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The guy is a few yrs older which is right around my age. And, yes. I don't think he wants anything to do with having a family. I think maybe i should let them play house one weekend at his place. She can stay with him, and i'll drop my kids off there too.

I'm sure it wont cramp his style.

In listening to some of the older recordings this past week, i got a feeling this guy is a total player. He is very smooth. My guess is he's got a lot of women going on at same time. Would love to prove that true and show it to WW. But, she would probably just say i doctored the photo.

Luke

You have some big decision to make tomorrow when she blatently walks out of the house to go have lunch with him.

i hope you do not just let it happen.

if he is a player i am sure he has dealt with husbands before. i believe he will call your bluff because she shows no fear, only anger.

[This message edited by Badhurt at 5:12 PM, August 21st (Thursday)]

I am sure he is a smooth talker and has ruined his share of marriages. Would be interesting to do any kind of background check and or get dirt on him.

Your wife keeps telling you there is no fixing this or whatever excuses she keeps throwing at you, yet she is the one that continually has the affair.

What is your plan for tomorrow. Have you asked her if she is meeting with him tomorrow. And if so, what will you do. Meet them or what?

Make her choose. Quit that job tomorrow. She doesn't want to? No problem, you get them both fired. Easy peasy. If she walks out that door tomorrow, you call HR.

She'll resent you forever? Better than treating you like a chump forever. Will you resent you forever? I wouldn't I'd feel like a man who won't share my woman with every cock that comes along.

That's what I'd do. You gotta be willing to end the marriage to save it, right? Getting the OM fired is just a huge bonus!

I feel if you are focused on making him look bad, and say you even convince her, then you'd always feel you were plan B. IMO its better to take back power by making her make a conscious choice. You are worth that. Tell her your expectations. She is clearly wrong and you are the honest one. Don't speak to her from a place of fear.

Luke,

Change Maker just went through this. Listen to these people. You are too focused on him. She is going to resent you stopping her fun regardless of what you do because she is not committed to you. Her first choice is him. You heard hit with your own ears.

If she keeps a lunch date with him after these two days what more do you need. Letting her do it with no consequence is only going to insure more.

Every statement to you has been an outright lie straight to your face.

You have got to ask yourself is this how you want to live because she is not going to end it. She will tell you it is ended but that will also be a lie.

She does not want it to end . You are Plan B

Your only chance to come out of this is to blow their lives up.

Luke,

Were you able to convince her for sure that it was a PI or other mode that caught her convo?

She expressed immediate fear that you had bugged her phone.

If you didn't convince her otherwise, she may now think the phone is bugged and she WILL NOT have it on her when they sneak away to meet.

I know you said your source told you they haven't met or spoke today, but if your source is the phone and she has ditched it at her desk while she runs off with him, then you have NO IDEA what they might be up to.

I certainly hope you made her think it was a PI or ANYTHING but her phone, your one true source.

Listen to the advice here. You need to go no contact and let her see what she is doing.

My story is similar and in trying to reconcile, it was all lies.

Everyone here was spot on when it came to what was about to happen.

I am sorry, but be prepared if she chooses the AP, it happened to me and it's the worst possible pain. But knowing the truth of what your are dealing with is preferable to the lies.

Please listen to the advice posted here. They know what they are talking about. They've been there.

Hugs to you for this pain!

If it were me, I would show up at work 10 minutes before her lunch break and see how everyone reacts.

Is tomorrow a test for her. Because if she meets with him, it is most likely a divorce, no chance at R.

There is a very good chance she will not trust her phone and have it off or more likely, she leaves it in her desk drawer at work.

Luke,

One other thing....if I was you I would go down to her work and quietly, without drama, put this POS on notice that if he doesn't stop fucking with your family and life, you will contact HR and destroy his existence in return.

Do not cause a big scene at her work...don't even tell her you are coming...just go to the office and ask to speak to him...use a false name/story to make sure he comes out, then find a little privacy and drop the hammer.

Scare the shit out of this little worm.

Luke,

Sort of feel bad having set you off on a path and then leaving SI for a couple of days…

But here’s my 2 cents for what it’s worth…

OK – The convo you caught is interesting. First of all she mentions touches but also no sex… So let’s simply assume they cuddle and fondle but haven’t had “sex” – probably because her definition of sex is the classic intercourse definition. I think we can leave that issue for the time being. It’s definitely something that needs to be crossed IF you reconcile. I am adamant that R can only be done from a base of truth. IF she had sex then you need to know. If they didn’t then you need to be convinced it didn’t happen. IMHO a polygraph is the way to go for this.

Her wording…

She is making SACRIFICES!

