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The only part that makes me doubt authenticity is the lying about a vasectomy thing. Unless he has a fetish about impregnating women, of course. Married women use some sort of birth control or else they're going to be pregnant all the time. That birth control may well be "avoiding marital sex," but still. Unless he just has them all get abortions, there is just no way that worked out for him. Demanding to not use condoms is probably common, but tricking a woman who is already willing to go bareback into believing birth control is not a concern would have a problematic pregnancy rate. Not that many BHs are clueless enough about how babies get made to be fooled often enough to protect this guy's wallet.

Clarissa: you said, "at least" he is being honest. And I read that as you giving him a little bit of credit somehow? Maybe, it struck a personal chord with me ... like if someone says, "I admit I'm an a$$hole" they think owning it makes it okay or better than not admitting it?

I am probably a little bitter.

I hope I didn't offend you. If so, I do apologize.

I have found this post fascinating and it’s interesting that floridaredman has chosen to ‘come clean’ as to his tactics and desires.

His approach is/was very similar to that employed by the OM in my wife’s affair. While, at the time immediately after discovery, his dishonesty provided me with an effective distraction for my anger and allowed me to (incorrectly) see my wife as a victim which helped my psyche in the initial stages of recovery, as many have said in response to this post, both APs are knowingly at fault during the course of the affair.

Several years down the road now and in that clarity that comes with distance, I am under no illusions that my wife was anything but a victim. She was bored in our marriage, wanted excitement, fun and possibly a boost in self esteem, and knowingly and deliberately entered into an unacceptable liaison. That the OM was employing tactics to stroke her ego and get the sex he wanted does not in any way let him off the hook either – he was (and regrettably still remains) an opportunist looking for vulnerable married women to bed.

As is so often said in so many different ways on this site, affairs are seldom about the AP. The AP merely mirrors what the wayward spouse wants to see, hear and receive. It’s invariably all about selfish wants and needs of the WS at anyone’s’ expense but most of all the family!

I have found this post fascinating and it’s interesting that floridaredman has chosen to ‘come clean’ as to his tactics and desires.

Jono..although I was unfaithful, my AP was single. Not that it matters though.

These were definitely not my tactics and desires.

While I amnot innocent..I am definitely not this sociopathic

..have to agree with Jono on his perspective after 7 years.

..ultimately, they ( my gf/wife and my bf of 25 years) knew what each wanted from the liason.

..what each of them did to get there and to maintain it for nearly 20 years is mind-boggling

..Jono.....you seem to have found 'peace' in the 7 years of reflection and growth in understanding this whole 'terrible' process of infidelity.

..your other post in Recon. shows more insight and depth of understanding also!

..only 444 posts!!?? ..your words of wisdom should be seen here more often.

you've been holding out on us!!

smy

[This message edited by somanyyears at 9:48 AM, September 20th (Thursday)]

Apologies floridaredman - I perceived the original post to be a confession by way of a warning / guidance to others reflecting your own circumstances. Your comment clearly indicates that the post does not pertain to you personally - I hope no offence was taken as none was intended.

The originator of the comments displays strong narcissistic tendencies and is clearly in need of help. Narcissism is a characteristic that is very prevalent amongst WS before and during the affair.

We tend to see people as being fixed in their behavioural patterns, but it is very evident that truly remorseful and contrite WS go through equally as massive changes in behaviour as their BS, with that change manifesting as a quantum shift to a very much better place altogether.

I have seen that in my wife - she really has become a truly incredible person and so very different to the person I married and the person she 'morphed' into during her affair. The change forged through that horrendous experience has moulded her into a truly loving wife and mother - more so, I believe, than she would have been had she not walked on the wild side. That having been said, I wish we could have found a less traumatic mechanism to have made that change!

I am not sure how many BS see that change in their WS in the first years of recovery, as they (the BS) become so introspect and guarded due to the pain they have suffered. Without in any way trying to patronise WS, those who do change for the better, and there are many, are quite amazing folk.

I often find significant signs of that transition in reading many of the wayward posts.

BS should take heed if they can - the premise of 'once a cheater always a cheater' which plays on the minds of most BS is most definitely not a fair or accurate statement.

I don't know, I read this and feel like it's somehow made up. Like a two dimensional composite stereotype of how a sleeze might think in this situation.

I certainly know men who act like this, some married and some single. Except for the not caring if the woman got pregnant part (for instance the author stated that his OW "often got caught" and in this day and age there is no one who doesn't know about paternity testing, so a fake vasectomy story is meaningless) - so that part makes very little sense and I doubt it's true. Also the part about "They didn't have to deal with the day to day stresses that adults face with me" -- "adults" (weird, was he having affairs with children?) I'm assuming this is actually WHY these OW were having sex with him- to have a fantasy.

I think the thing that rubs me the wrong way with this is that it stereotypes the man as wanting sex, and the OW as wanting "more" than sex. That somehow he thought he was putting one over on otherwise gullible women by tricking them into sex without marriage. When my guess is that if a married woman slept with him, she was probably after the same thing he was.

Look, my FWH had an A, and I will tell you that his OW did not have her eyes on cleaning up his dirty socks. She wanted to have sex and flirt and giggle and text and IM - but as far as any of the transcripts and emails I've ever read, she had no intention of taking on stepchildren and a mortgage with him.

Also skeevy - why would he ask them to "keep the secret" when these married women has as much to lose as he did? Clearly they were going to keep the secret of their own affair! Again, he makes it sound like he was screwing around with young children. "Shh, keep this secret, it's special"

I don't know, it just sounds like someone writing a composite cautionary tale rather than being a true transcript of the thought process of a predator. I think in reality, both partners in the affair are playing each other, and both are equally invested in the secrecy.

