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Newest Member: Red000

Reconciliation :
BH claims he wants to R, but no effort after 4 years

Topic is Sleeping.

Booyah ( member #60124) posted at 1:05 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

So your husband saw this coming (your affair) and even expressed his concerns to you??

Despite him doing this you still made the choice to betray him, stab him in the back, and murder your marriage.

Maybe it's just me but you also have all these reasons why you chose to do what you did. If there were issues in the marriage you work on them (you know like adults are supposed to do) and if he was unwilling to (get counseling) and if did but that didn't change things to your liking than at that point you'd have a decision to make (stay or go).

However that is NOT what you consciously CHOSE to do. Nope. You CHOSE the COWARDS way and KNOWINGLY blew up your marriage by having an affair with your boss also KNOWING that your husband had voiced his concerns to you that things were heading in this direction.

How F'd up is that!!

Sounds to me it was also another way of sticking it to your husband.

Again I don't think you've truly grasped what you've done to your husband.

Your husband isn't dealing with being STABBED in the back and heart the way you want him to? And YOU are the one who jabbed the knife in him?

So here you are four years later and things aren't where you want them?

Should your husband move on if this is a deal breaker for him? Some will say yes.

Your husband isn't handling all of this in a healthy way or again the way you want him to?

I can think of a shit load of things that are going through his head for the past 4+ yrs that he's not too happy about and desperately wishing you had chosen to do things differently.

Maybe in a warped way he's thinking you blew this marriage up. You killed it. So you be the one to ultimately end it and actually file for divorce.

Do you deserve how he's handling your betrayal? Not for me to say but there's a thing called consequences and none of this would be happening if you didn't choose to handle things like a freaking coward and step out of your marriage knowing your husband had major concerns this could happen.

If you don't like where things are, stop being a coward and finish what you did to your husband and marriage and that's end things by ripping up what was put on paper when you two married and legally end things even though you already did this.

posts: 1254   ·   registered: Aug. 11th, 2017
id 8690614

ButAnyway ( member #79085) posted at 4:28 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

^^THIS^^ … I agree.

The more BA describes her A and her mindset, the more I understand her BH.

posts: 135   ·   registered: Jul. 7th, 2021
id 8690642

13YearsR ( member #58259) posted at 4:28 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

Why not strip off the hair shirt and start demanding an equal role in your marriage? Your BH has had plenty of time to punish you... and he has, in spades. Meanwhile, you've straightened out your mind and your moral compass in therapy, correct? Try changing YOUR attitude to reflect it. You've worked hard so you can have some self-respect and dignity, right? Why not ACT LIKE IT? Confidence is attractive. Strength is sexy. When you start acting like a person who DESERVES to be treated like an equal, it might come as a shock to your BH at first, but... he's also going to be reminded of WHO YOU ARE and what your value is. When you act like all you are is a cheater, doesn't it stand to reason that all he sees is a cheater? And honestly, what colossal hypocrisy on his part. It's like he thinks there's one set of rules for you and another for him. My point is that we are each the arbiter of our own worth. When we believe that we have value, we don't tolerate mistreatment. But there's also something magical that happens when we believe we have value, right?... other people start seeing it too.

This! This! A thousand times, this! It will either help save your marriage or prepare you well for moving on. Win/win.

Also, I really, really hope that when you see responses like Booyah's that you realize that they're simply dumping their pain on you. It has nothing to do with you. It's all about them. Hold your head up and do your best. smile

The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off. ~ Gloria Steinem

The grass is greener on the other side of the fence because you're not over there messing it up.

DDay 2004. Successful R. 33 years married

posts: 604   ·   registered: Apr. 13th, 2017   ·   location: TX
id 8690643

HowCouldSheDoIt ( member #78431) posted at 5:45 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

I want to add my $0.02 to support the idea that things are different knowing that the BH cheated too.

