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The lies are never more insulting

Scorned12 posted 11/15/2019 23:53 PM

I swear sometimes I'm going to spontaneously combust. My UH has a script he sticks too when it comes to answering my questions or telling his story, but the even bigger problem? It is full of some of the most hideous lies. When I point out how awful they are and no one could believe such crap he just walks away. Says I choose to not believe him. And, as crazy as it sounds it is what happened. Idk if I need someone to back me up, or a 2x4 upside my head for giving this marriage another min. of my time. We are 3.5 yrs from last DDay. He has offered very little in the way of confessing but he does seem very remorseful at times.
Most everything I know is what I uncovered and even though it's proof enough for me he still denies it. Even after failing a polygraph test he still denies. He admits having an affair, says it was mainly sexting and flirting he did go to her house 1 time. (The morning I found out) but the only thing that happened was one sided oral sex he was the giver. Says he couldn't get hard, so he finally sat up and she asked "what's the matter" he says; "this just isn't going to work" puts on his clothes and goes into the living room. As he's putting on his boots she comes in and sits on the couch and when he looks up at her she says; "my God what happened to your lip"
When my UH gives oral he more times then not gets a hickey on his bottom lip. It looks like a bruise. He said his stomache replaced his feet in his boots. They kissed and hugged and he left.
Fast fwd. I recover some deleted text msgs from UH's phone from right after he left her hse.

Her; I am still from ur tongue.
Him; sorry I couldn't get u all the way
but for me it was absolute heaven.
Her; it was amazing ur amazing can still
feel u.
Him; the good thing about a mustache I can
still taste and smell ur incredible
Her; oh God wash ur face.
Him; no way
And baby ur body is GORGEOUS and
feels so goooood
Her; so is urs and I loved being tangled
with u.
Him; Idk how anyone could resist that.
Her; oh they do.
Him; idiots.
Her; I can't believe I have to wait till
tomorrow to see u.
Him; I still can't believe I had u in my
arms. I've dreamed of holding u like
I did at the coffee pot
Her; ditto
Is there any one here that doesn't know what "I can still feel u" means?
He says not a word was spoken about him walking out on her.
Duh cause it didn't happen. At 60 yrs old and she was 35 he has never walked out on any woman in his life in the middle of having sex. And if a man stopped in the middle of doing the most intimate act possible and walked out on me I think I would be horrified. Then to turn around and say Idk how anyone could resist that"
Excuse me didn't u just say u did?
All he will say about it is he doesn't know why they talked like that because he did walk out on her.

truthdisinterred posted 11/16/2019 01:06 AM

Hello Scorned12,

I'm new to posting here, but I'm definitely not new to being lied to. There's a reason why U.S. courts ask witnesses to "tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth" because anything less than that is a lie. It seems pretty clear that your husband is not being completely truthful with you.

But it also seems pretty clear that you already know that, so I'm wondering what's motivating you to keep pursuing (a very unlikely) confession from him. It breaks my heart to see you still being tormented by this lie after 3.5 years. How awful to have the images those texts must conjure up constantly replaying over and over in your mind. While I understand the intense desire to want your husband to come clean, at what point do you stop seeking what will probably never be found? Absent a full confession from your husband, what would it take for you to feel like you could let this go, and what (if anything) would it take for you to let your husband go? I would hate for you to keep living in this hell indefinitely...

Skoochnski posted 11/16/2019 01:40 AM

Thereís no way in hell I could stay after that.

EllieKMAS posted 11/16/2019 02:00 AM

Scorned - gentle as I can 2x4 coming your way. If he STILL hasn't told you the truth, failed a poly and STILL lies/denies, and walks away when you rightfully press him for truthful details... then he is in NO WAY remorseful. At all.

I'm sorry - it sounds like you have been stuck in this shit for a long time now.

IMHO, time to start thinking about what you want and need here and 180 his ass.

