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Just Found Out :
Punch to the Gut

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notperfect5 ( member #43330) posted at 4:45 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

TOC,

I've just got to say, you've moved through this first stage super fast. For me, between finding out of a possible EA and finally getting her to stop the false R and stop screwing the OM, and finally confess to what she did through two polygraphs was about two years. I am reconciling, but I have to say it would have been much better for me to divorce, HAD I NOT HAD 5 CHILDREN age 4-15.

Your husband cheated and committed adultery. That means you get to decide what is best for you, stay or go, with absolutely no regrets. I will say that it is easier, sometimes, to stay. But long term, every time I touch her I know she did just that with someone else. It will never be the same for me, and that is a shame. I will always think of my marriage in this way: She was my one and only. I was one of two. In a way, the OM will always be with us in my bed whispering and taunting me in my head, "Hello NP5... I've been just where you are now, and I'm still here..."

I made the decisions I made to keep my family together and prevent further damage to them. I do so from a selfish standpoint -- what I want most is to put it all back together and make the best of it for me and my children. That is not better, or worse or easy or hard. It is what is right for me. But what is right for you?

I can tell you now that my decision would have been different had my children been out of the house. The affair, the false R, the trickle truth, and the reconciliation, for me, has been excruciating. I wish I had been in a coma for the last 3 years.

It is significantly better now, but man it hurt so bad for so very long. It still does hurt and will for a long time.

Good luck TOC. And no, you don't have to turn the other cheek when it comes to adultery. God gives you that caveat, that special out. That is the exception.

NP5

Me: 55 BH Her: 52 WW - Edith12
DDay 8/13 EA, fake R
Turned PA on 4/27/14 and fake R
PA during MC and my IC and her IC through 12/14
Polygraph on 4/30/15, TT 5/5/15.. TT on 10/4/15, 2nd Poly and TT 11/17/15
DD's 23, 21, 18, 15 DS

posts: 1233   ·   registered: May. 5th, 2014   ·   location: Southeast
id 7683172
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mchercheur ( member #37735) posted at 5:33 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

Hi TOC,

There is no one "right" or more honorable way. Each of us BSs has infinite variables to take into consideration when deciding what to do after betrayal. Each of us has to weigh everything, and determine what is best for us. It is not anyone else's place to judge our decision without walking in our shoes.

Like Notperfect5, on Dday I still had 4 children at home. It was/is very important to me that they grow up in an intact family. Also, there was no way that OW Slunt was going to be part of their lives as a stepmother----I did not want them to have any contact with her.

AND there was no way that I was going to have my kids for only part of the time.

I kept my vows. It is bad enough that a Slunt walked into my marriage (yes, WH held the door open for her),but that Slunt is not going to have my kids every other weekend!

If I had already had an empty nest and just myself to decide for, like you do, I would have done exactly as you have done (which is what I did do in my first marriage when my first WH cheated---thank God there were no kids involved.)

Once my kids are launched, I may still leave, since my WH has not "done the work" of true Reconciliation, because "he doesn't believe in dwelling on things."

Sending you strength (altho you already have plenty!) and hugs. You are doing great.

[This message edited by mchercheur at 12:36 PM, October 12th (Wednesday)]

Me: BW; Him: WH --Had 10 mo. EA/ PA with COW; Dday 5/2011 Married 35 years/Together 36 years/4 kids together, and 1 grandbaby; OW 20 years younger than us/divorced no kids Trying to R; don't know what the final outcome will be

posts: 2687   ·   registered: Dec. 7th, 2012
id 7683215
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OngoingProcess ( member #40635) posted at 5:39 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

I had 4 young children at home and tried desperately for R. But TT over a year killed it for me.

There may be honor in staying but the WW has to be ready to be honorable. Your WH is not there. Will he be someday? maybe but it may be too late for you.

Please remember, this is HIS boundary, HIS consequence. He laid out this term of infidelity being a deal breaker. You are being honorable by honoring his terms.

Multiple DDays Oct '08 to Oct. '09
Same AP
Papers served 7/23/10
Divorced and Delighted 12/12/12

posts: 303   ·   registered: Sep. 11th, 2013   ·   location: NorthEast
id 7683222
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SadMom75 ( member #51609) posted at 5:42 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

People react from pain, and usually it has more to do with how they view themselves then how they view your actions.