I agree it isn't the same as initial cheating and I'm sure the trauma and shock is very different. But I do told her BH to a different standard knowing that he also cheated. It is still betrayal, it is still going back on your word to be faithful, it is all those things. Just because she cheated first doesn't make it less cheating.

So BA does have an argument here to expect her MH husband to meet her at the table and see her as more than just a cheater. As I write that I'm not suggesting otherwise even if he didn't cheat, I just want to apply some sense of responsibility to him especially since just like any other cheating he had other options, every one of them better than cheating.

I so, so hate cheating.

Me: BH Early 50's
Her: WW Early 50's
D-Day Nov 2020
Married 21 years before D-Day
3 children
Working toward reconciling. The most difficult thing I've had to do in my life.

posts: 307   ·   registered: Mar. 3rd, 2021
id 8690659

Booyah ( member #60124) posted at 6:14 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

So every post that might be speaking some hard TRUTH is just "dumping our pain" on to her??

You want some more hard truth 13Years??

My ex, who cheated on me nearly 30 yrs ago, was dealt with immediately. I knew it was a deal breaker the minute she put a knife in my back. I handed her divorce papers as fast as they could be written up and more importantly I haven't looked back.

I've been happily married for 22 yrs and my wife knows what will happen if she wants to mess around emotionally or physically with another man.

As for OP, when someone who's cheated has a list of reaso

posts: 1254   ·   registered: Aug. 11th, 2017
id 8690670

Booyah ( member #60124) posted at 6:30 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

Sorry last post got cut off.

When OP has a list of reasons why she cheated, and her husband saw this coming and she STILL stepped out on him???

She has NO idea what remorse is or she wouldn't be saying "I did this but....".

Not saying what her husband is doing is right but if he's fucked up (and he IS based upon what she's said) than she damn well is THE reason!!

Should he just end it? Obviously it's a deal breaker but he for whatever reason can't seem to have the courage to do so.

OP is Obviously a coward because she does NOT get it. It's like apologizing to someone and saying "I apologize but".

People who get this understand there's no "but".

She had the courage to stab her husband in the back and murder her marriage and let a man who wasn't her husband have his way with her so if doesn't like the way things are going than quit being a freaking COWARD and END things legally as her marriage was officially over the minute she had an affair with her boss and again her husband had concerns this was going to happen and voiced his concerns to her and it went in one ear and out the other which was another HUGE dagger put in his heart and followed by a big FUCK YOU!!

So 13Years you just go ahead and coddle OP because how dare anyone call a spade a spade. In your world it isn't something she should hear and if she does it's because I'm "dumping my pain" on her???

Thank you for making me laugh.

posts: 1254   ·   registered: Aug. 11th, 2017
id 8690673

ButAnyway ( member #79085) posted at 6:42 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

FWIW, I agree with Booyah.

We all have different life experiences and perspectives that shape the advice we offer. I have no issue with opposing advice so long as there is a valid basis for that advice. I have more issues with advice from someone who is in infidelity limbo through their own inactions and fear advising someone else how to deal with their limbo.

posts: 135   ·   registered: Jul. 7th, 2021
id 8690679

HowCouldSheDoIt ( member #78431) posted at 7:57 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021


I fully agree with you, there is no "but" and there is no "only" (as in I only cheated once or it was only an EA).

The most damaging at worst / unsatisfying at best discussions I've had with WW included a "but" usually intimating "but you hurt me too." It just makes things so, so, so much worse and my takeaway is that you're shifting blame, not owning your own stuff, and not really sorry.

So I am in 100% complete agreement.

Me: BH Early 50's
Her: WW Early 50's
D-Day Nov 2020
Married 21 years before D-Day
3 children
Working toward reconciling. The most difficult thing I've had to do in my life.

posts: 307   ·   registered: Mar. 3rd, 2021
id 8690693

HellFire ( member #59305) posted at 8:13 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

I agree with Booyah.

I also want to say that "posts like his" are often not people simply dumping their pain on the OP. (Which is so incredibly dismissive and condescending). Often, posts like his cut through the bullshit,and say what everyone is thinking. It's not sugar-coated. The WS just isn't being treated with kid gloves.

