. Do you want her to know you and love you and help you heal? Life is very short.

neandertal,it is not important what happened years before. Do you know why? Becouse you didnt wanted to leave your wife for OW and you didnt wanted to take your kid away and make OW her new mom. Your wife wanted to do just that. She loved her OM,wanted a familly with him,and she wanted to take your kid away from you and make her OM her new dad. That is what is inportant here,and it is unforgivable.And only wen you beat OM and he dropped her,only then she started to tell you that she oves you and wants to be with you. But you know what,if OM wanted to marry your wife,you would be single now.

[This message edited by DjDjani at 1:48 PM, January 14th (Tuesday)]

I will be starting a thread in the wayward section at some point. I want to prove to myself and my wife, that I can be a better person. We both need to become better people. For our daughters sake.

Or she could have been an alien

Doubtful, but who knows. I thought I was abducted by aliens once. But that's a story for another forum.

Certainly intent matters, a lot.

The best I can do is make an educated guess. It was almost 7 years ago and I was pretty drunk. I was always pretty drunk back then. Given everything else I was doing back then, my intentions were probably not good. My heart was rotten.

What was broken in me.....I've got a laundry list of whys. But so far most of them sound like excuses to me.

Do you now have a better idea of what you want?

I know what my heart wants, but I don't trust it. It doesn't align with how I think logically.

it is not important what happened years before

Maybe not to you. But to me, its very relevant. I'm fucked up. I need to unfuck myself for myself. Plus my wife deserves the truth and the opportunity to heal from my infidelity.

I've also not forgotten what she's done. Odds are our marriage wont survive this.

DJDani,

it is not important what happened years before. Do you know why? Becouse you didnt wanted to leave your wife for OW and you didnt wanted to take your kid away and make OW her new mom. Your wife wanted to do just that. She loved her OM,wanted a familly with him,and she wanted to take your kid away from you and make her OM her new dad. That is what is inportant here,and it is unforgivable.And only wen you beat OM and he dropped her,only then she started to tell you that she oves you and wants to be with you. But you know what,if OM wanted to marry your wife,you would be single now.

I'm not trying to defend anyone, but this is all speculation.

Had that woman in the bar not had morals, then possibly Neanderthal would have gone off with her and done the same.

And if the whole M was not messed up then maybe one or the other would never have done what they did.

Cheating is cheating.

Yes, I went full on and had sex with my AP many times, shared my feeling and thoughts. Is than any worse than the wayward who has virtual sex with a camgirl, or having an EA with the assistant at the office? Or the guy who rubs one out to porn everynight?

Sorry for the T/J.

I know what my heart wants, but I don't trust it. It doesn't align with how I think logically.

Logic because you rationally believe the odds are against you being able to get what your heart desires?

Or are you using logic to avoid going after what your heart desires, because you are afraid of being hurt again?

Imagine this playing out in a movie. Our hero knows in his heart what he wants. He's got all the information he is going to get, more or less. He logics himself into indecision. He fears himself into indecision. What are you rooting for him to do?

[This message edited by Pippin at 5:43 PM, January 14th (Tuesday)]

Logically our relationship should end. I know how hard it would be for me to forgive. Even with my history.

As emasculated as her affair made me feel, taking her back would probably be worse.

I still don't believe she knows what she wants. Can you imagine trying again just for her to finally realize, meh you aren't for me.

I want the hero to blow something up.

Logically our relationship should end.

Nope. Both D & R can be honorable actions.

I know how hard it would be for me to forgive.

OK. But forgiveness isn't necessary for either D or R.

Even with my history.

As emasculated as her affair made me feel, taking her back would probably be worse.

You might know that I argue the sense of emasculation is in your head. It's common, but it's not universal. For example, I felt it sometime, but most of the time I remembered W liked sex with me, and I always knew my parts worked, even at my age.

Right now, I think I read whining in your posts. Is that what you're doing?

If you don't want to R, acknowledge it, and act accordingly.

I still don't believe she knows what she wants. Can you imagine trying again just for her to finally realize, meh you aren't for me.

This makes me think you are giving her all your power. Stop.

It looks to me like you're using your own failings and your logic to avoid taking action to get out of your pain.