You have to do what feels right for you. At the end of the day not one of us lives your life. Only one person does and you have every right to choose each step in your life.

You were a committed wife, until he ended that. It's on him 100%. If he doesn't feel he owes you the vows he took, then you don't owe him "til death do we part" either. He changed the game.

It's such a painful process no matter what route is taken. We wrestle with staying, we wrestle with leaving. I wish for just a day those WSes could feel our pain and think the million different thoughts that run through our heads. Infidelity would take a serious decline, I think.

Good luck!

"Betray a friend, and you'll often find
you have ruined yourself"
-Aesop

posts: 699   ·   registered: Feb. 2nd, 2016   ·   location: PA
id 7683225
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 TurnOtherCheek (original poster member #55194) posted at 5:46 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

All, regarding what I wrote here

Someone on this forum wrote some very powerful words about those staying and working on it as being the honorable ones while those who run are somewhat cowardly.

No one actually said this or wrote it to me. I read it under another thread and I know that poster was speaking to someone else in a completely different situation but it definitely resonated with me because most likely it is what I am thinking about myself. That's usually how it works - the same thought was going through my mind so when I saw that, it really stuck. I just wanted to be clear - no one was being cruel. It was and is my own interpretation of thoughts conveyed elsewhere.

Thanks

Me: BW x 2 - 53
Ist XWH: Married over 17 years, DD and DS (mine)
2nd XH: Also 53, DS (his), 8 yrs together
OW: Pet sitter
D-Day: 9/11/16
Divorced in 60 seconds flat. http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=591733

posts: 441   ·   registered: Sep. 17th, 2016
id 7683229
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HardyRose ( member #55069) posted at 6:35 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

I don't think you are being a coward. You set a boundary and you are strong enough to enforce it. You decided long ago that an affair was a deal breaker for you. Your WH knew this.

I don't think either path is easy. There is no easy road out of the crap situation your WH put you in. The best path to take is the one that leads to your healing.

And honestly to decide that you are happier single than in a relationship with someone who doesn't love and respect you is very brave!

I hope you find an awesome IC that helps you realise how brave you are being.

posts: 923   ·   registered: Mar. 27th, 2016
id 7683277
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CheaterMagnet ( member #33581) posted at 7:19 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

TOC,

I stayed because I am a coward. I was afraid to start over. I was afraid to be poorer and have to live in a studio with no kitchen. I was afraid.

There is no honor in staying because you are too afraid to leave while your spouse gets to rugsweep.

There is honor in knowing what is a deal breaker for you and upholding that boundary. Infidelity is a deal breaker for me as well. I just lack the courage to make the changes needed in order to leave.

You are brave. You are strong. You are honorable. You are someone I would like to know in the real world.

If Happy Ever After did exist, I would still be holding you like this.
All those fairly tales are full of shit.
One more fucking love song I'll be sick. ~ Maroon 5

posts: 1968   ·   registered: Oct. 11th, 2011
id 7683310
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whymeagain8 ( member #55187) posted at 9:58 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

I keep reading here to stay strong. My STBX would love to rugsweep his "mistake" and go back to business as usual.

It is sad to me that I am even tempted to do that....I will stay strong, I will stay strong...I have to chant this. My two little boys and I deserve a better life without this type of doubt and emotional pain.

My STBX has no excuse at all for what happened except a shrug and "i'm human, humans make mistakes".

I knew he had targeted my friend and I was powerless to stop them from moving to EA and PA because I work/commute and he was laid off with nothing but free time....

Stay strong TOC

posts: 259   ·   registered: Sep. 17th, 2016
id 7683478
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Marc878 ( member #52592) posted at 11:24 PM on Wednesday, October 12th, 2016

Someone on this forum wrote some very powerful words about those staying and working on it as being the honorable ones while those who run are somewhat cowardly.

Where is it written that in the case of infidelity there is an automatic second chance?

If it's a dealbreaker and you walk away from betrayal, lies and deceit it's a good thing. Not everyone likes seconds.

When things get really bad they can always get worse so be prepared. However, the sun will come up in the AM and you can get through it.

posts: 2194   ·   registered: Apr. 5th, 2016   ·   location: Southeast
id 7683564
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shiloe ( member #1224) posted at 1:02 AM on Thursday, October 13th, 2016

There are many of us who gave that second chance and stayed and did the R, only to be stabbed in the back again.