Scorned12 posted 11/16/2019 02:15 AM

You are right I do already know that, and there's 20-30 more lies just as ridiculous.
It makes me so sad that we cannot have an intelligent conversation about it. He has moved out twice (or been put out) because I can't get past it. Truly i am past the affair it's the bold faced lies I cannot get past.
I understand at this point I will never get the truth from him. What I don't understand is why? Someone please shed some light on that. I have confessed to some pretty humiliating things hoping to get him to see we are all human and all of us have lied. He has been caught in too many to count but he will not take responsibly for anything. It was either my fault or the OW's fault. We have been to umpteen counselors and they all have sucked. I'm tired and I'm losing hope. And for sure I feel stuck.

truthdisinterred posted 11/16/2019 04:44 AM

It makes me so sad that we cannot have an intelligent conversation about it.
I know this feeling very well! Most of my attempts to talk about anything related to WH's affair(s) or to our relationship are met with extreme anger and defensiveness or with him shutting me out completely - and it doesn't matter how nicely or calmly I try to speak to him.

Truly i am past the affair it's the bold faced lies I cannot get past.
I told my WH that I could get past anything EXCEPT being lied to. I told him that I was willing to work through anything - and I meant ANYTHING - if he would just be completely open and honest with me. But, of course, he refused. He believes that some things are best taken to the grave, and that's what he intends to do. When his last affair came out, not only did he refuse to tell me anything more than I already knew (and even tried to twist that information), he also blamed everyone and everything (including God!) for his affair - everyone, that is, except himself. (And I say "last" affair because I'm fairly certain he's had more than that, but the last one was the only one I had concrete proof for as far as PAs go.)

I understand at this point I will never get the truth from him. What I don't understand is why?
It can be anything and everything from toxic shame, fear of what others will think of him, wanting to retain power (as having information that you want gives him power), to a whole host of other reasons, but in their minds, they create all kinds of excuses to make themselves feel justified about keeping secrets. My husband tried to tell me that he didn't want to burden me or our children with the painful knowledge of his affair. So alas, he and his fellow martyr AP would just have to suffer in silence (and in each other) to their graves. Gee, how noble of them!

I have confessed to some pretty humiliating things hoping to get him to see we are all human and all of us have lied.
I did the same (as I believe in being open and honest), but my WH viewed it as being foolish and lacking discretion (don't even get me started...). He has extreme double-standards and is very judgmental of others, but even the slightest bit of perceived criticism against him is enough to set off the worst narcissistic rage.

We have been to umpteen counselors and they all have sucked.
Forget MC - that only works when both spouses are willing to be completely open and honest and put in 100% effort. Find yourself a really good therapist (for IC), instead.

I'm tired and I'm losing hope. And for sure I feel stuck.
IC should definitely help with this (and if it doesn't, find a different therapist). Two books that have helped me the most were Leave a Cheater, Gain a Life by Tracy Schorn and Should I Stay or Should I Go? by Lundy Bancroft and Jac Patrissi.

Each of us has to walk our own journey and move forward with as few regrets as possible. I know for myself, I had to honestly feel like I did absolutely everything possible to keep my family together. I think I'm finally reaching that point. The sooner you take the focus off of your husband and put it on yourself (in a loving, constructive way), the sooner you'll get unstuck. Best wishes to you!

[This message edited by truthdisinterred at 10:48 PM, November 17th (Sunday)]

The1stWife posted 11/16/2019 05:15 AM

Truthdisinterested nailed it. I 💯% agree with everything posted.

Your cheaterís shame and embarrassment prevents them from being truthful. You can see why MC will never work as your CH refused to engage and be honest.

You are begging for the truth. He sees your pain. He sees your frustration. He has the ability to help you. But he chooses not to.

Stop the madness. Get yourself out of this cycle. You know he cheated. He knows he cheated. Heís a coward (proven to be true). But living like this is torturing only you.

Face reality. Heís not going to change. But you can change. You can move past this. First - accept he is a liar and a cheater. Second accept he will never be honest, truthful or transparent. Third heal yourself.

Stop making your whole life about him. He doesnít deserve it. Or you.

If he chooses to disrespect you (by continuing to lie) then stop putting him first. Or second. Or making him a priority. By this I mean read up on the 180. Donít do his laundry. Get your own social life separate from him. Do things you enjoy without him.

When he questions you - tell him you are redefining your role in his life. That the dynamics of your marriage changed b/c he lied and continues to lie.

nekonamida posted 11/16/2019 07:04 AM

Some cheaters are embarrassed and too ashamed to admit the truth but some are just plain narcissistic and don't want to be confronted with their bad behavior. If you can, read up on narcissism and see if he has other traits as well to determine for yourself what you're dealing with.