She’s saying “I will sacrifice my soul-mate because I have to remain married to Luke”.

She’s saying “I will sacrifice my soul-mate because my love for him jeopardizes his job-security”.

What she needs to say is “I don’t want to sacrifice my marriage”.

So OM is single and is her soul mate and she can’t think of life without him? Simple! She simply goes to him. Of course – not as your wife. Remember what I suggested you tell her? She’s totally free to do WHATEVER she wants – but not as your wife.

Now. I seldom if ever suggest confronting OM. But in your case I’m making an exception.

We know your wife lies. That’s a given. You don’t have a clue if they will meet on Friday… Well… that’s not right. We KNOW they will meet. They work together. That’s the issue. We KNOW that they will meet but we don’t know if your wife will maintain the (near impossible) only professional contact.

I am going to suggest you appear at the office just before lunch…

Ask OM and WW to meet with you. Tell him – with your wife in attendance – that you know about their affair. That you KNOW from their words and behaviors that they BOTH know it’s an affair and inappropriate. Then tell her that your wife thinks he’s her soul-mate and that she can’t think of life without him. Tell him that you want it totally clear that your wife is totally free to do WHATEVER she wants. Point out he’s single and if your wife is such a catch that he’s been willing to risk destroying a family and risking both their jobs then they are perfectly free and capable of starting a proper relationship BUT ONE WHERE SHE IS NO LONGER YOUR WIFE.

Then tell your wife that she is totally free to remain at the office for the rest of the day and that she can come home to get what she needs to move in with OM – YOU won’t do anything to impede her happiness. But if she wants to be your wife then she has to tell you so and she has to tell OM that it’s over.

And then she needs to tell you how she’s going to enforce NC with OM with them both working together.

Get it? Simply force the issue!

Because if you don’t…. Your wife will resent you because you forced her to sacrifice her “happiness”.

What will happen if you do the above?

Well… Undeniably there is a small chance WW will come home to get a weekend-bag and move in with OM. But if that’s what’s going to happen then that’s something that was maybe destined to happen.

I would be willing to place money on the OM dumping WW and your WW dumping OM in front of him.

And Luke,

Does her company have a clear no-relationship policy? If not then legally it will be hard for them to fire them. It can open a can load of legal issues.

Plus Luke… Prioritize: how important is her job compared to your family?

Luke

If you heard nothing today she did dump her phone. I hope you have read what everyone has told you. You cannot just let her defy you and walk out if the house tomorrow all dressed nice for her date with no consequence.

You must do something. Only if she believes it is the end of the line will there be any chance to stop this.

It's either blow the OM up or she keeps it up and you twist in the wind

I agree you need to stop this. I wouldn't be quite as dramatic as what some have suggested.

This might be naive, but I would sit down and talk with my wife and tell her the deal. I would tell her I won't share her with someone. I won't stay married to her while she dates someone else. I'd leave it up to her what she wants to do. I'd lay it on the line. I'd warn her that if she went on her lunch date I'd file for divorce. And I'd tell her that I'm not sure I won't divorce anyway, that I don't like being betrayed. I'd let her make her own decision about what she wanted. But any more contact would result in me filing for divorce.

that way she can only blame herself if she makes the decision to continue her relationship with the other guy and ends up divorced. She made the decision. this crap about "in a perfect world" is just crap. Not only is that how it would be in a perfect world, that's how it would be in my world.

I told her last night she needs to have NC with the OM. I just won't ask her to leave her work. She would resent me forever. She said so no lunches, texts, dinners, she gets that. I said NC means in this case only professional dialogue if she must.

Now, i started doing some things for me yesterday that i've never done before. When she got home last night. Normally the kids are all set for bed, but last night i let them stay up. I want her to take some responsibility. I told her to take care of the kids. To give them a bath, to read to them. I didn't help one bit. I let her make her own dinner. I deleted her picture from my phone contacts. I changed her name from what i call her to her real name in the contacts, and i when i speak about her to my kids i say "your mother" instead of something that had more meaning to me. I also call her by her first name now which i didn't do. I also blocked her from my facebook account. These are little things but i feel they help me retake some control over my life. And it feels right to me right now.

[This message edited by Luke at 11:29 AM, September 2nd (Tuesday)]

Luke

I asked her about lunch today. She said she will come right home after work. I told her to call me from her work phone before she leaves.

She told me last night that the OM asked her if she was happy before they started. She said she was. She had a happy marriage, job, kids. She is confused why she did this and said she wants to want to be with us, but feels nothing right now, she said she feels empty.