I tell my almost grown children now, if their SO cheats on them . . . .walk away.

I made a mistake the first time.

I should have left him, 3 little kids and all.

[This message edited by shiloe at 7:04 PM, October 12th (Wednesday)]

But remember, good love is hard to find . . -Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers
BS - 58 Dday 03/2011
Cheater -58 Married 26 yrs
DD - 23 DD -21 DS-19
A#1 2000 with married ho-worker/neighbor ow#1
A#2 2007-? OW#2 LTA- new MCOW D-2/17

posts: 1729   ·   registered: Mar. 7th, 2003
id 7683614
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nme1 ( member #44360) posted at 2:01 AM on Thursday, October 13th, 2016

I don't want to invest so much time in a possible R that has no guarantee of sticking.

This is totally understandable, it's the risk that those of us in R take, but it's a risk you also face with any new relationship as well.

I have no problem with you divorcing your WH, in my opinion he has not demonstrated that he understands what he has done to you nor has he shown any remorse for what you've been going through. It's ok for infidelity to be your deal breaker and you don't have to justify it to anyone.

BTW - if you transferred to Europe would you be able to take your dog with you?

Me: BS
Him: WS
M 16 yrs 2 x DS
D-Day 6th March 2014

posts: 1361   ·   registered: Aug. 4th, 2014   ·   location: Australia
id 7683645
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devotedman ( member #45441) posted at 12:11 PM on Thursday, October 13th, 2016

TOC, so how'd the talk with your boss go?

WRT you and an IC, your company probably has an EAP (Employee Assistance Program). While they do differ, mine offers 6 free IC visits (from a list of ICs on the plan, big list) per different incident per year, with health insurance / copays, etc., kicking in after the 6 free visits are gone. It also offers free phone-based calls whenever you need, so you get a somewhat random IC who has access to the ongoing notes in your file. I called several times in the middle of the night, early days. My longest call was about 1.5 hours, my shortest about 30 minutes, just a check-in call really. I had them in my cell phone directory and would just call when it all got overwhelming. I think Skype was an option, too.

I thank you for the feedback you've given on our advice to you so far. It does help each of us to tune our advice just a bit when we see what is working for people in different situations.

Personally, I told everyone that would listen. I was completely crushed. I just blurted it all out, at work, at the corner convenience store, to cabbies, basically if anybody asked, "How are you today?" they got a 5 minute short version of my fiancee leaving me for swingers. An interesting trade, they got a story to tell and I got compassion. I do not regret any of those trades.

At work there are always those that will take anything that you say and speculate. My personal philosophy is to counter that with making myself boring by sharing. No, those people aren't my friends, but if they know that I come home, scrape up something to eat or go grab something, then sit and read well, that doesn't make for a lot of mystery in intrigue for their speculations.

Plus, I'm not going to change one whit to avoid that "gossip". So what? If they haven't anything better to do than speculate about _me_, well, they've got a pretty sad, empty life themselves, eh? Spread that philosophy around a little, indirectly, and pretty soon you're not that fun to speculate about. Or, call their bullshit with bigger, clearly fantastic, bullshit.

"What do you think about Bob? Do you think that he has a secret?"

"Sure he does, each night when he goes home he gets a scrambled phone call from the CIA on a special phone in the heel of his shoe, just like in Get Smart. Then he gathers evidence against local drug dealers, trying to trace connections back to Colombia. After he does his part the CIA calls in the Enforcers! I wish that _I_ could be more like Bob, don't you? Gosh, whatta guy."

-or-

"Yeah, no. Bob's got no secrets. He's just a guy trying to live life, just like you and I. He does do some pretty fun stuff, though, to have a full life. He volunteers, he's in a small band, and he skydives. Much better than just sitting around, sad at home, eh? Hey, what do you think about those around the office that talk about others? I know _you_ don't, but that's really pretty sad and pathetic, isn't it? Those folks really need something to do. Sad, really..."

EDITED to add

Hey, today is the 2nd antiversary of her walkout. Yay, me! My blood pressure is down 20-30 points systolic and diastolic, my bank account is up, and I don't go around as much feeling like a loser. At least I'm sleeping through the night again, mostly.