Regardless of the reason, he's decided he will never give you the truth meaning he will never find remorse and will never R with you. You will be fighting this same fight with him indefinitely. Is this where you want to be 1 year from now? 3 years? 5 years? If not, go to a lawyer and start taking the steps necessary to end this marriage.

cocoplus5nuts posted 11/16/2019 07:27 AM

He is not remorseful, even when you think he is acting like it. He is gaslighting you, which is a form of mental abuse meant to make you feel crazy. It can make you question your own reality. You have to snap yourself out of it. You don't need confirmation from him or anyone else to know your truth.

I think you are projecting yourself onto him. You are still expecting him to think and behave like you do. He doesn't. He won't. You will not be able to make sense of it or understand it because that's not how you are. There is nothing you can do or say that will get him to be truthful.

Stop trying. Read up on the 180 and implement it. Get yourself into IC if you aren't already. Completely detach from him and focus on yourself. What do want? What do you need? Are you getting those things? If bot, what ACTIONS are you going to take to change that?

pureheartkit posted 11/16/2019 07:58 AM

Yes, mine acted the same. Without the truth or effort, I could not stay there. It was too hard and I needed to heal. He had devalued me and I felt like a thin shell of what I was. I was always there but it was like being a ghost of myself.

I loved him and wanted him to grow for his own sake and for ours. He still won't make the effort. Lies are his armor. He can't admit to anything except what I have proof for. He clings to the most flimsy of excuses. Tattered, sheer stupid lies that any decent thinking ape can see through. Somehow he needs them to wrap around his bare bones to protect his all sacred ego. It's all he values really and he'll defend it to the end.

Start on the road to your own happiness. You can't wait forever for a man who clings to his lies.

sisoon posted 11/16/2019 08:35 AM

Often it's the lying after an A that kills the M, not the A itself.

What question(s) did he fail on with the poly?

I'll tell you: a 60 year old man may very well not get erect when he is with his ap. If he was deemed to have lied on that question, though, I understand your concerns.

No matter what the poly said, your gut is telling he lies. You can't change him. The closest you can get is to tell him to either tell the truth or lose you - and then to D, if he continues to lie.

I'm very sorry you are dealing with this. I suspect you haven't ended your M for good yet because you've got messages in your head telling you he's lying because something is wrong with you. Those messages are lies. He's lying because he won't face his own problems.

Scorned12 posted 11/16/2019 09:39 AM

Thank you all for posting. I knew I would hear what I needed, now am I strong enough to do what must be done to heal myself.... I am.

Scorned12 posted 11/16/2019 09:50 AM

BTW he failed all three questions and that was not his first time at her house, it is staggering the lies he is clinging to, just plain awful.

landclark posted 11/16/2019 10:42 AM

Nothing makes me madder than when my WH acts like Iím stupid by lying to me. Itís such a slap in the face.

Bourbonhelps posted 11/16/2019 13:47 PM

Not quite a lie, but my wife said I should meet her ea partner (former childhood crush). "I would like him as a person."

truthdisinterred posted 11/16/2019 15:13 PM

Wow, Bourbonhelps. Some people are truly clueless (or just plain cruel). You should post that in the S.S.C.S. thread.

BetterTimesAhead posted 11/16/2019 16:20 PM

I read something online that made so much sense to me "Accountability feels like an attack when you're not ready to believe how your behavior hurts others". I think many WS are truly in denial about how much they hurt the BS, family and friends. They don't want to think that they could have done that so they blame everyone and everything else. Some, unfortunately, never get to the point where they realize how much they hurt others. They just continue to lie to protect themselves, even when seeing the pain on someone's face. I wish there was some magic phrase you could say to snap them out of it but unfortunately there isn't. If he is still lying after a failed poly and years since DDay, it seems likely he will never take responsibility.

Take care of yourself and do what you need to do for you.

Cooley2here posted 11/16/2019 19:18 PM

When I read a post like this it reminds me of how people are told to wear helmets when riding a motorcycle but donít. You are not wearing your helmet and you keep getting hurt. He isnít going to miraculously change. He lies because he keeps getting away with it. Do you want to stay married or are you going to put your helmet on and feel safe? This life you are living is not sustainable. Your health will suffer.
Please find things to do that give you validation. Donít depend on him. His focuses in life are covering his a** and lying. Both excellent life skills(I say sarcastically).
Please look after yourself.

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