OP, you still have no idea,after 4 years, how you've decimated the man you say you love. THAT may be a huge stumbling block for him. I know it was for me. I was incredibly angry..until my husband started to "get it." Once he understood just how much his affair affected me, it was amazing how quickly my anger disappeared.

Oh...and before it's dismissed..I am not dumping any pain on you. I'm reconciled. Dday was about a dozen years ago. My marriage is fine. blink

posts: 4665   ·   registered: Jun. 20th, 2017   ·   location: The Midwest
id 8690702

src9043 ( member #75367) posted at 9:03 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

I wonder how much the father of OP played in her decision to cheat? She may have been disgusted with her father for what he did, but on a subconscious level, did it give her some license to do the same? This is not the first account I have read where a WW had a father do such a terrible thing, yet ends up copying him.

BH is caught between that rock and a hard place that most BSs find themselves. Add the fact that he certainly had difficultly coping with life prior to the affair, it is no surprise that R seems futile at this point. The affair was pretty bad. It lasted a number of months and the WH's attempt to head it off were ignored by OP. It sounds like the affair ended when it was exposed. The OP feels like she has now been played by the AP. Huh? What were her expectations during the affair? Did the AP feed her crap that he was going to leave his wife for her? Was that her expectation? Unless I missed something, I don't think any of this has been made clear.

Nevertheless, at this point, things look quite bleak. BH's obsession with revenge and actually carrying out plans to fulfill that desire four years later is troublesome. I think most BHs despise the OM. I do. But to spend much time and energy on this pursuit years later is a symptom of how utterly destroyed this affair has left the BH.

The BH must acknowledge the fact that he just won't be able to forgive and move on. He is certainly entitled to feel that way and should not have to apologize to anyone for his mindset. Adding infidelity to a marriage that seemed dysfunctional per the OP is just a death knell.

But if the BH and OP still wish to try and save what is left of their marriage, who am I to discourage them. While it shouldn't rest on his shoulders, in order for the marriage to survive, the BH ultimately will have to forgive. He will have to eat that big shit sandwich. It's a cost/benefit analysis in the end.

BTW, I admire Booyah's approach to infidelity. I should have done exactly what he did. It may not be right for everyone, but I suspect there are plenty of BSs out there who "reconciled" and daydream wishing they did exactly what he did. It takes a certain confidence and courage in a person to totally upend their lives. It is much harder than agreeing to stay in my opinion. To many of us, staying was just a slow death. Any way you slice it, the person who should always have your back, threw you, the marriage, and the children under the bus. The "reasons" simply don't matter. Why in the hell should any rational person want to continue a marriage with that person?

[This message edited by src9043 at 9:45 PM, Tuesday, September 28th]

posts: 677   ·   registered: Sep. 7th, 2020
id 8690713

Jorge ( member #61424) posted at 9:04 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

He’s been stuck in that place and I’m helpless to do anything to change him. I get more upset when he does have moments of being emotional or vulnerable and he does want intimacy, it’s very one sided and afterwards it is back to the coldness which makes me feel used and upset.

Some in your place are happy they have a chance. It's not for everyone though, so if you feel used, discontinue. Feeling used is because he's had sex with you, but not intimate sex possibly. If this doesn't cut it for you, it's your option to decline.

I always acknowledge how I caused this pain but reiterate that I love him and want to R more than anything. He doubts my authenticity because he seems to still think the AP was some true love of mine. How could I want my H when I did that to him? This thought pattern justifies to him his treating me as if I’m not even there.

It's pretty typical for him to think AP was a love of yours. The thinking is if another man was enough for you to risk losing him, your family and marriage, then love or something very close to it was probable. If you tell him you love him (husband) after protecting yourself with lies, it's unreasonable for him to separate truth from non-truths. Just consider this so that you can manage your expectations.

I truly do want R but I only want it if it’s authentic.