[This message edited by devotedman at 6:23 AM, October 13th, 2016 (Thursday)]

Me: 2xBS b 1962 xWW after 2 decades, xWGF after almost 1.
Amelia Pond: Who are you?
The Doctor: I don't know yet. I'm still cooking.
ENFP-A. Huh.

posts: 5155   ·   registered: Oct. 30th, 2014   ·   location: Central USA
id 7683817
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BrokenheartedUK ( member #43520) posted at 1:46 PM on Thursday, October 13th, 2016

TOC, a lot of self doubt of all descriptions gets stirred up off the back of a betrayal. Seeing an IC will help you with this enormously. Everyone has their journey when it comes to R v D, I tried to R, and then filed for D when it was demonstrated completely clearly to me that this was never going to get better for me when my then WS, now EX, continued to lie to me during our R. Even if you go to a few sessions to talk through your slight ambivelence about filing for D, it will help you get the clarity that you pretty much already have.

Also, I'm so mad for you over the flower thing. Ugh. The whole "grand gesture" stuff is so manipulative and such bullshit. If he was really sensitive about your needs he would have honoured your request. And really, flowers...? Yeah, that totally makes up for the months of screwing around on you and the lying.

Hang in there. You got this. You're doing great. (((TOC)))

Me: BS
He cheated and then lied. Apparently cheaters lie. Huh. 13 months of false R. Divorced! 8/16 3 teenage kids
"The barn's burnt down
Now
I can see the moon"
-Mizuta Masahide

posts: 3432   ·   registered: May. 24th, 2014
id 7683876
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atalosss ( member #47882) posted at 2:10 PM on Thursday, October 13th, 2016

{{{Devotedman}}}, I don't know if your post was meant to be funny but it made me giggle 😂😂😂. We all could learn a lot from you!

Enjoy your second anniversary free from the lies, betrayal and outright craziness. Spoil yourself today!

{{{TOC}}} you are doing just fine. Stick with what is right for you 💕👊💕!

Eta: when my h was doing all to convince me to stay he bought me my favorite tree, yes a fucking tree. He planted it right in front of our living room window! I didn't say anything because I didn't want to upset my kids. So now I look out the window and have a constant reminder of his infidelity. I hate that fucking tree 😂😂😂!

[This message edited by atalosss at 8:23 AM, October 13th (Thursday)]

"You can't ride two horses with one ass" Channel66

posts: 1098   ·   registered: May. 14th, 2015   ·   location: canada
id 7683891
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Liverbird61 ( member #52407) posted at 2:18 PM on Thursday, October 13th, 2016

BTW - if you transferred to Europe would you be able to take your dog with you?

Not sure about all of Europe, however, England law is dogs go into quarantine for six months

At the end of the storm there's a Golden Sky.

posts: 82   ·   registered: Mar. 23rd, 2016
id 7683897
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MissedRedFlags ( member #43344) posted at 3:16 PM on Thursday, October 13th, 2016

TOC--

You are my hero. You took the hurt and pain of betrayal and were strong and decisive in what you would not accept.

Prior to being betrayed myself, I was adamant that cheating meant the end of the relationship...then, it happened to me and instead of walking away, to my shame, I accepted less and stayed.

Keep your head up and be proud of yourself.

[This message edited by MissedRedFlags at 9:17 AM, October 13th (Thursday)]

Me: BS 44
Him: WH 43
7 year LTA, DDay 1: June 4, 2013
DDay2: 6/5/16-Same OW
DDay3: 8/19/16-Same OW
DDay4: 8/1/17--found OW stalking me here at SI
Married 20 years
2 kids aged 14 & 12
Plan: get self out of infidelity

posts: 451   ·   registered: May. 6th, 2014   ·   location: Florida
id 7683952
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deena04 ( member #41741) posted at 1:26 AM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

I don't check in as often anymore, and we are R, but I want to be you when I grow up TOC. You handled this with dignity, and I wish you peace and happiness no matter where this takes you.

Me FBS 40s, Him XWS older than me (lovemywife4ever), D, He cheated before M, forgot to tell me. I’m free and loving life.

posts: 3352   ·   registered: Dec. 22nd, 2013   ·   location: Midwest
id 7684414
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 TurnOtherCheek (original poster member #55194) posted at 11:22 AM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Devoted man:

Thank you for the info on company EAP plans. We do have one and I never knew! I guess I just never paid attention but I have reached out to get more info so I can contact a counselor. You probably saved me a bunch of time, effort and $$$! Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Also, as to

Personally, I told everyone that would listen. I was completely crushed. I just blurted it all out, at work, at the corner convenience store, to cabbies, basically if anybody asked, "How are you today?"

