SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Thank goodness real lawyers came to this thread! Justastatistic is even a member of the bar in your state, so thanks to all the lawyers that have chimed in on this thread.

Remember... Guidelines are merely that... a guideline that is subject to adjustment up or down as the individual evidence and facts of a case come out. Do yourself a favor and don't go with the discount rate on this...

^^This^^ is really important, JM. Think of it also in the light of my exH's attorney. HE hired the MOST RUTHLESS and EXPENSIVE attorney in our state. That attorney's MO is to bury the opposition in paperwork, hearings, discovery, and more hearings. This is geared to not only make HIM $$, but also to bankrupt the opposing side in legal fees.

Trust me when I say that justastatistic is right - your wife has access to LOTS of inside information given her profession. Don't think that since it's all delegated by statute that there's nothing to be gained by getting a bulldog to fight for you. She most certainly will have one when she realizes the true financial shitstorm she's about to face. Do NOT let her bulldog fight with your hamster. Hers will surely eat your hamster in the first round.

I'm guessing from justastatistic's post that there are no "gray areas" in NJ where infidelity is concerned? In NC, while it is a no-fault state, IF the spouse would be entitled to alimony and infidelity is involved, then the court MUST consider the infidelity when determining alimony. Nice little "gotcha" we have here in NC. I'd love to know if there's ANYTHING like that in NJ???

I know it seems like you're just throwing $$ at the dissolution of a marriage that YOU didn't want and didn't create. But, you have to look at this process as WAR now, JM. Trust me - it will get MUCH worse before it gets better, and you only get ONE SHOT at this.

This is not the time to take the less expensive and/or less experienced advocate.

And also, you asked how you find the most ruthless bulldog attorney? Ask your friends, co-workers, and any attorney you know. That's how I found mine - I asked an attorney that had done some contract dispute work and a will for exH and I. He gave me 3 names and I picked the one I felt most comfortable with.

I have to ask if this is part of "the fog" or what, but after what I've been through, it's just more salt in the wound.

My wife wants to sit down with a close family member who is objective and loves us both, to talk. She still wants out of the marriage, but says she loves and respects me, and doesn't want hard feelings. For us to remain friends.

The ultimate betrayel, lying, cheating, getting angry at me, manipulating everything, rewriting our marital history together, stab me in the back, treat me like dirt, and you want to remain friends?

I mean, what the fuck......

The shitty part, I don't have great medical benefits through my company. They're "OK", but I would have to pay alot for decent coverage.

I'm gonna lose out on those state benefits, and I'm not gonna be able to go to counseling. I don't have $200 for each session every week or every other week.

My wife wants to sit down with a close family member who is objective and loves us both, to talk. She still wants out of the marriage, but says she loves and respects me, and doesn't want hard feelings. For us to remain friends.

She just wants to sit down in front of a witness and have you agree that she's not a bad person, the breakup was because of both of you, and remaining "friends" will just solidify her perceptions.

She stopped being your friend long ago, now. As the old saying goes, "With friends like that who needs enemies?".

I'd tell her she can pound sand about the meeting.

Actually, I'm going to the meeting. This will be therapeutic for me.

She doesn't know I have the phone records. She's been lying the whole time about the "who, when, where, why's". I have the documented proof, and for my own sanity, I'm calling her on all her bullshit, and each and every single lie.

You can't manipulate and lie against facts that are in black and white.

No this is not part of the fog.

My wife wants to sit down with a close family member who is objective and loves us both, to talk. She still wants out of the marriage, but says she loves and respects me, and doesn't want hard feelings. For us to remain friends.

You know for a fact she does not respect you, and if she loved you why would she want out of the marriage to have sex with other people? This is damage control!

She doesn't want to be painted as the bad guy. The one who busted up her marriage. So, if you go to this sit down and agree to be her friend, it will ease her conscious and the friend will tell everyone what a great wife she was for sitting down and offering you her eternal friendship. She will be the good guy.

Or if you get in this meeting and tell her I'm not going to be your friend after what you have been doing to me, then you become the BAD GUY!! Now the family member will say OMG JM72 wasn't willing to swallow his pride, it must be his fault the marriage failed.

This is a set up my friend. She wants out of this marriage but she doesn't want to face the stigma of being known as the one who blew up her own family. Avoid this meeting at all cost's.

You need to stop looking at this woman as your wife because that is not what she is right now. She is your enemy, and you need to start watching out for verbal traps and set up's. She wants out of this, but she wants out clean. So she is attempting to set you up as the fall guy.

That is my honest read on her intentions. Think about it, she said she still wants out, so why do you need a sit down???? You two don't need to be friends to co-parent, you must be civil toward each other and that's all. Watch you back.

And the fucked up thing is, I never reached out to the cat lady.

Even now, going through this, it still feels "wrong". I don't know if it's being programed from 25 years of marriage or what. I deserve to have fun.

And then I think I'm in no condition to have fun. Angry, depressed, sad, a shit load of still unaddressed feelings. I kept thinking "it wouldn't be fair to her to string her along" if I'm not ready or in no condition to start another relationship.

Sometimes having morals really sucks.

Longforgotten, I'm going to the meeting, and I will remain calm.

I will show her the proof, call her on her bullshit, tell her how I feel, and that's it.

How her selfish behaviors not only hurt me, but her own children will suffer.

How she lost the respect of everyone in the family.

How I've shown everyone the true facts of what is going on.

Let her get upset. Fuck her. If this makes me the "bad guy" by presenting actual facts and proving she's been lying from the start, well, I can live with that.

What's she gonna say, "no comment?"

And good riddance. She picked a guy who was twice married, twice divorced, 2 alimony payments, child support for 5 kids, told my wife the reason the marriages didn't work out was because he "gets bored easy", and is always in the clubs surrounded by other women.

