SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

[This message edited by twokidsmomny at 11:02 PM, June 8th (Thursday)]

twokidsmommy,

I totally agree with your description of OW. What you wrote exactly describes this OW, I wonder if they are related.

[This message edited by againonmyown at 10:17 PM, June 8th (Thursday)]

I read this thread all the time, mainly because the issue is very volatile. You can't read these threads without feeling a lot of emotions...some negative and some positive.

But I learned something here.

First of all, these women are going through a horrendous situation not of their own chosing. As such, this thread was created to provide these women with a SAFE HAVEN. We may not agree with their words and their decisions, but nevertheless, their feelings are real. Their feelings exist and they need to be expressed. They need to be validated.

Second of all, unless you are in this situation where your husband fathered a child with another woman, then you must admit and accept that you have no idea how you would react or think in this situation.

It's nice to sit back in a safe place of not having to deal with an OW/OC, and "think" that you would operate from a place of generosity, forgiveness and logical thought. But when you are actually faced with the turmoil of the situation...a situation that remains for many, many years and will cost you thousands of dollars at the expense of your own life and your children's lives. You may behave in a very different manner.

How many of us, pre D-day said that if we ever caught our husbands cheating, we would kick them to the curb, or we would walk out the door? And yet, when we actually were dealt the infidelity card, we behaved quite differently.

And how many of us have had mean thoughts, irrational thoughts. How many of us behaved admirably?

SI is a place where we can express our feelings, no matter how insane or illogical. We feel safe here.

And while I don't believe that anyone should be censored, there are little spaces on SI, such as this one, where we must let these women express their thoughts and feelings without judgment. If another BS dealing with OW/OC issues wants to express their feelings that run counter to what most of these women feel, then that's acceptable, but the rest of us need to step back and give these women a safe place to vent.

I think this thread needs to be like the Wayward forum. If you are not a BS dealing with OC/OW issues, then you need to not post your opinion. Not because your opinion isn't valid, but because then you put these women on the defensive. They don't need a place to defend their actions, just a place to vent their feelings and give each other support.

Georgie

[This message edited by curiousgeorge at 8:46 PM, June 8th (Thursday)]

I think that what it comes down to is that the OC is a constant reminder of the A. A lot of couples are able to move beyond the A and not have it be a big part of their life. But when an OC is involved, you are reminded each and every day about that time in your life.

IMHO, in order for a couple to reconcile, they need to be united against the OW. That would let the OW know that there is no room for the A to start all over again. There has to be boundaries set up. Realistically, the WS could have another A with someone else, not necessarily the OW. Yet, constant contact between the OW and the WS could start the A right up again.

Of course, it doesn't help if the OW is still determined to get the WS. I can certainly understand a WS choosing not to have contact with the OC if the OW makes it uncomfortable. But then again, the WS is entitled to visitation and doesn't have to visit the OC with the OW present.

As far as child support goes, well, that's another issue. It's the same thing as when you marry a man with children and he has to pay child support. You go into the relationship knowing that. The OW can't expect to receive the same amount that the family receives. The OC is only entitled to child support whereas the WS is responsible for supporting the marital family.

In my own situation, I have three children with my H. The OC will never receive the same amount of child support that I do. There will never be true equality because he will spend more time with our kids. We have more expenses also. So the question is, should I go down on the amount that I need to raise my kids so that she can have more? She was aware of his financial situation before she chose to have the baby and that was a choice that she made.

And divorce doesn't make it any easier. There are a lot of things to be worked out in a divorce settlement such as insurance, college expenses, medical expenses, etc. But what it comes down to is that the WS is only required to support the OC and not the OW. And should a WS feel bad if the OW doesn't have the same standard of living as the marital family?

What happens if the OW can't pay her rent or is not able to buy food? Should the WS feel responsible for feeding her other kids and not just the OC?

[This message edited by twokidsmomny at 11:01 PM, June 8th (Thursday)]

I will actually remove my thread, obvoulsy not many are actually reading what I ask, just flaming because I don;t understand. And I am not apologizing for asking those questions, but realizing that this thread has become a "if you dont agree, dont post" one, and it makes me just terribly sad to read it.

When I read "support" in a thread title, i assume that is what it means, and I have found that I can get gems of advice for different situtions, from support in other areas, as that is what an inspiration should be. So I read a lot of the support threads and think that some of the advice from SI is beyond value.

I think this thread should go in JFO, where the anger is raging still...just my $.02.

The one thing I will NOT reme is my sincere hope for all the mothers that no one ever says or talks about your child the way these OC are spoken of or that your children never long for a family member to love them without so much as an explanation as to why they don't.

May you all find peace within, wherever your paths may lead.

[This message edited by twokidsmomny at 11:02 PM, June 8th (Thursday)]

Twokidsmommy...

If you think you're upset reading replies, you may want to re-evaluate your own responses.

This thread is a hot topic and one we Mods would rather not have to step in on, so lets leave the barbs and hits out of this thread.