What does authenticity look like for you and how does that look to you?
The question implies he hasn't been authentic so he'll have to be told he's being inauthentic.
Does being authentic on his part mean not bringing the affair up?
Does it mean he is forgiving and if so what does forgiveness look like to you?
Outside of authenticity, what else is required of HIM will you need.
Have you asked him what is expected of you?

It’s hard for me to feel like he’s ever going to love me again the way I want and need. I’m so confused day to day because he’ll talk to me about our house construction as if I’m his partner and always wants my input on his revenge plans when he’s not lying to me about what he’s doing, but then we have zero other connections.

I understand this considering he's told you this. Not throwing darts here but this is the default consequence of infidelity. Not much, if anything is the same. He will not love you the same or with the significance that satisfies your needs. Some couples can reconcile with this and others can't. You'll have to make a choice here.

He never makes eye contact with me and he seems quite content that i sleep in the other room.

Again, another result of infidelity. I can relate to this, having been cheated on a couple of times. It was my inability to make eye contact that confirmed the end of my engagement with my x. I could not look at the person that thoughtfully and premeditatedly betrayed me. Eye contact for me was a form of self-betrayal, which I wasn't going to do. Eye contact is meaningful. It means for me you are accepting of that person and commits to engage with them. I could not do that with the person that disregarded my love for them. I'm not suggesting your husband is thinking this, but just giving you alternative thoughts to consider from my own personal experience.

He acts as if he can live like this forever or until the kids are out of the house, and Ive been trying to be patient and endure for the kids sake and to give him time to heal, but it just isn’t happening and I feel like I want to give up.

Everyone has a different threshold of pain and endurance. If you want to give up and are truly done, file.

I get so confused since I’m the WW I feel so much guilt but I also feel it’s more damaging staying together at this point. He just won’t budge.

The question that comes to my mind when I read this is where is he in his healing journey? Assuming zero is the starting point and 100 is where he has emotionally healed to a heathy state (defined by an infidelity or trauma specialist) where does your husband stand? It says here on SI that reconciliation can't happen without recovering. If he's in the middle of the recovery process while reconciling, then your expectations are off the mark.

Furthermore, if your patience is thin and your timetable doesn't sync with his, then you will have to make the hard decision to separate and divorce. The problem is even BS don't know there own timetable so it'll be blind faith on your part. Speaking of blind faith, he too is exhibiting blind faith just by being with you but he's not all-in yet. It's not possible to be all-in if he's still thinking he's inferior to your AP. Remember, it doesn't matter what you tell him, BS can only go by actions and the actions they draw upon were your activities with the AP. It's etched in his memory and will take a long while to manage in such a way that he can surrender his heart once again.

I feel so awkward in my own home - everything in it as I look around seems like it won’t be mine soon so I find it impossible to just exist like this.

Have you told him this and has he told you how he feels during the affair and now?

He was happy with just 1 child and resented the times I was at work and he had to care for the kids because he felt I was putting my career over the kids

Women have done this for years and have done so with dignity, grace and not complained. It's the world of one income households. Marriage means some stuff is going to be one-sided at times. Just like I don't have sympathy for wives or husbands who cheat due to their husbands or wives working late hours. Personally, I don't know anyone that LOVES working late, traveling, commuting and being away from their families. I've never met one although I'm sure they exist. Working a job that is demanding and stressful is also a lonely existence where you long to be with your family at the dinner table.

I also just felt so uncomfortable being next to someone I knew didn’t want me there.

Remember, it's not that he didn't want you there. He didn't want the person that cheated on him there. Important to empathize (not accept) with the difference.

his anger was so overwhelming that my issues just fell to the wayside.

Post infidelity and surviving it means your issues will be subordinate for periods of time. To progress, this will have to be accepted with extraordinary patience and love.

I also think the reason my IC encourages a healing separation is to try to jar my BH into changing.
Has your husband or IC required you to be jarred into changing anything?

But the OMW found out about the A before my H and there was a period of TT where BH wanted to talk to OMW to compare stories and she lied to him about the extent of things in an effort to protect her H.