Finally, i asked her to swear all this on her fathers ashes. She couldn't. She said she didn't want to let me down

The above is why it will not stop. She gave you no answer about lunch so after that conversation she is still planning on going to her lunch date with him unless there is something missing.She is not all in and I suggest you expect a burner phone. You should put a VAR in her car.

And i would not accept anything less than a lie detector test as to whether or not she had sex with him. She has and is still lying about everything else.

You were right. Absolutely no talk about R until YOU are convinced this is over. i strongly urge you NOT to start talking about therapy, books to read, or any other bull shit. if she does that on her own, it is fine because that will show some commitment. But you do not need to be begging her to read books at this point.

You need to give her D papers and force her to be sure 'she will not disappoint you". The translation for that is she will continue the affair and still want to live in your house. You must make that not an option and she must believe that.

[This message edited by Badhurt at 8:01 AM, August 22nd (Friday)]

...when i speak about her to my kids i say "your mother" instead of something that had more meaning to me.

This one jumped right out at me.

You need to keep things as normal as possible for your kids. Kids pick up on more than most people realize. Something this overt is going to throw their worlds into chaos. I realize coming from the guy who got so mad he told you to basic take the kids away from her for a night, this sounds a little two faced. I'm sorry. I gave you very bad advise. But you really need to keep the kids lives as stable as possible through this.

Twitchy, your right. And, my kids did correct me yesterday when i said "your mother". They said no dad you mean.... I don't wan't them to feel this cause they don't deserve any of this crap. It's between my wife and me. I agree kids do pick up on a lot so i will be more considerate of language i use with them. I will go back to what they know i should address her around them. Thank you.

A couple of things stand out. First of all I wish you could do what Bigger wrote and be there right before lunch.

I asked her about lunch today. She said she will come right home after work. I told her to call me from her work phone before she leaves.

If that was how she answered the question about lunch, she completely avoided the question.

The OM said he can't believe the lengths you are going to annoyed me for some reason, but I cant put my finger on that yet.

It tells me whatever you say to your wife is going to be told straight to the OM. Which could be interesting, you might have told your wife that the PI is no problem, because you are going to send the bill to the OM.

Your wife not being able to swear on her father's ashes is troubling. That tells me she does not know what she is going to do, and she doesn't know if she can keep NC.

This lunch for 10 people from work, does that include the OM?

If you heard nothing yesterday, yet her and the OM talked about everything you know, there is no way you can know what they are up to.

This is going to be hard to know what is going on as long as she works there. She should resent only herself and the OM for losing this job, not you. You did not cause any of this, so if she needs to resent someone for the loss of her job, she needs to realize that she and the OM caused the loss of her job, not you.

ETA: Did your wife ever tell you what the promise she made to OM was?

What was her reply to you when you asked you about OM being 12 years too late?

[This message edited by craig2001 at 9:07 AM, August 22nd (Friday)]

Dude, your setting yourself up to become this woman's warden. Trust me that's not a place you want to be in. Its not your job to tell her how detailed NC should be. Its rather obvious if you ask me. She is just playing the dumb, I don't understand routine. I don't want to piss on your leg here, but I don't see much if any remorse here. So far all she is giving you is lip service and that just don't cut it. IMHO, if she were committed to change, if she really wanted to fix what she has broken she would have started taking action. Has she looked into finding an IC for herself ? Has she figured out that her job is not as important as her M ? Has she even taken a moment to think about what her behaviors have done to you ? I think not pal. Don't expect any miracle here because its not going to happen. I still prepare for the ultimate consequence, D. You really need to protect yourself now.

Luke:

Your wife is still dissing you and the marriage and the kids, and you are allowing it.

If you heard nothing yesterday, yet her and the OM talked about everything you know, there is no way you can know what they are up to.

Exactly. She is still having contact with the OM.

IF she cared about saving the marriage she would quit her dream job. She screwed up?

She can and will find another job.

She is putting her job before the marriage.

I quit a dream job to relocate for my husband's dream job. I did not resent that. It was a choice I made to put the relationship with my husband first.

Either the OM quits or your wife quits. They can't continue these cozy talks.

If he is her boss in any way, he can be fired for fraternizing with an underling?

This is going to be hard to know what is going on as long as she works there. She should resent only herself and the OM for losing this job, not you.

Exactly, Luke.

You did not cause any of this, so if she needs to resent someone for the loss of her job, she needs to realize that she and the OM caused the loss of her job, not you.

Yes, Luke. She caused this issue.

She can and will find another job. Is her job more important than you?

If so, it's time to divorce.

[This message edited by seethelight at 9:34 AM, August 22nd (Friday)]