I will repeat again...insults, attacks and personal jabs will not be tolerated by any of you.

Comprende?

DS

You lost me...where am I attacking?

I'll edit my last response...

[This message edited by twokidsmomny at 10:54 PM, June 8th (Thursday)]

Just about everywhere on this thread for the last 2 or 3 pages.

I'm not going to fight with you. I'm sorry you're going through an emotional time...I hope that SI can help sort out your emotions.

That does not entitle you or anyone else to slam another members feelings. You seem to be in the mind set of having to be right. So, the next insult you decide to throw out, well, you may no longer be a member here if you can't seem to listen and be more open-minded to other points of view.

DS

I will step back...not my intent at all. I have learned so much from other members here, and thought I was open minded...sorry.

I have learned that people think very differently when it comes to personal issues. There is a school of thought that the idea is everything should be focused around a child or children in a family and/or marriage.

Then there is the idea that a marriage is built on the decisions of a husband and wife and children are second to that.

My marriage is not child focused, everthing does not revolve around my child. My child is happy, stable, has opportunities and etc.... I have worked very hard to help my child have good relationships and manage himself appropriately.

In the case of the OW/OC, she wants her child And Herself to be the focus of my marriage and family. If I don't let everything revovle around my own child, I definately won't let it revovle around OC/OW.

For all the teaching of values and self-respect and providing opportunities for my child, I feel that is my job. I am the mother. I direct the path of my child.

I am concerned with My child as I should be. It is my job to see to his needs and provide him with opportunities. It is not my job to do this for OC. The OC has a mother and that is her job. I see no reason to step in and take on her responsibility. I have enough to be concerned with my own child. I am not at all concerned about the needs of this OC. That is her mother's job.

I sincerely apologize to anyone that I insulted here. I am retreating to the corner until I can learn to play nice.

Hugs to you all.

[This message edited by twokidsmomny at 4:58 AM, June 9th (Friday)]

Haven't been around in a while but thought I needed to chime in.

"If you read Dr. Phil's website on OW/OC or Dear Peggy's, you will see that they both say that if an OC is involved you HAVE to make room for them in your marriage."

Does ANYBODY take Dr. Phil seriously???? Sorry to get down on Phil. Him and the big O grate on my nerves.

I agree with everyone who says that to each his own. We all deal in a way that works for US. In our case NC was/is the ONLY way to go.

Adoption was definitely an option for the ow but she was too selfish to choose it. It was her goal to have a child with any man. The one she picked just happened to be married. She brought a child into the world knowing full well the impact of her decision. Am I now supposed to feel pity for her and her kid? Donors don't make daddys!

The children that matter to me are MINE. Their suffering is what bothers me the most. Even though they don't know about the OC they suffer nonetheless. They suffer when we can't afford to do things for them. And NO, it's not all about child support. It's about astronomical legal fees fighting to not be screwed over by the ow and a system that's severly outdated (men really don't have any rights under current legislation)and it's been spent on numerous counseling sessions both marriage and individual.

They suffer because their Mother is often an emotional wreck (even though I hide it quite well). They suffer because there is a constant undercurrent of hurt running through their family that they aren't fully aware of. They suffer from the stress this has caused because it never seems to be settled (legally).

I don't have a problem with couples that integrate the oc into their lives and family. I've met several women since this ordeal started that have done exactly that. I am very close to these people. They respect my position and I respect theirs. I would never in a million years berate them for their decision so it irritates the hell out of me when someone comes to this thread and trashes me or any of the others that have chosen NC. That to me is bashing. So if I or others get pissed off and come out with both fists flying it's because you haven't shown us the respect you expect us to show you.

Don't chastise me because I've made a choice that doesn't work for you. Live my life for a while, then we'll talk. Until then I/we will do as we see fit for our situation, our marriage, our family and you do what's right for yours.

Me

[This message edited by Me&my3 at 11:42 AM, June 9th (Friday)]

I haven't posted on this thread in a while but have continued reading as I am in a OW/OC situation. I stopped posting because I voiced my opinion that I blame my husband for the affair, not just the OW.

I think a lot of women on this thread have been in reconciliation and/or trying to reconcile with their husbands.

I have to be honest, I stopped posting because I felt attacked also when I thought this was a safe place to share my feelings and opinions. This is such a heartbreaking subject but we all have our own situations and opinions and regardless of what they are we should all feel safe here to share them.

I felt attacked by a comment that those that by choosing to leave the marriage I am not "dealing" with it. My way of "dealing" with this situation is to realize that my marriage was never as strong as I thought it was, that my husband made a choice to cheat, not use protection (birth control aside - what about STD's???), then chose to continue to lie to me about the whole thing. This is my reality and like all of you I need help dealing with this. What I don't understand, and am not attacking ANYONE, but how is the husband forgiven of any wrongdoing but the OW gets all the blame?