How do you think this one will end? Get your popcorn ready...

How do you spend more than $7K on lawyers?

Easy - your WW throws a bunch of bullshit at you, that you (your lawyer) need to respond to. At $350/h ($150 for the secretary/paralegal), it adds up fast.

Example: WW demands more $ from you (this is prior to settlement/judgement/divorce) for temporary support. But you already pay her bills (rent, utilities, insurance, etc.). So you have a phone call with your attorney to go over your reciepts (that you've already collected and compiled), and discuss a strategy to respond - let's say you are fast, and that takes 30 min. That's $175.

Said lawyer then spends a hour reviewing the documents you gave him and drafting a letter to respond. That's another hour - $350.

Paralegal/secretary then compiles and formats the letter/info and sends to other laywer. 1/2 h - $75.

Other attorney replies, your attorney replies back. Nothing is resolved, but held until the trial. Another 1/2 (at least) - $175.

So: $175, $350, $75, $175. That's $775. All for bullshit.

Go to trial? 2 days - 8h @$350/hr; prep time? another 8h @$350. That's 24h @$350/h - Hell, that's $8400 right there.

Bottom line: If you WW is difficult in any way, about anything, it's going to cost you.

You get a good attorney because he knows the games that can be played, and how to best (quickly) deal with them.

I have no idea what she is going to say. I just feel her purpose is to show the family member that this entire break up is your fault. I have no idea how she is going to approach it or what she is going to say.

If you do go, then I agree with your layout. You must stay calm, do not raise your voice, show your evidence to the trusted family member, explain about her staying gone entire weekends without coming home. Show the text's where she didn't come last weekend and left her daughter hanging in the wind with out a care. Make you case calmly and then ask the family member, would you want to be friends with a person that does this.

She will most likely turn on you and try to provoke you, and remember, you have no idea what this family member has been told by her. So don't flip out if the family member turns on you as well. If this happens, wish them a good evening and leave quickly. I think, if your intent on going, that's the best you can do.

How do you think this one will end? Get your popcorn ready...

Well, if she is putting all her eggs in the Rapper Guy's basket, I'm pretty sure it's going to end badly. But I wouldn't worry about that if I were you, she is a big girl and this is the life she wants. So let her have it and move on.

This meeting?

Don't go. Nothing good is going to come out of it.

Confronting your WW? She clearly doesn't give a shit what you think. Her friend? She'll just see you as the "crazy" husband. (Maybe if you stay totally calm, like an undertaker, she'll believe you. But unless you've got video of WW fucking the dude, your WW will have some kind of semi-plausible excuse. Trust me. She's been thinking of them for sometime now). You're going to get angry and upset. That will be read as crazy.

Just go crickets. Detach. File for divorce and start the process of healing.

But if you really must go, bring a VAR (or a GoPro), as protection against some trumped up DV charge.

No, this family member is my cousins wife from my side of the family. She was close with my wife over the years, but now when I talk to her in confidence, she agrees that the way my wife is acting is disgusting and wrong.

There will be no false DV charges, them ganging up on me, etc. The reason it's her is because she loves us both, is level headed, trustworthy, and honest.

Look, I want to do this for ME. I need closure, and if that means exposing her for who she is now and the way she's acting, then that's what I want to do for me.

I know if someone is doing something that they have to cheat, hide, and keep secret, deep down, THEY know what they're doing is wrong. I'm just bringing it slightly closer to the light, to let her know, I know, we ALL know what she is doing is wrong.

This has nothing to do with trying to win her back or reconcile, I just need her to hear the truth, whether she wants to hear it or not.

We are just trying to make sure you have your eyes open and are prepared for any possible outcome from this. Affairs make for some seriously crazy situations.

I was thinking, it could be that she is aware of the financial ass spanking you are going to give her in divorce and she wants to meet with a loved, trusted, family member offering peace and friendship in the hope of getting a more favorable settlement. I mean it's possible.

I didn't think you were going into this trying to win her back. From following your thread all this time, it appears to me you finally have had enough. And your right, she knows she is in the wrong, but at this point she can't help herself. It's just to much fun running around like a 20 year old. Drinking, smoking pot, and screwing all weekend. I don't know where she finds the energy for all that. I am 48, what she gets done in a weekend would leave me in a coma 6 weeks.

I reached out to the cat lady, and we've been texting.

I only say that because I don't want to be a hypocrite. This isn't cheating, right?

If you are reaching out to her to have "FUN", then it is. Your still married, even if you are the only one presently honoring the vows. If you are just reaching out to her as a friend to talk to, there is nothing wrong with that, if you keep it to just friends. But that can be hard to do.

Look, your wife is out the door. Get the process going for divorce full speed ahead, then when your free of her you and cat lady can do anything you want together, and you won't have a guilty conscious.

:::::sigh::::::

It's been 4 months since I've had "companionship" you know.

Ok, Ok........dammit.

[This message edited by JM72 at 1:17 AM, April 20th (Wednesday)]

Oh, yes, I know. The last time I even held a woman's hand was 1991. But trust me, you will feel so much better about yourself doing things the right way.

Knowing you have a little honey more than a decade younger, with the body of an aerobics instructor interested in you should start to build a fire under your butt to get this divorce over with. LOL

You're killing me man........killing me

If you are hell bent on taking the meeting for "closure" then make a list prior. You don't want the meeting to turn into... what you did wrong in the marriage... Remembering the "good-times" so the Affair doesn't seem so bad...

I'm sure her hope is that at the end of the meeting you will be able to be friends...and that you wont be so angry that you take her to the cleaners at court.

My guess is she wants things to be "amicable" because she has some idea of the financial hit she is going to take. So she will try to talk you out of it.

Regarding Cat Lady, I think once you have filed you can talk to her with a clean conscience.