SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

but atm, he’s still the selfish, manipulative, serial cheat just one who’s woken up to not wanting ‘that’ AP.

Excellent point.

This is a game to him unfortunately. He doesn’t want to end your marriage b/c if YOU do that he loses. Yet he wants to conti us to cheat because in his mind it’s ok.

You know the old saying “you always want what you can’t have”. This is his game - he doesn’t have you but now wants you.

It’s all a game to him. Nothing real obviously as he is still with the OW or some OW.

It’s so hard to try and appreciate life at times like this. It’s also difficult to comprehend that I want something that has already been destroyed and doesn’t exist anymore. How can you want something that you don’t actually want?!

Sweetie, that's just your "old wolf" trying to reassert himself. Feed your new wolf. There's an exercise (I think it's in Susan Anderson's The Journey from Abandonment to Healing, but I can't remember right now), but in essence, it's a creative visualization exercise where you imagine your ideal home. It can be anything you like. In your imagination, you have all the resources you need at your disposal. (I was very surprised to find mine was a small cottage with Japanese gardens. )

Anyway, this one little creative visualization exercise will help feed your new wolf. Keep building on it. Draw pictures of it, journal about it, get into detail, etc. It seems like such a small thing, but your new neural pathway doesn't know the difference between what's real and what's guided. It grows just the same.

Feed your "new wolf".

Yeah it seems like he enjoys living a double life and spent want to give either up. Like what was said, different voids are filled by me and OW. But he can’t sustain both long term and he will no doubt learn the hard way.

Hopefully the old wolf is getting weaker and weaker by the weeks and will be invisible in he near distant future while the old wolf conquers.

He said to me the other day that my mum could of ‘spared me’ some heartache by telling her family so I didn’t have to. Well what about him sparing me all of this by not being a complete tit!

He has asked why our DD has been told we are moving house. To which I pointed out that we were. There is a for sale sign outside and she will see me packing up/clearing out. So be honest person I am, I will explain to her along the way and make it an adventure. I wonder if he actually has any emotions or common sense left in him.

Wonder what tricks he will play next and obstacles he will throw at me?! No more MC so I don’t need to listen to an audience with WH! I would love to know what my future holds. Lots of happiness and contentment I hope, but would be lovely to see a tiny glimpse so that I know all my efforts now will pay off.

NB just posted a book on another thread that really helped me find my inner warrior, it might help you. Leave a cheater gain a life is the title. Just a thought.

Keep travelling your path, you’re doing a great job. Don’t forget keep contact very brief and don’t engage small talk. You’ve got this!

Oh I will have a look at that book. I got one and read it over but had to put it down because it became unhealthy reading it so much. It would help if everything he did didn’t annoy me! He’s in two worlds and we are forgotten about when he’s in the other. I know he doesn’t give half a shit about me anymore but what about our DD? Or am I expecting too much from him?! Am I expecting him to be rational, caring and compassionate. I can’t go a day without knowing my DD is ok.

I don’t know how long I can cope with this parallel universe he has created that is impacting mine and DD so much. It’s awful. He’s spent the last 15 years ‘checking in’ on me and the last 3 ensuring his DD is ok. To have now gone to if and when it fits with him. Is this the new him now or just because he’s so obsessed with OW (despite saying he isn’t).

Sorry lots of questions that you can’t answer but only advise from your experiences.

Well had WH arrive to collect DD last night. Again lots of questions...all avoided and told him to not ask me anything personally again and he doesn’t need to know anymore or have the right. He obviously was suspicious and arrived this morning to pick up a jacket he needed (why he couldn’t get last night I’m not sure). He’s very miserable at the moment and seems to want to talk but won’t. House up for sale for 4 days and he asked if I thought it was worrying we hadn’t had any interest. WTF!! It’s been 4 days it will sell when it sells. Get the feeling someone doesn’t want it to sell. What a strange statement. Off to IC this morning, that will help me with my thoughts this morning.

There's no way to rationalize insane.

You really need to go NC.

Can you have a friend or family member to do DD exchange?

Can you block him on your phone?

Can you have a friend do any needed conversation through an email account? A "close" trusted friend would only pass to you pertinent mails, they would have to filter them . Only pass finance, D and DD relevant messages.

Have you gone through with D papers already? That should really help with him realize that it's done, you are no longer his property.