I DO think an affair that results in another child is worse than just an affair. It shows the stupidity of the MARRIED man in that he didn't protect himself (or his spouse) from any communicable diseases. Maybe the OW told him she was on birth control, so what? If he takes care of himself at least he would take the step to use a condom. Many stories include a OW with other children with other fathers? Did these men know this when they chose not to use protection - obviously the woman sleeps around - was he THINKING with his head at all or with his dick as most men do. I think it is the latter. If he didn't know anything about her and just believed that she was protected isn't that stupidity also?

I don't mean to raise all the questions that you all probably have asked yourself but how can you forgive and move on? I am just trying to understand...

My "dealing" with it is to choose a life free of mistrust and everyday reminder of what happened. My "dealing" with it is to choose a life without everyday wondering if I am being lied to over and over again. My "dealing" with it is my choice as reconciliation is the choice for many others. My situation is unique as all are.

I give you all so much credit for attempting to salvage what must have once been a solid, loving relationship. For me, I don't choose to live that path and I guess that's just my way of "dealing". I am not attacking anyone, just trying to deal with the reality of the situation and find a way to move on.

Please be considerate of those with an opinion that may be different than yours, you are not being attacked but are just trying to find a way to understand how to deal with all of this.

For anyone reading this who has not chosen to reconcile, there is another thread in this forum that is "For those who have chosen not to R". You might find a more comfortable place here though there is very little mention of an OC on this thread.

Peace and love to all, whatever your choice is to move past this.

btw - I agree on on the comment about Dr. Phil and Oprah - who are they to preach to people how to act, live in relationships. Oprah is even worse for her judgemental opinions on marriage and children of which she has neither.

I blame my h for the A probably more than i do th OW. But in another since i think plcing most the blame on the ow actually helps some people heal.

that'slife - believe me, i blame my H plenty and your message has been timely for me because i have been thinking about this in light of recent entires on this thread (that has seen a lot of action lately!)

anyway, i can only speak for myself, so here goes:

my H and i talk heaps about his actions, our actions, how we got here etc.....the outlet i need tho' is blaming the OW for her part, and i think we all agree, she does have a part in this. i won;t go into details but in my case it was very calculated. this statment in no ways exonerates my H of his part in this disaster. HIS VERY STUPID, THOUGHTLESS, SELFISH ACTION!

but you see, i can discuss this with him but i can't vent my feelings about the OW to her. we are in NC and, as has been recommended over and over again all over this website, i have not contacted her directly myself. i have thought of this but have repeatedley read stories and heard of this being a bad idea.

i have no where else to vent my feelings about her. here, we are all in the same boat so it feels like a safe place to do it when things become too much, do you know what i mean?

it isan't just this thread, i see it everywhere.

when you are trying to R, there is a time when you have to start moving away from the blame game and try to move forward. this is VERY hard, at least for me. but i still feel the urge to vent so here is where i do it. i am trying to R, make things work, i don;t know if in the long run it will work out but that's the committment i have made right now, i am 10 months out from d-day. once you have made that committment, my obligation is to try and move forward.

i am presently struggling with forgiveness, my H desperatly wants that but i don;t know how, at least right now.

i want to stop thinking about the OW/OC but i am also struggling with this as well.

i come here to try and help myself, get some relief, read how others are doing it.

in a way, i envy your choice, i do think of it but for many reasons, i am trying to stay. my H has done everything asked of him, provided full disclosure and we are still in MC. time will tell. most days i feel my love for him so strongly and others, well, they are harder days.

i hope this has made sense.

2kids - i didn't see whatever it was that you wrote the last fews days before you edited it, i hope you are okay, like i've said before i have enjoyed your honestly.

curiousgeorge - thanks for what you wrote, it is all so true and i, for one, really appreciated it.

meandmy3 - i concur wholeheartedly

when i found myself in this situation, i searched for info, support etc... and was so glad when i found this. i hope we can continue to support each other reagrdless of whatever personal choices you have made.

Cat -

I am sorry that the attempt is reconciliation is hard but I am sure it will get easier as time goes on. Your husband sounds committed to making it work and the fact that he is communicating with you is key. I wish more than anything that I could salvage my marriage but it won't work for me. Though he claims to be remorseful he continues to lie to me and I know he has continued to lie to the OW. I actually feel sorry for her but my revenge will be that she will end up with him. He is weak, and a liar and she will realize this eventually. I question her moral fiber as she got involved with a married man in the first place. She actually met my 1yr old daughter when the affair started. She is despicable and I hate her but my husband was the married one and no matter how much he was "pursued" if that, he was weak enough to give in. I have seen a side of him after seven years that makes me realize I can do so much better, even if that means being "alone". Good riddance. That is my situation and I envy anyone who has the chance to work on their marriage and try to come back from this. I think it actually may bring a married couple closer but in my case this won't happen. I would never criticize anyone for making the attempts to reconcile, I just can't personally because of what I am dealing with on a daily basis.