What's or who is your husband's truth source aside from you? If one doesn’t exist, then certainly you understand his inability to move forward, no? Truth is required to be the foundation. If he doesn’t think he has it, then no foundation exists for him to rebuild the relationship perhaps?

BH often says that he doesn’t even think he desires having a true partnership with anyone again, that it’s too late for him for that. I don’t believe that’s true, I’m sure it’s the hurt talking, but I know that I really want a true partnership.

You may not believe it but it's very important that you believe him today, September 28, 2021, and should be used as a measure of the depth of his pain and despair. What he is saying is, he's broken and from his perspective his heart is unfixable.

posts: 719   ·   registered: Nov. 14th, 2017   ·   location: Pennsylvania
id 8690715

13YearsR ( member #58259) posted at 9:18 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

How anyone could read this story and still pin all the blame on the OP for the current state of the relationship is beyond me. She's been working on herself, she's owning her shit, and trying to work on her marriage and HE HASN'T/WON'T. For four years. This is not new pain. It's time for him to sack up and own his shit and work on his healing, and if he doesn't, he's not a good candidate for R. Period. She can't drag his ass through R. It doesn't work that way. And she damn sure shouldn't own his nonsense. She's not making him act the fool. He's doing that all on his own.

Everyone needs to own their own shit. And stop saying shit like, "You have no idea how you've hurt him." Yes, she does:

I always acknowledge how I caused this pain but reiterate that I love him and want to R more than anything.

Ive been trying to be patient and endure for the kids sake and to give him time to heal

I want to understand the depths of his pain because maybe that could help him find his way.

And if my staying helps him in some way I feel like I owe it to him to do that.

I don’t want to cause any more damage to anyone.

Someone said my OP sounded like I don’t really respect my BH. I’m not sure what I said that conveyed that, but I definitely do. I’m entirely empathetic to the suffering I caused and would do anything to help him heal.

The fact that I allowed myself to cheat sickens me.

...immense guilt that I’m responsible for breaking the person I love, possibly for life. In the guilty moments I don’t think I could ever leave because I don’t want to cause more hurt.

Let go of the blame game and pay attention to the issue at hand, which is that the OP is trying to save her marriage, and her BS/WS seemingly won't do SHIT to help save it. We all say that it takes two committed partners to R, right? Well, in this instance the committed partner is the WS, and the BS/WS is too busy pining for revenge and playing the victim to come to the table. And what I'm not gonna do is stand by while y'all come with your torches and pitchforks to drag her to the bonfire and light her up. Especially on her first post.

We used to have a really strong WS community here. DS would have shut down this nonsense in a heartbeat. I miss her.

[This message edited by 13YearsR at 9:28 PM, Tuesday, September 28th]

The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off. ~ Gloria Steinem

The grass is greener on the other side of the fence because you're not over there messing it up.

DDay 2004. Successful R. 33 years married

posts: 604   ·   registered: Apr. 13th, 2017   ·   location: TX
id 8690720

ButAnyway ( member #79085) posted at 10:07 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021


IMHO, you’re not paying attention to what’s going on here. BH doesn’t want to R. He wants to maintain access to his kids and BA has admitted this is likely the case.

He is simply jerking her around with half truths to keep her off balance with hopium to keep her from filing, which basically is what she did to him during her A. It’s simple consequences for her previous actions.

Once the kids are of age or reach the age where a judge will consider their custody preferences, he’ll probably embrace a D from BA. Until then she can either endure or file … shit sandwiches can be served in both directions.

posts: 135   ·   registered: Jul. 7th, 2021
id 8690727

13YearsR ( member #58259) posted at 10:20 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

I think you're probably right, But Anyway. He's definitely not acting like he wants to R. And I don't think the OP should sit at the table with a napkin on her lap and daintily eat the shit sandwich that he's serving her. He either needs to show her that he wants to R or she needs to move along. Or she can stay, if that's what she wants to do, but I don't think it is. It's eating her alive.