If you commit yourself to processing your emotional pain and find a good IC to help you do it, you will almost definitely free yourself from your pain. You really can live a good life.

But you have to do the work. That starts by taking responsibility for yourself and by taking appropriate actions.

Neanderthal,

I may be an outlier in all that has gone before between you and your wife, but, I see something there on both your parts.

Why not arrange a few meetings with the two of you, say with the help of a mediator, to talk about things? you let go of the outcome and go into it with the idea of sharing you side and listening to her side.

The discussion could be about whatever in regards to your M, but the point is unless you both actually stop and find a way to communicate then nothing will ever be resolved.

One thing I learned over these last few years is that honest communication can be the hardest, and also the most rewarding, thing.

Of course, we can only go on what both of you post. But I believe she very clearly loves you, and wants to be married to you.

I agree with Hellfire (imagine that?! 😂 Based upon what she’s written, your wife clearly loves you. I will take it one step further and say the same feelings exist from you towards her. Is that enough? Maybe or maybe not.

IMO the problem you’re both having right now is your mired in these feelings of what you’ve done AND what was done to you. You both have a choice. You can stay in this state and do nothing, you can D or you can look for a way back to each other. It really sounds like, other than creating physical space between each other, your both stuck in a state of pain and self loathing.

If I may make a suggestion, ask yourself a few questions. Do you still love your wife in spite of what’s happened? Can you learn to forgive yourself for what’s happened? Despite the state of your marriage now, I still think there’s a chance for you both. It’s always important to learn from your past; just don’t allow yourself to remain there.

Sisoon, am I bothering you? Wasting too much of your precious time with my feelings? You're a Guide so you must know everything. The hell with 3-5 years to deal with infidelity. Shit or get off the pot N.

As emasculated as her affair made me feel, taking her back would probably be worse.

Rule number one is you feel what you feel.

But feelings do change, for good and for bad, as infidelity reveals so often.

The A used to make me feel emasculated -- but my feelings evolved and changed. I studied what it meant to me and about me and the actual definitions of the word, and at the end of the day I wasn't made weaker by the actions of others.

I kept my vows. I kept my personal honor. I was made stronger by surviving the emotional trauma inflicted on me.

Nothing my wife did reflects on me. How I handle life going forward is on me. Offering grace where none was deserved turned out really well in my case. Because once we both re-dedicated ourselves to a better relationship, it all got better.

I don't care which path you end up on, I just hope you eventually discover no one can make you weaker by the shitty choices THEY make.

[This message edited by Oldwounds at 2:17 PM, January 15th (Wednesday)]

You're a Guide so you must know everything.

I wish we did, that would be awesome.

My take is guides do what other veteran members do and pass along the experiences that helped them to the other side of it all.

It's hit or miss, like all other advice.

The hell with 3-5 years to deal with infidelity. Shit or get off the pot N.

Healing is done on whatever timeframe it takes; I’m not a BS so I really can’t say. Deciding to go in one direction or, another, though—do you think it’s realistic to stay separated and in limbo for 3-5 years before you decide whether to divorce or stay together? Honest question.

Sisoon, am I bothering you? Wasting too much of your precious time with my feelings? You're a Guide so you must know everything. The hell with 3-5 years to deal with infidelity. Shit or get off the pot N.

How many years did you have to rugsweep your affairs and cheating and wayward behaviour? And your BW is supposed to just hump that because she had her own A? The only reason my wife and I are still together today is because we both owned our shit.

Grow a pair of balls and shit or get off the pot is what Sisoon is telling you.

How many years did you have to rugsweep your affairs and cheating and wayward behaviour? And your BW is supposed to just hump that because she had her own A? The only reason my wife and I are still together today is because we both owned our shit.

Grow a pair of balls and shit or get off the pot is what Sisoon is telling you.

Who the fuck said she has to dump anything?

I'm supposed to take advice from someone who has minimized his owns actions. Your long term affair is much fucking worse than porn use! That's you owning your own shit?

N,

Were you that triggered by Sisoon, or is there something else at play here?

If yes, what was the exact part that extracted so much anger?

If no, what else are you having a particularly difficult time with today?

Also, is it possible you fear forgiveness because you don't fully understand how to forgive (or make peace with) yourself?