First I'm sorry for your pain and I do hope you are healing and feeling stronger. Your advice has always been so spot on for me. I have felt this way at times, most especially when someone asks me how I'm doing, too. In my head I answer them with, "my husband is fucking our dog nanny but other than that, awesome! How are you?" While I was away at the spa, I did blurt out to a few people my situation but they were strangers. It did feel so good because everyone was so nice. The first time I did it, it got me a longer massage! It was to my masseuse who asked me at the start of the massage if I needed her to work on any trouble areas, of course meaning any physical problems I might have. When I asked her if she could make my husband stop fucking other women while married to me, she went into full on Sisters United mode and took amazing care of me and had me relaxed and laughing after that massage. She had no massage right after me so said she would just take her time and work out more kinks on me. Best. Massage. Ever.

I learned of a new thing today. Had never heard this term before. Anyone familiar with Post-Nuptial Agreement? I have now read about it since my lawyer brought it up to me as something my "99.99999% certain STBXH" would like to offer and discuss further with me and my attorney present. I'm not sure if I should laugh, be offended or feel bad for him. Is this a gift he is trying to give me? After learning what it is, I am wondering what he thinks I need from this. I don't need his money. All I wanted was his love and FIDELITY! Is he trying to buy my forgiveness? I could not be more confused. Anyone been offered this and how did it make you feel? I have given thought to what I might want to ask for in such an agreement. All I can think of is his dog.

Lastly, to everyone from Marc, shiloe, notperfect5, mchercheur, OngoingProcess, SadMom, deena and really just everyone - you are all my heroes! Can't thank you enough for making me feel strong when I am at my lowest. Total rockstars. All of you.

Me: BW x 2 - 53
Ist XWH: Married over 17 years, DD and DS (mine)
2nd XH: Also 53, DS (his), 8 yrs together
OW: Pet sitter
D-Day: 9/11/16
Divorced in 60 seconds flat. http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=591733

posts: 441   ·   registered: Sep. 17th, 2016
id 7684622
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Amazingyetlost ( member #43745) posted at 1:44 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

Dear TOC

Other people will also weigh in, but your WS wanting to discuss a Post-Nuptial Agreement is weird ==

People here have done a PNA of the are going to R and want to set in place new or tailored financial agreements in the marriage.

A post nuptial agreement isn't what people who divorce do -- people who divorce just do financial settlements.

Simply cannot understand why WS wants to talk to you about this, unless, its " if we R then I will give you x" ????

Good Luck TOC!!!

[This message edited by Amazingyetlost at 7:45 AM, October 14th (Friday)]

ME: 63 BW
HIM: 62 EA & PA, ten months (madboomer)
Married: December 24th, 2013; he started the A in the months before wedding
D/Day: June 3rd 2014 (karma bus ran them over on OW birthday); NC June 4th 2014
Just sad all of the time

posts: 420   ·   registered: Jun. 17th, 2014   ·   location: Aotearoa
id 7684716
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TimelessLoss ( member #55295) posted at 1:48 PM on Friday, October 14th, 2016

TOC,

You seen through the post nup for what it is...an attempt to get you back by a financial "incentive".

The terms of a post nup typically offer more than the common 50/50 split of assets.

You don't need his cash or alimony. Your only shared assets are the boat and RV. You've stated you are willing to walk away from those anyway (If you divorce I believe he should buy you out or they should be sold; not because you need the cash but because they could represent a future trigger to you if you see them).

This is a disguised attempt to meet with you and your attorney, when his proposed terms could easily be sent from his attorney.

His vows didn't keep him faithful. He thinks a post nup will convince you he will be faithful by imposing a financial penalty on him if he isn't faithful? Why would you accept an agreement that is built on a condition that anticipates one party failing to live up to the agreement?

This is an empty, hollow offer given your circumstances.

Time after time all you have seen is the grand gesture (flowers), and now a financial incentive. Never anything that respects the boundaries you've established regarding NC. Now another attempt to meet with you when it is not necessary.

You've never seen anything from his heart.

"You've got to learn to leave the table when love is no longer being served"

posts: 1649   ·   registered: Sep. 23rd, 2016
id 7684729
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