It’s simple consequences for her previous actions.

Is it, though? Is tit for tat healthy? Is that what we recommend here in the R forum? No, it isn't. We want to see growth, empathy, and healthy relationships, not payback.

[This message edited by 13YearsR at 10:27 PM, Tuesday, September 28th]

The truth will set you free, but first it will piss you off. ~ Gloria Steinem

The grass is greener on the other side of the fence because you're not over there messing it up.

DDay 2004. Successful R. 33 years married

posts: 604   ·   registered: Apr. 13th, 2017   ·   location: TX
id 8690732

Luna10 ( member #60888) posted at 11:22 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

What is sad in this story is how two adults are willing to waste their lives indefinitely.

When I set off to R with my cheating husband I didn’t have any clear path of what that means. I knew it may work or not. I gave myself a deadline to have this sorted by though. A generous one after reading it takes 2-5 years and many times I thought I’m done only to give it a bit longer. Having a deadline meant that I knew what I wanted to achieve, what good looks like.

What I didn’t set off to do was live a miserable life for the rest of my days. It’s the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my life by far, to actually willingly accept your misery without trying to do something about it is really, really sad… I have no advice, I wish the BH/WH would be here to tell us his struggles too. It sounds like he’s really depressed and in pain and he doesn’t know where to turn anymore, he refuses to actually take action to change his life not because his WW says so, but because he deserves a life where he laughs again, where he doesn’t plot another revenge on the AP, where he feels peace.

Dday - 27th September 2017

posts: 1560   ·   registered: Oct. 2nd, 2017   ·   location: Europe
id 8690745

SI Staff ( Moderator #10) posted at 11:37 PM on Tuesday, September 28th, 2021

To Booyah (and others)

This is the Reconciliation Forum. From the forum description: A wonderful place to share your struggles, success stories, and triggers while trying to reconcile. There is to be no name calling in this forum. Venting is to be limited to you and/or your partner. Please post respectfully and constructively keeping in mind the goal for this forum is to reconcile. It's a long road, but you can do it!

If you can't post respectfully or constructively, please leave this thread.

posts: 10009   ·   registered: May. 30th, 2002
id 8690751

Thumos ( member #69668) posted at 1:33 AM on Wednesday, September 29th, 2021

I didn’t handle things well initially at all. I TT’d, I was defensive and generally wasn’t in touch with the mental issues I had, and focused only on his.

BrokenAsh, I apologize if you have already answered this, but could you indicate how long the TT, blameshifting and so on lasted after D-Day? In other words, are we talking a few weeks or much longer? How long ago did you write out a full and authentic timeline and allow him full access to texts etc?

As for your BH's revenge fantasies, I find this disturbing. I'm almost (not quite) five years out from my WW's affair, although only 1.7 years out from D-Day 2 which essentially reset the clock. Anyway, I think most BH's and BW's can relate to revenge fantasies on the AP. I was surprised at the level of anger and the elaborate detail I imagined.

That said, I knew it was always a fantasy. Like most BS's, I have empathy and good executive functioning, enabling me to game out reality multiple steps ahead and understand actions and consequences, thus self control/faithfulness.

Do you think your BH is simply ideating and sharing it with you out of his resentment of you?

Like your BH, my WW's AP was a man in my close proximity and social circle. So I had to restrain myself a number of times in his presence and my WW really showed very little awareness about how this constant triggering impacted me.

When was the last time he had to be near your AP and triggered by him?

"True character is revealed in the choices a human being makes under pressure. The greater the pressure, the deeper the revelation, the truer the choice to the character's essential nature."

BH: 50, WW: 49 Wed: Feb.'96 DDAY1: 12.20.16 DDAY2: 12.23.19

posts: 4598   ·   registered: Feb. 5th, 2019   ·   location: UNITED STATES
id 8690765

fareast ( Guide #61555) posted at 12:30 PM on Wednesday, September 29th, 2021


ChamomileTea has given you great advice. Read and reread her last post and take it in. IMO it is the only way forward for you both.