Skepticsm noted..but it's true.

circe

I wish that were true, but I've seen too many guys just like this over the years.

and in this day and age there is no one who doesn't know about paternity testing, so a fake vasectomy story is meaningless

It's not that he didn't know about paternity testing...it's that he didn't care. I've known some men who found out later that their child was not biologically theirs. There has been a few members of SI where this was found to be the case. Staying with the BH in many of these cases, anecdotally at least, seems to be for the stability the BH provides at home as a reliable father. Also, the WW is often in denial about paternity themselves. Seen this too (sadly enough).

It seems incredible that someone so transparent in their actions could be believed, but I've seen it happen more than once.

Jono..no apology necessary. No offense taken

It has been nagging at me since this was posted. Does anyone recall the Bill Paxton character in the movie True Lies? That is what this guy reminds me of. Maybe that's why I thought he would be easy to spot. In reality I'm sure he was more subtle than that....

Does anyone recall the Bill Paxton character in the movie True Lies? That is what this guy reminds me of.

LOL..I remember that guy. He was a character within a character. I agree with you that the OP of the confession was more subtle.

The author of this was revealing what was behind the veil. He admits to being crafty and denying he was fishing when called out. He only went full monty when his target took the bait.

[This message edited by floridaredman at 4:49 PM, September 20th (Thursday)]

MortuusCor, no offense taken. I think the WSs see one side and the BSs the other. Only natural, really.

But no, I do not give him "credit". To me, he came across as bragging. "I know how to play women so I can get into their pants. And it's soooooo easy with some of them."

As for admittng something unsavory or unpleasant about yourself, there's a difference between owning it and *owning it*. For example, I admit that I'm not the best housekeeper. Fine. You could say I own that. BUT, if I *owned it*, I'd be deep cleaning the house every weekend. KWIM?

This idiot admits he enjoys playng married women in order to get sex but he hasn't *owned it*. He's not going to change his behavior as long as it continues to get him what he wants. He'll stop when it no longer works or he has a bone deep epiphany that he's truly a complete douchebag and what he's doing is wrong on too many levels to count.

@lady_v I think I can see why he'd lie about having a vasectomy. It's probably a way to say to these women "I'm 'safe'. You don't have to worry that you'll possibly have to tell your hubby that you're preggo." More than likely, it's a way to cover his own ass. His OW gets pregnant (for real) and fingers him as daddy but he already as an explaination as to why it can't be him. He's off the hook unless the OW *demands* a fertility test. But then he knows this is highly unlikely so, off the hook.

[This message edited by Clarrissa at 5:18 PM, September 20th (Thursday)]

I agree wholeheartedly with Circe.

Sometimes truth is stranger than fiction.

I think that what this story reinforces to me is the issue of having very solid boundaries and self-awareness.

I know that it was brought up earlier in the thread that it takes 2 to cheat and this guy's *victim* is just as much at fault as he is, and I agree with that general sentiment.

However. The guy in the article has taken the concepts of manipulation and seduction to an extremely high level.

To me, he seems like the AP of the spouse that you would never have believed would cheat on you. One of the *excuses* that I have used for one-time cheaters is that maybe the WS got *caught up* in something that they didn't *see* until they were already stuck, KWIM? (and no, that is NOT an excuse by any means....)

This story, again, just reinforces that each person has to have a very strong sense of boundaries and self-awareness so that predators, like *article* guy, cannot get a toe in the door.

(man, *article* guy is really skeeving me out. Cold and calculating. He disgusts me, actually. It is frightening and sad that there are people like him walking this earth freely.)

Circe and Hope24, this "letter" or story has been posted on multiple websites in the past week so it must be true, like the commercial with the French model...

Regardless of its authenticity the real intrest for me has been the response to it. Everything from outrage to blameshifting, triggering to "I'm just here to help".

Myself included I believe we can be distracted by the horrible story or the "I'm so horrible, yet awesome so please validate me" posts. Anything to let us slide from personal accountability as that feels a lot more normal than the healing and new path we are trying to take.

Pain, healing, growing etc is all relative to the individual so if hearing about something like this helps great, but as waywards (this is the wayward forum right?) I believe we should avoid getting on our high horse after our own poor choices. That slippery slope is a real bitch...

It's not that I think it's too "bad" to be true - I think it reads more like someone trying too hard to sound jerky, and coming off sounding forced. It actually doesn't seem bad ENOUGH to me. It's like a pretend bad, rather than real-predator-bad. Does that make sense?

And the only reason I wanted to point that out is because predators don't always look like a big bad douche, and their motivations aren't always so cliche. Would I notice a man doing the moldy "get caught smiling and then look shyly away" in the office? Of course - I'd notice a fake yawn arm around me in a theater as well. If only it were that easy to spot the top of the slide for real.

I guess I just think real predators are more insidious than this. Either sociopathic in which case they enjoy the game, or narcissistic in which case they would never write something like this nor would they put that much thought into the OW's life and motivations in the first place. This does sound more like the Bill Paxton character in True Lies.

circe, in preperation for divorce, I read a few things on the internet. This sounds like someone paraphrasing the advice in those "get laid" manuals, with a sprinkling of I am married and I wanna fuck married women so they don't expect too much thrown in.

ETA:

And those guys actually do brag about this kind of shit.

[This message edited by aesir at 11:22 AM, September 21st (Friday)]

It's not that I think it's too "bad" to be true - I think it reads more like someone trying too hard to sound jerky, and coming off sounding forced. It actually doesn't seem bad ENOUGH to me. It's like a pretend bad, rather than real-predator-bad. Does that make sense?

Yes it does. That's exactly what I thought when I read it. There's plenty of "how-to" predator manuals on the internet. This is a frat boy version. I'm not buying it.