We haven’t been through divorce papers yet but this has been suggested. He isn’t pushing for anything at the moment and other than selling the house and splitting finances we haven’t done anything else. I have also suggested a mediator so that we both know what in terms of finances. Booking this is my next step. I am coping with the current things that are being sorted but feel if I did everything at once that this would be too much for me to cope with. He is agreeing to everything that I want at present but I am fully aware that this may change and solicitors will become involved at that point.

We haven’t discussed a friend doing handover. Not sure if this would be possible but can defo have a think. I can block him on my phone but not sure how that would work with DD arrangements. Unless we use a friend for this too. I am hoping to get through this the easiest way and to remain amicable for DD. I think I have done well so far under the circumstances and constant insanity he ripples our way. I have noticed in myself that I am stronger and more equipped when these ripples arrive. I also know that when I move out and into my parents this will be a great escape and one he cannot overcome, unless he does a complete change and want to be there for DD and build or friendship moving forward.

Part of moving on is actually moving on. You can't redesign your life with any authority as long as you're still in limbo as this guy's wife. What happens if you meet someone cool and want to date? What happens if your WH gets his nose out of joint and doesn't return your DD after visitation or takes her on extended vacation with his OW? In most jurisdictions, parents have equal rights unless there's a legal, binding custody agreement in place. You're trusting what you knew, not what's in front of you. There's another voice in your WH's ear and you can't know what kind of poison might be poured in.

I think you're selling yourself a good bit short by thinking you can't handle the details just now. You can. You've already proved how strong you are. This is just the next step in protecting you and your DD. Your attorney can guide you through one step at a time, but first you have to hire one, right?

Have faith that are stronger than you think. You've already proved it. You're a mom and you're a good one. That makes you mighty. And you've already said "No More" to the perpetual victimization of infidelity. That makes you mighty. This next step, while difficult, is necessary to achieving true freedom so you can really move on with life. You're NOT the one who ended the marriage. He is. All you're doing is crossing the t's and dotting the i's on a decision he made when he chose to break the covenant.

((big hugs))

Yeah limbo sucks and a new way of forced life does too. Having to almost play a game in a way. A side that you want and need to take but not one you chose that long ago. I feel like I will be in limbo until I move out of the family home. It’s like being in a cage. NC does help immensely and avoids further hurts and limbo. Despite having some satisfaction that he looks shit and is struggling, along with things with OW not being great the decision is still the decision. And surprisingly after such a short time I am able to see a positive future without him. I also don’t look at him that way anymore. He’s my DD’s dad and nothing else. I don’t miss him, long for him, think ‘oh I will just text/ring him’. I don’t wonder what he is doing or whether he is ok. I don’t dream about him or what we had. I dream about my DD, being on the beach, decorating my new home in the future. I thank my friends daily for the support they have provided and I focus my love and energy on them.

This paths a hard one to walk and my two steps forward three back are now two forward and one back. Being on dancing forward on my path.

Hi all,

Please could I call out for some help, reassurance and hugs?!

Had a really bad day today. One of my worst I would say in a while. I’ve had some really good days - when he’s not around messing with my head (I know you will all cry it about NC). Other than trying to get a restraining order on him I’m not sure I can do this at the moment. I haven’t arrived to the I AM FUCKING ANGRY with you stage. It’s been 3.5 months and it still hasn’t arrived.

I’m sick to death of his behaviour and mind fucks he now provides which are all part of his new relationship. He is a complete stranger. He’s not one ounce the person I knew! He is still going on about going to MC together. Is this part of his control?! I’m not by the way. I just don’t get it. I can’t understand any of it.

I’m hurting so much and don’t know where to turn at times. I find this place a great place for support and it stops me from contacting him and keeps me focused. Please keep me sane girls. X

You will get through this and come out better for it. I promise.

As for MC, I would suggest going one last time, talk to the MC prior to the both of you being there and use that time to inform your STBXH of how things will need to be handled from that day forward - You don't want to talk to him unless it is about child or bills. You will only respond via email (or text), pick up and drop off will be done at your Mum's - and inform him that you will not be there - (make sure you have someone willing to step up to do this for you). Inform him that as far as your marriage goes, there is NOT one. You won't be in a marriage that consists of three people, you won't play happy home because it is not happy and you will not be waiting in the wings for him to get his head out of his arse. Inform him from now on, this is the very last MC you will be partaking in and if he doesn't like it to bad. He made his choice on how his life was going to be - he wanted a girlfriend and now he has the freedom to have as many girlfriends as he wants. He made his choice that made him happy, now you are making your choice with what you can live with and be happy and he is not a part of that life.