Never bother with things in your rearview mirror. Your best days are on the road in front of you.

posts: 3265   ·   registered: Nov. 24th, 2017
id 8690824

 BrokenAsh (original poster new member #78473) posted at 11:06 PM on Wednesday, September 29th, 2021

There’s a lot to address so I’ll do my best. I took some notes in the various comments.

Numb&Dumb - Thank you, I’m going to re-read my posts to see where I’m including the "buts," I can tell you that by explaining my mindset at the time, I don’t mean that as any justification of the A. My mindset was extremely messed up so I don’t at all think that BH deserved the A or that the issues he had lessens my culpability for causing the damage. I just don’t feel that way but several have said this so I must be conveying that.

ChamomileTea- I love what you say about acting confident and like I have self respect and boundaries. This is what my IC has been working with me on, but it’s admittedly not easy for me. I struggled with confidence and self assertiveness before the A and now the A makes it that much harder for me. I really do feel it’s the key for me, and maybe would help him see me differently as you point out. I’ll continue my work on that. Part of my issue pre A was not speaking my mind, going along with things I didn’t agree with and not being my true self. My confidence in the past was mostly fake and just a front I put on to hide my insecurities. After a while I really lost the true me to the point I don’t even know who I am. I need to figure out how to be confident without it being dependent on what other people think. I need to find that within myself and this is really important to me. I’m trying but it’s hard. I’ll see something on the internet that BH was doing and it just sends me reeling. I know it shouldn’t. I hate that it does. In general I don’t have an issue with porn. Only when it replaces me is when I have an issue. The same day we went for a walk and he hugged me and asked me to affirm that I’d never blow up our family, I saw both porn and live web cam tabs open on his device. I’m sure he’d say the live cam was just an ad, and it probably was, but I don’t know and I haven’t said anything. But it still just hurts me. Because it wouldn’t have happened if I was in the room with him that night and that makes me think he’s glad the nights I don’t sleep in there. I only didn’t that night because I fell asleep with one of the kids. I get that he’s coping and hurting which is why I normally ignore it now, but it was a promise that we mutually made to each other for the period of time while we are working on things. It’s not a porn ban for life. Either way, I need to be able to not give a shit about that because I really don’t want that to affect me the way it does

Have we dealt with BH’s character flaws and boundaries? No. Not at all. We’ve never gotten that far in the process and to do that too early looks like blameshifting. So no, we’ve discussed the things that are issues for me and he mostly acknowledges them, but to me, it feel like about 8 years of being treated poorly. The post A treatment feels very similar to pre A which makes it that much more difficult.

Booyah- I’ve never justified what I did or thought it was ok. I’m merely explaining the way I rationalized it at the time. I don’t think any type of treatment or issues pre A would ever justify what I did. Of course I should have talked about my state of mind to him, instead of the occasional angry outbursts. I’m not just complaining he’s not handling it like I want him to, I understand all the reasons he is where he is. I know he’s broken and stuck and that I caused that. My post was because I’ve been going in circles for so long trying to R but realizing that I’m the only one working towards it, but still don’t feel confident that leaving is right. He does give me hope, and in those moments I believe that he wants to R but just hasn’t been able to. I asked him if he’s just riding it out until the kids are grown and he acted like that was ludicrous. He said why would I stay with you all that time just to divorce you when I’m even older? So I’ve been wanting to give him as much time as he needs realizing there is no set time table. I AM OWNING MY SHIT AND I AM SORRY.

Hellfire - I do understand how I’ve decimated him. I do. I wrote a detailed letter detailing just that. It detailed how I made him feel every step of the way. I do get it. I can’t change the past but I’m trying to do everything I can to help him and myself to heal as much as possible. For us and our kids. I don’t want either of us to live miserably forever.

Src9043 - I don’t know how my dad’s role contributed to this. I hated my dad for many years for cheating on my mom and for being so absent in my life. I did forgive him later in life because I could see that he was a broken person too. Just like my mom. I felt bad for them and I forgave him without ever addressing it. I’m still working on how my childhood issues contributed to my A.

You also said that I feel played by AP? I think you misread I never felt played by AP. We were both playing a role and AP did offer to leave his wife but before the A was exposed I was trying to break things off and end the A. I only say try because he was my boss and I was worried about offending him and him getting angry and taking it out on me in the work setting. In the back of my mind even in the midst of the A, I recognized that AP wasn’t even attractive and I never had any intention of trying to have a life with him. I was always very clear that there was no possible way that would ever happen.

You asked why any rational person would stay? There’s a whole forum here on people who decided to do just that for various reasons. I would say a person would stay because they believe in forgiveness, they believe a person can change and because they love them.

Jorge - what does authenticity mean to me? It does not mean never bringing up the A like you said. I would never shut down conversation on that. I know there are ups and downs, good days snd bad days and I’d be here for it all. I just want some actual progress to be made. It can go back and forth, that’s fine. What’s required of him from me is an honest answer as to whether he truly wants to R. Not for the kids, not for financial ease, not for it being too hard to get back out there, etc., but because he wants us. And if that answer is yes, I’d like to see some actions that back it up. If I had that I wouldn’t be on any timeline. I’ve also made it clear to BH many times that I want him to heal for himself and the kids, whether we make it or not

What does he say is required of me? He doesn’t. My IC asks me to ask him that regularly snd his answer is that I’ve done everything I’m supposed to do.

Where is he in his healing journey? I’m not sure but it’s not close to 100. Things are better than the initial months after DD as far as the extreme anger and plans for escorts and massage parlors (he was open about some of this but only had the one night stand I mentioned earlier as far as I know). We have discussed how I feel in the home. He gets t and says he understands, but says he is powerless to do any more than he’s doing. Also, when I talked about his anger being all consuming and my pain pushed aside, I was referring to pre A. Obviously there’s a lot of that post A and I understand that and have been more than willing to push my issues aside while we work this out. He really doesn’t have a truth source other than me. He read some of the texts but I admitted to him some had been deleted as they came in. We were never able to retrieve anything through the cloud or a third party app. Ive offered a polygraph multiple times and he says he doesn’t want it. I believe this foundational stuff is still an issue.

ButAnyway- maybe you’re right that he is just stringing me along for access to the kids, but he insists he’s not. That’s why I’m here.

Thumos - TT and blameshifting lasted a couple of months. I’m sure even after that I was still defensive in the big blow ups that we had, but I would say maybe 3 -6 months, not of TT but where I was still being super defensive and not owning it. I addressed the texts above, he saw what was there right away but I had deleted the incriminating ones as they came in, so I had to tell him the ones I deleted. Of course he thinks I’ve left things out.

BH has done more than just ideate his revenge schemes. He has moved forward on several. Like I said, some aren’t even against AP but against people that were connected to him. He has never been physically near AP since DD but he has had to deal with hearing about him professionally and a few times he heard about AP reaching out to people at his old job where this happened, he takes that as AP not learning his lesson and it sets him off being angry and upset and trying to plan another move.

13 YrsR and ChamomileTea- thank you for your suggestions and help. Hearing the comments from booyah and ButAnyways, etc make me question whether I have a right to happiness ever again. That’s what keeps me stuck too. And then my kid will say mommy why are you sad and I know I.can’t do this forever with no hope.

posts: 19   ·   registered: Mar. 8th, 2021
id 8690934

ButAnyway ( member #79085) posted at 12:47 AM on Thursday, September 30th, 2021


You most certainly have a right to future happiness. You may have made a decision fatal to your M, but I’m not condemning you forever.

Most, if not all, of us have screwed major life choices. I know I have. I just try to learn from it and not make the same mistake twice.

posts: 135   ·   registered: Jul. 7th, 2021
id 8690947
Topic is Sleeping.
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