Don't let his mind fucks take up space in your brain. If he starts talking about how happy he is, hang up/walk away. If he starts harping on having family time, inform him that your daughter has family time. Family time is with you and your parents and then she has family time with him and whomever he is with. He has no say so over what you do or say now. That gives you power - power to make a life that is one you are happy in.

Tell him you were happy being a family when it was you, him and your child. He decided that was not enough, so you set him free to find his happiness. That means you are free to find your own happiness and it will not be playing sister wives.

I know you don't want to be in a relationship where you share your hubby - has he mentioned that he would be ok with you having a boyfriend or was he being completely dickish and wanted you to be celibate while he has a gf? I can't remember if you mentioned that or not...but in any case - YOU are strong, You are beautiful and YOU deserve someone who will treat you as if you are the most precious thing in the world.

(hugs)

Mamadragon, thank you for replying so quickly.

No he wants me to find someone else. Well he said that in the beginning but when his head peeps out of his arse he asks me where I am going, who with etc. Like as if he is jealous and wouldn’t actually like it if I had a boyfriend. I actually think he doesn’t believe I will move back to be near my parents and put my DD in school there when that time comes. He’s obviously as stupid as I thought with this, because I knew early on that this was my only option to remove myself from his bomb devastation and continued mind fuck.

He is constantly online on WhatsApp! He is back obsessed with the OW. So when this happens DD and I are dropped and he’s left the building! I wish there was some sort of hypnotherapy I could go to that would allow me to move on quicker. To give me the strength to stop myself being sucked right back in. We are constantly fighting for power over each other. When he’s miserable I’m happy and when I’m miserable he’s happy. It’s bloody awful. It’s torture!

I don’t actually want him back if that makes sense. I just want to know him again. It is frightening to see someone change so much so quickly. Even the way he communicates now is completely different.

Sweetie I’m sending you a big hug.

Look lovely, you’re saying he’s changed, he hasn’t changed. This is who he has ALWAYS been. What’s changed is your ability to see through his bullshit. He wants you to go to MC so he can play the good guy. This man is ALL about trying to keep up his image of the good guy. If he drags you to MC, he can rewrite the narrative about what you did. MC will inevitably fail and then he can claim he tried so hard to save the marriage to all those friends who love to run between you both. He extremely manipulative.

As for him wanting to know who you’re with and so forth, again textbook, of course he doesn’t want his supply of ego kibbles to be giving them to anyone else. Look he doesn’t love you, and he doesn’t love the AP. Right now he doesn’t have a Scooby doo what love is. All he cares about is obtaining kibbles,

I recommended a book last time, please read it, it was written for BS just like you. It’ll speak to you and help you understand his drives. They are all about selfishness and entitlement.

Now this is where I’m going to get a bit hard. Stay off his bloody whatsapp. You’re pain shopping. You know he’s with this AP, why do that to yourself? I have said this all along and I’ll say it again, she is not the issue here. You need to focus on the bigger picture here, he’s a serial cheat, he has done this to you three times that you know of. Stop trying to analyse each little detail and look to the big picture, he a nasty piece of work, those rose coloured glasses need to come off.

Youre doing so well. You have so many plans to move forward. You’re being a fabulous mother to that wonderful little girl of yours. Keep travelling your path. Again huge hugs!

Much needed hugs Dragonfly.

You’ve made a good point about the MC. Makes him look like the good guy. Why else would he go. I’ve been wondering that for a while now, but adding to his hero status that is ✅. He needs one hell of a IC because he is one messed up individual!

As to the WhatsApp - my mum tells me that. I was ridiculous in the beginning. Wanting to know his every move. That’s past now, thank god! Just the WhatsApp checking today. Yeah further pain but nice confirmation that he’s a dick and I am right in thinking that and he isn’t a weak little man that needs help. It’s also confirmation that he’s like a seesaw with his kibbles. I hope I’m the one to get off this bloody seesaw before the OW does.

I have got two books I’ve read and put away. Got too obsessed with reading about it all. But will open it again if you think it would help.

one thing that gives you power and help to detach from him is the 180. read up and modify it to fit your situation.

Don't go to MC, unless you go one last time to inform him that "this is how I am going forth and it is not with you".

He is showing you who he is, believe him. He is not going to be your friend - at best you *might* be able to co-parent.

Don't let him push you out of your house. Stay there until *YOU* are ready to leave. Get your ducks in a row and take your time doing so. When he comes to pick up your child for a visit, have her ready and waiting on the porch. When he walks up, hand her off and turn around and shut the door. Do not give him the chance to speak. Tell him in your last MC 'no contact except by text or email and only about child, bills or visitation". Anything else - he gets crickets. Better yet, be dressed to kill when he picks her up - even if you only go for a long drive by yourself. You will show him that you are not waiting on him = that you have a life and he is no longer a part of it.

It will drive him bat shit crazy - do not give in to him and respond in any matter. As the song says "he is just someone you used to know".

You will be just fine, if not better than before - you are stronger than you know, and honestly, you want your child to see how strong, how beautiful and how awesome her Mum is. You will find those bitch boots soon and will stomp a mud hole making your life perfect

I just want to know him again.

Why? Serious question. I think it would do you a world of good to sit with that for awhile. What do you think you'd find out about him that you don't already know?

Seems to me that the things you DO already know would be enough. You already know he's an adulterer. You already know that he doesn't share the same values. You already know that his word means nothing; his vows mean nothing. You know he's dishonest about who he is and what he believes. You know he's the kind of zero who would walk out on his family, who doesn't honor his commitments. You know that he lies to himself and everyone around him about being a decent human being. You know that his chief motivators are ego kibbles, centrality, and impression management, thus you also know that he is narcissistic in his dealings with others. And I know if you sit down and spend some time with it, you'll think of a dozen other things you already know which preclude this guy from being someone you want in your life in any sort of emotionally intimate way or with any kind of frequency.

We've talked repeatedly about your "old wolf" and this is him. And please don't think we don't understand how hard it is and how confusing it is to be confronted with the face of our dear one and not be able to truly recognize him. We do. We've all been there. As soon as you engage, the old wolf reasserts and you just can't believe that all the new things you know are actually true. But honey, they are. They really are.

This guy has given you no hope of him making any kind of recovery. All he's done is extract value from you.. in kibbles, in centrality, in impression management. That's what narcs DO. And it's sad to see someone you once loved more than life itself go down that path, but NOTHING you do can change him. There's no indication at all that he's even capable of it. All you can do is save yourself and your DD so you don't end up spending your lives in orbit around Planet Ego.

Book that attorney. Just do it. At worst, you come away with a little more information than you had before, and at best, you start truly envisioning a life for yourself and your little girl that YOU design.

((big hugs))

Hey NB, new day, hope you’ve woken up feeling brighter. Just to say reading the books really helped me get to a place where I understood my CS drives. (Gently), you’re already obsessing day in and day out, I know because I was there and in many ways I still am. You will obsess it’s part of the process but obsess in a healthier way. Read and understand as much as you can. ‘Leave a cheater, gain a life’ is a fabulous read for newly betrayed, it’s very accessible, and by the tone of your thread perfect for you, as it attempts to answer so many of your questions as you try to make sense of the nonsensical.

Knowledge is power NB, it really is. The more knowledge you have the less blindsided you’ll be by his behaviour.

Hugs (((NB))) you got this, honestly you really have!

Hey everyone,

Book ordered and on its way. Today no brighter than the last unfortunately. But it’s intensified by lack of sleep. DD up most of the night. Don’t think MC even one last time is a good idea. Not whilst I am feeling like this. Need to be on top of my game to get across how I feel. I’m immobilised with anxiety again but will carry on with my day and hope it passes quickly.

I am having one serious wobble. I will read 180 now and try to do things that will make me feel better. It’s an awful feeling....you’ve been dumped by your WH and then you’re trapped at the same time. You are unable to cut yourself from them in an instance like they did us. I have to wait for the house to sell and finances to be split. Healing would happen much quicker if this could be done in an instant.

I also have to learn to ‘enjoy’ (couldn’t think of another word) how I feel. Even the overwhelming flight response i get when I’m anxious.

Thank you for your support ladies. It helps me lots and keeps me focused and a nice reminder that yes why would I want to know him again. What is there to know?! And he hasn’t done anything to even show he’s remorseful or actually concerned about me.